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PageMaster posted:I think someone mentioned something similar above but maybe it's just quicker and easier for plumbers to knock out project after project with everyone doing renovation work right now. Two did say that the acidic and hard water keeps then from ever doing copper, but another refused to do PEX because it's a time bomb and he's read all the studies that the PEX industry is keeping from being released. Very strong opinions here apparently. I had Kitec piping in my condo that had to get replaced with regular pe because it apparently IS a ticking time bomb.
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Jun 29, 2021 00:01
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SpartanIvy posted:I realize this is an ironic opinion since I have uponor, but those copper press fittings with o-rings making the seal give me pause. Just seems like a more expensive shark-bite system to me. Yeah, if you get a 'copper' repipe, there's a good chance the plumber will use propress. Sweating pipe, especially in tight areas, is a dying art, and time is money. It's better than sharkbite, but you're betting your future on an oring.
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Jun 29, 2021 00:11
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So which do you trust least, PEX B or copper with Sharkbite fittings?
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Jun 29, 2021 00:28
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SkunkDuster posted:So which do you trust least, PEX B or copper with Sharkbite fittings? You need to define a time scale for that.
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Jun 29, 2021 00:36
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Well I put in the PEX to get rid of 30 year old polybutylene which was also poised to explode any day, so I guess my only winning move was to not buy a house.
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Jun 29, 2021 01:07
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PageMaster posted:Well I put in the PEX to get rid of 30 year old polybutylene which was also poised to explode any day, so I guess my only winning move was to not buy a house. You have officially transcended into "those who know the Truth".
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Jun 29, 2021 01:12
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MY pipes harv been lead for my hole life and aiunt nothing gone wrong with them!!!11!
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Jun 29, 2021 01:41
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The main thing with plumbers going to all-PEX vs copper is the liability insurance premiums are a lot lower and permitting can be a lot cheaper as well. I have one run of PEX in my garage to a sillcock; it's in a spot where I can get at it to replace it if it fails. I have another 70-LF run out to my wife's herb garden plots, some of which I left exposed to sunlight. The rest of my garage, and all of my house, is copper. My neighbor ran a PEX feed through his unheated garage. So far it's handled five winters of being frozen solid. That is a chance I would not take. I have to say, working with Sharkbites on copper is definitely faster & easier...but I can't say I trust them like I do trust copper. Now drain / soil lines...PVC is the poo poo. I did a little iron work when I was younger. Even without leaded joints: gently caress that.
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Jun 29, 2021 03:42
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This may be a dumb question but I know that they make pvc that can withstand pressure so why not use pvc as a general plumbing pipe for the supply side of things too?
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Jun 29, 2021 13:23
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KKKLIP ART posted:This may be a dumb question but I know that they make pvc that can withstand pressure so why not use pvc as a general plumbing pipe for the supply side of things too? They do. Technically, PVC (Sch 40) can be used for potable water lines as long as it's not hot water. PVC starts to weaken around 140F, which is possible with a water heater. CPVC withstands up to around 200, so it's considered safer to use. PVC isn't significantly cheaper than CPVC, and it's not worth trying to mess with 2 different pipe types, so usually they just use CPVC everywhere. PVC still has all the downsides of CPVC, brittle with time, glue set time, etc., so you're not gaining anything.
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Jun 29, 2021 13:53
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PainterofCrap posted:My neighbor ran a PEX feed through his unheated garage. So far it's handled five winters of being frozen solid. That is a chance I would not take.  Frozen solid with water inside?? I thought "probably won't burst if it freezes" was a bonus for an early freeze if you miss turning off the water once or twice, not a design feature to plan around.
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Jun 29, 2021 13:53
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That is another thing - I'm in socal. The odds of us having a hard freeze are nearly nil. Sure it dips below freezing here and there but I can count on 0 fingers the number of people I know who have had a pipe burst. We all have exposed uninsulated hard pipes (copper or decrepit galvanized). My main service is outside my front door and has probably 3 linear feet of exposed pipe, my hot water heater is the same, and it's tankless so at night it's unheated. Unless it has freeze protection? Not clear where the water would go if it did.
