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Snowglobe of Doom posted:...... except that doesn't take into account the level of exposure, or the slowness of the vaccine rollout (of course there were hardly any breakthrough cases for most of the pandemic, there were hardly any fully vaxxed people early on) or any other real world factors. Also that percentage is always going to keep increasing over time as more and more breakthrough cases occur each month so of course it looks good this early in the pandemic, but what we need right now is a snapshot of the current situation. Comparing the current number of breakthrough cases to the current number of unvaxxed cases takes exposure rates and vaxx rates and everything else into account. You're making it sound like this is some new stat being invented specifically so that they can make things seem artificially low. I'm trying to explain that it is literally the definitional measure of effectiveness that is used for any vaccine.
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Jul 23, 2021 14:41
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learnincurve posted:It’s been a few days now and my anecdotal research has come to the conclusion that the people (aside from people with exemption lanyards) in the U.K. not wearing masks in shops and on public transport are exclusively confrontational looking couples in their 20s and disgusting old men. If only the world’s top scientists would listen to coughing old man on UK bus… but no, they’re in the Big Pharmacy pocket 
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Jul 23, 2021 14:47
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LanceHunter posted:You're making it sound like this is some new stat being invented specifically so that they can make things seem artificially low. Real interesting that they don't post the unvaccinated stats using the same type of general population calculation, isn't it???? Gee I wonder why they express this one value using a completely different method.... LanceHunter posted:I'm trying to explain that it is literally the definitional measure of effectiveness that is used for any vaccine. Well post links then, I'd like to read about that
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Jul 23, 2021 14:50
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Real interesting that they don't post the unvaccinated stats using the same type of general population calculation, isn't it???? Gee I wonder why they express this one value using a completely different method.... https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9855432/ And they don't post that measure of unvaccinated infections vs the unvaccinated population because there is no such thing as a measurement of the effectiveness of nothing.
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Jul 23, 2021 14:54
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"In these [vaccination effectiveness] studies, rigorous risk adjustment is necessary to ensure the comparability of study populations" LOL the stat we're talking about includes absolutely no risk adjustment and no comparison of study populations, what the gently caress are you even talking about You're going to have to do better than that, try again E: the statistic itself is not an effectiveness study by itself, it's just two raw unverified numbers divided into each other with zero adjustment or accounting for the small population of DC. The vaccine hasn't even been available for a year and the early availability was extremely limited so they wouldn't have sufficient data to even start an effectiveness study yet. LanceHunter posted:And they don't post that measure of unvaccinated infections vs the unvaccinated population because there is no such thing as a measurement of the effectiveness of nothing. Dumb chuds have been posting that exact thing the entire pandemic and it's the exact same kind of bullshit stat as what we're talking about.  https://twitter.com/Sandernista412/status/1418337708611706887 Snowglobe of Doom fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Jul 23, 2021 |
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Jul 23, 2021 15:35
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NotJustANumber99 posted:the regularity with which you seem to happen across these nutcases suggests theyre all your tyler durdens I live in the red wall but only encounter these plague carriers on the bus now they can day drink again though, which is nice.
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Jul 23, 2021 15:40
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So as the UK flounces merrily along towards a healthy third wave, I'm eyeing up going to get my second jab 2 and a bit weeks earlier than scheduled at a local walk-in that's happening this weekend. Equally, I'm seeing a bunch of stuff coming out that the longer the interval between 1st and 2nd jab, the better and more lasting the immune response (for Pfizer). On balance, it's probably better to just go and get it at 6 weeks right? Even if that's marginally inferior to waiting 8-12 weeks. Feels like the risk of 2 weeks non double-jabbed is just playing with fire right now. I'm not 100% shut in and take public transport intermittently, and it's about 50% masks off. Heatwave isn't helping none.
