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Inzombiac posted:My house is about 1600 sq. feet (not including finished basement) A good contractor will do a Manual J calculation for sizing, though typically they just throw in what was there and hope for the best. At the very least, your contractor should be ensuring you have adequate supply, and more importantly, return duct capacity for the size. You said you have a furnace already, right? This potentially impacts what types of systems can be supported, as it contains the actual blower motor and motor control board.
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Jun 29, 2021 22:05
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B-Nasty posted:A good contractor will do a Manual J calculation for sizing, though typically they just throw in what was there and hope for the best. At the very least, your contractor should be ensuring you have adequate supply, and more importantly, return duct capacity for the size. Good to know. I'm fine with paying $5K for a new AC unit, I just don't want to get hosed around by up-sellers.
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Jun 29, 2021 22:47
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A lot of new units are inverter driven which allow them to work at various power levels rather than MAX or NOTHING. This makes getting really accurate sizing less important since it just runs at a lower level more or less constantly, rather than turning on and off a bunch.
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Jun 29, 2021 22:59
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MrChrome posted:My 22 year old AC system has kicked the bucket. It has a refrigerant leak. We've been having places come out to spec out a new system but they all have a 4-8 week lead time. It's a Unico system so I guess they're hard to get ahold of because there is only one manufacturer? I'm a bit confused here, is there a specific reason you're going with the same manufacturer that you have in place right now if you're replacing everything? Or is this the manufacturer your contractor uses and they're just backed up? Supplies are hosed everywhere right now so it may be less "your specific system has hard to find parts" and more "nothing is in stock anywhere". In your shoes, unless the cost to do so is astronomical I'd be looking at doing the repair on the 22-year-old system to just get it running now and schedule the full replacement as soon as all the parts are available.
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Jun 29, 2021 23:06
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IOwnCalculus posted:I'm a bit confused here, is there a specific reason you're going with the same manufacturer that you have in place right now if you're replacing everything? Or is this the manufacturer your contractor uses and they're just backed up? I had three places come out and do quotes. All three of them specced out a Unico and nothing else. I think Unico has its own specialized ducting. We're keeping the ducts that I already have. If I knew they could come out on some date and repair it for price X I'd strongly consider it. Problem is I don't know when anybody can come out, or how much it will cost until they do the leak test. To make this more complicated I'm in an area that flooded over the weekend. Many homes in my area lost their HVAC units if they were in the basement. All the HVAC companies are really busy cleaning things up. Mine is AC only and it's in the attic. Either way, I'm going to call the HVAC place back tomorrow and see how booked up they are. 
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Jun 29, 2021 23:16
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lmao I just called to get a second opinion and asked about the "gotta replace the whole system" bit. Bless her heart trying to stay composed but she laughed and said she's never heard of that before. Dug a little deeper and it was just some lovely up-selling tactic to put everything under the same blanket warranty. So happy I didn't pull a twelve thousand dollar trigger.
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Jun 29, 2021 23:17
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Shiny new system up and running, already working like a champ cooling the house  Sitting on my couch and not sweating like a pig, had forgotten what that was like
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Jun 29, 2021 23:33
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Nitrousoxide posted:A lot of new units are inverter driven which allow them to work at various power levels rather than MAX or NOTHING. This makes getting really accurate sizing less important since it just runs at a lower level more or less constantly, rather than turning on and off a bunch. "Units" meaning mini splits, but this is a conversation about central AC.
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Jun 29, 2021 23:58
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Motronic posted:"Units" meaning mini splits, but this is a conversation about central AC. Nah, they make variable speed condensers in ye olde residential split flavor. They are just rare on the market right now, because they're expensive and correctly sized single speed works just fine in 99% applications. IIRC the Bosch offering was bragging about not even needing a specific air handler, you send it 24v to run and it just modulates itself off suction temp and pressure.
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Jun 30, 2021 00:05
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MRC48B posted:Nah, they make variable speed condensers in ye olde residential split flavor. They are just rare on the market right now, because they're expensive and correctly sized single speed works just fine in 99% applications. One weird Bosch, one weird Daikin......am I missing anything? They are so rare, and such a bad idea for parts and service, that it's hard to even consider them as part of a conversation as far as I know. Perhaps you work in an area where there are more than 0 and you carry parts on your truck. Nobody around here does.
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Jun 30, 2021 00:08
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Trane's partnership with Mitsu tells me they will be A Thing in the future. But this is the part of the conversation where you tell me R-12 was the only refrigerant we ever needed.
