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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:Check this out on @Newegg: Skytech Chronos Gaming PC Desktop AMD Ryzen 7 3700X 8-Core 3.60GHz, NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 8GB, 16GB DDR4 3000, 1TB NVMe Gen 4, 750W Gold PSU, 240MM AIO, 11AC WiFi, Windows 10 Home 64-bit https://www.newegg.com/skytech-st-c...-149-_-07162021 This is the only other viable option I'm seeing in this price range: https://www.newegg.com/abs-ali479/p...0-074-_-Product $100 cheaper, with equivalent CPU, worse but still perfectly acceptable cooling, slower NVMe (probably won't matter?), and less upgradeable due to the lower capacity PSU.
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Jul 16, 2021 22:01
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:No, that looks rather well ventilated, assuming it ships in that fan/cooler config. Top-mounted AIO, three front intake fans with a mesh front panel, and a rear exhaust. The CPU's gonna run cool, that's for sure. The cooling looks quite good for a prebuilt. ABS is generally fine, and as far as pre-builts go rather well reviewed by GN. Individual units matter, but top mounted AIO, vented front with multiple fans is a good sign of someone who knew what they were doing. On top of this other excellent advice, you should also nuke whatever windows is on there and clean install (this is standard advice for any pre-built).
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Jul 16, 2021 23:00
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Hi PC building thread. Like a lot of posters, it’s time to build a new PC and all the tech and numbers have changed since the last time! Reading through the thread a recommended build seems to be emerging. It looks like I’ll need to do a little extra reading to get my head around RAM speeds and CPUs that like all 4 RAM slots filled rather than 2. I wanted to get some general advice on what to go for before I do deeper research. Unfortunately, I don’t have the time I used to so I’d love to copy a build that someone has used and identified any quirks/found optimum cooling. What country are you in? UK What are you using the system for? If you’re doing professional work, what software do you need to use? This is where some advice would be great. I do a wide range of things, often on budget/FOSS software so I am unsure if I’m better investing in a high clock speed over many threads/cores. I use the Linux subsystem a lot and I assume it has access to all the machine's resources. I’ve come close to making the switch many times, but key bits of software keep me on Windows. Gaming is likely off the table for the next few years. I do a lot of varied stuff for work though:
What's your budget? I’d rather not go above £1,000 but it’s more about finding the point of diminishing return. I’m happy to invest in something I use every day but don’t want to throw money at imperceivable improvements. Parts I already have:
Additional wants:
This comes across as really demanding but I wanted to be as detailed as possible. Feel free to tell me where I’m being deluded. After some sense checking I’ll try to get a parts list together for critique. Thanks for any advice!
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Jul 17, 2021 12:44
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I recommend setting a max budget here. 1k£ is on the lower side (but doable) and your use cases will benefit from buying the higher end parts.
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Jul 17, 2021 13:08
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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:I recommend setting a max budget here. 1k£ is on the lower side (but doable) and your use cases will benefit from buying the higher end parts. If there's tangible benefit to be had I could go over as this will hopefully be a tax-break. Would £1,300 be a good spot? Very open to budget advice, thought I'd at least give a jumping off point.
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Jul 17, 2021 13:25
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Little fishes posted:If there's tangible benefit to be had I could go over as this will hopefully be a tax-break. Would £1,300 be a good spot? Very open to budget advice, thought I'd at least give a jumping off point. you can get a great pc for 1300 quid, sec. something like this config https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/awd-mb520-drgb-intel-10400f-6-core-43ghz-nvidia-rtx-3070-8gb-desktop-pc-for-gaming-ps112990-3758916 isn't entirely perfect (you'd need more memory at very least) but gives you an eyeball of what you can clear for that much money, or something on the ryzen side https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/amd-ryzen-36003600x3700x-rtx3070rtx3080-gaming-windows-packages-from-ps125000-at-palicomp-3764461 the 3600 config at least if your primary motivator was gaming or GPU AI stuff.
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Jul 17, 2021 13:34
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or, on the cheaper side https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/ry...alicomp-3764673 that's got some slightly goofy components in (the 3500X was an asia only 6 core cpu without hyperthreading, go figure) it and if absolutely nothing else i would insist upon you upgrading the PSU, but you'd be clearing a thousand i think.
