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david_a posted:Is there some in-universe explanation for why the colonists didn’t send out any info on the aliens? I would think there would be enough time between one person being infected to the colony being overrun that they could send out a status update with something like “hey so we found some weird critters out here, we’re dealing with it though no worries” Could be two things, they did and it was ignored/not told to the Sulaco crew OR things went to poo poo so quickly they couldn't send anything out in time.
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Jul 9, 2021 16:04
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Darko posted:Yeah, I figure the progression is: david_a posted:Is there some in-universe explanation for why the colonists didn’t send out any info on the aliens? I would think there would be enough time between one person being infected to the colony being overrun that they could send out a status update with something like “hey so we found some weird critters out here, we’re dealing with it though no worries” To me, I assumed something like Alien Isolation where maybe two or three people total would have actually gotten info from the colony, and Burke was like "wow some new life to send a team to I'll get right on that thanks guys also this is mega-hyper classified great job everyone!" and anyone else involved just moved on with doing their jobs. Isolation's docs and stuff you find throughout have such a great left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing corporate distancing between people, I mean stuff like that happens irl so I don't think it's a big stretch when you have an actively malicious character like Burke. The real explanation of course is that one of the aliens bit off and consume the head of one of the colonists and then just repeatedly transmitted the everything is a-okay message in their voice like how Alien was originally going to end. 
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Jul 9, 2021 17:10
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Neo Rasa posted:The real explanation of course is that one of the aliens bit off and consume the head of one of the colonists and then just repeatedly transmitted the everything is a-okay message in their voice like how Alien was originally going to end. 
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Jul 9, 2021 17:27
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david_a posted:Is there some in-universe explanation for why the colonists didn’t send out any info on the aliens? I would think there would be enough time between one person being infected to the colony being overrun that they could send out a status update with something like “hey so we found some weird critters out here, we’re dealing with it though no worries” The short version is that such communications were kept in-house in the colony until it was too late, and then things went to poo poo really fast - there actually is a novel that spells out how the colony went down: Alien: River of Pain (Novel #3) https://www.amazon.com/dp/1781162727/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_PB5WKNG5K9ZVHNEQVK43 There’s also an Audible audio drama version if that’s your thing.
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Jul 9, 2021 17:28
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Xenomrph posted:The short version is that such communications were kept in-house in the colony until it was too late, and then things went to poo poo really fast - there actually is a novel that spells out how the colony went down: It makes sense if we say Kane and then Ripley in Alien 3 are outliers and that in general the process is pretty fast like in AvP/Prometheus/Covenant In general though yeah I totally buy how people would keep that thing in-house, it's not like Burke is the only dipshit out there or/and doesn't realize the danger of the things.
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Jul 9, 2021 17:32
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For a colony like that it might not be very unusual to encounter a new life form that they'd take samples of and do tests in the lab, etc. It might not be the kind of thing that warrants an immediate report, maybe they were just like "oh another alien bug to study, we'll include it in the bi-weekly report".
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Jul 9, 2021 17:39
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Maybe that guy is always getting infected with weird parasites, so they were like "old man newt, at it again" yawn
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Jul 9, 2021 18:28
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If you permit a moment’s cynicism, the weird gaps and implications that people like Sunkos and Neo Rasa are talking about exist because Cameron wanted a “Burke is behind it all and Bishop is actually good” twist, but doesn’t lay the groundwork for it. Consequently, we have a bunch of scenes where Bishop acts extremely suspicious for no clear reason, and Burke’s side of the scheme doesn’t make much sense either. So the movie’s story is telling you that Bishop is really nice, and we should feel sad when he’s impaled. But, strictly speaking, Bishop doesn’t actually do anything good. Like, okay, he gets the survivors to the Sulaco - but he also ‘accidentally’ brings up the Queen somehow. And, if you go by the sequel, he also brings up one or two additional aliens. Besides the stuff covered elsewhere, we also have the basic symbolism of Bishop getting his chest burst. The Queen emerges from Bishop, with a sort of symbolic rebirth. So the conflict of Bishop versus Queen, such as it is, stands for a conflict in Bishop’s own programming. He’s programmed to preserve human life, but also clearly programmed to assist in illegal activities that would lead to the manufacture and sale of deadly bioweapons.
