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I picked the wishy-washy third option ("I trust you'll make the right decision" or something), then chose to kill her, and she died before I could do it. I figured my character hesitated for too long since I already established them as indecisive.
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Jun 18, 2021 09:23
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I got the scene where Bajsaljen kills her and she was dying but definitely still alive when he did it, iirc. It was largely framed as a mercy killing imo.
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Jun 18, 2021 10:59
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Vitamean posted:The script only shows two dialogue box prompts (each with a grant her request/leave her be option) 3rd option pickers actually get put together with kill her choosers.
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Jun 18, 2021 14:50
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logging in for the first time ever to say i could have fixed dyunbu
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Jun 19, 2021 07:41
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Honestly given how she continues to refuse to drop her goddamned field record about her no doubt tragic backstory I at this point am perfectly ok with dunking on her and her soldiers in perpetuity. That said, the Blades lecturing her about the futility of revenge after they've been directly involved in slaughtering her friends and having initially specifically targeted her and hers for death for having been too good at healing the wounded is some real arrogant, self-righteous bullshit! It's less "poignant disagreement over the righteous course" and more "murderer trying to pull moral supremacy, while also trying to kill the victim." Isolde and Xeven lost a lot of sympathy for what happened to them from that little FATE series alone. Jetrauben fucked around with this message at 00:15 on Jun 20, 2021 |
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Jun 20, 2021 00:11
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Jetrauben posted:Honestly given how she continues to refuse to drop her goddamned field record about her no doubt tragic backstory I at this point am perfectly ok with dunking on her and her soldiers in perpetuity. I mean We’re not talking about the red cross here. We are talking about a fascist imperialist officer who uses healing magic in order to facilitate...imperialism. I’m not really seeing the problem here 
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Jun 20, 2021 00:44
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Captain Oblivious posted:I mean Oh sure, but there's a difference between "you're working for fascists, gently caress you" and self-righteously talking about how revenge will only bring more suffering and won't bring back the dead when you're the ones who made those corpses. :P
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Jun 20, 2021 00:47
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Jetrauben posted:That said, the Blades lecturing her about the futility of revenge after they've been directly involved in slaughtering her friends and having initially specifically targeted her and hers for death for having been too good at healing the wounded is some real arrogant, self-righteous bullshit! It's less "poignant disagreement over the righteous course" and more "murderer trying to pull moral supremacy, while also trying to kill the victim." Fully agreed. As a healer *drinks essence of the profane* I *thin air* am *chaincast* protected *glare* as *presence of mind* a *seraph strike* non *afflatus misery* combatant *dia* *30xglares*
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Jun 20, 2021 01:25
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I mean, once again, the skirmish even says "normally this would be a warcrime but..."
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Jun 20, 2021 07:23
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Misja should have turned a few more of the blades to chairs.
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Jun 20, 2021 07:55
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:Misja should have turned a few more of the blades to chairs. To be fair, the Blades who survived were also the ones who were more or less decent!
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Jun 20, 2021 07:58
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Jetrauben posted:To be fair, the Blades who survived were also the ones who were more or less decent! Literally two actual members of the Blades of Gunnhildr survived, and both of them were Red Mages. And it's not even a 'there's more we didn't see', Meryall outright says it. I think by the end of Zadnor Lovro is alive and captured, and I kinda wanna see more from him. Unlike a lot of the tempered we see, the Blades seem like they're mostly there, they're just apparently staunch monarchists now. I want a scene or two of just him talking, see how his brain works right now and all that. ...also, now that I think about it: I just remembered that Misija-Gunnhildr summoned up her weird cycle-throne to take down the Diablo Armament. That actually raises even more questions than when she used it in DR, because there I just assumed it was another transformed Blade or something. But no, apparently that's some kind of inherent part of her powerset, part of the package deal, and... lady, why is THAT your weapon of choice? I'm not judging, it just seems like something you'd have to actively choose rather than default to something like 'the queen wields a regal longsword', and I just want to know why. Cleretic fucked around with this message at 08:56 on Jun 20, 2021 |
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Jun 20, 2021 08:53
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Cleretic posted:Literally two actual members of the Blades of Gunnhildr survived, and both of them were Red Mages. And it's not even a 'there's more we didn't see', Meryall outright says it. A queen has a throne.