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Jul 23, 2021 16:05
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Dumb chuds have been posting that exact thing the entire pandemic and it's the exact same kind of bullshit stat as what we're talking about. Wait, first you complain about how there isn't a comparative statistic released for cases among unvaccinated people compared to the unvaccinated population, and then you're quoting some chud making up a version of that very statistic and claiming that is what I'm talking about? And yes, there haven't been full studies of effectiveness yet. And when there are they will have some adjustments and controls to get more useful information out of the data (like effectiveness within various populations and sub-groups). But ultimately, the measure that they will be comparing will be the number of cases among the vaccinated compared to the vaccinated population. Because that is how you loving calculate effectiveness. Like, unless you believe that the city of Washington DC is secretly run by chuds who are intentionally releasing misleading statistics trying to downplay the risk to the vaccinated, I don't see what your argument is here.
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Jul 23, 2021 16:23
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My 6 year old son's school is filled with anti-mask chuds (well, the parents are I mean). Caving to pressure from these loud-mouth mongrels, the school sent out an email today that they will be "requesting to higher ups in government to remove the mask mandate in the schools and make it a choice". This is loving infuriating and terrifying me, especially as I read this:  Can someone here please calm me down and tell me that my son wearing a mask is extremely effective even though practically none of his classmates will be wearing them in September? 
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Jul 23, 2021 16:24
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Jeza posted:So as the UK flounces merrily along towards a healthy third wave, I'm eyeing up going to get my second jab 2 and a bit weeks earlier than scheduled at a local walk-in that's happening this weekend. Equally, I'm seeing a bunch of stuff coming out that the longer the interval between 1st and 2nd jab, the better and more lasting the immune response (for Pfizer). Nooooo! Pfizer released research today saying the absolute sweet spot is 8 weeks, at 6 weeks you could be as much as 88% immune already and you won’t be in the group offered boosters.
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Jul 23, 2021 16:28
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OK. I'm scared. I'm at work and thankfully work in an office. But a lot of people are getting sick.
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Jul 23, 2021 16:36
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Blooster posted:Can someone here please calm me down and tell me that my son wearing a mask is extremely effective even though practically none of his classmates will be wearing them in September? Well-fitted, rated (N95/KN95/KF94) masks work well when worn properly. There are medical professionals who dodged COVID all year thanks to N95s. Can you expect a first grader to maintain vigilance? Maybe not.
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Jul 23, 2021 16:38
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Blooster posted:My 6 year old son's school is filled with anti-mask chuds (well, the parents are I mean). I think "up to" is doing a lot of work there in saying that "up to 30% of children" will have long term symptoms. Not only is long COVID not at all well defined, spanning from "a little under the weather for 3 months" to "your life is significantly impacted" but we don't know much about incidence and severity of long term COVID in the general population much less kids specifically. I don't think we can say anything definitive at all about kids getting long COVID except that ideally they wouldn't want to get COVID at all in the first place.
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Jul 23, 2021 16:45
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:"In these [vaccination effectiveness] studies, rigorous risk adjustment is necessary to ensure the comparability of study populations" LOL the stat we're talking about includes absolutely no risk adjustment and no comparison of study populations, what the gently caress are you even talking about Looks like he tweeted through the whole thing too Doubt he thought it was worth dodging a sore arm or a slight fever at the end Died days after mocking Biden’s vaccine push, too
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Jul 23, 2021 16:48
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LanceHunter posted:Wait, first you complain about how there isn't a comparative statistic released for cases among unvaccinated people compared to the unvaccinated population, and then you're quoting some chud making up a version of that very statistic and claiming that is what I'm talking about? LanceHunter posted:But ultimately, the measure that they will be comparing will be the number of cases among the vaccinated compared to the vaccinated population. Because that is how you loving calculate effectiveness. I just googled a bunch of sources and they all said that vaccine effectiveness was the proportionate reduction in disease among vaccinated people compared to unvaccinated people/total population under field conditions. I'm still waiting for you to post a source that says otherwise but here's several sources that back me up: https://www.cdc.gov/chickenpox/outbreaks/downloads/appx-f-inv-outbrks.pdf https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/WHO-2019-nCoV-vaccine_effectiveness-measurement-2021.1 https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.05.21251139v3.full.pdf Etc etc etc etc If anyone else is interested in how the US government/media is using this to spin the current vaccine effectiveness, here's another example: https://twitter.com/efindell/status/1417968144623210503 It's a bullshit statistic because the percentage of fully vaccinated in Texas immediately after February was barely over 6% and their post-February covid deaths dropped off extremely quickly, so the huge majority of those 8,787 deaths occurred when hardly any people were fully vaxxed and the last surge was winding down.  https://ourworldindata.org/explorer...&country=~Texas  https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/usa/texas/ It doesn't tell us anything useful about how effective the vaccines have been since February.