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Jun 29, 2021 17:51
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Well you'll be poo poo outta luck when the next ice age starts. Any day now if you listen to my grandfather.
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Jun 29, 2021 18:24
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I fixed my plumbing issue  I asked on reddit and someone suggested backflushing the hot water supply line, which resolved the problem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rO2Gg3N4Vhk 0:42-1:06 in the video
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Jun 29, 2021 20:09
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actionjackson posted:I fixed my plumbing issue Was there some big piece of gunk in the pipe or something?
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Jun 29, 2021 21:29
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SpartanIvy posted:Was there some big piece of gunk in the pipe or something? nothing huge, but a decent amount of small black debris. when I turned the water to hot it made that kind of "pop - psssshh" noise like you get when turning on the water after the main water supply has been off for a while.
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Jun 29, 2021 22:54
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actionjackson posted:I fixed my plumbing issue  congratulations! It doesn't take much to stop up a faucet.
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Jun 29, 2021 23:45
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Interestingly enough Pfister didn't mention this at all. as annoying as reddit is, their plumbing page saved me here
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Jun 30, 2021 00:44
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Blowjob Overtime posted:
It was more of a proof-of-concept when the garage was just basic stick & siding, so no loss if it blew. The whole run is in a heated space now
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Jun 30, 2021 00:48
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PainterofCrap posted:It was more of a proof-of-concept when the garage was just basic stick & siding, so no loss if it blew. I've done the same multiple times over multiple years in my old barn. Not intentionally, but it's happened and I wasn't too balled up about it because everything is open and easy to replace. It's held up fine and is doing so to this day 7 or 8 year later.
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Jun 30, 2021 00:54
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An extremely cool thing happened today. We closed on our townhome and are officially property owners, which we thought would take decades in LA! We also got a notice from the HOA board that they're replacing the pipe from the water main into our utility box on account of it being corroded, 47-year old galvanized steel and replacing it with copper. We also discovered that our internal pipes are made of the same 47 year old galvanized steel and are unsure of whether or not there's similar issues internally. Thus, the HOA is asking everyone to sign a waiver indicating that they expect the water pressure into the homes to increase and that it's in the interest of everyone who hasn't repiped internally to do so as a risk management issue. Some basic facts: - 1200 Sq. Ft 2-story townhome with attached, private 2 car garage below housing all utility connections (i.e. there's no external piping we would be responsible for and there's 3 stories in total if you count that garage as one) - All our plumbed fixtures are on one side of the house, with the master bath and kitchen being in a vertical stack above each other on the southwest corner and the powder room in the northwest corner - No obvious indicators of internal pipe wear (discolored water, iron staining, etc.) anywhere in the house from us or the inspector. - Brand new hot water heater is in place which says to me that someone at least has looked at this stuff on some level in the last year or two. Here are the complicating factors and questions: 1. Is it worth having a plumber specifically come out and take a look? 2. Is it worth having the pipes replaced due to their age/material even if they're nominally okay now? I don't mind spending a few grand immediately, but I hesitate a bit about dropping like $15k immediately if it's going to be expensive. I'd probably want to just go with PEX since this isn't a house we're going to be in for 25 years anyways but don't know enough about these materials to really understand if that's insane or not. 3. Our intent in the next 2 years or so is to split the jack and jill upstairs into two separate bathrooms (there's already a vanity on each side, so likely just adding a shower and toilet). If we re-pipe, I have to assume that at least having a rough-in done simultaneously would be cost-effective if not doing the whole thing?
