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What Im being doing is: first I raise MaA only; than I click raise all, and Ill wait until it raised to the amount I want, than I pause and either click that x to stop raising or move than away with ctrl+click (that will stop raising too and move immediately)
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Jul 14, 2021 19:28
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So kinda futzing with it is the only way. Would be nice if there was an edit box in the Army screen that let you create an "army" that could be raised individually. For feudal contracts, would it make sense to max out your vassals tax burden (which i have been doing) but then also minimize their levy contribution over time? Like I've already got too many levies anyway. Or is the increased opinion not worth it (it's only +5 for low levy and +10 for no levy).
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Jul 14, 2021 20:05
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PancakeTransmission posted:You only get the bonuses if you directly control the holding. So you will not get city bonuses - they will go to the Baron (which then pass a portion of gold to you). Temples you will get if you are running a Secular religion and you hold it. Ah yes, that makes sense. I'm still having some trouble distinguishing between county level holdings and baronies - I guess the main castle is mine, and then if it's a 4+-slot county with an extra castle, that castle is held separately by a baron (which may or may not be me)? It's also a bitch and a half figuring out which specific slot I need to move my troops to in order to siege any given enemy county down. I suppose the only solution, other than clicking until you find the castle holding(s), is to get familiar with the little icons on the map.
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Jul 14, 2021 20:06
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appropriatemetaphor posted:So kinda futzing with it is the only way. Would be nice if there was an edit box in the Army screen that let you create an "army" that could be raised individually. Oh yeah, thats really lacking. The "raise all" button approach is very practical, but I miss being able to raise just what I want to raise PittTheElder posted:Pretty much. Useless is probably overstating it, they're huge in the very early game when nobody has MaA, and they're very good for eating attrition during sieges (don't use your non-siege engines for this), but they get absolutely butchered by the good MaAs. I haven't actually experimented with it, but I would be willing to bet that Armored Cav could go 10:1 against a levy stack and quite possibly wipe them. Armored Foot probably 5:1 but a wipe would be doubtful. I need to be smarter with them my next game, I really had no idea they could be that powerful
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Jul 14, 2021 20:18
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Phlegmish posted:Ah yes, that makes sense. I'm still having some trouble distinguishing between county level holdings and baronies - I guess the main castle is mine, and then if it's a 4+-slot county with an extra castle, that castle is held separately by a baron (which may or may not be me)? Cities and Temples can be fortified holdings as well, depending on who holds them. The easy way to tell is to just look on the map, the ones with walls require besieging. All baronies can be owned by the county holder if you really want, the issue is the Wrong Type of Holding penalty and Theocratic faiths that automatically lease out temples. But you can absolutely own multiple castles within a county (just revoke from the Baron, there's no tyranny penalty for it), though unless they're farmland/floodplain terrain doing so is typically suboptimal in the long term; it counts against your domain limit and you're usually better off acquiring another county. appropriatemetaphor posted:For feudal contracts, would it make sense to max out your vassals tax burden (which i have been doing) but then also minimize their levy contribution over time? Like I've already got too many levies anyway. Or is the increased opinion not worth it (it's only +5 for low levy and +10 for no levy). That's generally what I do. And as a vassal the opposite is true, you generally want to offer your liege more levies in exchange for privileges. PittTheElder fucked around with this message at 20:23 on Jul 14, 2021 |
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Jul 14, 2021 20:19
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Yeah for minor wars I don't even bother to raise my levies, I just whip out my stack of elite men-at-arms and go to town: I guess I should get around to replacing all of the infantry with cavalry, I can afford it now.
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Jul 14, 2021 20:28
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The overwhelming power of upgraded MaA would almost be balanced if they couldn't just teleport all over the map. Make them only rally at your capital or evenly distributed through your personal holdings. From a balance perspective it doesn't really make sense that I can disband an army in Spain and next day re-rally them in Egypt for a new war. But it certainly is fun.
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Jul 14, 2021 20:36
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Well they fixed the teleporting ages ago. But yeah the muster times are still very speedy.
