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For Shapers in the remake the best build is getting to like 10-12 Mechanics/leadership and 4-5 points in each shaping skill. Then every other level up into essence so you can afford to have 7 high tier creations. I think my other stats were like base then 22 essence mastery by end game.
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Mar 26, 2021 16:53
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Zore posted:For Shapers in the remake the best build is getting to like 10-12 Mechanics/leadership and 4-5 points in each shaping skill. Then every other level up into essence so you can afford to have 7 high tier creations.  , though I'd also add that the 10-12 Mechanics/Leadership are basically end-game numbers; no need to rush too much on your non-combat skills. Personally, I've found it's usually a good balance to raise them every 3 levels or so; this keeps you effective in Mechanics/Leadership without putting your character way behind on the combat side of things. Oh, and put enough points into your magic skills to be able to cast everything, but more than that isn't particularly worthwhile if you're a Shaper.Also, the new 'stealth' skill is kind of poo poo. The instant you attack one guy in a pack of enemies, all his buddies will hear the fight and jump in, so it's really only useful if you're dedicated to pacifism. It doesn't work well if you've got more than a couple creations, because they generally spread out and/or get in each other's way enough that someone gets caught. Oh, and if the zone's clear condition is to kill enemies, the game usually doesn't count sneaking past, so it makes your overworld travel a pain in the rear end. ilitarist posted:A4 has fun concept of late-game bosses present in the game throughout the game, but other than that you're not missing much. Just like with all the other Spiderweb games, all are self-contained. I think this one starts the story of Dark Side Loyalists anime villains, but I think that's it. Oh, and the A4 ending has the water monsters just stop appearing regardless if you do anything or not. The general consensus among the playerbase is that the 'water monsters' (again, supposed to be one of the biggest problems plaguing Avernum) were an  concept added in production when Jeff realized he couldn't include boats, so he needed a handwave to explain why you can't get a boat.
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Mar 29, 2021 02:43
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https://twitter.com/spiderwebsoft/status/1387178140284329984?s=20
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Apr 28, 2021 05:03
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Apr 28, 2021 05:14
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even as a lifelong spidweb person i bounced off hard on QW release because of graphics but i just gave it a fair shot and after like an hour i forgot about most of it and beat it that said the most avernum remakes/avadon stuff wasnt winning graphical acolades but they were both a bit more palatable indie fare only thing id say is :doublethumbs: with QW is character models changing with gear you have equipped (to some degree) by the end youre all wearing the same plate armor and robes cause of how loot is meaningless, but seeing PCs actually change appearance depending on what you equip them with was nice....which says a lot, but still but QW ended up pretty fun 50-60 hours distraction, id still recommend anyone to do nu-nuAvernum 1-3 over it though
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May 13, 2021 03:11
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I haven't played any spiderweb games much at all, or crpgs in general for that matter. I did pick up the original geneforge off I believe a humble bundle at some point, I had played it a bit and thought the writing was pretty fun but ultimately set it down and never picked it back up Anyways i recently got my ADHD medicated and want to give it another shot, but the crpg gameplay was very tedious and uninteresting for me. Wanted to know if there was substantial changes in that regard in the geneforge remake, if the story was significantly rewritten or anything, and would it be recommended to just play on the easiest difficulty or something and mostly ignore the combat/looting/not-talking-to-people stuff
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Aug 3, 2021 20:58
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Oh wow this thread hasn't had a new post in a couple months uh
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Aug 3, 2021 20:59
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ninjewtsu posted:I haven't played any spiderweb games much at all, or crpgs in general for that matter. I did pick up the original geneforge off I believe a humble bundle at some point, I had played it a bit and thought the writing was pretty fun but ultimately set it down and never picked it back up The story had some additions in the remake in the form of new characters/factions/quests and minor rewrites to make the dialogue flow better with some of the sequels but the core of the story is identical to the original release. The systems were changed a lot mechanically, the gameplay is extremely different so maybe try it if you bounced off of how fiddly the original release was? Otherwise its pretty easy to power through on easy. Geneforge is one of my favorite games of all time and I think it has a really unique hook and story to tell.
