(Thread IKs:
Nuns with Guns)
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Dapper_Swindler posted:ehh. i like it more of voldemort is kinda everything wrong with wizard society and poo poo in human form and that he is a creation from both upbringing and the hosed up society so harry and the other fucks realize they have to actually try to fix the world so some other wizard chud doesn't become the next wizard hitler or some poo poo. The book goes into a painful level of detail that Voldemort was already a budding serial killer before he knows wizards exists. You could really tell what Rowling had on the TV when she was writing those parts. And then his main obsession was with death and immortality with the racism secondary. The racism important to the wealthy Death Eaters because it was a tool to maintain power, just like Voldemort. So anyway, Dumbledore was fully aware of the type of asset he was recruiting with Voldemort and sent Harry to grow up in abusive household to become the replacement.
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Jun 8, 2021 17:53
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Somehow I'm not surprised that a childrens book series doesn't properly flesh out every part of the setting, and any attempts to do so end up up stunningly stupid.
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Jun 8, 2021 17:55
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And Harry grows up to be a cop and a bad dad.
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Jun 8, 2021 17:56
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The text heavily implies Tom Riddle was born evil because he was the product of rape. Which is pretty fuckin' 
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Jun 8, 2021 17:56
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Tim Traveller visits the disputed Franco-Belgian border: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ddlv47t1tQ I enjoyed that video quite a lot. 
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Jun 8, 2021 18:09
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Archer666 posted:Somehow I'm not surprised that a childrens book series doesn't properly flesh out every part of the setting, and any attempts to do so end up up stunningly stupid. I don't really see why being childrens books mean they should end up incoherent and muddled. Pratchetts Tiffany Aching series for instance are childrens books and those don't really suffer from such issues.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:09
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The Harry Potter series is funny because the first book is a fine children’s book but Rowling immediately got sick of writing children’s books so they become all politics and weird magic rules to justify those politics.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:10
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I will always beat the drum whenever Rowling comes up to read Rick Riordan stuff instead
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Jun 8, 2021 18:15
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I read Harry Potter through secondary school, I picked them up about year 9 and shotgunned the first 3 with gusto then felt Order of the Phoenix was disappointing but still went through the rest. Then I read 'The Casual Vacancy'. I genuinely hoped she'd grown as a writer but it was awful and filled with the worst stereotypes of council house residents that I felt awful for buying it.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:17
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She's a fascinatingly AWFUL writer, and it was truly a trip watching reviewers twist themselves inside out to like Casual Vacancy purely based off "W-well she wrote Harry Potter!". Even further hilarious in the grimmest sort of way that the only people who liked her most recent dreck were fellow TERFs honking off to the trans serial killer.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:39
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DekeThornton posted:I don't really see why being childrens books mean they should end up incoherent and muddled. Pratchetts Tiffany Aching series for instance are childrens books and those don't really suffer from such issues. The Tiffany Aching books also take place in a pre-existing world with dozens of prior novels establishing it. It's not the same thing as a children's series built from the ground up as such.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:44
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achillesforever6 posted:I will always beat the drum whenever Rowling comes up to read Rick Riordan stuff instead I'm always fascinated by the way that Riordan's stuff made dramatic political evolutions. The early stuff was way into the idea of "western civilization" and one of the bad guys talking about how unfair the gods are gets Killmonger'd. The next set had Percy establish a bargaining position and demanding a standard of care for Demigods to protect them from a hostile cosmos. The most recent books are about the inherent death and evils of fascism both at scale and personally, star explicitly queer casts, and casts Zeus and all of Olympus as either reveling in or complicit with domestic abuse and exploitation. It's all still Kid Lit but it's funny to see how much Riordan's politics have changed personally and professionally - he got cooler with age!
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Jun 8, 2021 18:50
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Brian David Gilbert bought a new ice cream maker https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjmzfOUOw08
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Jun 8, 2021 18:52
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Neddy Seagoon posted:The Tiffany Aching books also take place in a pre-existing world with dozens of prior novels establishing it. It's not the same thing as a children's series built from the ground up as such. Sure, Discworld was already established and fleshed out when the first Tiffany Aching book was released, but nothing about the setting is dumbed down or simplified and The Chalk is written as coherently as any other part of the world. The way the books are written there really is no need to have any prior knowledge of the larger world to appreciate the books and their themes. There really isn't much suggesting that the books couldn't have been equally good completely disconnected from the Discworld series. The main diffrence with Harry Potter is that Pratchett was a good writer.
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Jun 8, 2021 18:57
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SteelMentor posted:She's a fascinatingly AWFUL writer, and it was truly a trip watching reviewers twist themselves inside out to like Casual Vacancy purely based off "W-well she wrote Harry Potter!". Even further hilarious in the grimmest sort of way that the only people who liked her most recent dreck were fellow TERFs honking off to the trans serial killer. Why the gently caress did Harry potter get big
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Jun 8, 2021 19:15
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it only hit me talking about it someone yesterday that Terry Pratchett was my first introduction to the idea of being transgender and made it seem so completely normal and reasonable that as a kid I didn't even notice myself digesting the concept. So good job, Terry. Not sure how woke or unwoke the rest of your content is and I'm afraid to check, but nice one on that.
