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Kuro's soundtrack is going to slap so hard It's got a "Kamen Rider in Roaring 20s America" feel to it
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Aug 13, 2021 00:37
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Are there any podcasts that, like, go into a deep dive into the Trails series?
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Aug 13, 2021 02:21
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Y'know, I like Juna and while she's sorta awkwardely inserted into Crossbell as if she was there in previous games I think it mostly lands ok (though not always) but it genuinely really bothers me that her apartment is the same place where Lloyd's Aunt and Uncle lived. Maybe they move out in Azure or something and it's not actually a problem but I used to visit that apartment every chapter, you can't just pretend the Crawford's have always lived there! Couldn't they have used any other room? Glad i did play Zero before CS3 though. It definitely makes returning to Crossbell feel more meaningful even if there's references to a lot of stuff from Azure I don't really understand. Also happy for Sharon backstory. She's still the best character and I hope she plays more of a role than in CS2. Kinda interesting that her backstory really reminds me of Josh. I wonder if the resemblance is intentional and they're going somewhere with it or if it's just that empty shell tween assassins who get adopted by the family of one of their targets is a solid backstory to use for a former member of an evil secret society.
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Aug 14, 2021 09:53
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SyntheticPolygon posted:Y'know, I like Juna and while she's sorta awkwardely inserted into Crossbell as if she was there in previous games I think it mostly lands ok (though not always) but it genuinely really bothers me that her apartment is the same place where Lloyd's Aunt and Uncle lived. Maybe they move out in Azure or something and it's not actually a problem but I used to visit that apartment every chapter, you can't just pretend the Crawford's have always lived there! Couldn't they have used any other room? I don't think they actually do. I think it's a 4 story building, and you enter through the roof and visit floors 3 and 4 in Arc 2, and from the front door to visit floors 1 and 2 in Arc 4.
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Aug 14, 2021 10:15
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There's still stairs going down in CS3 you can't fool me! That ain't floor 1. E: Bellheim does look way different though for the outside at least. Maybe there's been renovations? I'm still not feeling it. SyntheticPolygon fucked around with this message at 10:24 on Aug 14, 2021 |
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Aug 14, 2021 10:19
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Yeah I thought I was misremembering something about the layout. But that just means you enter on floor 2 or the basement is living space too. Could be a lot more than 4 floors too.
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Aug 14, 2021 10:28
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SyntheticPolygon posted:There's still stairs going down in CS3 you can't fool me! That ain't floor 1. Its British so the bottom floor is Ground floor and the second floor is floor 1
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Aug 14, 2021 11:40
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SyntheticPolygon posted:Y'know, I like Juna and while she's sorta awkwardely inserted into Crossbell as if she was there in previous games I think it mostly lands ok (though not always) but it genuinely really bothers me that her apartment is the same place where Lloyd's Aunt and Uncle lived. Maybe they move out in Azure or something and it's not actually a problem but I used to visit that apartment every chapter, you can't just pretend the Crawford's have always lived there! Couldn't they have used any other room? Yeah, it's clear the building is larger than what the player gets to explore, so I'm not sure why they put them in that exact spot. As for Sharon. (Sky spoilers) Yeah, her backstory is a lot like Josh, with the difference that Sharon grew up completely without any sense of self while Joshua was never really an empty shell. Unlike Sharon, Josh had a normal life before the Hamel incident and part of reversing the "tuning process" that Weissmann put him through was reclaiming those memories of that life, stop dissociating from them and pretending they happened to someone else and embracing the good parts, like Loewe as a brother figure rather than a fellow enforcer, the harmonica his sister left him and eventually returning to the Hamel ruins to pay his respects alongside Estelle.With Sharon, there is no real past to reclaim.
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Aug 14, 2021 12:03
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SgtSteel91 posted:Are there any podcasts that, like, go into a deep dive into the Trails series? While I do not know of any currently, I co-host a JRPG show that keeps falling dick-first into trilogies and we've discussed doing Sky soon. But right now we're in the middle of the Xenosaga trilogy and so these prep plans are for, very literally, next year at the earliest.
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Aug 16, 2021 02:23
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Juna is an extremely good character and honestly CS4 would be much better if she just became the lead.
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Aug 16, 2021 02:28
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secretly best girl posted:While I do not know of any currently, I co-host a JRPG show that keeps falling dick-first into trilogies and we've discussed doing Sky soon. Oooh, thanks!