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Aug 3, 2021 21:09
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I haven't played the remake, but judging by previous 20 games from this developer the answer is no. I don't think those games are good in skip combat mode. Geneforge is cool in making you earn your progress and the threat of combat should influence your decisions. If you don't know a lot of CRPGs there are many story and wiritng-focused ones that might suit you better.
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Aug 3, 2021 21:10
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ninjewtsu posted:Anyways i recently got my ADHD medicated and want to give it another shot, but the crpg gameplay was very tedious and uninteresting for me. It's less fiddly, but it's still very much a throwback CRPG. quote:Wanted to know if there was substantial changes in that regard in the geneforge remake, if the story was significantly rewritten or anything No, you're still a novice wizard who gets shipwrecked on a strange island and discovers Terrible Powerful Secrets. quote:and would it be recommended to just play on the easiest difficulty or something and mostly ignore the combat/looting/not-talking-to-people stuff For you, probably. You can always change the difficulty later if you're unhappy with what you set it at.
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Aug 3, 2021 23:09
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They've smoothed off some of the rough edges of the combat and made it a lot less finicky, especially with regards to loot/inventory management (most notably, by adding a bottomless "junk bag" that holds all the poo poo you want to sell back in town). But at heart, it really keeps the throwback CRPG style - turn-based, HP, lots of stats/equipment, huge amounts of text and writing, etc. I would note that there's a decent sized demo which covers around 10-15% of the game and it's very seamlessly set up to transition your saves to the 'full' game, so if you're on the fence, I'd say to just download the demo on Steam and give it a shot. Also, just FWIW, the thread has a decent number of people who have it bookmarked and reply, it's just that posts come in waves. Being a small indie developer, Spidweb doesn't really have a constant stream of news. Sometime soon (probably later this month or early autumn), Spidweb will announce their next game Queen's Wish 2 and probably with a kickstarter attached, but till then, there's just not much to discuss outside of answering questions.
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Aug 4, 2021 02:38
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Is anyone having difficulty running any of the earlier Geneforge games? It's the Spiderweb series I have the least knowledge of, and I was wondering if playing 1 and 2, maybe 3, is near to impossible now? I'm also curious about the first set of Avernum remakes, 1-3. The only reason I can run the original 4 Exile games is due to finding some that are pre-wrapped, but I will say that the original Nethergate runs perfectly on Win7 and Win10 despite its age. It was the first 32-bit game that Spiderweb ever did, and for some reason Jeff pretends that it never existed.
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Aug 4, 2021 02:47
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JustJeff88 posted:Is anyone having difficulty running any of the earlier Geneforge games? It's the Spiderweb series I have the least knowledge of, and I was wondering if playing 1 and 2, maybe 3, is near to impossible now? I'm also curious about the first set of Avernum remakes, 1-3. The only reason I can run the original 4 Exile games is due to finding some that are pre-wrapped, but I will say that the original Nethergate runs perfectly on Win7 and Win10 despite its age. It was the first 32-bit game that Spiderweb ever did, and for some reason Jeff pretends that it never existed.
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Aug 4, 2021 03:19
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So regarding the Servile Origins quest... Am I misremembering or is this quest new? I could have sworn the original game heavily implied or outright stated that Serviles were originally made from Humans, while this game comes out and has characters speculating on it, but ultimately in this quest reveals that actually they're not at all based on Humans.
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Aug 4, 2021 03:22
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MagusofStars posted:Also, just FWIW, the thread has a decent number of people who have it bookmarked and reply, it's just that posts come in waves. Being a small indie developer, Spidweb doesn't really have a constant stream of news. Sometime soon (probably later this month or early autumn), Spidweb will announce their next game Queen's Wish 2 and probably with a kickstarter attached, but till then, there's just not much to discuss outside of answering questions. Yeah I'm pretty sure there's a ton of us nerds skulking around, just waiting to talk about Spiderweb games. The Spidweb forums were the very first forums little Hawkperson posted on  I haven't played the Geneforge remake yet but these games will always hold a very special place in my heart. MagusofStars posted:I haven't tried on Windows 10, but I've done the original Geneforge games on Win7 and didn't have many issues, so I wouldn't expect problems with Win10 for either of those series. I think I tried them on Windows 10 but I can't remember. But the only problem I had was that I had to fiddle with the resolution before I could get what I could see to line up with what I wanted to click on. Had to do a bunch of experimentation with the launcher iirc. The games themselves worked fine though.