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Jun 8, 2021 19:17
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Violet_Sky posted:Why the gently caress did Harry potter get big "Getting taken out of your boring life to go live at a magic school" is pretty solid wish fulfillment for kids. Add in the extremely easy sub-branding of the houses to give you a team to identify with, lots of weird little unexplained details in the corner to capture the imagination (the Mos Eisley Cantina effect), and the fact that Harry Potter got a lot of backlash form fundies (which ended up netting it a lot of publicity and praise in the form of "this isn't evil, it's getting kids passionate about reading!") and you've for yourself a recipe for success. Also, the series had the extraordinary luck of coming out at the same time as the millennials (the largest generation in US history) were at the right age to be reading children's books. EDIT: It's really hard to understate just how hard the fundies went after Harry Potter initially. Like, check out this Chick tract. By the late 90s, the Satanic Panic had faded. A whole lot of huckster preachers were trying their best to get it started back up, because it helped them rake in a lot of money. They needed Harry Potter to be popular, because they needed a target for their "Satan is going after your children" sermons. There's a good chance that, if you first heard about Harry Potter in the 90s, it was because of a news story talking about its "controversy". The fundies absolutely primed the pump there. And I guess they kinda got what they wanted*, by making a vicious transphobe the most celebrated author in a generation. *All they really wanted is money. LanceHunter fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Jun 8, 2021 |
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Jun 8, 2021 19:32
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Impermanent posted:it only hit me talking about it someone yesterday that Terry Pratchett was my first introduction to the idea of being transgender and made it seem so completely normal and reasonable that as a kid I didn't even notice myself digesting the concept. So good job, Terry. Not sure how woke or unwoke the rest of your content is and I'm afraid to check, but nice one on that. Well, there’s always the Vimes Boot Theory https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/72745-the-reason-that-the-rich-were-so-rich-vimes-reasoned
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Jun 8, 2021 19:37
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It's sorta like talking about David Cage's games yesterday: on finding out that the creator is a shithead there's an impulse to crow about all the failings of the work in a way that makes it seem impossible that they could have been incredibly popular, but they were.
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Jun 8, 2021 20:04
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LanceHunter posted:Also, the series had the extraordinary luck of coming out at the same time as the millennials (the largest generation in US history) were at the right age to be reading children's books. Also it's a point that's been made to death and imo is actually pretty over emphasized, but it is a fact that the vast majority of those millennials grew up with the books which also helped keep a ton of readers engaged long past the point where they would have stopped caring had the tone remained the same as Philosopher's Stone. Harry being a kid when you're a kid, a horny and frustrated teenager when you're a horny and frustrated teenager, and an overburdened young adult when you're an overburdened young adult really does a lot to lock you in.
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Jun 8, 2021 20:06
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LanceHunter posted:"Getting taken out of your boring life to go live at a magic school" is pretty solid wish fulfillment for kids. Add in the extremely easy sub-branding of the houses to give you a team to identify with, lots of weird little unexplained details in the corner to capture the imagination (the Mos Eisley Cantina effect), and the fact that Harry Potter got a lot of backlash form fundies (which ended up netting it a lot of publicity and praise in the form of "this isn't evil, it's getting kids passionate about reading!") and you've for yourself a recipe for success. I was a literal child and not American so the only real fundie thing I saw with Harry Potter was that some kids weren't allowed to even read it. This came up when my fourth grade teacher had us listen to the first chapter of Philosopher's Stone for English class. (Also Jesus Camp, but I want that movie to be fake so bad. Like "Harry Potter worships the devil!" Later on they pray to a cardboard cutout of Dubya even though I don't think God would approve.)
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Jun 8, 2021 20:10
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Violet_Sky posted:Also Jesus Camp, but I want that movie to be fake so bad. I'm sorry to say, but it's real and there's worse, there's the ones that literally abduct queer kids because their parents want them to "fix" them.
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Jun 8, 2021 20:24
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I enjoyed Rowling's first detective novel and think those things are more in her wheelhouse, but the other 2 suffered for being twice the length they should be. Pulpy serial killer books shouldn't make for doorstop paperbacks.
