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I’m so glad that the finals matched the intensity of this entire basho. The staredown was electric and then the match was a straight up brawl. I was pulling for Terunofuji because getting the rope on a true double basho is the perfect ending to his comeback, but I couldn’t help but pump my fist song with Hakuho. Seeing him just let loose with emotion knowing that the sumo elders can’t say poo poo was probably the best sports moment this year.
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Jul 18, 2021 16:28
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I was rooting for Teru, and in general I am not happy about the kind of slaps and forearm smashes that Hakuho does, but I still nearly jumped out of my chair when he got the win. An absolutely electric moment.
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Jul 18, 2021 16:34
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That double arm lock man, as soon as that was in Terunofuji was hosed. I wonder how Hakuho will do as a coach.
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Jul 18, 2021 17:13
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bessantj posted:That double arm lock man, as soon as that was in Terunofuji was hosed. He said in the interview he's gonna keep fighting 
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Jul 18, 2021 17:14
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Brut posted:He said in the interview he's gonna keep fighting Just go out into the street and start slapping people? No, I mean when he does eventually retire how he will do as a coach/heya owner.
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Jul 18, 2021 17:19
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it's def his goal as he obtained japanese citizenship and a few of the guys in miyaginoi-beya (enho and hokuseiho for sure) have this semi official protogé status of his where they'll be expected to join his heya when begins. forget the term for it tho. certainly those two have shown promise and i'm sure he's taken a major role in their training.
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Jul 18, 2021 17:24
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he's out there havin fun, good on him
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Jul 18, 2021 18:11
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That loving elbow smash into Teru's face was brutal. This was a great basho.
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Jul 18, 2021 18:21
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Miyagino-oyakata reaches retirement age next year in August, so I'd expect Hakuho to be retired by then, at least.
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Jul 18, 2021 18:28
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Kisenosato opens his stable next month.
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Jul 18, 2021 18:31
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That was a great basho. It was nice to see so many people well enough to show their skills. I'm very happy for Terunofuji and hope we see more great sumo from him in the future.
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Jul 18, 2021 18:32
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The sumo mainichi podcast has (as always) a good summary of the final day. They’re even more down on Hakuho’s forearms and slaps than I am but overall I agree with their take on the showdown. I think that a lot of the people ITT who love the slap fighting are fairly new to sumo and/or come from watching MMA. It seems like longtime fans are less keen on the “ugly” sumo that Hakuho increasingly goes with. (For the record I’m by no means a longtime sumo watcher)
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Jul 18, 2021 18:34
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I agree with that but also thought it was super exciting. I was definitely in the “ya hate to love it” camp. My biggest disappointment of the day was Takayasu MK 
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Jul 18, 2021 18:50
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Takayasu was sacrificed to the altar of Shodai
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Jul 18, 2021 18:51
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What an awesome final day, what a basho. I'm super pumped for Aki now. I just messed around a bunch on Sumo A-Z and found that only 3 current gyoji have been held back from promotions (otherwise there's a perfect correlation between their ranks and their ages, it seems like). Anyone know what's up with Kimura Asanosuke and Kimura Yukihiro? What did they do to get held back to juryo when their peer group is all makuuchi? And I'm really curious about Shikimori Tomokimi, who's down in jonokuchi and looks like should be in sandanme already going by their peer group--how could you have screwed up that badly at such a low rank, and why wouldn't you quit if you had? Or is it that these guys just started gyoji-ing a few years later than normal (Sumo A-Z doesn't have that data, just DOB) and so it looks like they've been held back but they're really "on track," just late? I'm going to do the same analysis for the yobidashi and tokoyama too, wonder if anything will come up there.
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Jul 18, 2021 18:54
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My take on slaps is the same as my take on henkas—if you don’t want it to happen to you, don’t let it happen.
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Jul 18, 2021 19:11
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If there's no rule against it and it works you might as well do it
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Jul 18, 2021 19:15
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I sometimes wonder if non-Japanese who watch sumo and complain about whether certain tactics are worthy of a yokuzuna and weaboos who worship at the altar of honorabu samurai combat are pretty much the same people.
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Jul 18, 2021 19:21
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I liked the final match.
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Jul 18, 2021 19:23
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Does anyone have a photo of the macaron, I can't find the video w/ the awards ceremony that shows it
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Jul 18, 2021 19:24
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Slaps go hand in hand when I think of sumo. The elbows I didn't think of, but i learned of the one bald buff Egyptian rikishi that just leveled people with forearms consistantly and those felt dirty
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Jul 18, 2021 19:27
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If you don't want to get slapped you need to do what Yoshikaze used to do and just attack with the face.
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Jul 18, 2021 19:51
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I forgot which bout it was but me and a buddy were watching day 15 today and we both just looked at each other after one tachiai because it sounded like someone slammed two 2x4s together.
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Jul 18, 2021 19:54
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holy poo poo that last match. incredible. tochinoshin had a good one today too 
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Jul 18, 2021 20:13
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Tobizaru, Wakatakakage, and Hoshoryu all had good wins today. Small boys stay strong until the last day
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Jul 18, 2021 20:36
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So glad I avoided spoilers all day, in my very short sumo watching history I think that was the most exhilarating match I've seen, from the stare down to the elbow blast to the kotenage. I only wish I'd gotten into sumo earlier to see Prime Hakuho, seeing how he dominated the field with roughly one working limb makes me wonder how anyone had a chance when he had all four limbs going. My fantasy score was clearly sacrificed to make this such a good basho, but I'll take it. Biosys fucked around with this message at 21:05 on Jul 18, 2021 |
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Jul 18, 2021 20:52
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I can't believe that it actually ended up being the greatest bout I have ever seen. Holy poo poo. I hope Hakuho is just saying he's staying around to keep the Olympics stuff 'above board' because there is no ending he could have better than that. I don't want to see Hakuho eventually have to crash out because he can't win anymore.