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Jul 17, 2021 13:39
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Little fishes posted:If there's tangible benefit to be had I could go over as this will hopefully be a tax-break. Would £1,300 be a good spot? Very open to budget advice, thought I'd at least give a jumping off point. Let me be more clear. Cab’s builds are great at your posted budget range. But you could easily spend £2k-£2.5k and still see a genuine benefit. Your specific use cases will see real time abs speed improvements from all of the expensive high end components. Ie high core count CPU, high end high VRAM GPU, high speed high capacity memory, high speed SSD, etc. You’re pretty unlikely to reach a diminishing returns point on any budget you set if your original thought was £1k. OP doesn’t have a ton of advice on this cause we don’t run into it often.
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Jul 17, 2021 13:56
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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:Let me be more clear. That makes sense and thanks for the links Cab. The work stations I have used for micro-CT work are multi-processor, multi-GPU monsters that I could only dream of. Maybe I need to pump the breaks a little and get my wish list more reasonable? I am happy to build myself (quite enjoy it) and to wait for GPUs to settle down. What if I went back to roughly £1k for a system without a GPU (using my old Radeon to drive my monitors until then) but plan adding a GPU down the line? (I don't know if I'm being open to advice or frustratingly vague!)
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Jul 17, 2021 14:39
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haha, any excuse to put a life wasted on hotukdeals to good use. if you don't want a GPU you can put something together yourself to get a hell of a lot more CPU performance and avoid the prebuild entirely, that's only really recommended if you get an incredible deal, aren't comfortable doing the work yourself or want the peace of mind of a warranty or if it's GPU apocalypse times. GPU availability is currently trending upwards and that's bringing prices down a little but there's still a way to go. you could probably even config some REALLY goofy stuff, i mean: https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/amd-ryzen-threadripper-12-core-1920x-35ghz-tr4-3754043 that's a secondhand threadripper 12 core, i mean a few generations old but for the purposes of discussion, that you could probably sneak by under a grand, quad channel 32 gigs with all new other parts (probably not a great motherboard but whatever). not that i'd suggest it but it demonstrates the incredible flexibility you have on that budget. as Pilfered put it your objectives can benefit from an arbitrary quantity of performance so it will be down to the compromises you wanna make.
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Jul 17, 2021 14:55
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It’s hard to get good one-on-one comparisons sometimes - which ATX case would you recommend? A Corsair 4000D, or an In Win 101?
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Jul 17, 2021 15:40
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Your only bottleneck here is your budget. I am not kidding on that. So if £1k without a GPU that’s helpful, but the more specific you are here the better Rec you’ll get.
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Jul 17, 2021 15:42
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Hasturtium posted:It’s hard to get good one-on-one comparisons sometimes - which ATX case would you recommend? A Corsair 4000D, or an In Win 101?
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Jul 17, 2021 16:06
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Llamadeus posted:The Corsair is quite a bit better in terms of airflow and compatibility, the InWin case is basically reliant on those bottom intakes. Thank you! I wanted to like the In Win, but the Corsair is really solid overall.
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Jul 17, 2021 16:27
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I got all my parts and just froze because I realized it's been almost a decade since I did this last. Are you supposed to attach everything to the motherboard first before putting it into the case?
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Jul 17, 2021 18:16
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LorneReams posted:I got all my parts and just froze because I realized it's been almost a decade since I did this last. Are you supposed to attach everything to the motherboard first before putting it into the case? Nope. There are a ton of videos on youtube but basically step one is to touch something metal to ground yourself, then motherboard in, CPU and cpu cooler on, RAM in (unless your ram goes under your cooler), case fans and drives in, SATA cables to mobo, front panel i/o cables to mobo, PSU in and PSU cable management, GPU in and then manage the cables from PSU to GPU. You can do this a few ways but this is what works for me. Don't forget to put the motherboard I/O shield in the case/on the mobo before you put the mobo in.
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Jul 17, 2021 18:22
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LorneReams posted:I got all my parts and just froze because I realized it's been almost a decade since I did this last. Are you supposed to attach everything to the motherboard first before putting it into the case? It very much depends on your board and case and CPU cooler. I prefer to put the board in the case first and everything else after, but that’s not always possible.
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Jul 17, 2021 18:23
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VelociBacon posted:Don't forget to put the motherboard I/O shield in the case/on the mobo before you put the mobo in.