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Jul 9, 2021 18:31
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Darko posted:The point of both movies was deconstructing that macho 80s stuff by having the machismo emasculated or controlled by vaginas. Literally. Except Arnie win in the end. Maybe Ripley is a fuller deconstruction but the fact remains the movies gave me a cast of characters and I didn't much like them. That's kind of a problem outside of a slasher film I prefer my space truckers, which I've heard Alien popularized. Dunno if that's true but I still like it. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Jul 9, 2021 |
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Jul 9, 2021 21:19
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NikkolasKing posted:Except Arnie win in the end. Maybe Ripley is a fuller deconstruction but the fact remains the movies gave me a cast of characters and I didn't much like them. That's kind of a problem outside of a slasher film Arnie won only after getting rid of his ridiculous 80s machismo-stand-in weaponry (McTiernan actually stated to purposefully make fun of this when they leveled the forest shooting randomly), having the ridiculous 80s Commando-styled strength completely rendered useless (he didn't cause the Predator any pain whatsoever and dropped the one liners - and was shown to be completely bloodied, which 80s heroes weren't doing except for McTeirnan directed with Die Hard taking the latter idea further). Having to depend on crawling away in fear and getting lucky from traps was completely counter the 80s hero. The first half of Predator was establishing the 80s hero completely to the point of Arnold throwing knives hard enough to pin dudes to a wall and then spouting catch phrases, homophobia and overly sexual (tyrannosaurus) talk from the male characters and invincible action hero gun shooting mowing down all the bad guys, only for the second half of the movie to end up with a bunch of scared guys crying, in total fear, and just running and crawling. It's a different kind of flip than Aliens, which had the guns and dicks always there but had women controlling everyone in the second half, but a good one, imo. No issues with you preferring one or the other on an aesthetic level, just wanted to point out the context of both being a commentary on what you don't like.
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Jul 9, 2021 22:54
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Darko posted:Arnie won only after getting rid of his ridiculous 80s machismo-stand-in weaponry (McTiernan actually stated to purposefully make fun of this when they leveled the forest shooting randomly), having the ridiculous 80s Commando-styled strength completely rendered useless (he didn't cause the Predator any pain whatsoever and dropped the one liners - and was shown to be completely bloodied, which 80s heroes weren't doing except for McTeirnan directed with Die Hard taking the latter idea further). Having to depend on crawling away in fear and getting lucky from traps was completely counter the 80s hero. Also in Predator 2 they say he died from his wounds too so the Predator did in fact succeed in killing Arnold, while the Predator went out on their own terms by nuking the area. Still he does defeat the Predator by with imagery from both sexes by luring it into a ravine and then dropping a giant log on it. Alan "Dutch" Schaefer is the Kwisatz Haderach.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:02
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Neo Rasa posted:This is a character type you can play in the recent tabletop RPG where you're an android but there's some specific order/thing that if you run into you just hard lock into "must do X thing until it is done" Can you role play that? Like Ash in the first movie sort of thing where the other players don't know your decisions are hard wired? Because that sounds pretty cool. If the other members of the party are aware of your directive it seems kind of boring and pointless to me.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:08
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BiggerBoat posted:Can you role play that? Like Ash in the first movie sort of thing where the other players don't know your decisions are hard wired? Because that sounds pretty cool. If the other members of the party are aware of your directive it seems kind of boring and pointless to me. You can and it's pretty cool. The game is made so you can play one session scenarios where "stereotypical alien poo poo happens" so it's kind of obvious there is someone is acting off. But running a campaign in it is basically long term space truckin' you can play the long con with that stuff and have other situations where corporations gently caress with people that aren't directly alien-related. Or have it so the player is aware they're an android but have to keep it a secret for [whatever story reasons] so the player has to like, pretend to panic/make rolls for stress even though rules for panic/etc. don't apply to androids. The way the system works is really cool for this basically as more poo poo happens you roll for and end up getting stress points. The more stressed out you are, the MORE dice you get to roll when you want to do poo poo, but the more variety of erratic stuff that you didn't quite intend is possible from the results. Android players don't get stress points but have to fake it by making the rolls/noting it and such if they want to be undercover, other players can tell you're an android if role play it too calm and steady or if you act TOO off to look like you're freaking out or forget to roll your extra dice. You could even do an opposite Alien 3 Bishop sort of situation where one or more players is randomly selected to be an android by the DM, so they legit don't know they're an android until they suffer an injury. So playing an android is pretty interesting and they made a good variety of stuff possible with it. That said, it's probably better suited to one session games.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:27
