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Der Waffle Mous posted:Complain about a game never getting proper support and new rules and then suddenly it's a roadmap to planned obsolescence make up your mind  You're not supposed to announce replacement product during the preorder for the product it's obsolescing.
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Aug 16, 2021 15:32
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Der Waffle Mous posted:Complain about a game never getting proper support and new rules and then suddenly it's a roadmap to planned obsolescence make up your mind Planned obsolescence was a reference to the book, not the game itself. There's a big difference between proper support and growing the game as opposed to "In order to play, you need to pay an additional $50 for this Compendium, which is going to be outdated in a few months." Again, we're all used to this - GW does it all the time. Two or three year cycles can be rough on the wallet, but making it painfully apparent that the lists in this expensive book are essentially placeholders that are only going to be relevant for a few months stings.
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Aug 16, 2021 15:38
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moths posted:
I don't really think they're going to do faction books that wholesale replace the compendium tbh, I bet future team releases will be like the kommandos or krieg where they make a separate team.
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Aug 16, 2021 15:39
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berzerkmonkey posted:Planned obsolescence was a reference to the book, not the game itself. There's a big difference between proper support and growing the game as opposed to "In order to play, you need to pay an additional $50 for this Compendium, which is going to be outdated in a few months." Are the temp lists available online? Because in 1998 with no internet I can see why GW might make a book of temp rules for old teams. But in 2021? 
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Aug 16, 2021 15:42
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Remembering the 3e 40k rulebook where the last like fifth or so of the book is entirely updated statelines for every unit in the game because there weren't any codexes yet. Was a bare minimum threshold.for usable I guess?
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Aug 16, 2021 15:47
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Booley posted:I don't really think they're going to do faction books that wholesale replace the compendium tbh, I bet future team releases will be like the kommandos or krieg where they make a separate team. It's really unclear. I revisited the blurb and they are tight lipped, but 1) all the pictures are of existing teams, 2) it promises "new kill teams with plenty of customisable options" (and lack of customization is the big complaint about compendium forces), 3) that's the release model of indexes from the start of 8th, and 4) there are conspicuous holes in some compendium forces. But to take a step back: They're promising a full year of releases and they don't have the legos to do that without reusing compendium forces. I'd hope you're right and it's a year of unique and super specialist variants, but that's not consistent with what we saw from Warcry or anything else.
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Aug 16, 2021 16:16
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A new Kill Team every three months that may or may not also function as an update for a regular 40k unit doesn't sound unreasonable
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Aug 16, 2021 16:19
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I think I would be excited about this new Kill Team if it was at most $60 for everything you need to play, and it was just sold as one pack, instead of spread across 4 individual purchases. I'm wondering if those later box sets they've announced will include the full rulebook, cards, and measuring tools? When one of those hits with one or two factions I care about I'll probably jump on it. Also, I'm still salty with how fast GW dropped Apocalypse, so I'm much more hesitant to buy in on a new game than I used to be. Chainclaw fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 16:20
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Chainclaw posted:I think I would be excited about this new Kill Team if it was at most $60 for everything you need to play, and it was just sold as one pack, instead of spread across 4 individual purchases. I'm wondering if those later box sets they've announced will include the full rulebook, cards, and measuring tools? When one of those hits with one or two factions I care about I'll probably jump on it. My guess is that everything will come separate, similar to what they did with Warcry - Killzone box; Fire Team box; Killzone book. Going off the core release, you'd be looking at a single $150 - $200 buy-in for each expansion, which certainly won't fly. At least with breaking things out you can somewhat justify it by "Well, this Killzone is $75, but I don't have to buy anything else if I don't want to."
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Aug 16, 2021 16:43
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For anyone who thought Warhammer had peaked, here's a 20-metre long chainsword
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Aug 16, 2021 16:48
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At that size, would those blades even be sharp? I just imagine it operating like one of those gigantic excavator machines, scooping/tearing material off rather than actually cutting.
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Aug 16, 2021 21:18
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Der Waffle Mous posted:Remembering the 3e 40k rulebook where the last like fifth or so of the book is entirely updated statelines for every unit in the game because there weren't any codexes yet. Remember Ravening Hordes, the flimsy paper booklet that contained every single army list for Warhammer Fantasy 6th edition until each army book could come out... over a 5 year period? I played Wood Elves, I was using a well-worn copy of Ravening Hordes for that entire period while I waited for my list to be updated.
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Aug 16, 2021 22:20
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Squibsy posted:Necromunda these days is the most alike to Inquisitor or Mordheim FYI I think I'm going to paint my Starstriders with an eye for statting them out in Necromunda. Does anybody play Shadow War: Armageddon anymore? While it'd still preclude my Deathwatch guys, I picked up the rulebook for a few bucks and it seems like it's pretty flexible.