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Jun 30, 2021 00:14
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Oh, sorry I didn't suggest a future possibility for a problem that needs to be solved right now. Look, "nobody" has these things. It's often hard enough to get multi stage units serviced unless that particular unit is super common in your area. I get that you are into this stuff because you do it for a living, but in many areas it's not a good choice or suggestion for anyone. You should know this because surely you've run into some odd unit that nobody know what to do with or has parts for in your travels. You don't want to be the person who owns that unit. You don't want to be the person who suggested that unit.
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Jun 30, 2021 00:20
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I love in Portland, a decently sized city. Is the suggestion to only get a 1-stage unit?
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Jun 30, 2021 00:22
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Inzombiac posted:I love in Portland, a decently sized city. The suggestion should pretty much always be that you are shopping for an installer/HVAC company first and then within the makes/models that they commonly install.
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Jun 30, 2021 00:25
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Inzombiac posted:I love in Portland, a decently sized city. Motronic is correct. If you had no capacity problems with your existing 1stage last year, the same sized unit will probably be fine, he is also correct that what you most want is something reliable and easily repairable. btw you posted this in the "Its hot in Seattle" thread: quote:It also uses the illegal freon poo poo, so I can't get it recharged. This is absolutely false. R-22 production is getting phased out, so it is illegal to manufacture it, and most equipment now uses newer refrigerants, so it's getting more expensive as supply goes down. But you the consumer can keep using it if you wish. Any licensed contractor can charge your AC unit. Any licensed contractor can fix your R-22 unit. "This Freon is illegal, I can't fix this" is a lie to sell you a new unit. That said, if your hvac is more than 20 years old, you are probably throwing good money after bad and need a new unit.
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Jun 30, 2021 00:41
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Goddamn, good to know. I don't know the exact age but the install/service sticker is so sun bleached that it is unreadable. I think that's a pretty good sign, haha.
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Jun 30, 2021 01:11
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Motronic posted:One weird Bosch, one weird Daikin......am I missing anything? This continues to make me mad. It seems like 100% lazyness given the rest of the world does it. It's one blower/condenser instead of one per room, it's simpler than a minisplit yet those are ALL inverter driven variable units. Those kids and their newfangled foreign technology. I get we have to live in the world of what's easiest to service and sell but at least they could not lie about it.
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Jun 30, 2021 02:05
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H110Hawk posted:This continues to make me mad. It seems like 100% lazyness given the rest of the world does it. Probably economic (more training, different parts to stock, warranty service has a SURPRISINGLY expensive and large amount of shelf space basic stocking requirement for a lot of brands) than anything else, but it pisses me off too. It's not done because "they" don't have to, even though these units are better in a lot of ways if you have the service support for them. I want one. But I want one that can be promptly supported and that doesn't exist in my area.
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Jun 30, 2021 02:13
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Motronic posted:Probably economic (more training, different parts to stock, warranty service has a SURPRISINGLY expensive and large amount of shelf space basic stocking requirement for a lot of brands) than anything else, but it pisses me off too. It's not done because "they" don't have to, even though these units are better in a lot of ways if you have the service support for them. I want one. But I want one that can be promptly supported and that doesn't exist in my area. It's what ultimately drove me not to get one as well. Chicken / egg problem until someone forces their hand on it. Manufacturers also don't have to design it in the dumbest way to have a thousand fru's. Hopefully the people's soviet republic of California eventually mandates multispeed units. 
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Jun 30, 2021 02:44
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Motronic posted:One weird Bosch, one weird Daikin......am I missing anything? Every national manufacturer makes units with variable speed motors, it's always their unit with a 2 stage compressor, trane, Bosch, daikan (Goodman/Amana), carrier, I'm pretty sure even Rheem, trane has been making them forever since they always shell out for consumer advertising and want to seem 'the best', nobody carries variable speeds but I mean your blower/condenser fan motors shouldn't be going out very often rich people love these units but my personal opinion is that they're completely unnecessary and over priced
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Jul 1, 2021 03:47
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Ace of Baes posted:Every national manufacturer makes units with variable speed motors, it's always their unit with a 2 stage compressor, trane, Bosch, daikan (Goodman/Amana), carrier, I'm pretty sure even Rheem, trane has been making them forever since they always shell out for consumer advertising and want to seem 'the best', nobody carries variable speeds but I mean your blower/condenser fan motors shouldn't be going out very often We're not talking about variable speed/multi stage systems. Inverter systems are a completely different thing.
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Jul 1, 2021 03:50
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Motronic posted:We're not talking about variable speed/multi stage systems. Inverter systems are a completely different thing. Sorry, random idiot walking in. Could you elaborate? Only because if I ever talk about inverters, I'm talking variable speed, but I'm in a more industrial sector.