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Aug 16, 2021 02:30
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So I'm currently at Chapter 3 in FC, and I've been thinking about the differences between Trails in the Sky and the first two Cold Steel games. I think of Sky as a Ghibli movie while Cold Steel is a mecha anime. FC does evoke a lighthearted, coming of age story with two young kids as they walk across the country, meeting colorful characters and getting into adventures. Cold Steel has an episodic feel, with a core cast of characters coming together, despite various views and backgrounds causing friction, in the first game/half of the season, then trying to survive in the middle of a war breaking out in the second game/season. And then there's Rean and Valimar checking off all the mecha anime tropes, with Crow and Ordine also checking off the rival enemy mech tropes. And I've been thinking about comparisons between Estelle and Rean, and how some view Rean as a weaker character, but I think they're both good in their own ways Estelle is an open book, and for good or ill always says what's one her mind. And despite the hardships she's gone through from the Hundred Days War and hardships she's experienced on her quest to become a full-fledged Bracer, she holds onto her optimism in the face of more pessimistic views and people. (I'll probably have more to say as I get to the end of FC and into SC) Rean had a traumatic experience from a young age, and that's been crutch for him in all aspects in his life; from keeping relationships with friends and family at arms length, to even when he decides to take up swordsmanship he holds back from fear of what he could become. But deep down, he does want to make deep connections, and jumps to defend others, so even if he is afraid of his power, he'll become a monster if it can save his sister or classmates. It's what makes the moment in CS2 when he learns Spirit Unification that much stronger. And it's in spite of all these issues that he's still able to overcome the Trials and become the Ashen Awakener. So I felt, at least, that he earned the power ups. SgtSteel91 fucked around with this message at 15:07 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 02:39
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Man, the Crossbell chapter of CS3 is so drat good. Genuinely one of the best parts of the whole series so far. I imagine i'd get more out of it if I had played Azure first but it was still fantastic. I'm used to Trails games all having pretty slow buildups with most of the big scenes being in the latter half but this was just chapter 2 and they went all in for it. There was a whole lot going on but I think every story thread got a good amount of screentime and it all came together well. And despite how much was happening I think this chapter handled the cast a lot more deftly than the usual. Most of the time only one or two characters really have much of a personal connection to events each chapter up until the end, but although the cast was real big this time I felt like everyone had a good reason to be there. Obviously this was the Juna focus chapter and her stuff was great, but the rest of new Class VII also got some good scenes and the 2 cool and mysterious students who clearly know more than they should finally joined the party. The old Class VII guys who showed up also had way more of a connection to the events of the chapter than the 3 from chapter 1 and they even still found the time to give us some Sharon focus and have Olivert do some stuff. It also had a fantastic end of chapter boss. I was absolutely not expecting to be fighting Super McBurn this early and I didn't think there'd be another boss fight so everyone had 0 CP and only 2 brave points and it was a real fun struggle to make it through. I'm really loving CS3 so far.
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Aug 16, 2021 12:42
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RevolverDivider posted:Juna is an extremely good character and honestly CS4 would be much better if she just became the lead. extremely true, especially if it came with the completely different story that would imply
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Aug 16, 2021 16:55
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if people hate Cold Steel so much write fanfiction about how your version of the story would have gone down and been less dumb and stupid
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Aug 16, 2021 17:04
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I like 1-3 that doesn’t mean I have to like 4
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Aug 16, 2021 17:24
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exactly the same except Arc en Ciel has to fight the Rivalries and the Divine Knights have to put on a concert
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Aug 16, 2021 17:45
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Honestly they should have committed to the class shift if that’s the way they wanted to go. Having Rean be a background character with backstory you the player already know is something you don’t see happen often
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Aug 16, 2021 18:04
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have steel survive
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Aug 16, 2021 18:09
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Junpei posted:if people hate Cold Steel so much write fanfiction about how your version of the story would have gone down and been less dumb and stupid CS1 and CS2 are great as is. For CS3, dump new Class VII. Don't pay lip service to the idea that Rean is having a tough time; actually commit to it. Have him be forced to invade other countries and kill and detain dissenters to Osborne's rule. Have Class VII lead an actual resistance against Osborne and Rean trying to juggle between roleplaying as the Ashen Chevalier cracking down on the Resistance (while trying to let them escape while not blowing his cover and credibility) and actually trying to fight against Osborne. The world war breaks out but the heroes do not become stupid and sabotage their country in the war; they still genuinely fend off the Alliance. Have real stakes. Class VII members die during the story. Maybe one is captured as a resistance member and is executed or dies beaten to death in prison, another is killed defending Erebonia from the alliance. Maybe a Divine Knight bodyblocks a railway gun's shot, killing the pilot and the mech. Calvard's airforce begins a firebombing campaign and levels Roer to the ground and you go around digging through the rubble for survivors and you see refugee camps and ration stands set up. In retaliation, Erebonia invades parts of Reimferia, Liberl (such as Bose and Rolent), and when the truce comes Erebonia gets to actually keep its captured territories. Almost all of the antagonists die, either killed in battle, or they are captured and then months later they are tried and executed. Rean is dead at the end. Last scene is Jusis overlooking a cemetery where his friends are buried and reminiscing. Make it a bittersweet ending like Tactics Ogre. In future games that revisit Erebonia, you get to see Roer and/or other towns being rebuilt, and see Bose and Rolent under Erebonian rule. Also the Bracer guild's stunt gets them banned from Calvard too, resulting in mass resignations of Bracers as most of them only care about the money and aren't willing to stick their neck out for little to no pay (as was set up in CS1 and CS2).