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Jun 8, 2021 20:41
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stillvisions posted:Part of art is developing a language to describe that particular medium and its relationship to the viewer/listener/etc. Trying to use the language of films as art to describe a video game would be like comparing movies to plays - they have some surface familiarity and artistic elements which cross over but they're not the same. For instance, it would be stupid to complain that a play doesn't use camera movement in a way to help reveal the story. You're judging different creations using very different yardsticks. I keep trying to formulate a response but I just don't have the capacity to say it without sounding like a loving moron or an rear end in a top hat. On one hand, I want to cut them some slack because the source of much of this discussion is in academia, where publishers have it all locked away and the only people that even read any of it are academics. There's also a stigma in general about being too learned because being critical of media makes you look like an insufferable killjoy, even if you still enjoy the work you're analyzing. On the other hand, mainstream geek culture has an extremely limited cultural reference pool and everything just becomes a retread ofStar Wars, The Lord of the Rings, superheroes, or action films from the eighties. Alex Pappademas also laid out what a lot of my problems with geek culture and superhero flicks are better than I ever could hope to in 2019: https://gen.medium.com/the-decade-comic-book-nerds-became-our-cultural-overlords-f219b732a660 Star Man fucked around with this message at 21:05 on Jun 8, 2021 |
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Jun 8, 2021 21:02
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DrVenkman posted:I enjoyed Rowling's first detective novel was this the one where the bad guy turned out to be a man dressed like a woman. little on the nose for her
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Jun 8, 2021 21:03
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Star Man posted:I keep trying to formulate a response but I just don't have the capacity to say it without sounding like a loving moron or an rear end in a top hat. The only trick is to not care about this and 
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Jun 8, 2021 21:10
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Bleck posted:was this the one where the bad guy turned out to be a man dressed like a woman. little on the nose for her No that's her newest one where the man dresses as a woman to attack people in bathrooms because Rowling is a TERF piece of poo poo.
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Jun 8, 2021 21:10
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josh04 posted:The only trick is to not care about this and But I want to make a good post, not a lovely post. On this dead gay comedy forum that no one reads, just like academia.
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Jun 8, 2021 21:21
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Didn't Rowling's first non-Potter work get poor reviews/sell really poorly until it got 'leaked' she wrote it?
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Jun 8, 2021 21:54
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I read the books when they came out and was satisfied enough with the ending to not want any more out of the series. When I heard that there was more on the way I kind of rolled my eyes and kept my interest at a minimum, and boy howdy did I make the right choice there.lunar detritus posted:The books and Rowling can go burn in hell nowadays but I'm glad I read them because they introduced me to fandom. I would hesitate to call that a good thing. 
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Jun 8, 2021 21:58
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Yvonmukluk posted:Didn't Rowling's first non-Potter work get poor reviews/sell really poorly until it got 'leaked' she wrote it? yeah
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Jun 8, 2021 21:59
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Rowling's first choice for the movie was Terry Gilliam. Later Gilliam turned out to have bad opinions about MeToo and apparently likes to grope woimen in elevators.
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Jun 8, 2021 22:19
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MonsieurChoc posted:Rowling's first choice for the movie was Terry Gilliam. So she regrets not getting them in there then?
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Jun 8, 2021 22:35
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Turpitude II posted:if you'd like to see what you missed out on, there's an animorphs read-along in the book barn. Yvonmukluk posted:Didn't Rowling's first non-Potter work get poor reviews/sell really poorly until it got 'leaked' she wrote it?
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Jun 8, 2021 22:39
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Yardbomb posted:So she regrets not getting them in there then? Just because she hates transsexuals doesn't mean she likes gropers or sex pests like men. She's just overall lovely
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Jun 8, 2021 22:46
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Lordy does Joann hate fat people
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Jun 8, 2021 22:46
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Arcsquad12 posted:If I remember right the line about the slytherins going to the dungeons was in the book as well, because their dorm rooms were down in the dungeons. The movie just made it sound like they were going to prison rather than house arrest. They were escorted to the Room of Requirement and out into Hogsmeade in the book, along with all the younger Hogwarts students. In the movie they probably meant that they were being sent back to their common room, but it's 1. It's weird to phrase it as sending them to the dungeons 2. It's weird to house arrest (lol) them and nobody else. DekeThornton posted:Sure, Discworld was already established and fleshed out when the first Tiffany Aching book was released, but nothing about the setting is dumbed down or simplified and The Chalk is written as coherently as any other part of the world. The way the books are written there really is no need to have any prior knowledge of the larger world to appreciate the books and their themes. There really isn't much suggesting that the books couldn't have been equally good completely disconnected from the Discworld series. There are differences in the priorities and qualities of writing between Pratchett and Rowling, but there is a lot to be said for how Harry Potter itself shifted what was acceptable and appropriate to write about for a specific age demographic. Harry Potter started coming out at a time when multi-dozen volume mini chapter books were standard, and it paved the way for novel-style YA books like The Wee Free Men to exist at all. I don't think anyone was expecting contemporary book series for children like say, Goosebumps, to hold up to a critical breakdown of the setting. The real issue here was always trying to expand it out into a self-sustaining EU that could be marketed towards adult consumers because everything about the setting is innately reductive and childish.
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Jun 8, 2021 23:56
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Solitair posted:I would hesitate to call that a good thing.
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Jun 9, 2021 00:10
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MonsieurChoc posted:Rowling's first choice for the movie was Terry Gilliam. True story: I have been in an elevator with Terry Gilliam. He didn't grope either of the women also in there on that occasion.
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Jun 9, 2021 00:44
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Violet_Sky posted:Why the gently caress did Harry potter get big it got way, way worse as it went on
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Jun 9, 2021 01:01
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