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Jun 20, 2021 08:55
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We never saw what happened to that one jackass she tempered who wasn't a Blade. I've been imagining that's where the chair came from.
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Jun 20, 2021 08:55
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The chair is Save The Queen itself.
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Jun 20, 2021 10:24
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Cleretic posted:Literally two actual members of the Blades of Gunnhildr survived, and both of them were Red Mages. And it's not even a 'there's more we didn't see', Meryall outright says it. He is, yes. Red Mages seem to be fairly morally virtuous as a general rule, which amuses me.
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Jun 20, 2021 20:28
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Red magic is specifically the discipline based on careful, ecologically-sustainable magic use, so I'm not surprised that it skews towards thoughtful, helpful people. (Although, it's hard to judge red mages against white and black mages because there are about five other white mages and zero black mages besides the Warrior of Light alive today.) Hm, how common are the jobs? Paladin: Ul'dah trains them. Warrior: Just an advanced marauder, hard to tell if someone is one or not. Gunbreaker: Pretty common, albeit not in Eorzea. Dark Knight: I guess there's two of you, give or take a few split personalities. White Mage: It's just you and the Padjals. Scholar: It's just you and a tonberry. Astrologian: We are going to teach people astrology no matter how many men I have to kill to see it happen. Summoner: The Maelstrom have been training up a few. Black Mage: It's just you. Red Mage: There seem to be a few wandering around. Blue Mage: Martyn will practically pay you to learn this one. Bard: Gridania's been training a few more. Machinist: Anybody can learn it; that's the whole point. Dancer: It's common in Thavnair, but nowhere else. Dragoon: Ishgard trains them. Ninja: They're common in Othard. Samurai: They're common in Othard. Monk: They're reasonably common in Ala Mhigo.
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Jun 20, 2021 20:44
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I thought a few beast tribes had a BLM or am I misremembering the ARR BLM quests.
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Jun 20, 2021 20:55
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To be perfectly honest, I level-skipped those and am still working my way through NG+ing everything.
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Jun 20, 2021 21:00
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We run into plenty of thaumaturges but none with the pure Mhachi firepower we have. Also warriors are different from marauders, it's a specific kind of fighting that needs the inner beast that comes from whatever mountains up north Curious Gorge is from. I think right now it's just you and Curious Gorge as official Warriors, with Dorgono and Broken Mountain learning how to control the inner beast again. Also we're the only Dark Knight like us, the lore book says that Dark Arts and Darkside are 100% never use for Dark Knights because the Frey situation it creates normally ends up with you dead instead of a wholesome bonding moment. Of course we don't have Dark Arts anymore but I think it still counts. Veev fucked around with this message at 21:05 on Jun 20, 2021 |
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Jun 20, 2021 21:02
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quote:A priestess of the Order of Nald'thal. During a visit to the Marasaja Pit to hear the confession of a prisoner, Lalai was distracted by the presence of powerful magicks. Seeking to identify the source of this arcane disturbance, she ventured into the deepest reaches of the prison. There, she encountered Ququruka Tataruka, a legendary mage who had spent the past century meditating in unbroken confinement. His vast knowledge of divine myth and ancient thaumaturgy ignited in her a burning curiosity—a ravenous flame that demanded to be fed. Thus it was that her frequent duties within the Pit masked her gradual initiation into the art of black magic at the foot of her imprisoned master. (Kazagg Chah, 269th Order Mendicant Da Za, and Dozol Meloc were also disciples of Ququruka but only Kazagg even acts as a Thaumaturge during solo instances.) Waldeve also survived the events of the story - even if his band was doing Black Magic incorrectly (without regulation) they were still Black Mages. That's not a LOT of Black Mages but it's more than just the WoL alive.
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Jun 20, 2021 21:07
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I feel like there are probably some people around similar to Y'shtola or Alphinaud where what they're doing isn't exactly Scholar or Black Mage but it's basically the same thing in application.
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Jun 20, 2021 21:13
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All the Scions and Sharlayans use the Sharlayan version of the spells, and Sharlaya is just so good and has so much knowledge they are able to reverse engineer a lot of that stuff.
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Jun 20, 2021 21:33
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IIRC it was specifically your possession of the BLM job stone that kept you from eventually fueling your spells with your own life force (to the point of death). At least in ARR there were no other BLM job stones around but the beast tribe NPCs in that questline carried on traditions of black magic, though were not necessarily formal Black Mages themselves.