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Aug 16, 2021 19:27
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not enough edgy grimdark, make Rean say the gently caress word
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Aug 16, 2021 19:30
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Moofia Boss Val posted:CS1 and CS2 are great as is.
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Aug 16, 2021 19:31
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...It was mistake to read all that, having not gotten to CS3 or 4 yet
SgtSteel91 fucked around with this message at 19:49 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 19:43
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Yeah I wanted actual stakes in CS4 but that doesn’t fit at all
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Aug 16, 2021 19:45
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Moofia Boss Val posted:CS1 and CS2 are great as is. What in the gently caress. That's about as edgy as berserk and no one wants that lol.
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Aug 16, 2021 19:51
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SgtSteel91 posted:...It was mistake to read all that, having not gotten to CS3 or 4 yet don't worry, it's still a mistake to read even if you've finished the series
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Aug 16, 2021 19:53
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Moofia Boss Val posted:CS1 and CS2 are great as is. nothingpersonnelkid.txt
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Aug 16, 2021 19:57
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Moofia Boss Val posted:CS1 and CS2 are great as is. CS3 is fine as is, being one of the darker games in the series without being grimdark like this thanks. It's CS4 which doesn't commit to anything in CS3 where the problem lies.
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Aug 16, 2021 20:09
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yeah like if they just committed to the dark plot choices theyd make thatd be a perfectly fine level of darkness. heck, you could walk back like, one, for that big moment of relief. its the fact they do it for basically all of them thats the problem. the solution isnt to execute duvalie by firing squad. heck itd also be fine if they hadnt made the dark plot choices to begin with. the annoyance comes from the backpedaling.
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Aug 16, 2021 20:10
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That is taking it from one extreme to another. Outside a couple backstories trails will never be that
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Aug 16, 2021 20:11
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I apologize for having made the post that lead to that monstrosity getting posted
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Aug 16, 2021 20:24
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I don't want to come into CS3 and 4 with a colored perspective just yet, but it's a little dis-heartening to hear that 4 apparently drops the ball on some things. I got burned by Mass Effect 3, so I hope CS4 doesn't get as bad as that. Then again, I'm kind of a big softie who doesn't like it when bad things happen to fictional characters I like in stories, so maybe I'll be fine with the backpeddaling on darker stuff, as you all keep implying SgtSteel91 fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 20:25
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I mean ultimately play it and make your own decision, for good or bad
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Aug 16, 2021 20:30
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SgtSteel91 posted:I don't want to come into CS3 and 4 with a colored perspective just yet, but it's a little dis-heartening to hear that 4 apparently drops the ball on some things. I got burned by Mass Effect 3, so I hope CS4 doesn't get as bad as that. CSIV is not as bad as ME3 in that regard, it just manages to feel really toothless in a lot of ways. I thought it was great fun and had some really cool bits. I still liked it.
