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admanb posted:I think we can separate "GW underpays people" from "GW doesn't care about its rules" because I'm guessing they underpay everyone, not just rules writers, and their attention to rules has improved significantly over the last couple of years, but I would assume not because they decided to start paying people more. In that twitter thread he says as far as he knows other departments were paid in line with industry standards, so it does seem like rules writers specifically were being underpaid.
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Jul 27, 2021 20:23
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Cat Face Joe posted:wow, £2.28 each! If you read the article, it's actually 5k each.
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Jul 27, 2021 22:12
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GW can get away with underpaying its staff for the same reason that there's tons of RPGs available for $25-30; the hobby is awash in people eager to work for free or nearly free in order to get to be more immersed in their hobby experience. And more generally, a glut of unemployed people and stagnant wages for the working poor for decades has prevailed on both sides of the pond. This isn't to excuse GW for underpaying its employees, only to suggest that they're hardly unique in our hobby for it, and it's completely unsurprising.
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Jul 27, 2021 22:58
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Angrymog posted:If you read the article, it's actually 5k each. dang, thanks for the math lesson, professor funslayer!
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Jul 27, 2021 23:02
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JMBosch posted:What makes buying a poo poo game for the minis that you like painting and playing with different from buying a poo poo videogame for the aesthetic dress-em-up accessories you can use to make your character or their base or whatever look how you like? Like everyone else said, I can take those minis and use them in a game I like more. I can't move characters between videogames. And I don't think all of these creators are setting out to make lovely games. I'm saying that for a lot of the buyers, they're there because they want the minis, and the game is a bonus. Some of these Kickstarters have had mini-only tiers for that very reason.
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Jul 27, 2021 23:16
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Nuns with Guns posted:Bethesda only "lightly crunching" employees and still releasing incomplete messes like Fallout 76, as well as antics like loving Obsidian every step of the way on Fallout New Vegas' development and refusing them bonuses after it all because the metacritic score wasn't high enough, and the heavy pressure they put on their satellite studios to release cynically monetized games like Wolfenstein: New Blood, can all be bullshit things even if we haven't heard any reports of widespread abuse, racism, or misogyny from the studio. The Todd Howard thing is just a meme because he's a carnival hypeman and he kind of sounds like a discarded muppet experiment. I was mostly defending Todd, not the now-dead CEO of Bethesda who was so corrupt he got banned from ever working in banking ever again. But don't lick the boots of Obshitian too hard there, the plucky, dudley-do-right, why-cant-we-catch-a-break, "if only we had the time and funding we'd give you diamonds" thing is a complete meme. Tsilkani posted:Like everyone else said, I can take those minis and use them in a game I like more. I can't move characters between videogames. I've met very few people excited for the Heroquest remake because they liked the ruleset, after all.
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Jul 27, 2021 23:24
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can we stop talking about video games industry pls, I understand it was used as an example but it's a derail and two or three pages of it is sufficient
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Jul 27, 2021 23:28
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I find it endlessly funny that this derail is of a conversation about Games Workshop. 
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Jul 28, 2021 01:02
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Would it be a derail to say the Switch is still running strong as effectively one platform where GW has made 2 editions of 40k, and now 2 of Kill Team? That make you buy new stuff to just keep using your old stuff. (Also reports in the Snipe and Wib discord is that the new Kill Team rules don't come with army construction for anything but the 2 pack in forces so it looks like it isn't just including templates to replace measuring tape but going full modern Necromunda where you need a friggin Guide just to know what you need to get. Because old Necromunda was 2 softbacks or later 1 hardback and you pretty much had access to all the rules and gangs. And not this:  Blood Bowl isn't quite as bad but its close.) Tabletop game companies seem to be doing like a lot of bigger videogame ones in making as much exclusive but required add ons just to play the game you just bought and seeing how much more they can fleece out of people. Its just worse in Tabletop as it seems a huge portion of the audience demands endless supplements and organized play support otherwise game is dead and doesn't matter. (Also production values huge and fancy. Coffee Table Books but at 2-4x the cost of said books and generally useless or at least impractical for actually being a rule book for playing a game with, especially if you have to be the GM or travel outside your home.) I get companies need to make money but this is the only way? Endless editions and supplements? As much blind buy as possible? Ever increasing prices for less actual content?
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Jul 28, 2021 02:21
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Continuously updating the rules of your tabletop game to keep balance and mechanics fresh is Good. Charging for those updates is Bad.
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Jul 28, 2021 02:44
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Captain Rufus posted:Would it be a derail to say the Switch is still running strong as effectively one platform where GW has made 2 editions of 40k, and now 2 of Kill Team? what This is amazing, by the ways: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpm904XT_lM TheDiceMustRoll fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Jul 28, 2021 |
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Jul 28, 2021 03:32
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admanb posted:Continuously updating the rules of your tabletop game to keep balance and mechanics fresh is Good. Charging for those updates is Bad. How do you pay the writers of those updates?