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Jul 2, 2021 00:47
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TheGreyGhost posted:An extremely cool thing happened today. We closed on our townhome and are officially property owners, which we thought would take decades in LA! Did you get a water pressure reading when they inspected your townhouse? Is your HOA going to be putting in pressure regulation at all? At what pressure? I would have someone out to look and give you a bid on it at least, the HOA is telling you to do this. That should be free. 50 years is nominally the lifespan of galvanized, and your HOA is doing the right thing and getting ahead of the issue. I can't imagine it being $15k but it will probably be over $5k. If you have plans but not time/money to do the split bathroom then I would make sure the "trunk" line up is big enough to support it and ensure they put in a little access box. Given they're going to have to bash open walls to do the bathroom renovation anyways I wouldn't worry about stubbing it out. Get a few bids, heck throw in one from those sketchy REPIPE TODAY!!!! companies where this is all they do just for giggles. Pretty sure that's who my contractor subbed my house out to. Unfortunately this may just be the short straw for you on maintenance.
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Jul 2, 2021 01:09
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H110Hawk posted:Did you get a water pressure reading when they inspected your townhouse? Is your HOA going to be putting in pressure regulation at all? At what pressure? I'm going to have to check the inspection report to confirm. Right now, the way the upstairs works, it's essentially a regular shotgun vanity/toilet/combo showertub with the wall across from the toilet open into the other bedroom where there's a vanity outside of the external wall. The idea is essentially to wall off that small corridor and the existing door, leave that vanity placement, and reclaim the closet portion of the corridor as the shower/toilet zone. There's pretty good precedent for it, since a number of units in the HOA have already done it--it's just always a question of efficiency to me since I hate having to have stuff reworked that soon after.
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Jul 2, 2021 01:16
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Sorry I'm just catching up on this thread after a long week.B-Nasty posted:Yeah, if you get a 'copper' repipe, there's a good chance the plumber will use propress. Sweating pipe, especially in tight areas, is a dying art, and time is money. That's why you only get quotes from companies that will sweat the pipe. And here's a pro-tip: if you're on City water, or even on well but near a city, you can probably call in to a municipal water department service yard, and just ask if anyone does plumbing work on the side. A lot of times the O&M techs will do pipe work as a side job, and you end up with an install that is cleaner and better than most of the plumbing companies will do. PageMaster posted:I think someone mentioned something similar above but maybe it's just quicker and easier for plumbers to knock out project after project with everyone doing renovation work right now. Two did say that the acidic and hard water keeps then from ever doing copper, but another refused to do PEX because it's a time bomb and he's read all the studies that the PEX industry is keeping from being released. Very strong opinions here apparently. Acidic water is definitely a valid concern with copper, moreseo with the solder used than the actual pipe material, but it would need to be pretty acidic to see impact (i.e., probably less than a pH of 6.0-6.5). Hard water doesn't really do much to copper - we have really hard water here, and when we've removed 30-40 year old copper, it looked pretty good. B-Nasty posted:They do. Just a correction: 140-deg F and 200-deg F are the maximum working temperatures for PVC and CPVC, but the pressure derates much sooner. The indicated maximum working pressure for each is at 73-deg F the last time I checked, and derates above that. So for example, here in Phoenix, it's obviously not uncommon to get ambient temperatures in the 110s deg F, so any exposed PVC or CPVC may start to see joint failure at around 60-70 psi. Still decent, but given a lot of systems are running at 70 psi minimum here, it's a chance not worth taking. PVC/CPVC joints also don't respond well to water hammer, and so when you combine temperatures above 73-deg F and quick-closing solenoids on washing machines and dishwashers, yeah, it's not ideal.
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Jul 2, 2021 16:59
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Thought I would ask a quick question just incase anyone knows off hand. I'm looking to install a new bar shower in my bathroom and for Reasons it needs to have exposed surface pipes. I want to use a Grohe Grohtherm 2000 bar shower so I need some backplate elbows for it, how do I tell which backplate elbows will do the job? Grohe make a backplate elbow https://www.plumbingforless.co.uk/showers/shower-fixings/grohe-backplate-wall-union-elbows-pair-chrome-18862-000 Which works with 'compatible' Grohe showers but which are those? Anyone happen to know what it is i need here. UK by the way.
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Jul 2, 2021 19:18
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Thanks. I don't believe our water is THAT acidic, but the water quality report doesn't list that. The city is getting back to me for my own curiosity.