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Jul 17, 2021 18:28
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You can absolutely put the CPU and cooler in first, and even RAM. Doing so may be a good idea if the constraints of the case are tight and annoying to work in. Hasturtium posted:Thank you! I wanted to like the In Win, but the Corsair is really solid overall. PC components run unreasonably hot these days. In the old days you could get away with all kinds of interesting designs with limited ventilation (though even 15 years ago I was dremeling in vent holes in some cases), but nowadays if your case isn't airflow oriented then it's junk. Which is kind of sad when you think about it. There are a lot of designs that I like that are just not viable. I think that In Win looks sharp, but the side vents are just not open enough to be conducive to good airflow. It's been one of the frustrations of mine when it comes to modern TDP-pushing component design. If you're into the solid front panel design, you can also consider the NZXT 710 (but not the 510, that thing's an oven). The corner vents in the 710 are just enough to give adequate airflow with a triple intake setup (which it comes with default), while the vents in the 510 are a joke. The Corsair 4000D shows a similar principle; even with the solid front panel, those open slits on the front provide just enough airflow, assuming you have good fans. The open ventilation of the Airflow version is preferable, though. edit: Ah, the InWin wants you to use the bottom fans for intakes and the side for exhaust? I think the bottom's open enough for intake, but there are two issues with this. First, in bottom-intake-only configurations, the CPU runs hotter since it's eating all the GPU exhaust (the GPU runs cool, though). Second, most of the airflow is going to be lost out the side before it reaches the CPU, I feel like. Though at this point, maybe we can consider the restrictive side vent design a feature so you don't leak too much air before it completes its circuit out the back.You should maybe even eschew the side fans altogether. It could potentially work with triple bottom intake, single rear exhaust. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 21:30 on Jul 17, 2021 |
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Jul 17, 2021 21:09
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I put the mobo on top of the mobo box. I put the cpu, ram and cooler on then. I grab the whole thing by the cooler and put it into the case, then I put the GPU in. :/ it works just fine and I've done it a number of times.
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Jul 17, 2021 21:14
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change my name posted:That CPU is pretty much top-of-the-line new new, don't worry about it. The front fans that suck air in from a solid pane of glass (there are no vents on either side either??) are hilarious, though I wonder if this is the idea here - intake from a narrow slot on the top and bottom of the front panel. Since the case has a filtered mesh top, I'd just take the front fans and mount them as intake at the top. You wouldn't see the unicorn puke as well though, unless the case is on the floor.
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Jul 18, 2021 10:06
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I have used and modified a fair number of cases over the last 20 years and have watched and read maybe too much content about cases, airflow, case mods, etc, and I've developed a little bit of intuition for case airflow and heat management as a result. But I still end up mystified by some of the poo poo SIs try to pull with their cases. It seems nobody who sells prebuilt computers actually understands anything about how computers operate.
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Jul 18, 2021 10:20
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:They make IDE to SATA adapters for <$10USD if you really want to load up those 3.5" discs... Bit late to the party here but floppy drives aren't IDE. They had their own connector  Edit: oh except this one apparently. 5.25" IDE floppy drive is a new one on me 
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Jul 18, 2021 11:02
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:PC components run unreasonably hot these days. In the old days you could get away with all kinds of interesting designs with limited ventilation (though even 15 years ago I was dremeling in vent holes in some cases), but nowadays if your case isn't airflow oriented then it's junk. Which is kind of sad when you think about it. There are a lot of designs that I like that are just not viable. I think that In Win looks sharp, but the side vents are just not open enough to be conducive to good airflow. It's been one of the frustrations of mine when it comes to modern TDP-pushing component design. That’s all true, smart, and incisive. I remember using some weird 90s cases with a Core 2 Duo and midrange graphics cards of the time and seeing pedestrian temperatures. Something tells me that wouldn’t be as tenable now. My use case will be more forgiving than some: I’m assembling an 8 core (130W) Power9 in a Raptor Computing Blackbird motherboard, with a relatively dinky Radeon FirePro W7000 (~110W) pulling graphics duty for now. If I replace it later, it will likely be with an RDNA workstation model with comparable thermals. The Power chip has high thermal tolerances and a solid reference cooler, and video is a lower priority than on my gaming machine, a relative inferno with a Core i9-7940x and an RTX 3070. The Corsair is a nice case, but I can’t reconcile the appearance of the Airflow edition… it’s just not an aesthetic I can get behind. The 4000D appears to be a pretty ideal solution; thanks again for the insightful analysis.