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Jul 28, 2021 04:05
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Puppy Time posted:How do you pay the writers of those updates? With all the money from the minis you keep selling? We're talking about GW here, right?
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Jul 28, 2021 04:07
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The bonus is great news, but bear in mind a notable chunk of it goes strictly to management and that GW's head earns in the top six figures. So it's all relative.
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Jul 28, 2021 06:20
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admanb posted:Continuously updating the rules of your tabletop game to keep balance and mechanics fresh is Good. Charging for those updates is Bad. ideally you achieve balance sooner rather than later and then it needn't be continuous in the first place if a game doesn't "stay fresh" then it was just a bad game whose badness was obfuscated enough that it took you a minute to notice
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Jul 28, 2021 09:38
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TheDiceMustRoll posted:what
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Jul 28, 2021 10:06
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The Fighting Fantasy (and other gamebooks) facebook group just said quote:"ADMIN POST: I feel it necessary to say something on this subject. As many of you will no doubt by now be aware, our little community has been rocked by the news of the reprehensible behaviour of a prominent one of our number. I have removed the individual in question from every gamebook group that I am an Admin for to prevent any issues before they happen. No-one can condone the person's actions, but we all just need to disassociate ourselves and walk away from this immediately. No comments invited please. Thank you." Err...who was that? I'd ask as a comment but apparently they aren't needed.
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Jul 28, 2021 12:28
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James M Hewitt has posted a longer/more nuanced piece on his time with GW https://lagoon83.medium.com/working-at-games-workshop-the-nuanced-version-edda9ffb1237
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Jul 28, 2021 12:49
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Comstar posted:The Fighting Fantasy (and other gamebooks) facebook group just said is it Sandy Peterson? https://www.belloflostsouls.net/2021/07/rpg-call-of-cthulhu-creator-faces-backlash-after-transphobic-statements.html
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Jul 28, 2021 13:24
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alg posted:is it Sandy Peterson? I presume it was, unless there were TWO people in the industry or famous to do something like that today.
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Jul 28, 2021 13:34
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Comstar posted:I presume it was, unless there were TWO people in the industry or famous to do something like that today. I didn't think Sandy Peterson wrote gamebooks; at least not the Fighting Fantasy ones?
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Jul 28, 2021 13:38
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I'm assuming it was a community member or they would have named/shamed. E: sorry, a non-famous community member. And it could be anything, someone getting convicted of a high profile crime might be enough to cause a lot of off-topic derails. moths fucked around with this message at 14:56 on Jul 28, 2021 |
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Jul 28, 2021 14:08
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That's not particularly useful for other communities to know to be wary of this person.
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Jul 28, 2021 14:42
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TheDiceMustRoll posted:But don't lick the boots of Obshitian too hard there, the plucky, dudley-do-right, why-cant-we-catch-a-break, "if only we had the time and funding we'd give you diamonds" thing is a complete meme. I don't know why you think I'd be licking any loving boots here after comparing the loving gaming industry to Dungeons and Dragons demons, by that standard you're licking Mr. Howard Baatezu's shiny hooves, too. e- I'm not asking to keep litigating this, but I'm not going to take being called a boot licker for the most basic observational comment Nuns with Guns fucked around with this message at 15:15 on Jul 28, 2021 |
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Jul 28, 2021 15:09
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Nuns with Guns posted:I don't know why you think I'd be licking any loving boots here after comparing the loving gaming industry to Dungeons and Dragons demons, by that standard you're licking Mr. Howard Baatezu's shiny hooves, too. ill send ya a pm, we'll leave it off the thread
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Jul 29, 2021 02:17
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Puppy Time posted:How do you pay the writers of those updates? Infinity updates the rules and army list options and puts everything up for free on the internet. You only need to pay if you want printed copies of the rules or the lore. Given that they can do this with cheaper per unit minis and much smaller army sizes requiring smaller purchases, certainly GW "we primarily make miniatures and also please buy hundreds of them" can probably swing it. edit: for instance, here's the official free PDF of the Infinity rulebook right from Corvus Belli: https://downloads.corvusbelli.com/infinity/rules/infinity-rules-en.pdf BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 02:32 on Jul 29, 2021 |
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Jul 29, 2021 02:28
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Corvus Belli has also offered an official free-to-use army building web app for a few years now, which is something GW just launched this past December, though also for FREE*. (*free for a month while it's in beta)
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Jul 29, 2021 07:40
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just gently caress this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXljeaktnDA
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Jul 30, 2021 00:02
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StratGoatCom posted:just gently caress this. They actually think they can make a Warhammer streaming service on top of alienating tons of fans? Wow.
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Jul 30, 2021 00:45
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StratGoatCom posted:just gently caress this. Anyone able to give a synopsis/transcript for those of us who'd rather shoot ourselves than listen to someone droning on for loving ages? Locking information behind video is bad enough, worse when the "video" is just audio.
