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(Thread IKs: fart simpson)
 
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Maximo Roboto
Feb 4, 2012

mawarannahr posted:

socialist alternative in China was complaining about the tutoring companies and regulations on private schools. I went to their website to work myself up a little

I’m pretty sure if you connected all the dots, you would find chinaworker.info is getting some NED money for their work in China, HK, and Taiwan (and if they aren’t they should instead of harassing members for dues in order to do the same)

this list is from 2016, is there a newer one? http://nedprogramsinhk.blogspot.com/

I'm sure the NED isn't the only boogeyman out there that's covertly funding all sorts of movements and groups

mila kunis posted:

the old marxism thread brought this site up, i don't know or care if they're funded by the west but they're definitely in the chuangcn vein of stupid trash that doesn't represent chinese workers or communists at all

They could form a crypto-ultra-rightist international with the Communist Party of Great Britain (Marxist-Leninist), MEK, and uh the LaRouchites

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BrutalistMcDonalds
Oct 4, 2012


Lipstick Apathy
efb

Lostconfused
Oct 1, 2008

The entire point of NED is that it's not even secret. It's all public and out in the open.

Pener Kropoopkin
Jan 30, 2013

https://twitter.com/BlueSamuraiZero/status/1420481355654197250?s=20

ded redd
Aug 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy
the audacity of the chinese government to erase the historical record of

*checks notes*

uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

ded redd
Aug 1, 2010

by Fluffdaddy
you know bros i have to confess i didn't really come into this thread today to find out there were extra-mongolian individuals who held warm feelings for the khanate but here we are

thatfatkid
Feb 20, 2011

by Azathoth

Office Pig posted:

you know bros i have to confess i didn't really come into this thread today to find out there were extra-mongolian individuals who held warm feelings for the khanate but here we are
Just wait until you learn about Albanians and Alexander the great

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️

Office Pig posted:

the audacity of the chinese government to erase the historical record of

*checks notes*

uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Of course we can count on smoothbrains failing basic geography to fairly investigate the context of the fake outrage they are getting at.

lobster shirt
Jun 14, 2021


temujin is no match for critical race theory with chinese characteristics.

Grapplejack
Nov 27, 2007

now i'm just imaginging like, lost causers but for the golden horde

"Sons and Daughters of the Khanate"

sexpig by night
Sep 8, 2011

by Azathoth
why would china not feel a statue of genghis khan was worth keeping around, it's a mystery, I think they may hate history?

Zmej
Nov 6, 2005

Mirello posted:

Oh its definitely real, chinese young people (espicially college graduates) are really pissed off about this.

mila kunis posted:

sixthtone have a bunch of articles on the subject
these were very helpful. thanks guys :china:

this was such a pro-click. going to go around shouting "Deng Was Right" unironically now

FrancisFukyomama
Feb 4, 2019

I thought Genghis khan was viewed fairly positively in China since the line is that he’s a cultural hero of the Mongols and since Mongols are part of the multicultural Chinese nation, he’s also a Chinese hero. at least that’s the reasoning all the Chinese people I know who consider genghis to be Chinese is

Raskolnikov38
Mar 3, 2007

We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold

thatfatkid posted:

Just wait until you learn about Albanians and Alexander the great

Raskolnikov38
Mar 3, 2007

We were somewhere around Manila when the drugs began to take hold

FrancisFukyomama posted:

I thought Genghis khan was viewed fairly positively in China since the line is that he’s a cultural hero of the Mongols and since Mongols are part of the multicultural Chinese nation, he’s also a Chinese hero. at least that’s the reasoning all the Chinese people I know who consider genghis to be Chinese is

the yuan dynasty is not well regarded by non-Mongolians i believe

FrancisFukyomama
Feb 4, 2019

Raskolnikov38 posted:

the yuan dynasty is not well regarded by non-Mongolians i believe

kublai khan seems pretty popular in China, in a Qin Shihuang “established order and institutions” way

I mean, all those Genghis and kublai statues they have around China were pretty recent

Pener Kropoopkin
Jan 30, 2013

I've been trying to look up which statue that is exactly and just can't find it, or any news story about it. That's not the only Genghis Khan statue in Inner Mongolia either, so it's not like the CCP is trying to wipe out his memory. AFAIK that could be a statue of Guan Yu.