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Aug 4, 2021 03:58
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JustJeff88 posted:Is anyone having difficulty running any of the earlier Geneforge games? It's the Spiderweb series I have the least knowledge of, and I was wondering if playing 1 and 2, maybe 3, is near to impossible now? I'm also curious about the first set of Avernum remakes, 1-3. The only reason I can run the original 4 Exile games is due to finding some that are pre-wrapped, but I will say that the original Nethergate runs perfectly on Win7 and Win10 despite its age. It was the first 32-bit game that Spiderweb ever did, and for some reason Jeff pretends that it never existed. I remember a lot of loving around with dxwnd for getting 1 and 2 working on Win 7 but it ultimately came together.
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Aug 4, 2021 04:00
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RoboChrist 9000 posted:So regarding the Servile Origins quest... That's new for the remake And it ties in more with the later games in the series that back off that particular plot point.
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Aug 4, 2021 04:03
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JustJeff88 posted:Is anyone having difficulty running any of the earlier Geneforge games? It's the Spiderweb series I have the least knowledge of, and I was wondering if playing 1 and 2, maybe 3, is near to impossible now? I'm also curious about the first set of Avernum remakes, 1-3. The only reason I can run the original 4 Exile games is due to finding some that are pre-wrapped, but I will say that the original Nethergate runs perfectly on Win7 and Win10 despite its age. It was the first 32-bit game that Spiderweb ever did, and for some reason Jeff pretends that it never existed. I didn't have any problems when I picked them up
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Aug 4, 2021 04:33
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Hawkperson posted:Yeah I'm pretty sure there's a ton of us nerds skulking around, just waiting to talk about Spiderweb games. This threads is one of my favorite on SA, purely for nostalgia. It always warms my heart to see how many of y'all played the same games I did 25 years ago. Especially these games, just because of how much time i put in and how much entertainment I got out of them. Somewhere in my house is a leather-bound notebook my brother and I would fill out as we played Exile 2. That way when the other person was playing, we could keep track of where we found stuff so the other could hunt it up later.
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Aug 4, 2021 16:36
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Zore posted:That's new for the remake Huh, I don't mind spoilers; how did the original games deal with it in the later games? I only ever really played much of the first. I loved the setting and concept but just various life issues stopped me from getting into the sequels the first time around
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Aug 4, 2021 22:31
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RoboChrist 9000 posted:Huh, I don't mind spoilers; how did the original games deal with it in the later games? I only ever really played much of the first. I loved the setting and concept but just various life issues stopped me from getting into the sequels the first time around All the later games end up dealing with a rebellion against the Shapers that gets kicked off by the spread of canister and Geneforge technology from Sucia and you actually even get to play as a Servile in 4/5 (they're the Combat Strong, Magic Neutral, Shaping Weak class). The games are also way more about dealing with the consequences of creating life, especially sentient life, with the Serviles and Drayks (and later other creations as the war ramps up and the Drayks create essentially superior versions of themselves who uh start running roughshod over the rebellion  )My guess is he wanted to back off some of the implication that the only reason to care about the Serviles is because they were warped from humans because the later games are far more about pan Creation personhood to some degree and that gets muddled if you can separate out Serviles. Zore fucked around with this message at 22:45 on Aug 4, 2021 |
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Aug 4, 2021 22:41
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Oh I knew that much. I just didn't know how the sequels dealt with the particular issue of the genetic origins of Serviles. But yeah. Avernum may be the series that introduced me to Jeff's works and the one that most has the nostalgia going for me, but Geneforge is easily his most thoughtful and intelligent work and the one of his series I'd most like to see in a proper 3D or at least like what he'd do if he had unlimited money to spend on the art for it. It's such a unique and cool setting and it's honestly tragic to me that we can't see it realized fully in the visuals. Jeff deserves so much more recognition and success than he has.