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Jul 30, 2021 01:03
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DigitalRaven posted:Anyone able to give a synopsis/transcript for those of us who'd rather shoot ourselves than listen to someone droning on for loving ages? Pretty much this, please don't post "vlogger who's never heard of editing" with no context.
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Jul 30, 2021 01:08
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What do you all not understand about that perfectly clear title, "The Fate of TTS", that isn't fully explained in the description, "Please watch the video for all context please please I beg of you.", or in the first five+ minute of a man complaining about GW and saying he's not going to fight them over it because he has a kid now? Edit: Okay, from context clues and those first few minutes I'm assuming TTS is some kind of Warhammer fan media that Games Workshop has said they'll be cracking down on, and the creator is giving up. Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 01:27 on Jul 30, 2021 |
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Jul 30, 2021 01:12
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I thought it was Tabletop Simulator.
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Jul 30, 2021 01:36
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The guys who make "If the Emperor Had a Text To Speech Device" are ceasing to make "If the emperor had a text to speech device" because games workshop is implementing some weird first party streaming service while also implementing draconian fanwork laws for things that don't involve their first party streaming service, and while TTS is almost certainly fair use, they do not have the time or money to actually fight that in court, and asking Games Workshop if they're cool with them continuing to make TTS would just result in them becoming aware of it, and probably demonetizing the channel and shutting down their patreon. So they're going to keep their style and gimmick but move onto other properties that are more welcoming to fan works. They aren't ruling out moving back to games workshop but it would require concrete evidence that they're okay with fanworks again.
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Jul 30, 2021 01:46
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I'm guessing its Text To Speech, as in, the now pretty famous If The Emperor Had A Text To Speech Device series of humorous warhammer parody videos, and, without watching, that content 100% is legally protected by fair use laws because it's parody, but that probably does not in any way mean that youtube will let him keep the videos up if games workshop has decided to send a C&D. e. yup what he said
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Jul 30, 2021 01:47
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I increasingly feel like cracking down on fanwork these days is just kind of dumb; it's almost never going to be any kind of competition for your own stuff, and it's basically free advertising. There's several things I've gotten into just because fanwork made me go, "Hang on, this looks kind of neat?" The only exception I can think is if you're like marketing to children and weird people have decided to overwhelm the internet with porn of your work. Also youtube sucks.
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Jul 30, 2021 03:05
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To add to this, I never cared about Dragon Ball Z and became kind of a fan after watching Dragon Ball Z abridged, which was amazing. Even though they legally were fine, and the american side of the IP was fine, they got slapped with strikes on a semi-constant basis. Lots of other shows did this too, Attack on Titan was a brutal one.
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Jul 30, 2021 05:17
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I think Team Four Star and Alfabusa's content mirror each other a lot. Started off as a cheap, meme-y parody, fleshed out to the point where it almost became more about telling a story than making gags, and simultaneously serves as both a foot in the door and a lock on the same door for various future projects.
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Jul 30, 2021 05:53
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Puppy Time posted:I increasingly feel like cracking down on fanwork these days is just kind of dumb; it's almost never going to be any kind of competition for your own stuff, and it's basically free advertising. There's several things I've gotten into just because fanwork made me go, "Hang on, this looks kind of neat?" I think the “weird people” factor matters a lot here. I cannot imagine GW not being perfectly aware of the fan stuff. And they also know that for every hundred good things from the fan community you might get one ArchWarhammer. And that is something you never want your IP associated with. So the solution ends up a pre-emptive strategy of either taking products into the fold or sending C&D letters. Not because they are not aware of the advertising value, but because they are aware of it and know they cannot control what image that advertisement gives them, for better or worse.
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Jul 30, 2021 06:28
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Battle Mad Ronin posted:I think the “weird people” factor matters a lot here. I cannot imagine GW not being perfectly aware of the fan stuff. And they also know that for every hundred good things from the fan community you might get one ArchWarhammer. And that is something you never want your IP associated with. So the solution ends up a pre-emptive strategy of either taking products into the fold or sending C&D letters. Not because they are not aware of the advertising value, but because they are aware of it and know they cannot control what image that advertisement gives them, for better or worse. I guess. My take on it is that GW really likes things to be a part of the closed ecosystem - no proxy models, kitbashing only with our sprues, use our paints, brushes, water pots and such, listen to black library audiobooks while you paint etc etc etc. And it kind of works. I've only been doing miniature stuff since april, and I've met an enormous amount of people who basically view "wargaming" as "warhammer" and everything else is just weird and strange to them. I can't tell if it's a weird sunk cost thing, because from the way they bitch and whine most of the time, it's definitely not the rules, pricing, quality of product, etc. The whole "pile of shame" thing threw me for a loop too, most of the warhammer people I know just have boxes and boxes and boxes of model kits they've never touched
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Jul 30, 2021 08:24
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