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Neo Rasa posted:Also in Predator 2 they say he died from his wounds too so the Predator did in fact succeed in killing Arnold, while the Predator went out on their own terms by nuking the area. Also for what it’s worth the recent (and surprisingly good) Predator: Hunting Grounds videogame has been treating itself as a canonical sequel to the movies, and has even brought back Dutch (voiced by Arnold and using his likeness) and even just brought back Isabelle from ‘Predators’ (voiced by Alice Braga) There is a whole meta-narrative in the game with audio logs you can pick up, and a bunch are by Dutch and explain what he’s been doing since the events of ‘Predator’. https://youtu.be/Vw9Vjh0gGP0 Xenomrph fucked around with this message at 23:37 on Jul 9, 2021 |
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Jul 9, 2021 23:33
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Xenomrph posted:I don’t think that’s accurate. You're right I very strongly misremembered https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0-RU44jRqo The novelization has him hospitalized after being rescued and also stricken with some alien radiation poisoning from being too near the nuke and it's there that he gets to interact with Keyes, after which he leaves (escapes? I forget if he was being held but probably) and is never seen again. Xenomrph posted:Predator: Hunting Grounds I completely forgot this game existed and will definitely check it out.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:43
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“Where is Dutch” is also a major plot point of the first few arcs of the Dark Horse Predator comics, and features Dutch’s brother (who is an NYPD cop). It’s actually handled a lot better than you’d expect. Well, other than them not actually resolving where Dutch is, I guess. 
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Jul 9, 2021 23:49
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BiggerBoat posted:Can you role play that? Like Ash in the first movie sort of thing where the other players don't know your decisions are hard wired? Because that sounds pretty cool. If the other members of the party are aware of your directive it seems kind of boring and pointless to me. Yes. I forget the specifics, but the Game Master is supposed to slip each player a piece of paper, but only the secret android gets one with a directive or something. The Alien RPG is pretty cool with all the different ways you can play. Just needs a Predator expansion.
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Jul 9, 2021 23:54
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Xenomrph posted:“Where is Dutch” is also a major plot point of the first few arcs of the Dark Horse Predator comics, and features Dutch’s brother (who is an NYPD cop). It’s actually handled a lot better than you’d expect. I read those as a kid but was too young/stupid to understand how rad they were, was pleasantly surprised when the omnibuses came out and they hold up pretty well! Open Marriage Night posted:Yes. I forget the specifics, but the Game Master is supposed to slip each player a piece of paper, but only the secret android gets one with a directive or something. The Alien RPG is pretty cool with all the different ways you can play. I feel like this is inevitable, there's a big Colonial Marines expansion coming out this year, I think it's slightly larger than the actual main book for the game lol
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Jul 9, 2021 23:57
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The PDF version of the Colonial Marines expansion is out, I’m in it as a name-dropped NPC. 
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Jul 10, 2021 00:14
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Xenomrph posted:The PDF version of the Colonial Marines expansion is out, I’m in it as a name-dropped NPC. "WHERE'S XENOMRPHSKI!" that fuckin' rules
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Jul 10, 2021 00:29
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Neo Rasa posted:"WHERE'S XENOMRPHSKI!" I’m on pages 200 and 203.  
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Jul 10, 2021 01:10
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That's fantastic! Now I need to know whether Vaughn succeeds in taking you out or not.
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Jul 10, 2021 03:28
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DorianGravy posted:That's fantastic! Now I need to know whether Vaughn succeeds in taking you out or not. I won't lie to myself about my chances, but I have my sympathies. 