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Jul 2, 2021 19:35
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When we get heavy long rains and the water table raises we have groundwater coming up into the basement. It's a 1924 construction and I think it was built with a dirt basement floor. There is now concrete but it's patchy and of varying quality. Would putting in a sump without drainage tile help at all with keeping the groundwater below the basement at bay or would tile really be needed? I got a quote for perimeter drains awhile back but it's a bit more than what I wanted to spend at the moment.
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Jul 4, 2021 06:21
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 Oh god dammit. At least it waited until after we were back from vacation yesterday. It’s leaking during the recharge cycle when it fills the media tank up initially.   Yep, that’ll do it. Put it in bypass and a replacement o-ring kit for the water softener and some replacement clips that I broke are on the way. Worth gambling $62 on, even though this softener has an ‘02 date code. devmd01 fucked around with this message at 20:10 on Jul 5, 2021 |
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Jul 5, 2021 20:07
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The Slack Lagoon posted:When we get heavy long rains and the water table raises we have groundwater coming up into the basement. It's a 1924 construction and I think it was built with a dirt basement floor. There is now concrete but it's patchy and of varying quality. It probably wouldn't really help you all that much, because for your circumstances, you have to treat your basement basically like an excavation pit that needs to be kept dewatered, and typically you would see the excavation area surrounded by dewatering pumps/wells to keep the water below the excavation floor. So while a sump may help some, I don't think it'd end up being worth the money you would spend in the long run.
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Jul 9, 2021 18:52
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SourKraut posted:It probably wouldn't really help you all that much, because for your circumstances, you have to treat your basement basically like an excavation pit that needs to be kept dewatered, and typically you would see the excavation area surrounded by dewatering pumps/wells to keep the water below the excavation floor. Definitely. A weeping tile running the perimeter of the goon's basement would be the best bet. I don't know where they are, but around my area (Toronto) they have been making people discharge their sump pumps in to wells in their yards as opposed to the old way of discharging in to the storm sewers. This has the benefits of less strain on storm sewers, particularly during heavy rains and also it helps recharge ground water resources. Draw backs of course are that you're basically "recycling" the water from sump - well - ground - back to sump - back to well for longer period, until the groundwater level drops to the static level. Their municipality may be different obvs.
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Jul 9, 2021 19:58
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AmbassadorofSodomy posted:I don't know where they are, but around my area (Toronto) they have been making people discharge their sump pumps in to wells in their yards as opposed to the old way of discharging in to the storm sewers. They showed a house near Boston that had to do that on a recent season of This Old House (snippit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYUlab-_Oe0) So, the renovation of their house triggered what was probably a $60,000+ expense of basically building a septic tank in their yard for rainwater.
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Jul 9, 2021 20:08
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B-Nasty posted:They showed a house near Boston that had to do that on a recent season of This Old House (snippit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYUlab-_Oe0)  !!!!!I don't think city of Toronto is so extreme with this, but I'm doing a lot more work the last several years WRT infiltration systems, Seems like every other job I'm doing holes for percolation tests. I don't know exactly what the criteria for it is either, some houses get it, some don't and its not always just the tear down and rebuilds. But nor is it, just houses getting large additions either.
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Jul 9, 2021 22:03
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B-Nasty posted:They showed a house near Boston that had to do that on a recent season of This Old House (snippit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYUlab-_Oe0) In the video he says it's about $25,000 and it's triggered because they built a giant garage with driveway to eat up a ton of permeable space on the lot.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:21
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FISHMANPET posted:In the video he says it's about $25,000 and it's triggered because they built a giant garage with driveway to eat up a ton of permeable space on the lot. Yeah, but I'm assuming that's with TOH kickbacks and the fact that they already have equipment. There's no way, in a suburb of Boston, post-COVID, that project doesn't cost at least 40K. I was actually thinking of another episode where a dual-doctor couple near Boston had to do the same thing when they enlarged their house. I mean, it's not going to hurt 2 doctors that bad on top of probably a $500K reno, but I'm sure it still made them choke a bit. I can think of much better ways to spend those tens of thousands than something that adds zero value to the home.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:55
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AmbassadorofSodomy posted:Definitely. A weeping tile running the perimeter of the goon's basement would be the best bet. I had received a quote from a company that said the best solution was digging down and putting a french drain on the perimeter of the basement and a sump to pump it out. Is this what you're calling weeping tile?