PhilippAchtel
May 31, 2011


At least some people had the sense to ask the right question:

https://twitter.com/ChadOfChadsAF/status/1420470239121354752

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️

PhilippAchtel posted:

At least some people had the sense to ask the right question:

https://twitter.com/ChadOfChadsAF/status/1420470239121354752

What, how dare Russian spies ask sensible questions

Some Guy TT
Aug 30, 2011

https://mobile.twitter.com/nick_kapur/status/1420500125722583047

Mantis42
Jul 26, 2010

That's better than Proust

Some Guy TT
Aug 30, 2011

https://mobile.twitter.com/nodutdol/status/1419748433934573570

Pyrus Malus
Nov 22, 2007
APPLES
There's a vid I saw posted with this Remnim University professor talking about the deep state and how the CCP has infiltrated the biden administration and turmp was actually a savior all along etc etc and of course it's making inroads in right wing circles.

Anyway I wanted to curse you all with it in an attempt to maybe figure out what the heck this actually is because it's clearly american right wing propaganda and maybe knowing more about it will allow me to dunk on people who post it in the future

apologies for nazi twitter link outside the self own thread ofc:

https://twitter.com/JackPosobiec/status/1419806207460659203?s=09

LimburgLimbo
Feb 10, 2008

drat I wrote almost exactly the same as this article over a few beers a while back in the lol at trump thread in GBS lol

Ardennes posted:

I didn't know the US military was directly involved in 1/6.

That's a critical difference imo; for all the issues with US militarization, the US military is pretty apolitical to an extent you historically don't often see in such a powerful organization, and it's probably one of the main reasons the US hasn't totally fallen to fascist assholes

LimburgLimbo
Feb 10, 2008
Imma repost it because gently caress your scroll wheel fingers

Edit: my writing is arguably better despite doing it while being a few Strong Zero in, because it looks like this dude glossed over the kinda important part of the story where there were actually opposing ultranationalist factions, with different takes but broadly similar goals, which is perhaps important because one faction's aims could be ultimately advanced by the actions of another, while retaining plausible deniability. Ultimately the specific faction that did most of the coup-attempts and open attacks *was not* the one that gained power.

I'm going to mark this as a personal victory over Bloomberg

LimburgLimbo posted:

This is very nearly a non-sequitur, but I've spent quite a bit of time thinking about how people contextualize information, in relation to that I was thinking about peoples' conceptions of prewar/wartime Japan and the history there.

You know another place where ultranationalists started getting bolder and bolder and suffering minimal consequences before eventually taking effective control of the government entirely? Japan in in the 1930s; until finally a 1936 "failed" coup attempted (one of many far-right secret society coups and assassinations in that period) roundly secured the power of the ultranationalists. Before that, in the early 1900s, Japan was rapidly modernizing and showing itself to be quite progressive (by the standards of the colonial empires at the time, that is).

Within a year, in 1937, the military had engineered casus belli for the war they wanted in China, and began the string of atrocities that Japan is known for.

If you read the details of these events, the one thing that ties them all together was that in almost every case of a far-right secret society *literally killing a prime minister* or trying to engineer a coup, the perpetrators got off with basically slaps on the wrist, because the opposition didn't have the power or were too fearful for their lives to fight back against the encroaching extremists.

...but of course something like that could never happen in AMERICA, right?

LimburgLimbo posted:

Yeah part of my recent musings have been specifically around that. Many westerners are more aware of the German history, and frequently at some level make some kind of distinction between things the "Nazis" did and how "Germans" are and at some level understand that you shouldn't let the Nazis take over or win elections. But they really don't with Japan, despite them following somewhat similar patterns where extremist elements politically took over, and things are frequently framed as "the Japanese" as an entire race/culture having committed many atrocities. Which in my mind really misses an important point because there's fascinating lessons to be learned from Japan's downfall to extremism.

There's elements of the fact that people just don't know the history of Japan in the period, there's also some elements of racism/prejudice in the sense that people are generally more willing to view people from greatly different cultures as a monolithic other.

This is also not to excuse populations in general - in Germany and in Japan there were enthusiastic participants in the fascist movements there and things aren't as simple as it was just "the Nazis" or just the Japanese ultranationalist secret societies that brought about what they did.

Japan is interesting though in that there was never something like Hitler's election to Chancellor that marked a clean transition of power - it was more that the extremist elements of the military just took over bit by bit, with the civilian government largely intact but powerless. By the time Tojo became Prime Minister it was quite late in the game.