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Jul 10, 2021 03:46
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Predator Hunting Grounds is Not Good because it would take 30 minutes for me to play as a predator so I never did and it was just a generic shooter
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Jul 10, 2021 15:22
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CelticPredator posted:Predator Hunting Grounds is Not Good because it would take 30 minutes for me to play as a predator so I never did and it was just a generic shooter Actually the game is cool and fun and good, I had a lot of fun even just playing as a human
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Jul 10, 2021 15:32
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It’s boring. It’s just call of duty with a familiar antagonist . I hate these online only games. I want to be the cool villain
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Jul 10, 2021 23:18
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Darko posted:Arnie won only after getting rid of his ridiculous 80s machismo-stand-in weaponry (McTiernan actually stated to purposefully make fun of this when they leveled the forest shooting randomly), having the ridiculous 80s Commando-styled strength completely rendered useless (he didn't cause the Predator any pain whatsoever and dropped the one liners - and was shown to be completely bloodied, which 80s heroes weren't doing except for McTeirnan directed with Die Hard taking the latter idea further). Having to depend on crawling away in fear and getting lucky from traps was completely counter the 80s hero. This is why Predator is a great film. Neo Rasa posted:Also in Predator 2 they say he died from his wounds too so the Predator did in fact succeed in killing Arnold, while the Predator went out on their own terms by nuking the area. This is why Predator 2 isn't. I really need to give Predator 2 another watch speaking off, it's been too long.
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Jul 11, 2021 04:33
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Predator 2 is cool and good, I’m sure you will recognize this when you rewatch it.
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Jul 11, 2021 05:23
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Predator 2 is incredible.
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Jul 11, 2021 05:36
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RikrsTLYylk I remember this and so many other lines from Predator 2. It's a very quotable movie.
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Jul 11, 2021 06:23
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“El Scorpio iz reeeeadddyy!!”
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Jul 11, 2021 07:06
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Does anyone happen to have handy the website that broke down in detail who added which elements to Alien? If I recall correctly, the takeaway was that O'Bannon's screenplay was essentially rewritten from the ground up by Shusett (?) and Scott. There was lots of talk about O'Bannon and the pyramids. I read it a couple of years back and a friend who loved Shock Value was interested in taking a look.
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Jul 11, 2021 14:25
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feedmyleg posted:Does anyone happen to have handy the website that broke down in detail who added which elements to Alien? If I recall correctly, the takeaway was that O'Bannon's screenplay was essentially rewritten from the ground up by Shusett (?) and Scott. There was lots of talk about O'Bannon and the pyramids. I read it a couple of years back and a friend who loved Shock Value was interested in taking a look. There’s probably a lot of those, but I really like Strange Shapes. You might be thinking of the Writing Alien article.
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Jul 11, 2021 14:42
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The Queen pooping the egg out in the Sulaco could be plausible. If you rewatch her running towards the elevator after Ripley, you can see what could be her egg laying cloaca or whatever the gently caress you want to call it. The egg sac she tore away from may be to help multiple eggs mature quicker at the same time or whatnot. So maybe she had one waiting to go when Ripley ruined it all, she popped it out on the Sulaco but it was still immature, and it took time to mature by itself and opened a short time later. NOW GO LOOK AT HER GENITALS!
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Jul 11, 2021 17:23
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feedmyleg posted:Does anyone happen to have handy the website that broke down in detail who added which elements to Alien? If I recall correctly, the takeaway was that O'Bannon's screenplay was essentially rewritten from the ground up by Shusett (?) and Scott. There was lots of talk about O'Bannon and the pyramids. I read it a couple of years back and a friend who loved Shock Value was interested in taking a look. One thing I remember that was interesting from the quadilogy/anthology documentaries was that Ash not being on the level/the corporation loving them over was contributed by either Hill or Giler. And even though they finding the eggs in a ship instead of pyramid like originally written, I like the sort of pharaonic bits of the company logo/etc. we see in Alien and that really committed "the company was here before you, it will be here after you" omnipresence of it, even that far out in space with Ash and them being worried about how many shares they're going to get and stuff.