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Jun 20, 2021 21:42
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Rand Brittain posted:Red magic is specifically the discipline based on careful, ecologically-sustainable magic use, so I'm not surprised that it skews towards thoughtful, helpful people. (Although, it's hard to judge red mages against white and black mages because there are about five other white mages and zero black mages besides the Warrior of Light alive today.) It's the Immortal Flames that have the Summoning Squad. I remember because they have those weird robes where the whole chest piece is shaped like scales At the end of that quest series, the Flames are able to salvage a bunch of summoner soul crystals from the Summoning Matrix, so presumably they're about to become a lot more common! I feel like that happened at the end of another job questline too, but I can't remember which one it was.
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Jun 20, 2021 21:45
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Chillgamesh posted:I feel like there are probably some people around similar to Y'shtola or Alphinaud where what they're doing isn't exactly Scholar or Black Mage but it's basically the same thing in application. Right. Y’shtola is a Sharlyan THM and Alphonaud is a different type of ACN. Lily is what makes a WoL SCH a SCH. Honestly THM/BLM is a bit confused because advanced THM seem to be able to do BLM stuff despite ARR lore saying they should be dying. Though Shtola is killing herself via constant magic vision so 
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Jun 20, 2021 21:54
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In general, the discipline breakdown is a little weird, because some of the lesser disciplines - thaumaturgy, lancers, etc - are treated as unique or distinct to specific Eorzean cities yet they're clearly spread far beyond them and are practiced elsewhere. Ishgard was isolationist until very recently but has healers and thaumaturges/black mages, there's conjurers and healers all across Othard and Ilsabard, etc. Sarvautoir indicates that Ilsabard mages are extremely formidable in their own right.Veev posted:Also we're the only Dark Knight like us, the lore book says that Dark Arts and Darkside are 100% never use for Dark Knights because the Frey situation it creates normally ends up with you dead instead of a wholesome bonding moment. Of course we don't have Dark Arts anymore but I think it still counts. I'd assume our Fray Problem is largely because we're unconsciously using Creation magic to make an Esteem from our own issues? Rand Brittain posted:Red magic is specifically the discipline based on careful, ecologically-sustainable magic use, so I'm not surprised that it skews towards thoughtful, helpful people. (Although, it's hard to judge red mages against white and black mages because there are about five other white mages and zero black mages besides the Warrior of Light alive today.) It's just funny because even being taught by such a massive piece of poo poo as Lambert, Red Magic seems to naturally produce heroes. Jetrauben fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Jun 20, 2021 |
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Jun 20, 2021 21:57
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Jetrauben posted:In general, the discipline breakdown is a little weird, because some of the lesser disciplines - thaumaturgy, lancers, etc - are treated as unique or distinct to specific Eorzean cities yet they're clearly spread far beyond them and are practiced elsewhere. Ishgard was isolationist until very recently but has healers and thaumaturges/black mages, there's conjurers and healers all across Othard and Ilsabard, etc. It's worth noting that a lot of that basically boils down to independent discovery of similar technique. You even have similar situations on The First. You can argue maybe it's a legacy memory from the Ancients or maybe it's just what makes sense in terms of magic study. While people use different skills they don't necessarily have the same names. Like in the Othard area they have Geomancy and Onmyojutsu which function under the same basic rules as White/Black magic just with some differences. Likewise the Xaela have black magic but only can use it to the full extent when they have a totem. Gogo also effectively taught himself Blue Mage through direct Mimicry instead. Honestly I feel like the 'legacy memory of the Ancients' makes sense because we've seen the Ascians use similar spells. It's likely some variation of them has always existed and we're just seeing the specific Eorzean-brand versions (except for stuff like Gunbreaker or Samurai where you're seeing their homeland version instead.) Basically if you want to blow someone up, you're going to naturally gravitate towards fire magic because it's the best way to blow someone up. From there you'll develop other techniques which follow similar rules and the end result is going to be something that has Fire, Ice and Lightning magic most likely. From there it'll develop in different directions but it all has the basic common root. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Jun 20, 2021 |
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Jun 20, 2021 22:04
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CNJ makes sense though because despite the padjal’s and CNJ’s guild insistence earth, water and light aspected aether is everywhere so anyone should be able to figure that out anywhere. No spirits needed. Lancer is poking stuff with a stick but DRG is problematic because you need dragons. I guess meracydia could have them.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:04
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hobbesmaster posted:CNJ makes sense though because despite the padjal’s and CNJ’s guild insistence earth, water and light aspected aether is everywhere so anyone should be able to figure that out anywhere. No spirits needed. I think with Dragoon you more specifically seem to need not just dragons but dragon blood? Which makes the summoned dragoon splinters in the Hero's Gauntlet a little weird, since as far as we know dragons are naturally only present on the Source? But then again nothing says they can't be summoned from the Source.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:06
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I figure most of the classes you see replicated across the world the team just doesn't want to have to come up with region-specific alternate titles.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:06
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Hogama posted:I figure most of the classes you see replicated across the world the team just doesn't want to have to come up with region-specific alternate titles. I mean eastern melee could just all be SAMs and NINs right?