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Aug 16, 2021 20:37
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In Sky you have all of these sepia flashbacks with a sad musicbox playing about how bad the Hundred Days War was for Liberl, with characters talking about their villages being burned to the ground with their little sister trapped inside a burning building, or their mom being crushed to death by rubble, or orphans wandering a wartorn country before being picked up, or how the military got overran and the survivors were being besieged within the walls of Grancel and Leiston, and they made this counterattack that gave them a moment of hope... only to find out that an even larger second wave was being massed within Erebonia and the Liberlians knew they were totally screwed, only saved by the bell. And every other Liberlian character has been affected by this war somehow. And this was just the Kingdom of Liberl, some backwater nation. The series then begins spending 7 games (starting with SC where Osborne made a play for Liberl) building up towards this gargantuan world war between industrialized superpowers, and you visit all of these towns and forts that would be targets for conquest and bombing and all of these characters and NPCs that would surely participate in the war or become civilian casualties, and party members would have to choose sides and fight and kill each other... and then (CS4) the world war doesn't happen. No towns are destroyed. No territories change hands. No one becomes impoverished or disabled or dies. Literally nobody loses anything. All party members wind up teaming up together (even though it makes no sense and they should have every reason to fight each other), and you get one of the biggest cases of blueballs in the history of gaming. Kondo and Takeiri lied to me for 7 games - 600 hours of playtime - and didn't deliver. I have no hope that the final arc with the end of the world and Ouroboros will amount to anything of consequence.
Moofia Boss Val fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 20:38
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There are parts of CSIV that really work. It's still worth playing and evaluating for yourself, my problem is what Endorph described better. CS3 cashed a lot of really interesting checks that I liked and got me really hyped up for CS4 then CS4 ran screaming away from all of them.
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Aug 16, 2021 20:51
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Moofia Boss Val posted:In Sky you have all of these sepia flashbacks with a sad musicbox playing about how bad the Hundred Days War was for Liberl, with characters talking about their villages being burned to the ground with their little sister trapped inside a burning building, or their mom being crushed to death by rubble, or orphans wandering a wartorn country before being picked up, or how the military got overran and the survivors were being besieged within the walls of Grancel and Leiston, and they made this counterattack that gave them a moment of hope... only to find out that an even larger second wave was being massed within Erebonia and the Liberlians knew they were totally screwed, only saved by the bell. And every other Liberlian character has been affected by this war somehow. And this was just the Kingdom of Liberl, some backwater nation. The series then begins spending 7 games (starting with SC where Osborne made a play for Liberl) building up towards this gargantuan world war between industrialized superpowers, and you visit all of these towns and forts that would be targets for conquest and bombing and all of these characters and NPCs that would surely participate in the war or become civilian casualties, and party members would have to choose sides and fight and kill each other... and then (CS4) the world war doesn't happen. No towns are destroyed. No territories change hands. No one becomes impoverished or disabled or dies. Literally nobody loses anything. All party members wind up teaming up together (even though it makes no sense and they should have every reason to fight each other), and you get one of the biggest cases of blueballs in the history of gaming. Kondo and Takeiri lied to me for 7 games - 600 hours of playtime - and didn't deliver. I have no hope that the final arc with the end of the world and Ouroboros will amount to anything of consequence. I mean, again I don't disagree that CS4 is toothless and is too afraid to commit to anything but the problem is still with CS4, not CS3. All CS4 needed to do was just commit to some of the twists CS3 had and not immediately walk them back and it'd be fine. There's no need for grimdark nihilism, not even the Liberl arc had that.
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Aug 16, 2021 20:52
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Mr. Fortitude posted:I mean, again I don't disagree that CS4 is toothless and is too afraid to commit to anything but the problem is still with CS4, not CS3. All CS4 needed to do was just commit to some of the twists CS3 had and not immediately walk them back and it'd be fine. There's no need for grimdark nihilism, not even the Liberl arc had that. I wouldn't consider that "grimdark nihilism". Grimdark would be literally everyone dying, and nihilistic would imply it would be all for nothing. Tactics Ogre and Zeta Gundam had a lot of losses along the way, but some people did make it to the end and ultimately the world was starting to get better. They are neither grimdark or nihilistic. I'd argue that Liberl did have that bittersweet feel, as the Liberlians didn't really get anything out of the war. They didn't win. They survived. Not everyone got a happy ending, and we later learn that the war didn't have a clean, perfect resolution, as the truce was predicated on covering up another injustice. That'd be in line with what I was proposing, IMO. A war with consequences that brought about change and wasn't the perfectest, happiest ending ever, but life went on.