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Jul 14, 2021 20:40
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PittTheElder posted:Well they fixed the teleporting ages ago. I dont think they fixed They do take longer to raise if you are far from your capital but still seems too fast to me Last game I had my capital in Italy and still could raise my MaA in Persia in like 30-40 days If I had to raise them on the capital and move them to Persia, it would take many months, and also be expensive and suffer attrition along the way
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Jul 14, 2021 20:45
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Elias_Maluco posted:I dont think they fixed what they mean is that you use to be able to raise, disband, move the rally point, and then re-raise everything at the rally point with no penalty. you could in effect teleport your troops all over your territory rather than have them march anywhere
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Jul 14, 2021 20:51
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Make Men At Arms permanently raised like whatever the equivalent in CK2 was. Maybe make it so that they're cheaper to maintain when they're stationary and/or are in a province with a barracks. e: heck make it so that you can garrison MaA in castles and fortifications to make maintenance cheaper and then they can also tamp down rebellions in the area. It would also add an element of espionage and strategy, "oh hell my neighbor is moving all his MaA to the border." Moon Slayer fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Jul 14, 2021 |
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Jul 14, 2021 21:07
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appropriatemetaphor posted:So kinda futzing with it is the only way. Would be nice if there was an edit box in the Army screen that let you create an "army" that could be raised individually. The only real downsides here are that faction power and dynasty/house/culture control are based on total military strength, aka levies plus MaA. Drop too low and you'll have to spend money and time whenever your vassals/peasants get uppity and you'll lose control of determining your legacy traits and culture fascination.
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Jul 15, 2021 00:53
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PittTheElder posted:Moreover I'm pretty sure adding levies to a MaA based stack can actually hurt their combat performance due to the Combat Width calculation. Combat width is based on the average size of the two armies in play (plus terrain modifiers). So in the basic case, if you have 1000 Armored Footmen vs. 9000 enemy levies on a plain (100% combat width modifier), the width is 5000; all 1000 of your guys are fighting, but vs. only 5000 of their guys, the other 4000 just stand around waiting for their comrades to get cut down. The second point is super valid; baiting the AI makes a huge qualitative difference in ending a war early and not pissing the player off playing at chasing geese. But assuming the fight is going to happen, I experimented a bit and found that having a stack of levies was always useful for huge fights, as while more enemy levies get to fight, it doesn't matter as all the wounds are being assigned onto your chaff. So like 12k worth of MAA buffered by 60-100k levie stack incase someone could actually pose a threat and you don't feel like taking losses on your megastack. MAA is borked, but then people like playing conquer-the-world so maybe it's working as intended?
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Jul 15, 2021 00:57
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Olanphonia posted:The only real downsides here are that faction power and dynasty/house/culture control are based on total military strength, aka levies plus MaA. Drop too low and you'll have to spend money and time whenever your vassals/peasants get uppity and you'll lose control of determining your legacy traits and culture fascination. Cultural head is determined by which ruler controls the most counties of that given culture, not raw military power.
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Jul 15, 2021 05:16
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Is tech speed based solely on the cultural heads learning stat?
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Jul 15, 2021 05:39
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Serephina posted:But assuming the fight is going to happen, I experimented a bit and found that having a stack of levies was always useful for huge fights, as while more enemy levies get to fight, it doesn't matter as all the wounds are being assigned onto your chaff. So like 12k worth of MAA buffered by 60-100k levie stack incase someone could actually pose a threat and you don't feel like taking losses on your megastack. I mean I guess in the case where you can levy that many levies, then it's not going to hurt, but also I don't want to pay them lol Maybe I should announce to the thread that all of my analysis completely excludes the situation where you have more levies+MaA than your opponent, it's very difficult to lose that war at the worst of times. Punching up is the only case where army optimization really matters, it's not like EU4 where you have to worry about composition and mil tactics and such. I do think one area where MaA could be "improved" is by drastically increasing they're recovery time. Something like Agincourt where the cream of the aristocracy and warrior classes get massacred should have long term effects, while in game you just wait three months and go back to face rolling. nuketulsa posted:Is tech speed based solely on the cultural heads learning stat? Average county development actually plays a bigger role I think, but yeah in terms of learning stats only the cultural head's has any impact.