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Jul 18, 2021 21:12
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Scythe posted:What an awesome final day, what a basho. I'm super pumped for Aki now. Gyoji promotion is mostly by seniority, so the age and rank disparity should only be because someone started gyoji-ing at a later age than those at a similar rank. You may miss promotion though if you are too inaccurate with your calls. This really only causes issues when you get to the highest ranks, because ideally everyone gets a chance to be Shikimori Inosuke and then Kimura Shonosuke (these are the official names of the two highest gyoji - they have shikona too) before they retire, but that might be tricky if the dude senior to you is younger than you. They had this issue just recently, however the former Shikimori Inosuke was forced to retire for being a sex pest which handily solved it, so I don't think there'll be any age issues for a while.
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Jul 18, 2021 21:15
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Elissimpark posted:Gyoji promotion is mostly by seniority, so the age and rank disparity should only be because someone started gyoji-ing at a later age than those at a similar rank. You may miss promotion though if you are too inaccurate with your calls. Oh yeah, I know—that’s why I was trying to figure out if any of the three guys I mentioned actually had missed promotions (and if so, for what missed calls or discipline issues) or if they had just started a year or two later than their compatriots. Similarly, why isn’t there a current Kimura Shonosuke? Seems like it’s been vacant for a bit…
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Jul 18, 2021 22:34
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I remember the scuttlebutt being the Shikimori Inosuke who turned out to be a sex pest had other problems so they were hesitant to promote him. That doesn't explain why they haven't promoted anyone in the last couple years though.
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Jul 18, 2021 22:48
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Old men trying to make a point that seniority alone won't get you the nod if you are going to embarrass them?
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Jul 18, 2021 22:49
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The staredown from teru was ballsy. I wonder if hakuho had decided to feed him the elbow the whole time or if it was a snap decision he made when it became apparent that just because hakuho had been away for a while teru thought his achievements put them on a comparable level. Either way it was vicious as gently caress and absolutely appropriate for someone with the rank of yokozuna to be expected to be able to deal with and overcome. Also I think it's grotesque that sumo old men shake their heads at how someone won when losing in sumo is punished so severely. If you want people to henka less often, maybe don't put them on the precipice of a massive pay cut because they're fighting through a dozen injuries.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:19
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Scythe posted:Oh yeah, I know—that’s why I was trying to figure out if any of the three guys I mentioned actually had missed promotions (and if so, for what missed calls or discipline issues) or if they had just started a year or two later than their compatriots. Ah okay. I think it has to be drastic to get you overlooked for promotion. The last Shikimori Inosuke had a few overturned decisions (in fairness, a couple were hard calls and were a matter of mm in replay, from memory) which is why they probably held back there. Kenning posted:I remember the scuttlebutt being the Shikimori Inosuke who turned out to be a sex pest had other problems so they were hesitant to promote him. That doesn't explain why they haven't promoted anyone in the last couple years though. Last Kimura Shonosuke retired in 2015, so it's been a while. Not sure why they don't just bump everyone up one, because Shikimori Inosuke has been Shikimori Inosuke for 2 years now and I haven't heard anything weird about him.
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Jul 18, 2021 23:48
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i heard about the senior yobidashi getting a forced retirement due to harassment but had no idea about his gyogi coutnerpart as i wasn't following in 2015 also, speaking of gyogi and promotions: I know it's their job to write the fancy calligraphy on the official written banzuke. wonder if there's ever been someone who was good at the officiating part but held back due to lovely calligraphy
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Jul 19, 2021 00:47
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Hakuho's slap to forearm strike to unserhook is such an effective combo for him that I wonder why more rikishi dont attempt to try a similar strategy. It really seems like Hakuho is way ahead of the game on technique, propriety be damned
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Jul 19, 2021 01:08
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Marching Powder posted:catch his koshi 
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Jul 19, 2021 01:46
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Another interesting hakuho stat from this tournament: a zensho with 11 different methods of finishing the fight. That's mastery.
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Jul 19, 2021 02:00
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Hakuho's strikes give me a vibe similar to watching a Mike Awesome/Masato Tanaka match where they feel irresponsibly dangerous but also I don't care cause they're real loving cool.
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Jul 19, 2021 02:10
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Thauros posted:also, speaking of gyogi and promotions: I know it's their job to write the fancy calligraphy on the official written banzuke. wonder if there's ever been someone who was good at the officiating part but held back due to lovely calligraphy That'd be sad. From memory though, pretty much a lot of their first years is practicing calligraphy. There's probably a thread of sumoforum with photos, where they practice common kanji (like "yama" and "gawa") over and over again. I think Kimura Yodo is the gyoji who's in charge of the practice and calligraphy in general. In other news, I've been looking for this for ages and finally found it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpmIEt8uKFE Sadly, all rikishi here have now retired - Tenkaiho, Gagamaru, Toyonoshima and Asahisho. Marching Powder posted:Another interesting hakuho stat from this tournament: a zensho with 11 different methods of finishing the fight. That's mastery. There was a period a few years ago where he was actively trying to use as many new techniques as possible. It was about the time he used a neko damashi or two.
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Jul 19, 2021 02:18
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I wouldn't be surprised if his desire to master and win with every technique was a necessity as part of his project to identify ways of beating himself and shoring up those weaknesses before his opponents could identify and exploit them.
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Jul 19, 2021 02:29
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