To give a really brief, rough history of the downfall at the hands of extremists, with wikipedia links (English articles are really limited though) for convenience

1921 November - Moderate PM Hara Takashi assassinated by a far-right extremist. Killer ultimately only spends 13 years in jail. For assassinating a goddamn head of state. This one is fairly early and before things really started accelerating but important because the PM was pushing for things like joining the league of nations, removing military control of the Korea colony and having it civilian run, and generally removing a lot of the terrible oppressive poo poo Japan did in Korea, which the far right reallllly did not like.
1929 start of the Great Depression, made a lot of people discontent and gave a lot of rhetorical ammo to people who were saying there needed to be radical change, etc.
1930 November - Liberal PM Hamaguchi shot by a right wing extremist from a secret society. Survives but suffers health problems, steps down as PM and dies about a year later.
1931 March - an abortive coup by a far right secret society. Actually their second attempt after trying to start riots a month earlier in February. Get slapped on the wrist as punishment.
1931 October - literally the same loving dudes as before try a coup. The leaders gets *20 days house arrest* lol
1932 May - another attempted coup in which they assassinated the Prime Minister and blew some stuff up, then when it was clear they hadn't set off a larger uprising took taxis to the police office to turn themselves in to the military police. Get a slap on the wrist. Again, for *assassinating the head of state*.
1934 November - another planned coup. Some of the perpetrators were *gasp* expelled from school a year later.
1936 February - the biggest and most coherent coup attempt yet, but which ultimately failed, and finally the perpetrators were punished... but they were also of a separate extremist faction than the one that would eventually take over. It could be suspected that the Touseiha who became the dominant extremist faction and de facto took over the country were happy to have the conspirators (who were from their opposing ultranationalist faction) take the fall because the end result met their needs while also letting them gut the opposing group.

And after this everything rapidly goes even further to poo poo and becomes the Japan you see portrayed in movies as soilless bastards, controlled openly by the military, secret police terrorizing those at home and abroad, killing and raping a burning their way across all of Asia, etc. Once things hit critical mass they can go bad really loving fast.

In my mind some of the parallels here where the US may be heading, with extremists literally killing politicians then taxiing around to turn themselves in, and getting poo poo like house arrest for open treason, is mind boggling. People in the US keep waiting for a big event like Hitler being made chancellor before really freaking out, but in reality if things go really bad it will be more like Japan, where extremist elements just gradually get bolder and bolder, and never get punished for it worth a drat because people don't want to sack up stop them, and there's never an official name change or different flags or anything, poo poo just goes bad, fast.

Really probably the only reason we're not further along into this is because somehow the US military is actually so far pretty good at being relatively non-political. We'll see if that holds up if/when their budget starts to get cut though.

Edit:
Here's an interesting contemporary article written in 1936 about the last coup attempt.
https://archive.macleans.ca/article/1936/6/1/government-by-assassination

Read the ending if nothing else:

quote:

What had all this bloodshed meant after all? Only that the Army cannot be controlled by the civil authorities, even with the support of the Emperor himself...

All through these troubled years it has become increasingly plain to a startled world that the Japanese Army and the Japanese Nation are not one in their ambitions for conquest in Asia, for war with Soviet Russia, for world dominance.

The Army has gone far since 1931. It has climbed high. But “even monkeys fall from trees," the Japanese say. Japan has still to suffer much, but the Army will finally fall far and hard; and then peace may come to a troubled and quiet-loving Asia.

If only he had been right.

LimburgLimbo has issued a correction as of 07:55 on Jul 29, 2021

Centrist Committee
Aug 6, 2019
I just finished surveillance valley and lol at tor being a cia plot to break through the chinese firewall

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️

Centrist Committee posted:

I just finished surveillance valley and lol at tor being a cia plot to break through the chinese firewall

I had literally bought a HK SIM card and used it in the mainland for fully unlocked internet

Zedhe Khoja
Nov 10, 2017

sürgünden selamlar
yıkıcılar ulusuna

Mantis42 posted:

That's better than Proust

In Search of Lost Time is the most aptly named book series to ever exist.

crepeface
Nov 5, 2004

r*p*f*c*
saw this video of a talk that kishore mahbubani gave at the harvard institute of politics about china's ascendency into the #1 superpower and a student asks about their relationship (?) with usa being a close #2 and i loving lolled and lmaoed at the answer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVkLqC3p0Og&t=4209s

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

crepeface posted:

saw this video of a talk that kishore mahbubani gave at the harvard institute of politics about china's ascendency into the #1 superpower and a student asks about their relationship (?) with usa being a close #2 and i loving lolled and lmaoed at the answer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVkLqC3p0Og&t=4209s

oh poo poo that did NOT go where I expected

thatfatkid
Feb 20, 2011

by Azathoth

crepeface posted:

saw this video of a talk that kishore mahbubani gave at the harvard institute of politics about china's ascendency into the #1 superpower and a student asks about their relationship (?) with usa being a close #2 and i loving lolled and lmaoed at the answer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVkLqC3p0Og&t=4209s

Lol wow how do I get a gig like thatwhere I can just make poo poo up and get paid to travel the world?

stephenthinkpad
Jan 2, 2020

Pyrus Malus posted:

There's a vid I saw posted with this Remnim University professor talking about the deep state and how the CCP has infiltrated the biden administration and turmp was actually a savior all along etc etc and of course it's making inroads in right wing circles.