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Aug 16, 2021 20:58
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To be fair death doesn’t mean grim dark as that would technically mean CS1 ended on a grimdark note. Which isn’t how I would call that
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Aug 16, 2021 21:03
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I think the games hold up. What would I do if I were going to remake them today? Almost certainly make the games worse, but there's a few tweaks that I think could work. We may as well speculate, since we'll be waiting a long time for new content. 1)Make the relationship system dynamic. This has been done before---see Mass Effect and how eventually Tali and Garrus will hook up if you don't romance either. It's criminal that the girls don't get a real ending and are just pining away for Rean. They deserve better. Bonus points if this somehow changes their 2)Not a story thing, but put fast travel in Nord in CS1 after you've gone through an area once. 3)Be unafraid to stray from Rean---even if he's the main character, the opening sequences of CS4 prove that it's somewhat unnecessary to have only one focal character---CS3 coincidentally covering most of the areas that Rean didn't go to for field studies in CS1 is kind of jarring. Not going to Jurai at any point during the story feels insane to me. I think that cutting the fat from some of the longer field studies in CS1 and having shorter field studies for both groups has potential to be better, but then again, there's a good chance it could also make things cluttered as all hell. I'm not married to this idea. Incidentally, if Falcom wanted to release a short gaiden or codex that's the first game's alternative field studies, I would purchase it immediately. 4)One of three options: a)Cut Elliot entirely---self explanatory, even though I like Elliot, it's obvious the writers never gave him the attention they give anyone else in Class VII. If the cast must be trimmed, he's almost certainly the least important. b)Expand Elliot's character---One thing I predicted that was only sort of true was that Elliot in CS3 would be a spy. It's true that he used his travels as a performer to keep an ear to the ground and the common people about happenings in the Empire, but I'd have loved to see a more explicit "yeah, he's in intelligence" (technically, he'd be working in opposition to intelligence) bend to it. Especially since Class VII is Olivier's baby. Olivier acted this way in the Sky games. Flushing out this part of Elliot would have made him a ton more interesting, and everything the plot would need to make this change work already exists. c)To get weird with it, merge Elliot and Alan, either as one character or by making Alan into Elliot's brother. I've discussed before why I think these two, somewhat unfinished feeling characters are very compatible to be made into either one character, or linked characters. My feelings that this would have worked only increase as the story goes along. If you made them into one character, then you could have them play out Alan's story more than Elliot's in CS3 and 4, and it trims some of the roster fat by making a prior player-character into a brainwashed antagonist, and you could justify the "curse" being able to get hold of him because in this universe, he never reconciled his desires against his father's and lost control of his life before the curse. This would leave the player more emotionally invested in the plot. Alternatively, if you went the "brothers" route, it would add much needed pathos and drama to a character that is desperate for something interesting. Alan would still be a useless rear end in a top hat, but you'd have a reason to care. 5)Somewhat building on 3: On the second half of field studies in CS3, really lean in on the returning Class VII characters using their different connections and individual strengths to solve the problem at hand. Don't just make them present. Make them important. Did anyone other than Emma actually significantly influence the field studies? If you're going to put spotlight back on the old class, then fuckin' do it. Hell, for a decent portion of these, you could probably cut Rean out entirely. (stick him with the New Class for whatever shenanigans that they get into--being frustrated about not being the center of things is very in character for him) You would probably have to replace him with a temp to round out the numbers. Good thing there's plenty of established characters floating around to pick from. 6)Make the Great Twilight make some loving sense for why Ouroboros is down with it, or at least cryptically hint that there's a reason why this is OK by them and not going to just doom everyone, everywhere, including themselves. 7)For the love of God, expand Kurt and Cedric. Make Kurt notable enough that random story NPCs toss a few lines specifically at him, especially in CS3 where he's a locked character, to flush out his family's fame, and really hammer home the various ways he feels like he doesn't live up to it. Don't even necessarily give him more screen time, quests, or events, just a few extra lines of dialogue sprinkled here or there between himself and some high profile NPCs would go a long way to flushing him out as a character, and would by no means seriously impact the flow of the game. ~~~~ Also, huh? What, if any, playable characters were you expecting to pick a different side than they did in CS4? Why would literally any member of the cast (Apart from Crow, but in that case, why bring him back?) side with the opposing force? Veryslightlymad fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 21:06
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