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Jul 15, 2021 05:42
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nuketulsa posted:Is tech speed based solely on the cultural heads learning stat? yes and also development and if anyone bordering you has it already
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Jul 15, 2021 08:02
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lmao wtf just happened. I (King of Sicily) went to invade Venice on behalf of a claim of one of my persons in my court and instead of him becoming a vassal he became a King. Lmao wut. Also the Dutchy of Venice remains uncreated. Background: I married a daughter to the Doge of Venice for an alliance but then he died. I looked over and she was chilling there and she now had four kids with claims to the Venitian counties. I had an option to bring them back to my court so I did. Great! Now I had four kids that I could marry off to my own kids and grandkids (ehh a little incest never hurt anyone) to get pressed claims to Venice. The goal was to land my kids as counts of Venice, then to form the Dutchy of Venice to give to someone else. This same plan largely worked with Sardinia, where I both conquered some counties and vassalized others to get enough to form the Dutchy. WTF happened here where instantly somehow the dude who I presumed would become my vassal became a King? Not the worst thing in the world since he's part of my dynasty and instantly became allied with me due to marriage. But still I'm kinda baffled as to what happened. If I really want to try to create the Dutchy now, I'll have to somehow claim title against him via dynastic claim.
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Jul 15, 2021 09:12
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Maybe MAA should actually be wrapped up into the overarching systems of interpersonal feudal politics that form the basis of the game. Right now you can have large numbers of professional soldiers that are essentially inert both politically and socially; any quick glance at the history of the Byzantine empire should prove that this was very much not the case. Maybe once you hit a certain number of MAA's the game should start pressuring you yo to assign a commander, for efficiencies sake. Of course, once your best fighting men are led by an actually character rather than the perfectly loyal and nameless officers a variety of problems to navigate present themselves.
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Jul 15, 2021 09:38
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How are you supposed to keep your troops supplied in enemy territory? I don't get it. My army is currently in an occupied county, there is an unbroken chain of occupied counties leading back to my own territory, and I'm still suffering from attrition.
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Jul 15, 2021 09:51
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Phlegmish posted:How are you supposed to keep your troops supplied in enemy territory? I don't get it. My army is currently in an occupied county, there is an unbroken chain of occupied counties leading back to my own territory, and I'm still suffering from attrition. I think you always suffer some attrition in enemy territory, even if it's close to your territory. You can assign a commander with the "reduce attrition" trait, but that only goes so far. Personally I always park some of my troops on nearby friendly / occupied counties to recover. Of course, that becomes a bit tedious since you always have to watch out for the enemy doomstack, and re-merge the armies if necessary.
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Jul 15, 2021 09:58
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Phlegmish posted:How are you supposed to keep your troops supplied in enemy territory? I don't get it. My army is currently in an occupied county, there is an unbroken chain of occupied counties leading back to my own territory, and I'm still suffering from attrition. Let them replenish supplies in occupied or friendly territory before moving on (you can see their supplies when the army is selected, it's a small bag in the UI). You'll always have some attrition in enemy territory but it gets significantly worse once supplies run out. Some people faff about with splitting stacks and having half of the army move back and forth to supply the guys besieging the enemy, but I never bothered with that level of micro-management.
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Jul 15, 2021 10:36
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It's a shame that Paradox is so in love with doomstacks, because what Man At Arms/combat really needs is a numerical advantage mod, that gets exponentially larger the more lopsided two forces are. So if an enemy outnumbers you 3 to 1 it should be next to impossible to win, and if they outnumber you 5 to 1 it should be literally impossible to win. And then they need to make terrain penalties considerably more prohibitive to balance that, so that you can beat an army at a 2-1 disadvantage even with the worse Man at Arms if the terrain is bad enough. EDIT Femtosecond posted:lmao wtf just happened. The answer is fairly simple. Venice is a Kingdom level title. (I mean, there's a duchy level title there, too. And a county level title!) The Serene Doge of Venice is considered to have power on par with a King. Venice is/was a big deal. Veryslightlymad fucked around with this message at 10:58 on Jul 15, 2021 |
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Jul 15, 2021 10:56
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PittTheElder posted:Average county development actually plays a bigger role I think, but yeah in terms of learning stats only the cultural head's has any impact. This can produce some amazing tech speed discrepancies. Playing as a Tamil king with my demesne on the farmlands in the south of India, I was able to boost my development so well that although I had a lower dev level than Constantinople, I had far fewer counties of my culture to dilute it with, and as a result I had a base research speed like 20-30% higher than the Greeks. I ended up reaching Late Feudal decades before they did.
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Jul 15, 2021 11:17
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Veryslightlymad posted:The answer is fairly simple. Venice is a Kingdom level title. (I mean, there's a duchy level title there, too. And a county level title!) The Serene Doge of Venice is considered to have power on par with a King. Venice is/was a big deal. To wit, a large part of why the fourth crusade (the one that sacked Constantinople) happened the way it did can, admittedly in a very simplified way, be explained with “because Venice said so”. Venice was a rival to the Byzantine Empire, if not in terms of absolute power, then in commercial and economic strength… that is also why “they said so”.