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Jul 23, 2021 17:00
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LanceHunter posted:Wait, first you complain about how there isn't a comparative statistic released for cases among unvaccinated people compared to the unvaccinated population, and then you're quoting some chud making up a version of that very statistic and claiming that is what I'm talking about? It is reasonable to assume that at some point the number of breakthrough infections will rise from 200 to 400. Maybe next week, maybe next month, who knows when, but it'll happen. When that happens do you think the vaccine has become half as effective as it was when there were only 200 cases? Because that's what you are argueing for. Thoguh fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Jul 23, 2021 |
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Jul 23, 2021 17:03
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Fallom posted:Looks like he tweeted through the whole thing too That 34 year old man just did the Lords work. His death is going to encourage thousands and thousands of younger people to get vaccinated.
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Jul 23, 2021 17:05
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Jul 23, 2021 17:06
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Died of Covid or died with Covid 
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Jul 23, 2021 17:07
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spunkshui posted:That 34 year old man just did the Lords work.  It's a false flag! He's not even real! Clearly faked by Big Pharma to sell more vaccines!
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Jul 23, 2021 17:08
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LanceHunter posted:Like, unless you believe that the city of Washington DC is secretly run by chuds who are intentionally releasing misleading statistics trying to downplay the risk to the vaccinated, I don't see what your argument is here. It's not chuds who are trying to downplay the risk to the vaccinated with misleading statistics. It's open 'er up types who think the vaccines are a magic bullet to fully reopening the economy without any efforts at non-pharmaceutical interventions despite the apparent risk of severe disease in vaccinated people who are exposed to delta. (severe by a normal person's definition, not the ridiculously high bar set by the NIH)
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Jul 23, 2021 17:09
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learnincurve posted:Nooooo! This sux to read because I’m getting mine in a few days with 4.5 weeks since first dose, but it’s either this or not getting it
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Jul 23, 2021 17:10
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spunkshui posted:That 34 year old man just did the Lords work. He’s a minority though (or was) So chuds will continue preaching antivaxxin while chillin and relaxxin (because they did get vaccinated, re:Fox News)
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Jul 23, 2021 17:12
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Platystemon posted:Well-fitted, rated (N95/KN95/KF94) masks work well when worn properly. I am going to find out today if their masks are N95. My son wore his mask the entire Kindergarten year just fine without complaints. He actually likes wearing them, I kid you not. gohuskies posted:I think "up to" is doing a lot of work there in saying that "up to 30% of children" will have long term symptoms. Not only is long COVID not at all well defined, spanning from "a little under the weather for 3 months" to "your life is significantly impacted" but we don't know much about incidence and severity of long term COVID in the general population much less kids specifically. I don't think we can say anything definitive at all about kids getting long COVID except that ideally they wouldn't want to get COVID at all in the first place. Yeah but I keep reading poo poo like people having tinnitus, erectile dysfunction, memory loss, and loving diabetes from it which makes my mind go wild with imagination as to what this must be doing internally to people if it can cause poo poo like that.
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Jul 23, 2021 17:16
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Went to the supermarket today in the UK, now that masks are "personal responsibility and common-sense", lol. Still plenty of people masked up, plus lots without. But what I don't get are the people who have gone to the trouble of carrying a mask and wearing it, but then not loving wearing it properly? If you want to wear a mask, put it over your damned nose or you might as well not be wearing one at all. "I'm very concerned about the pandemic, so I'll make a half-arsed attempt to protect myself I guess."
