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You don’t need the rights to the Silmarillion to reference its basic plot points. All the important bits are right in the preamble to the Annals of the Kings in LOTR.
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Aug 5, 2021 01:34
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Hell, if someone owned the rights to the Silmarillion and not LotR, they could go right ahead and make a LotR adaptation because it says "Frodo alone with his servant went to Mordor and threw the Ring into the Fire" Right there in black and white
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Aug 5, 2021 01:37
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The only way to do the music would be something like episode 8 of Twin Peaks: The Return
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Aug 5, 2021 01:37
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Data Graham posted:Hell, if someone owned the rights to the Silmarillion and not LotR, they could go right ahead and make a LotR adaptation because it says "Frodo alone with his servant went to Mordor and threw the Ring into the Fire" that's not even what happens in LotR so you’re in the clear
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Aug 5, 2021 01:53
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Zoran posted:that's not even what happens in LotR so you’re in the clear I love these little moments where you can picture JRRT having a sensible scholarly chuckle. Time to summarise my epic trilogy, what is the most succinct way to do that, in a manner which appears okay at first and then gets more and more wrong the longer you look at it?
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Aug 5, 2021 02:22
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Mahoning posted:They don’t actually have the rights to the Silmarillion. In fact the initial press releases about the show specifically mentioned that fact. I just think since Christopher Tolkien does they’re probably less strict about that fact. It's been confirmed by recent leaks that they have been allowed to use some stuff from the first age, and the estate signed off on it. This makes some sense, and likely means that the first age stuff will be flashbacks.
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Aug 5, 2021 03:01
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The two trees died before the First Age. 
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Aug 5, 2021 03:05
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Imagine the lawyers who've spent the last year determining if "I was there, Gandalf" constitutes a copyright violation.
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Aug 5, 2021 03:49
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I’m curious and terrified of how they’d portray a Valar. Just an actor that’s been made into a giant?
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Aug 5, 2021 04:22
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:The two trees died before the First Age. There is actually no definition regard when the first age started, we don't know where the death of the two trees falls in relation
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Aug 5, 2021 04:33
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As I recall, there’s talk of “years of the Trees” and “years of the Lamps”, which to me implies their separate era, but technically it wouldn’t have to be I suppose.
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Aug 5, 2021 04:38
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The first age was explicitly the longest, and The First Age During The Years Of The Sun is only 600 years whereas the second and third both hit 3000, which means it explicitly CAN'T be a separate era. Honestly the most likely but unconfirmed event for the start of the first age is probably the awakening of the elves, which would produce the equivalent of 4902 sun years in total. (Also this means i was wrong about not knowing where the death of the two trees is in relation to the first age, it HAS to be within the first age because otherwise the first age would be at most 638 years and very much not the longest) reignonyourparade fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Aug 5, 2021 |
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Aug 5, 2021 04:50
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The bending of the Earth or War of Wrath didn’t mess with the cosmology to alter the lengths of years I suppose?
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Aug 5, 2021 04:54
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BigglesSWE posted:I’m curious and terrified of how they’d portray a Valar. Just an actor that’s been made into a giant? like the aliens in avatar
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Aug 5, 2021 08:02
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reignonyourparade posted:Honestly the most likely but unconfirmed event for the start of the first age is probably the awakening of the elves, which would produce the equivalent of 4902 sun years in total. Huh, my understanding was that the ages were specifically the Ages of Man, and the first age started when man awoke. Maybe I was wrong on that. Looking up the regular wikis, this may have been one of the things he was fuzzy and changed his mind on, but the most common interpretation is the the Ages are of 'the children' (Elves/Men/etc) and is a separate set of divisions to Valinor Years of the Lamps/Trees/Sun. So yeah first age probably started when the elves woke up, and overlapped Years of Trees and Years of Sun. He specifically said that the Noldor leaving happened towards the end of the first age, and that happened during the long night between Trees and Sun. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 12:00 on Aug 5, 2021 |
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Aug 5, 2021 11:47
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As I said before the concept of a “year” in those contexts are silly and it’s better imho to just think “long time” It’s myth anyway who cares how exactly something lasted.
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Aug 5, 2021 11:52
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Shibawanko posted:like the aliens in avatar Horny cats?
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Aug 5, 2021 12:04
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The valar can shift forms and the elves are huge also
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Aug 5, 2021 12:05
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they're going to show the breaking of the world with a CGI flat earth with valinor breaking off and the world literally becoming a globe, maybe with iluvatar (nude) in the background waving his hands
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Aug 5, 2021 12:13
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when the elves pass into the west they'll show the boat lift off slowly from the ocean and go into space. there'll be a bit where a younger elf asks like "how is this possible again??" and then another guy will go like "well, as you know, the world once used to be flat, etc.."
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Aug 5, 2021 12:16
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Shibawanko posted:iluvatar (nude) uwu Iluvatar
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Aug 5, 2021 12:18
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BigglesSWE posted:I’m curious and terrified of how they’d portray a Valar. Just an actor that’s been made into a giant? Can the Valar assume various forms like the Maiar? I can’t recall offhand but I would assume so. Personally I think it’d be cool if the Valar shifted back and forth between humanoid forms and spiritual forms, so Ulmo becomes a sort of water spirit, Manwe is an air elemental kind of thing. There’s a painting called Ulmo Lord of the Waters by Roger Garland that’s kind of on the path to what I’m picturing.