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Aug 4, 2021 22:47
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RoboChrist 9000 posted:Oh I knew that much. I just didn't know how the sequels dealt with the particular issue of the genetic origins of Serviles. I agree, but he at least seems very content and happy with his niche so I don't know that he would agree with us. https://youtu.be/stxVBJem3Rs Just the exemplar of what an independent artist and designer should strive for. Really inspirational.
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Aug 4, 2021 23:17
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This thread has awoken Jeff. Queen's Wish 2 is coming https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/spiderwebsoftware/queens-wish-2-the-tormentor
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Aug 4, 2021 23:55
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gently caress yes, but lol at using art from QW1 for the kick starter.
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Aug 5, 2021 00:32
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Can anyone recommend a way to contact Jeff directly? Part of me wants to ask him why he pretends that Nethergate Original doesn't exist, but mostly I want to ask him if he could include GOG codes for buying his games straight from Spiderweb instead of just Steam codes. I prefer to buy directly from Spiderweb for obvious reasons, but I prefer GOG to Steam for my extra key.
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Aug 5, 2021 00:34
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JustJeff88 posted:Can anyone recommend a way to contact Jeff directly? Part of me wants to ask him why he pretends that Nethergate Original doesn't exist, but mostly I want to ask him if he could include GOG codes for buying his games straight from Spiderweb instead of just Steam codes. I prefer to buy directly from Spiderweb for obvious reasons, but I prefer GOG to Steam for my extra key. jvogel@spiderwebsoftware.com is where I’ve emailed with him before for beta testing and stuff.
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Aug 5, 2021 00:43
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ilitarist posted:This thread has awoken Jeff. Queen's Wish 2 is coming Yesssssssss. Really excited to see how the dungeon and item system will be tinkered with based on how it shook out in 1. I was initially really annoyed with “clear in one run or do it again” but once I got into the game it gave it such a fresh feel. Don’t remember enough to remember it’s little clunks but I do remember Jeff acknowledging them and mentioning having some ideas for solving them.
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Aug 5, 2021 01:14
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ilitarist posted:This thread has awoken Jeff. Queen's Wish 2 is coming I'm mildly disappointed that I can't give him my money yet.
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Aug 5, 2021 04:20
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Hawkperson posted:Yesssssssss. Really excited to see how the dungeon and item system will be tinkered with based on how it shook out in 1. I was initially really annoyed with “clear in one run or do it again” but once I got into the game it gave it such a fresh feel. Don’t remember enough to remember it’s little clunks but I do remember Jeff acknowledging them and mentioning having some ideas for solving them.
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Aug 5, 2021 14:36
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idhrendur posted:I'm mildly disappointed that I can't give him my money yet. 
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Aug 5, 2021 20:27
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so far i'm really enjoying geneforge mutagen on easy mode. the crpg stuff is a little clunky but not as bad as i'd feared, and the writing is really fascinating. got a good laugh at the servile who invented servile banditry because he read about it in a book. haven't run into anyone other than the awakened yet (well, there was the one taker spy i guess, who honestly put up a half decent argument for betraying my people with no prior reason to), and i'm enjoying how even within the awakened sect each servile has their own individual nuance in how they think of shapers and react to me. honestly their individuality almost makes it a bummer that i can't interact with any given one more, i'd love to do more stuff with the servile who's learned how to make and use shaper artifacts (believe his name was ham?). i opened the dude's locked box and was disappointed that i only got like one line of dialogue and a one use magic rock out of it i'm considering bumping the difficulty up but i'm also running into an issue where my ice dinosaur randomly gets feared and occasionally charmed during battle, and until i have a good handle on that i don't really want to introduce additional frustration into the combat. i understand it's because i made him too strong, i guess next level up i need to dump everything into my own combat abilities so i can make him weaker without combat getting more difficult. i remember reading about the original geneforge that having creations/constantly absorbing and remaking them meant they sucked some xp away from you (though not enough to be meaningful even over an entire game run), is that mechanic still present in mutagen? oh also i found an ice dinosaur in the awakened fortress and i guess i told it to go back to its master but i have no idea who its master is or where it went. sucks because i'd kinda like to follow up on why that thing was there ninjewtsu fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Aug 6, 2021 |
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Aug 6, 2021 00:40
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also it's a little unclear to me how long the island has been abandoned, is that normal? from how individual societies have formed it seems like it'd be hundreds of years but from the way the serviles talk it seems like they're mostly the original creations that got abandoned, not their ancestors generations later or anything (though i do notice there's at least one child servile, i guess the shapers gave serviles reproductive organs?). i think that one servant mind i talked to said its been abandoned for a few hundred years, are serviles just really long lived, am i misunderstanding something, or have i just not gotten far enough in for the answer to be clear?