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Jul 1, 2021 15:24
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Several manufacturers offer "variable speed" systems in which the only thing that are variable are the fans. They are quieter, but not truly variable to load conditions.
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Jul 1, 2021 15:52
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I have an inverter driven fully variable 4 ton central A/C, a carrier greenspeed. Paid $12000 almost a decade ago, and it has been fantastic. I am never going to recover the cost difference I paid over the 2-speed (almost $5000 iirc, the contractor so I made price it it for me and so had to send their techs to carrier school for it thought I was nuts), but just having silent trickles of cool or warm air since it mostly operates at 50% capacity is fantastic. My temperature swings are a degree or two at most. The outside unit is also almost silent most of the time because of this too, which is great so I don't hear it when I'm out in my yard Qwijib0 fucked around with this message at 16:33 on Jul 1, 2021 |
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Jul 1, 2021 16:26
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Decided to finally get at this messy looking setup in my garage, which is what I believe an original furnace and blower with an AC added on later: It works fine, but the yellow insulation is gross and ugly and has no vapor barrier so I thought I'd look at changing it out. It appears that the duct from the entire setup is just a sheet metal insert that funnels into a box that connects to flex duct, with maybe a half inch gap around the duct where it enters the ceiling and no seal between the sheet metal and the box in the ceiling.    Can I (and should I) just foil tape around where the initial duct funnels into that box? I'm thinking I could then put proper insulation with vapor barrier, wrap around up to an inch or so above the ceiling to 'fill' the gap around the ductwork/box and then tape the remaining perimeter gap in the ceiling? Edit: there's definitely cold air blowing out between the duct/funnel and the box transition to the flex duct, so I'll probably foil tape that. The yellow foam is only for a 6 inch run and I'm pretty sure doesn't do anything so I'm wondering if there's insulation wrap with adhesive on one side so I can easily wrap just the exposed duct below the ceiling. The black gunk is just crud blowing down from the transition above over 7 years or so, and I might be out of DIY territory if I try and seal the gap between the transition box and the ceiling hole. The are probably actual formal terms for what I'm trying to describe and identify but I have no idea what those are... PageMaster fucked around with this message at 03:16 on Jul 4, 2021 |
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Jul 2, 2021 16:04
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Definitely seal up that duct, unless you like wasting money cooling your garage. That flue also looks like it's either angled down or level - it needs to be angled up (I think roughly 1/4" per foot? though that may be on newer condensing furnaces - either way, it needs to be sloped up toward the actual vent). That furnace looks pretty old too - it would be a drat Good Idea to have a couple of carbon monoxide alarms in the home. It's not a matter of if, but when, the heat exchangers in the furnace will crack and start spitting CO into the air. Some furnaces make it 10 years, some make it 50+ - it depends on climate, how much they get used, how well built the thing is, and a bit of luck. The vapor barrier and insulation I wouldn't personally worry about, unless your garage is climate controlled. Hopefully Motronic will be along with more better words; I'm just Handyman Renter, he actually knows fancy stuff like code.
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Jul 9, 2021 11:42
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STR posted:Definitely seal up that duct, unless you like wasting money cooling your garage. That flue also looks like it's either angled down or level - it needs to be angled up (I think roughly 1/4" per foot? though that may be on newer condensing furnaces - either way, it needs to be sloped up toward the actual vent). That furnace looks pretty old too - it would be a drat Good Idea to have a couple of carbon monoxide alarms in the home. It's not a matter of if, but when, the heat exchangers in the furnace will crack and start spitting CO into the air. Some furnaces make it 10 years, some make it 50+ - it depends on climate, how much they get used, how well built the thing is, and a bit of luck. Thanks! Flue is actually sloped up, that was just a bad angle, and we installed the CO detectors on each floor as required (actually finally just wired them and the smoke alarms). The manufacturing label on the furnace is in the back(I think), but the PO said replaced with the AC condenser, and the condenser was manufactured in 2014. We're in CA so I don't plan on ever using the heat, but I would be worried more about the blower/air handler age since AC is pretty constant I've already tried and failed sealing with foil tape twice because the two sections aren't flush and the tape just 'floats' over the gap when I can get it on, but mostly it just rips when I push over the gap. I'm thinking maybe foam weather stripping to fill the gap first, then tape over that? This may all be moot since I can't really get to the back very easily but I'm going to try once I figure out what works
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Jul 9, 2021 17:32
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A few hours ago while our central air was running the house filled with that horrible "something electrical is going up in smoke smell". Narrowed it down to the furnace, opened it up and water was dripping into it from the air inlet. The smell was the safety switch for the door letting out the smoke: Well that could have been so much worse. Bypassed the switch for now. Went outside, looks like the air inlet is just a 90 degree fitting. We had some serious driving sideways rain today, so that explains how the water got in:  Simple fix would be to add another 90 so it's facing down, right? Any reason I'm not thinking of that would be a bad idea?