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Aug 5, 2021 12:25
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webmeister posted:Can the Valar assume various forms like the Maiar? I can’t recall offhand but I would assume so. Personally I think it’d be cool if the Valar shifted back and forth between humanoid forms and spiritual forms, so Ulmo becomes a sort of water spirit, Manwe is an air elemental kind of thing. There’s a painting called Ulmo Lord of the Waters by Roger Garland that’s kind of on the path to what I’m picturing. Ulmo changes his shape all the time. shapeshifting just is a thing that happens sometimes in Tolkien, that's why I never got all that mad about Sexy Shelob, as a spawn of Ungoliant would be a rough equivalent of a Maiar in terms of age and power.
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Aug 5, 2021 12:29
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The shape changing was fine for Shelob. The male gaze was not.
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Aug 5, 2021 12:30
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will the new show have only white elves?
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Aug 5, 2021 12:40
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ChubbyChecker posted:will the new show have only white elves? I do not believe so, i thought they already announced a pretty diverse cast euphronius posted:The shape changing was fine for Shelob. The male gaze was not. its not like her costume had her rear end and titties hanging out, or the camera was placed right next to her rear end like Miranda in mass effect 2.  The scandalous shoulder revealing dress WoodrowSkillson fucked around with this message at 12:55 on Aug 5, 2021 |
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Aug 5, 2021 12:47
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If the show fucks up "Valar/Maiar" = plural and "Vala/Maia" = singular I will go on a rampage
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Aug 5, 2021 12:54
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WoodrowSkillson posted:I do not believe so, i thought they already announced a pretty diverse cast The rumors I've seen are that the POC cast are men and proto-hobbits. But that also could be wishful thinking by the "b-but Heimdall is a NORSE god!!" set.
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Aug 5, 2021 13:07
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feedmyleg posted:The rumors I've seen are that the POC cast are men and proto-hobbits. But that also could be wishful thinking by the "b-but Heimdall is a NORSE god!!" set. Gotcha, well, here's hoping. Numenor should be diverse as hell, as should the elves. There is 0 reason for them not to be in 2021.
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Aug 5, 2021 13:12
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Not to get into a whole Thing but it will involve a bit of a rethink of how the three kindreds of the Elves are distinguished (and Men too), considering that a huge part of what differentiates them in the text is stuff like hair/eye color. It's not essential to the story though, and equally important is which ones were attracted to the sea, which ones liked deep learning, etc. The story works just fine emphasizing those aspects rather than physical characteristics.
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Aug 5, 2021 14:59
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Data Graham posted:Not to get into a whole Thing but it will involve a bit of a rethink of how the three kindreds of the Elves are distinguished (and Men too), considering that a huge part of what differentiates them in the text is stuff like hair/eye color. I would argue that there are a lot of ways you could add diversity to elves badly. "Let's have all the high elves be nordic types, the Sindar be Mediterranean, the wood elves be slavic, and the Avari be black or asian," for example would not be a great look. I'm not saying you couldn't do it right. I'm just saying that I'm going to assume they wouldn't get it right until they actually show that they can.
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Aug 5, 2021 15:15
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That would still be better than how a lot of fantasy codes their races...
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Aug 5, 2021 15:19
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the avari should speak with a cockney accent
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Aug 5, 2021 15:20
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there does not need to be consistent physical appearance differences between the various elves and that part of tolkien's writing can safely be ignored. the story is not enhanced in any way by knowing the hair and skin color tendencies of various elvish groups. and if you even want a lore reason, all of the elves have been mingling in Middle-earth for so long since the sinking of beleriand the only ones that would have consistent traits in a community would be the Sindar in the woodland realm and lothlorien.
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Aug 5, 2021 15:41
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ChubbyChecker posted:the avari should speak with a cockney accent That's how Patrick Stewart voiced the Calormenes in his audiobook of The Last Battle. It sounded fuckin ridiculous Actually all his voices in that book were hilariously terrible, my skin crawled in embarrassment for him
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Aug 5, 2021 15:53
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So between the LOTR show, and the One Ring tabletop game that is set to come out this fall, my friends and I ahve been casually talking about tolkien a lot. One thing we got to speculating about is what was Middle earth like before the sun and the moon show up. All kinds of stuff was living there, but life as we know it needs sunlight to drive everything. So what was it actually like? My thought was that the stars would have been far brighter. maybe even enough to give a near twilight level of visible light. And if that light still had the properties of sunlight, via Varda's power, that would be enough to work with for plants and such.
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Aug 5, 2021 16:02
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WoodrowSkillson posted:its not like her costume had her rear end and titties hanging out, or the camera was placed right next to her rear end like Miranda in mass effect 2. C'mon dude
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Aug 5, 2021 22:33
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MikeJF posted:Huh, my understanding was that the ages were specifically the Ages of Man, and the first age started when man awoke. Maybe I was wrong on that. It's pretty clear from Morgoth's Ring that Tolkien intended for the Ages to be the Ages of the Children of Ilúvatar, beginning with the awakening of the Elves. There's overlap between the Age of the Trees and the First Age. This convo popped up a bit earlier in the thread, if anyone is bold enough to go searching for it. euphronius posted:As I said before the concept of a “year” in those contexts are silly and it’s better imho to just think “long time” This is a perfectly valid way of engaging with the text, so long as you also accept the fact that Tolkien himself cared very much about this stuff and did a lot of math to make sure the years lined up as intended.
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Aug 5, 2021 23:14
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https://twitter.com/joshcarlosjosh/status/1423668285837504514?s=19
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Aug 7, 2021 00:42
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Tree Bucket posted:uwu Iluvatar Iluwutar
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Aug 7, 2021 09:51
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