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Jun 20, 2021 22:07
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hobbesmaster posted:CNJ makes sense though because despite the padjal’s and CNJ’s guild insistence earth, water and light aspected aether is everywhere so anyone should be able to figure that out anywhere. No spirits needed. Yeah, I basically assume that the 'base' classes are the bitch-rear end basic concept that is easy to learn and the job stones are just one specific branch. The basis of Healing is probably Conjury since that stuff is everywhere, and then some day someone went "What if I used other planets instead of this planet for power" and got Astrologian and presumably someone else went "Guys, I just marathoned all of Gundam and I have a GREAT IDEA" for Sage. Likewise Arcanist is the bitch-rear end basic "what if I used a stone to make a familiar" and then it veers off into "What if I used a fairy instead of a carbuncle" and "What if I shoved some primal energy in to stuff?" Red Mage is just combining the basic CNJ and BLM and using a buildup to offset the natural cost of spells. Lancer is born from spear technique and then Ishgard modified them to take advantage of dragon stuff. Pugilist is "I can fuckin' punch someone real good ya'll" and Ala Mhigo came up with the specific monk brand. Limsa just had Rogues until someone came over from overseas and introduced the idea of ninjas. Theoretically you could have more offshoot classes like Scholar/Summoner with major gap being there "It's a horrifying pain to design around gameplay wise."
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Jun 20, 2021 22:13
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You can see the alternate-universe stuff in action if you pay close attention to the cast names the shadowless use in Heroes' Gauntlet - it's all variant names for various job skills.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:24
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hobbesmaster posted:Right. Y’shtola is a Sharlyan THM and Alphonaud is a different type of ACN. Lily is what makes a WoL SCH a SCH. Honestly THM/BLM is a bit confused because advanced THM seem to be able to do BLM stuff despite ARR lore saying they should be dying. I maintain that Y'shtola using Foul means she's absolutely a BLM saying she's just a THM to avoid being sideyed.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:30
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SirSamVimes posted:I maintain that Y'shtola using Foul means she's absolutely a BLM saying she's just a THM to avoid being sideyed. To be fair Foul's mechanic involves building up a gauge over time. The idea behind Limit Breaks is that when a battle breaks out the aether used in the area starts building up and someone can exploit it for BIG BOOM. I always assumed Foul was the same thing on a smaller level which would mean there's no reason a THM couldn't do it if they had enough power.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:32
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Kan-E-Senna claims to be a White Mage but she clearly casts Collective Unconscious.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:35
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Gunbreakers are not common - as far as we know the ones we've actually seen in the game are it, unless there are more survivors out there.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:36
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Blockhouse posted:Gunbreakers are not common - as far as we know the ones we've actually seen in the game are it, unless there are more survivors out there. Technically there are a whole lot of them since Garlean Gunblades were derived from Bozja Gunblades apparently, just redesigned because Garleans can't use aether. Beyond that though we know that more are being taught.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:44
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ImpAtom posted:Technically there are a whole lot of them since Garlean Gunblades were derived from Bozja Gunblades apparently, just redesigned because Garleans can't use aether. Beyond that though we know that more are being taught. Garleans are not using the Gunbreaker discipline/fighting style or even the same weapon so I don't think they even technically count. Every person we've known who is actually a Gunbreaker has been taught by a Hrothgar survivor from Bozja.
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Jun 20, 2021 22:45
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