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Jul 11, 2021 18:39
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Alien fanboy reporting in. One of my favorite novelizations is Alien: Tribes. The illustrations are beautiful and awful, and the whole description of the Berserker was awe-inspiring to my 10 year old mind. Just a complete engine of destruction and insanity. It feels like if you're strapped into one of those, there's not really any coming back, right? I own a pair of Alien Stompers and I love em. If I had to pick a FAVORITE, I guess Aliens, but it depends what I'm in the mood for. Predator is still my favorite. Also, and I don't want to rock the boat here, but I hated AVP but thought that AVP:R was a lot of fun since all of the humans ended up being expendable. It's not a great movie in any capacity but it's fun.
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Jul 12, 2021 19:11
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Floodixor posted:Also, and I don't want to rock the boat here, but I hated AVP but thought that AVP:R was a lot of fun since all of the humans ended up being expendable. It's not a great movie in any capacity but it's fun. I agree with this completely, AvP1 is watchable but it just, like, it's so close to being awesome but just isn't for a lot of reasons imo. I really hate it because of that it feels like a real waste of a good cast and sets and stuff. Wasn't a fan of the Predator faces in it, the Captain Predator with the cape and stuff owned though. AVP:R is honestly kind of a worse movie overall but I like how they just said gently caress it and made like, it feels sort of grindhousy like it's the meaner lower budget knockoff of some hypothetical big AvP film released the same year, but with an actual budget. Neo Rasa fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Jul 12, 2021 |
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Jul 12, 2021 20:47
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david_a posted:There’s probably a lot of those, but I really like Strange Shapes. You might be thinking of the Writing Alien article. That second link is mind blowing. I'd read the O'Bannon and Shuesset draft awhile back, and had always just assumed it was a smooth road to the final product based on the similarities. Never in a million years would I have guessed O'Bannon had to actually fight their way back to making that film after 9 drafts of Hill and Giler dicking about with like... ordinary military bunkers replacing all the Giger alienness, a fleet of spaceships instead of the isolation of an expedition, and Atilla the Hun fighting the Alien with Jack the Ripper. Its kinda like the inverse of Ridley' s Nottingham movie where they ended up with a generic mess at the expense of an amazing script. With Alien, the OG writer ended up saving the day, somehow getting things back thing on-track with the original concepts that made the whole endeavor even worthwhile in the first place. Its drat near criminal that O'Bannen doesn't have the primary writing credit for Alien, but at least Hill & Giler didn't get away with stealing all the credit. (Beyond the hosed up claims they made in that Cinefantastique article) Side note: That link also ended up leading me to this post citing quotes from Lynch and Chronenberg where both think Alien plagerized their own work... https://alienseries.wordpress.com/2016/01/14/david-cronenberg-and-david-lynch-on-alien/ But each claiming the same chestburster scene was clearly apping their own work in xyz. Considering the lawsuit from Space Beegle too, its just funny so many people are upset with O'Bannen/Giger for plagiarizing their work while each seeing the same scene as being a direct copy of some totally different root. EvilTobaccoExec fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Jul 13, 2021 |
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Jul 13, 2021 20:18
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New Alien comic out that takes place on LV-426 with the nephew of Vasquez 35 years after the event of Aliens. To put it bluntly, the planet is hosed. Remember the whole nuclear explosion? It left a nuclear winter in it's wake and everything is pretty much rubble for the most part aside from a few parts that go underground. There's a lot of alien corpses around, one still in the wall though if that's dead or not who can say for sure. Burke left a message that says if there was a mission failure subject zero was in the lower levels. Yup the original infected guy is in stasis. Is it Newts father? Who can say for now. Oh and there IS an alien running around only it's not normal. It's got a icey color/look to it, I say ice because know the acidic blood? This one has blood that will freeze whatever it comes into contact. One person loses their arm due to it that snaps off after the aliens blood gets on her. Think Jason in Jason X when he shatters that womans skull or how that nerd in Goldeneye got froze over.
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Jul 14, 2021 20:56
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It's also just a cliffhanger tie in for something else, it was comically short.
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Jul 14, 2021 21:09
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