Anyway I wanted to curse you all with it in an attempt to maybe figure out what the heck this actually is because it's clearly american right wing propaganda and maybe knowing more about it will allow me to dunk on people who post it in the future

apologies for nazi twitter link outside the self own thread ofc:

https://twitter.com/JackPosobiec/status/1419806207460659203?s=09



He is just one of the fairly famous think tanks rehost by Guam Video channel

You can search "嚁东升 Guan video " on YouTube and see how many new video he has recently. He talks about currency and big picture economy policy stuff. See I type his last name wrong because it's impossible to type his last name on my pinyin input. But you can copy and paste the correct name on the video titles.

Some of the Guan video has Chinese subtitle and then you can turn on google auto translate but most don't. He is not first tier think tank like jin canrong but still famous enough to be in a live talk event for people to see face to face. It's probably one of the annual talk events. And the think tanks gets jokey in those events. He had a similar little joke talk I think from 1 year ago in which he told the story of a mysterous important Jewish woman who owns a big house in the inner ring of Beijing and played important role in the Sino-US trade talk (and IIRC has Chinese citizenship, which is kind of impossible unless you get granted by the leadership a long time ago). He told that story as a way to show wink-wink CCP had secret channel with Wall Street.

This video has the same conspiracy angle wink-wink "look our leadership has secret connection with one of the fractions in Washington". It's meant to be a joke for live audience because if it's real he would never touch that secret. Stupid right wingers eating up any conspiracy is just a byproduct.

Junkozeyne
Feb 13, 2012

LimburgLimbo posted:

drat I wrote almost exactly the same as this article over a few beers a while back in the lol at trump thread in GBS lol

That's a critical difference imo; for all the issues with US militarization, the US military is pretty apolitical to an extent you historically don't often see in such a powerful organization, and it's probably one of the main reasons the US hasn't totally fallen to fascist assholes

The US military upholding US hegemony apolitically, talking to the captain of a seized iranian oil tanker: just imagine how we'd treat you if this was political

LimburgLimbo
Feb 10, 2008

Junkozeyne posted:

The US military upholding US hegemony apolitically, talking to the captain of a seized iranian oil tanker: just imagine how we'd treat you if this was political

Pretty obviously I'm talking about in the sense of relatively apolitical domestically; i.e. in the US you don't have active military members taking over elected positions, or siding too obviously with certain political groups, taking official political stances regularly, etc. like has been the case historically in many places.

Military action, and the very existence of military power, is indeed inherently political in particular when used outside of national borders so yeah congrats ya got me bud you're just the smartest laddie or lassie in town, nobody else but you could possible understand that context, round of applause.

wisconsingreg
Jan 13, 2019

exmarx posted:

bernie's 'major countries' bit has always sucked

Luxembourg -- famous major country

my bony fealty
Oct 1, 2008

Zedhe Khoja posted:

In Search of Lost Time is the most aptly named book series to ever exist.

it's ripe for an anime adaptation. bishie Marcel swoons for waifu Odette

Junkozeyne
Feb 13, 2012

LimburgLimbo posted:

Pretty obviously I'm talking about in the sense of relatively apolitical domestically; i.e. in the US you don't have active military members taking over elected positions, or siding too obviously with certain political groups, taking official political stances regularly, etc. like has been the case historically in many places.

Military action, and the very existence of military power, is indeed inherently political in particular when used outside of national borders so yeah congrats ya got me bud you're just the smartest laddie or lassie in town, nobody else but you could possible understand that context, round of applause.

You are posting in the eurasia thread where domestic politics indeed don't matter as US imperialism enjoys bipartisan consent. Take the insane bullshit that it matters to the rest of the world if the stick they get beaten with has an R or D on it to one of the countless US domestic threads

LimburgLimbo
Feb 10, 2008

Junkozeyne posted:

You are posting in the eurasia thread

Yeah because I'm talking primarily about Japanese political history which is an interesting subject especially as it relates to the current cases of the waxing of fascism and ultranationalism worldwide today; passing juxtapositions with the US are not the main point and please don't let your inability to understand context drag "R and D" bullshit into here as you poo poo violently upon your keyboard.

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️


"I'm not racist, but...".jpg

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fart simpson
Jul 2, 2005

DEATH TO AMERICA
:xickos:

Palladium posted:



"I'm not racist, but...".jpg

where’s the issue with this

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