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Jul 15, 2021 11:21
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Femtosecond posted:lmao wtf just happened. It sounds like you pushed that person's claim on the Kingdom of Venice rather than the Duchy of Venice. Since kings can't have other kings as vassals (you'd need to be an emperor to have king-level vassals), he went independent.
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Jul 15, 2021 14:19
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Neurion posted:Cultural head is determined by which ruler controls the most counties of that given culture, not raw military power. poo poo yeah, my bad.
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Jul 15, 2021 14:55
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Vizuyos posted:It sounds like you pushed that person's claim on the Kingdom of Venice rather than the Duchy of Venice. Since kings can't have other kings as vassals (you'd need to be an emperor to have king-level vassals), he went independent. This would make sense but I swear that wasn't on the table... However, in retrospect I wonder if the "King of Venice" title is named something slightly different than "King of Venice" and so perhaps that's why I breezed by it in reading this? I'm actually gonna see if I can load back up an old save because I really want to understand what happened here.
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Jul 15, 2021 17:31
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Don't republics call the king-level title "serene doge?"
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Jul 15, 2021 17:40
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Moon Slayer posted:Don't republics call the king-level title "serene doge?" yep
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Jul 15, 2021 17:53
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Yeah total reading comprehension fail. There's three titles here. Two are Republic Counties, the Third is Most Serene Republic of Venice..... and on the next line here: Kingdom Title !!!! I think I further got confused here because I have my own Republic County. It didn't occur to me that Republic is just a government type and you can have more than county level republics. whoopz.  Yeah interestingly when I won the title for this guy he wasn't Serene Doge but rather King of Venice, so presumably the latter title is for AI republic characters.
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Jul 15, 2021 17:55
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Femtosecond posted:This would make sense but I swear that wasn't on the table... However, in retrospect I wonder if the "King of Venice" title is named something slightly different than "King of Venice" and so perhaps that's why I breezed by it in reading this? Yeah, that's probably why. For republics, the standard duke-level title is Doge and the king-level title is Serene Doge. It's not something that comes up that often, since non-feudal rulers above duke-level are rare, but you can tell by the title shield for the claim.
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Jul 15, 2021 17:56
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oh lol the shield. Yep there's a little crown on it. In my defence.... I'd drank a whole bottle of wine and this was 1am... so I suppose I should try to be a bit less impaired when about to start important invasions.
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Jul 15, 2021 17:57
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I've considered modding the little flag-topper icons. They're very difficult to tell apart at a glance.
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Jul 15, 2021 18:08
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megane posted:I've considered modding the little flag-topper icons. They're very difficult to tell apart at a glance. I prefer the CK2 shield icons to CK3's crown and banner. It also helped to make different parts of the world seem different (even if mechanically they weren't).
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Jul 15, 2021 18:59
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How does matrilineal affect inheritance laws? I can marry my granddaughter off to the heir to Aquitaine either regular way or matrilineal. I'd like to somehow inherit Aquitaine. edit picture because love a screencap 
appropriatemetaphor fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Jul 15, 2021 |
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Jul 15, 2021 20:12
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You always want matrilineal if she's of your dynasty. It doesn't directly affect inheritance laws (outside of like house seniority or tanistry), but the offspring of a matrilineal is in the same dynasty as their mom. A male favored inheritance will go to the king's son, regardless of if the kid is your or his dynasty.
Unreal_One fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Jul 15, 2021 |
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Jul 15, 2021 20:15
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appropriatemetaphor posted:How does matrilineal affect inheritance laws? It doesn't. Only thing it affects is which dynasty any offspring from the marriage belong to.
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Jul 15, 2021 20:22
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Got the alert that my king would be dead in a year. I guess the AI got the memo as well? A peasant revolt and two "gimme a kingdom!" revolts kicked off which my king died in the middle of. Good luck new Alfonso I guess! Should I be making more Dukedoms? I've got basically all Counts under me (king), is that why everyone hates me? 
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Jul 15, 2021 21:12
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If your king title is still de jure their liege, directly having the counts be vassals under you shouldn't be a problem unless it makes you go above your vassal cap.
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Jul 15, 2021 21:32
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