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Jul 13, 2021 01:23
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Nope thats fine. If you really want to  add some wire mesh to prevent critters from crawling in and making a home while its not running.
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Jul 13, 2021 02:52
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This is the condensate pipe that goes to the pump which carries it out of the basement. I'm pretty sure the pipe is clogged which is making the whole thing drip. I can seem to get it off the threads. Any suggestions? Also if I just have to replace the pipe, is there a good reason why it's this stupid shape?
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Jul 13, 2021 23:47
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Its that stupid shape for a reason, to keep the air in and let the water out. If you're lucky one of those 90 fittings isn't actually glued. if not, you may end up having to rebuild it with pvc fittings. just make a copy of what you had, and press fit but don't glue the first 90 going left out of the air handler.
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Jul 14, 2021 00:14
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MRC48B posted:Its that stupid shape for a reason, to keep the air in and let the water out. aha very cool. I pulled the condensate pump off the unit and the whole pipe assembly wants on the threads inside the drain hole but is indeed glued everywhere. dope
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Jul 14, 2021 00:56
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Danhenge posted:aha very cool. I pulled the condensate pump off the unit and the whole pipe assembly wants on the threads inside the drain hole but is indeed glued everywhere. dope If you do replace it, use this instead: https://www.amazon.com/Rectorseal-83114-113B-Trap-Brush/dp/B00BMUFSGI/ref=pd_lpo_1?pd_rd_i=B00BMUFSGI&psc=1 This gives you 3 easy places to clean it from, and includes a brush that fits the cleaning holes perfectly.
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Jul 14, 2021 01:48
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devicenull posted:If you do replace it, use this instead: https://www.amazon.com/Rectorseal-83114-113B-Trap-Brush/dp/B00BMUFSGI/ref=pd_lpo_1?pd_rd_i=B00BMUFSGI&psc=1 I already cut off the pipe and went to lowes and bought pvc to replace but i haven't yet put anything together and it looks like the plumbing supply store nearby has these things. I'm too tired to fix this tonight but thankfully the upstairs AC where our bedroom is works fine and it's not so hot that the downstairs is unbearable. The whole thing was incredibly stupid because the pipe setup also made it basically impossible to open up the unit itself without cutting off the pipe. Anyway once got the pipe off there was indeed a bunch of black grime that had built up around the drain inside the unit that I vacced up that was probably causing dripping around the hole.
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Jul 14, 2021 02:52
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Sorry to doublepost, but I got it all done and installed. Had to go buy some new condensate tubing and splice it in because I had to cut it off the condensate pump to it free initially, and nobody was selling condensate line that was long enough to reach all the way across my basement. Dry fitting the new pipe out of the AC unit leaks a little bit so I'm going to have to figure out the right pieces to cement vs just friction fit.
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Jul 15, 2021 19:58
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STR posted:
Reaching way back to eat my words; while PO said it was replaced in 2014, I picked off the front panel looking for the control board and found the manufacture date of 2003;. Almost never use heat here, but AC all the time, so what is the life expectancy of one of these and for would I tell if it's going bad?
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Jul 16, 2021 06:17
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You would need to pull it apart and visually inspect the heat exchanger assembly for rust/cracks/holes.
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Jul 16, 2021 14:00
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MRC48B posted:You would need to pull it apart and visually inspect the heat exchanger assembly for rust/cracks/holes. Well I guess we run AC only until inspection/maintenance and save up for a replacement. Edit: popped a fuse installing our nest so maybe sooner than later if I can't figure out how to replace it. PageMaster fucked around with this message at 16:50 on Jul 16, 2021 |
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Jul 16, 2021 16:38
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I am trying to figure out how to get my furnace to run in a fan only mode. It's been unnaturally hot where I live and I currently don't have AC so I wanted to to use my furnace to circulate air around my house to hopefully make it a bit more comfortable. My thermostat only has wires from the furnace going to terminals R and W. On my furnace I tried to short terminals R to G to just turn on the fan, when I do that I hear a relay click but the blower does not turn on. I was trying to replicate this video below, minus the switch at the moment, but it doesn't seem to be working. Any idea on what I'm doing wrong or if it's dumb idea on what I'm trying to do? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5IxghVYhYY&t=122s
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Jul 17, 2021 01:30
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if it's going click but not moving air, it means no one wired the fan motor to the furnace board for fan only operation. if you want help from this thread you need to post pictures of the wiring so we can see what's up.
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Jul 17, 2021 01:46
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