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Jul 18, 2021 17:51
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Just get a cheap case and keep the panels off. 'Aint beating that airflow.
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Jul 18, 2021 19:24
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Is now still a bad time to look into building a PC? I asked in the old thread about upgrading to a new PC last year, something around early December. However, I was told that it would be better to wait until February or March for prices to adjust because of various issues. Obviously it's now July, but I looking into what it would cost to build or buy a new PC, and it sounds like there's still price issues/scalping with stuff like the RTX cards and such.
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Jul 18, 2021 20:32
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Max Wilco posted:Is now still a bad time to look into building a PC? I asked in the old thread about upgrading to a new PC last year, something around early December. However, I was told that it would be better to wait until February or March for prices to adjust because of various issues. Obviously it's now July, but I looking into what it would cost to build or buy a new PC, and it sounds like there's still price issues/scalping with stuff like the RTX cards and such. I have a similar question to this- I was thinking of building a workstation around a threadripper 3960x; are there any new processor lines coming out in the near future that's worth waiting for? I'm not in a particular rush.
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Jul 18, 2021 21:13
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The only difficult thing to buy right now is the graphics card. Everything else sells for msrp or cheaper.
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Jul 18, 2021 21:25
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Listerine posted:I have a similar question to this- I was thinking of building a workstation around a threadripper 3960x; are there any new processor lines coming out in the near future that's worth waiting for? I'm not in a particular rush. The rumours are around that the Ryzen 5000 series threadrippers are imminent, so might be worth waiting there in case those are worth an upgrade or if the 3000 ones get cheaper.
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Jul 18, 2021 21:27
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Mu Zeta posted:The only difficult thing to buy right now is the graphics card. Everything else sells for msrp or cheaper. In that case here are my present specs: quote:Operating System Here's something that I loosely conceptualized based off a computer build from Origin PCs, with some substitutions I made. quote:CPU Granted, I don't know if all those parts are compatible, and this build is just something I made tentatively. Storage-wise, I though maybe I could carry over some of my drives from my current computer (provided there are enough bays). Since the RTX isn't viable to get, I'm wondering what would be a good alternative.
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Jul 18, 2021 21:44
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The 1070 is still a perfectly fine card for right now, so don't feel in any rush to upgrade that if it's working fine. Just ask the usual questions about why you're after a workstation CPU like a 5900, if you're just planning on playing games on the thing you could save money to funnel into a better GPU down the road by sticking to the 5600X and a B550 motherboard.
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Jul 18, 2021 21:49
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njsykora posted:The rumours are around that the Ryzen 5000 series threadrippers are imminent, so might be worth waiting there in case those are worth an upgrade or if the 3000 ones get cheaper. Awesome, thank you.
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Jul 18, 2021 22:01
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njsykora posted:The 1070 is still a perfectly fine card for right now, so don't feel in any rush to upgrade that if it's working fine. Just ask the usual questions about why you're after a workstation CPU like a 5900, if you're just planning on playing games on the thing you could save money to funnel into a better GPU down the road by sticking to the 5600X and a B550 motherboard. In my original post, I put down the Ryzen 7 3700X and MSI Radeon RX 5700, and I was told it was better to wait until February/March and go for a 5600X and RTX 3080 to get a system that was way more powerful than the build I suggested. I guess I just saw that the 5900X was 12-cores versus the 5600X's 6-cores or the 5800X 8-cores. In a discussion in another thread a while ago, and the topic of PS3 emulation came up, where they said that having a CPU with more cores helped with running RPCS3 (I'd have to try and go find the post to see what they said specifically). I'd probably be using it for gaming mostly, like you said, However, I had thought about trying to learn 3D modelling with Blender, and I though maybe the 5900X would help reduce render times. That said, I imagine the 5600 or 5800 would also make a dramatic difference compared to what I have now, and 3D modelling was just something I had thought about toying around with. I dunno, on Amazon the 5800X is $400, and the 5900X is $550, and based on that, I though an extra $150 wasn't that much more for what seems like a substantially better processor. I'm not in a rush to upgrade to a new system right this moment; it was just something I was considering. I can keep waiting to see if the RTX cards drop in price. Max Wilco fucked around with this message at 22:56 on Jul 18, 2021 |
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Jul 18, 2021 22:53