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Jul 23, 2021 17:20
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Super lolling at this https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/anti-vaccine-groups-changing-dance-parties-facebook-avoid-detection-rcna1480 Group members have incorporated a range of coded language to mask their discussions, many of which perpetuate debunked theories about the vaccines. “Danced” or “drank beer” mean “got the vaccine.” References to “Pfizer” generally use the terms “pizza” or “Pizza King,” and Moderna is referred to as “Moana.” Users generally play around with unofficial language about dancing to create more coded language. For example, one group member said her husband had become sick after going on a “cross country trip where we spent 2 nights with dancers,” referring to two people who had just been vaccinated. “He believes that by being around those who have danced the glitter caused the shingles reactivation,” the group member wrote. The glitter, in this case, refers to “vaccine shedding,” a false theory among anti-vaccine activists that claims people who have been vaccinated are somehow “shedding” their vaccine onto the unvaccinated, and causing them to become sick with a litany of illnesses.
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Jul 23, 2021 17:27
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“After being around many dancing folks, my teenage son’s Ly mph No des on his neck swelled into little lumps like gum balls. Our very wise, non-dancing doctor says he has an ear infection and a sinus infection. Could this be related to other dancer’s glitter? Has anyone else had this experience? My side F X were different (exhaustion and mega moon occurrences).”
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Jul 23, 2021 17:29
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https://twitter.com/gelles/status/1418402642414424065 Also the African nation of Guinea decided to back out of the Olympics and stop their team from attending but the IOC strongarmed them into turning up
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Jul 23, 2021 17:36
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Stoatbringer posted:
A lot of people are dumb as hell.
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Jul 23, 2021 17:52
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Comfy Fleece Sweater posted:Super lolling at this I kinda applaud the creativity for avoiding Facebook's word-detection, despite it being used to perpetuate stupid pseudoscience that ultimately kills people.
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Jul 23, 2021 18:01
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we're back, baby https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1418617270432149506
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Jul 23, 2021 18:24
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Jul 23, 2021 18:35
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Virginia Department of Health has just done their weekly update for their breakthrough cases dashboard with data through the 18th. Total breakthrough cases: 1,377 (an increase of 220 from last week's 1,157). Total breakthrough hospitalizations: 114 (an increase of 33 from last week's 81). Total breakthrough deaths: 37 (an increase of 19 from last week's 18). The percentage of total COVID cases that were in unvaccinated people: 99.3% (a decrease of 0.1% from last week's 99.4%). Once again, vaccines are overwhelmingly effective.
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Jul 23, 2021 18:47
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Yeah Florida reported nearly a quarter of the deaths and over a fifth of the cases out of the entire US totals yesterday:   https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/usa/florida/ Meanwhile Gov DeSantis is threatening to introduce legislation to ban mask mandates in schools https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article252951498.html
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Jul 23, 2021 18:49
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You know things are getting bad again when I'm back to doing curbside pickup to get my alcohol.
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Jul 23, 2021 18:59
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As a Floridian, agreed. The tourists are absolutely flooding us because nowhere else will take them. Between them and DeathSantis, they're killing us. Please stop coming here.
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Jul 23, 2021 19:01
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Me: Alright! I wore a mask for over a year, stayed away from people and got vaccinated. Time to go enjoy a drink outside, my brain needs this. Everyone here: We didn’t do anything. Me: *cough*
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Jul 23, 2021 19:02
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My fourth positive test was this morning (3 at home, 1 PCR). I'm feeling better and it's been 12 days since the onset of symptoms. I've never had a fever. I'm learning I may test positive for up to 90 days post-infection? When is it safe to go out in the world again? I'll still be masking up for the foreseeable future, and limiting my time indoors with strangers, but is it safe to see friends who I know are vaccinated?
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Jul 23, 2021 19:04
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Blooster posted:I am going to find out today if their masks are N95. If you do find child sized N95 masks please post in the thread. I only looked on Amazon but there didn't seem to be anything.
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Jul 23, 2021 19:04
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Fuckin lol. 3 weeks ago they claimed 2887 cases. That 148 today with 21 days to death (which is low even for delta) either a CFR of 4.4% or .. pretty massive under reporting. I mean, they are under reporting cases of course. But they are having a fuckin massive outbreak.
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Jul 23, 2021 19:06
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