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Aug 6, 2021 00:50
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ninjewtsu posted:so far i'm really enjoying geneforge mutagen on easy mode. the crpg stuff is a little clunky but not as bad as i'd feared, and the writing is really fascinating. got a good laugh at the servile who invented servile banditry because he read about it in a book. haven't run into anyone other than the awakened yet (well, there was the one taker spy i guess, who honestly put up a half decent argument for betraying my people with no prior reason to), and i'm enjoying how even within the awakened sect each servile has their own individual nuance in how they think of shapers and react to me. honestly their individuality almost makes it a bummer that i can't interact with any given one more, i'd love to do more stuff with the servile who's learned how to make and use shaper artifacts (believe his name was ham?). i opened the dude's locked box and was disappointed that i only got like one line of dialogue and a one use magic rock out of it The way creations work has changed massively in the remake compared to the originals. Creations have a base level and then get an extra level for every point you have in their shaping type and every point you invest in their stats or special abilities. If a Creation is a higher level than you it has a chance of getting the random fear/charm you noticed. Best way to deal with it early on I found was to spread yourself out among multiple creations instead of stacking one, they don't get their own EXP so feel free to experiment!
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Aug 6, 2021 00:52
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the tooltip says having too many of them makes the fear thing happen too! so if i'm level 3, and i make a level 4 dinosaur, it has control issues, easy to understand. if i make 2 level 2 dinosaurs instead how does my control over them shake out?
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Aug 6, 2021 00:56
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ninjewtsu posted:also it's a little unclear to me how long the island has been abandoned, is that normal? from how individual societies have formed it seems like it'd be hundreds of years but from the way the serviles talk it seems like they're mostly the original creations that got abandoned, not their ancestors generations later or anything (though i do notice there's at least one child servile, i guess the shapers gave serviles reproductive organs?). i think that one servant mind i talked to said its been abandoned for a few hundred years, are serviles just really long lived, am i misunderstanding something, or have i just not gotten far enough in for the answer to be clear? Most of the Serviles you've met have never seen a Shaper, they're generations down the line. There are a few other creations on the island who have but that's because Creations can be exceptionally long lived due to the whole 'Shapers loving around with genetics for centuries'. Creations that are deemed relatively harmless like Serviles and Ornks mostly reproduce naturally. ninjewtsu posted:the tooltip says having too many of them makes the fear thing happen too! so if i'm level 3, and i make a level 4 dinosaur, it has control issues, easy to understand. if i make 2 level 2 dinosaurs instead how does my control over them shake out? It won't be a huge chance to fear. And you'll find as you level your control over everyone is going to shoot up very quickly and it won't be a real concern except for the secret creation
Zore fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Aug 6, 2021 |
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Aug 6, 2021 01:00
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Yeah, even Learned Pinner who is Old As Balls hasn't seen a shaper before.
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Aug 6, 2021 01:01
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Yeah, you learn in the opening Sucia's been barred for about 200 years and Serviles have basically human-equivalent lifespans. There's a few other areas you run into later that nail down the timeline further.
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Aug 6, 2021 01:06
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I really hope we get a GF2 mutagen. I like it just a little bit more then the first one, and the combat polish mutagen got is just so nice.
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Aug 6, 2021 01:47
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Famethrowa posted:I really hope we get a GF2 mutagen. I like it just a little bit more then the first one, and the combat polish mutagen got is just so nice. We're almost definitely getting it in about 18 months after Queen's Wish 2 is released My only concern is that Jeff retires before he finishes out the Geneforge remakes  . Though honestly G4+5 aren't bad to play mechanically like 1+2 are.
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Aug 6, 2021 01:59
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