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For gaming, there is no benefit to the 5800/5900 over the 5600. You will get significantly more performance by putting that extra $150+ towards a better GPU. The 5600 is faster, better, and cheaper than the 3700! The 5600 + 3080 is still the strongest price/performance combo.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:06
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i was under the impression most emulation needed single core but don't uh, quote me on that.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:10
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Depends on the emulator and how it's written I think, but people have gotten PS3 emulation working on far weaker CPUs than any of the 5000 series Ryzens.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:25
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:For gaming, there is no benefit to the 5800/5900 over the 5600. You will get significantly more performance by putting that extra $150+ towards a better GPU. I mean, the strongest overall price to performance ratios when going by MSRPs are the midrange i5-11400F and RTX 3060 TI, but the current cost of the 11400F is inflated quite a bit over MSRP, maybe because retailers recognize it's only marginally worse than the 5600X in gaming. In the current pricing situation, and considering Max Wilco wants something with better emulation performance, the 5600X is what I'd recommend anyway. I wouldn't recommend the $250 price increase for the 5900X. The 5600X is more than capable enough as it is. The 5900X might help a little in Blender, but I heard the CPU assist is kinda janky there anyway (sometimes the GPU will have to wait for the slower CPU to finish its task before moving on? something like that, take this with a grain of salt). The 3060 TI does offer the best value per frame (as midrange cards often do), but this gen scaled up pretty nicely so the 3070 and 3080's MSRPs weren't too far off the mark, comparatively speaking. I say comparatively because the entire gen was maybe 10 to 20% overpriced out the gate. Still, at MSRP they're all decent values depending on how much power you want. There's nothing wrong with a 5600X and 3060 TI rig, if you can get your hands on one. Sadly, it's still a terrible time to be building a new PC. Maybe in six more months... Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 23:34 on Jul 18, 2021 |
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Jul 18, 2021 23:26
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I mean, the strongest overall price to performance ratios when going by MSRPs are the midrange i5-11400F and RTX 3060 TI, but the current cost of the 11400F is inflated quite a bit over MSRP, maybe because retailers recognize it's only marginally worse than the 5600X in gaming. In the current pricing situation, and considering Max Wilco wants something with better emulation performance, the 5600X is what I'd recommend anyway. I wouldn't recommend the $250 price increase for the 5900X. The 5600X is more than capable enough as it is. The 5900X might help a little in Blender, but I heard the CPU assist is kinda janky there anyway (sometimes the GPU will have to wait for the slower CPU to finish its task before moving on? something like that, take this with a grain of salt). Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I mean, the strongest overall price to performance ratios when going by MSRPs are the midrange i5-11400F and RTX 3060 TI, but the current cost of the 11400F is inflated quite a bit over MSRP, maybe because retailers recognize it's only marginally worse than the 5600X in gaming. In the current pricing situation, and considering Max Wilco wants something with better emulation performance, the 5600X is what I'd recommend anyway. I wouldn't recommend the $250 price increase for the 5900X. The 5600X is more than capable enough as it is. The 5900X might help a little in Blender, but I heard the CPU assist is kinda janky there anyway (sometimes the GPU will have to wait for the slower CPU to finish its task before moving on? something like that, take this with a grain of salt). 10-20% overpriced by pre-1080Ti standards. By 2000 series standards? Price points were perfect this gen, if even maybe underpriced because the 2000/supers were so bad and so insanely inflated. You can easily do blender on the 5600x. If your plan is to “toy” with blender, absolutely get the 5600x and shove the rest of that cash into the best GPU (but nothing above the 3080) that you can get. You can always upgrade the CPU if you really get into blender.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:32
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Maybe, but I don't like looking at the 10 series like it's ancient history, and I don't want to fully let nvidia off the hook for the 30 series prices just because the 20 series had especially awful value.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:41
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njsykora posted:Depends on the emulator and how it's written I think, but people have gotten PS3 emulation working on far weaker CPUs than any of the 5000 series Ryzens. The post I mentioned: v1ld posted:You could run it on your PC with emulation and capture there. Here's an image I captured running at 3440x1440 ultrawide. The post mentions the 3600 and RX 5700, but that you could improve performance with something with 8 cores. The emulation thing isn't a critical thing, just something I was just putting it forth as benchmark of sorts. I don't think I could do it on my current system, though. - Like I said, I don't need to improve my system at the moment. The 5600X and RTX 3080 sounds like a good combo, so I'll try to keep it in mind when it becomes more viable to get the parts without having to pay inflated prices.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:58
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