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Jul 10, 2021 01:23
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What I call a weeping tile is a corrugated plastic pipe with fabric around it that allows water in to it, and channels it to.... "Somewhere" a sump pimp in this case. Typically they get covered with some pea gravel on top of that, followed by soil. TBH I don't know what a french drain is but its probably the same poo poo. If you're reasonably handy, this isn't out of the realm of a diy project. While you do need to hook up your sump pump to something, sewer etc.. which may require a permit of some sort, the major cost of a project like this is the labour. Digging. A mini excavator and a weekend or two could save you thousands. Even if you just did the digging yourself and had a contractor drop in the tile, and hook up the pump. Don't forget to call before you dig E: yeah looks like french drain = weeping tile. Or approximately equivalent: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_drain wesleywillis fucked around with this message at 03:21 on Jul 10, 2021 |
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Jul 10, 2021 01:36
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The Slack Lagoon posted:When we get heavy long rains and the water table raises we have groundwater coming up into the basement. It's a 1924 construction and I think it was built with a dirt basement floor. There is now concrete but it's patchy and of varying quality. My house was built around 1930 in a drained swamp in southern New Jersey. The soil is sand, and my house has no footings. Cinderblock straight on the sand. Originally the basement was dirt, with concrete only under the chimney stack and a pad for a coal-fired furnace (originally the furnace was in the dining room. I found the tie-in in the wall between there and the kitchen, where the chimney was located before I tore it out). Some time not long after WWII, they poured a puddled-concrete slab down there; in some places it was 3" thick; in others, less than 1/2" When we bought the place in 1992, there was an ancient Speed Queen pump in a steel crock along one long wall. The basement floor was fractured with a few dirt spots. It flooded in the spring of '93 and stayed that way until October. Perversely, no water ever seemed to enter the crock - it was the driest spot down there. When we finally saved enough to get it waterproofed, I asked the guy the same question you did: large perforated crock vs. full perimeter pipe? After asking for a shovel, he dug a 1-foot-deep hole in one dirt spot. We then walked around outside, looking at the gutters and the lay of my yard. Ten minutes later, we came back to the basement, and the hole was full of water. We got the perimeter drain system. No regrets.
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Jul 10, 2021 03:18
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AmbassadorofSodomy posted:sump pimp Huge letdown if there isn’t a plumbers-only bowling team called the Sump Pimps
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Jul 10, 2021 03:30
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The Slack Lagoon posted:I had received a quote from a company that said the best solution was digging down and putting a french drain on the perimeter of the basement and a sump to pump it out. Is this what you're calling weeping tile? The difference between a French drain and weeping tile is specificity. Proper weeping tile, that you tie into a sump, should be right at the footings. You can call that a "french drain" and that might be accurate in general, but a "french drain" can also be at grade. This is NOT what you want as a solution here. You want it at your footing depth and tied into an internal sump pit. "Weeping tile" is called this because it literally used to be permeable tile pipe put around the perimeter of your footings. Today this will be plastic corrugated pipe with a sock over it.
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Jul 10, 2021 03:35
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PainterofCrap posted:My house was built around 1930 in a drained swamp in southern New Jersey. The soil is sand, and my house has no footings. Cinderblock straight on the sand. This sounds like our basement. Has the perimeter drain worked well? Motronic posted:The difference between a French drain and weeping tile is specificity. Proper weeping tile, that you tie into a sump, should be right at the footings. You can call that a "french drain" and that might be accurate in general, but a "french drain" can also be at grade. This is NOT what you want as a solution here. You want it at your footing depth and tied into an internal sump pit. I think it may be regional differences for what people are calling things - the quote was for a 'french drain', along the inside perimeter of the basement walls. Perforated pipe surrounded by crashed stone and topped with concrete, which leads to a sump
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Jul 10, 2021 05:10
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