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Aug 16, 2021 22:40
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moths posted:It's really unclear. I revisited the blurb and they are tight lipped, but 1) all the pictures are of existing teams, 2) it promises "new kill teams with plenty of customisable options" (and lack of customization is the big complaint about compendium forces), 3) that's the release model of indexes from the start of 8th, and 4) there are conspicuous holes in some compendium forces. To be clear the Kommandos team did not prevent you from taking Kommando fireteams in your regular Greenskins teams so having the models be in an existing team is no obstacle for them to making a new team. I think people are jumping at shadows with this whole thing. GW will not release books that replace the compendium. Power creep might make the compendium teams seem a little weak when they come out with the kits designed with Kill Team in mind but the idea that they're gonna start releasing Kill Team codexes to replace the compendium is just people catastrophizing every little thing GW does.
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Aug 16, 2021 23:11
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AnEdgelord posted:I think people are jumping at shadows with this whole thing. GW will not release books that replace the compendium. When i first saw unit rules separate from the main rulebook my first thought was "they're basically going to do Chapter Approved for this". Each new KT set will have a booklet with the new rules for both factions. Then every year we'll either get " Compendium 2022" to replace the old one or "Kill Team Annual 2022" to add the new teams from the last 12 months.
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Aug 16, 2021 23:30
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Desfore posted:At that size, would those blades even be sharp? I just imagine it operating like one of those gigantic excavator machines, scooping/tearing material off rather than actually cutting. Just a giant, weaponized escalator, hungering for flesh...
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Aug 16, 2021 23:36
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I hope they stay true to pattern and make that new weapon sprue for the Warmaster available separately. I'm not overly interested in buying a second one, but by god do I want that chainsword.
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Aug 17, 2021 01:54
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xtothez posted:When i first saw unit rules separate from the main rulebook my first thought was "they're basically going to do Chapter Approved for this". Each new KT set will have a booklet with the new rules for both factions. Then every year we'll either get " Compendium 2022" to replace the old one or "Kill Team Annual 2022" to add the new teams from the last 12 months. I feel like we'll see a Kill Team <whatever> expansion with the rules for the new relevant kill teams and such instead of a new yearly compendium. I really don't imagine that much would change yearly. Not that I wouldn't put it past GW
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Aug 17, 2021 02:10
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AnEdgelord posted:https://www.goonhammer.com/reivers-rubricae-kill-team-battle-report/ I've been watching battle reports online, the game does look fun and pretty involved even with a small Astartes team. And the AdMech team looks seriously dangerous. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHZmjPgmTTw
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Aug 17, 2021 02:29
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I understand the qualms people have because their teams might look pretty bland atm, but if the game itself is good hopefully it'll overcome that
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Aug 17, 2021 03:42
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I haven't been keeping up on new KT news at all. What I'm gathering from the last page is teams are limited to individual boxes you can buy now? So my hope of being able to run a sisters list with a seraphim, a few battle sisters and some repentia is now impossible?
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Aug 17, 2021 15:11
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Moola posted:I haven't been keeping up on new KT news at all. What I'm gathering from the last page is teams are limited to individual boxes you can buy now? The teams are groups of “fireteams” which are units of the same type. if I remember right. sisters use 2 fire teams, so you could run 5 sisters and 5 repentia. You could also make one of those teams arco flagellants too.
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Aug 17, 2021 15:19
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Is there any faction that gets more than two fire teams btw?
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Aug 17, 2021 15:46
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DrDraxium posted:I understand the qualms people have because their teams might look pretty bland atm, but if the game itself is good hopefully it'll overcome that The "blandness" looks like people aren't looking at equipment and strategem options. I saw one video with someone pointing at the space marine datacards and complaining that none of them have special abilities, but then in an AP video someone playing space marines was using a "Transhuman Physiology" ability. This sounds like individual datacards might not have any specials, but they gain some abilities based on keywords. That strikes me as a good approach.
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Aug 17, 2021 16:20
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I'm actually surprised how much KT looks like Saga so far. Particularly size-based army composition, range increments, and off-card abilities. In Saga, you get four to six points to build a warband. A point buys you 12 levy, 8 warriors, or 4 elite warriors. It also uses fixed ranges for everything (S, M, and L instead of shapes) and a Warcry style battleboard where you buy effects from what you roll in a dice pool. KT is probably going less random there, which might be good for 40k's target demographic.
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Aug 17, 2021 16:26
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I just watched the start of another of Guerilla Games' battlereports, T'au versus Aeldari. Any suggestion that Compendium teams will be "vanilla" can be discarded. Both lists are fully flavored. T'au get rangers, fire warriors, and stealth battlesuits as fire team options; with lots of drones available. Eldar can have Guardian teams, Dire Avengers, and weapons platforms. Both lists have suitably sick weapons profiles. A plasma rifle is 4 dice, 4+, 4/5 damage, which, uh slightly outclasses a las rifle. Shuriken catapults have the Rending tag, convert one hit to a crit. If anything, the Imperials are starting to look second tier. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYZjPWHKwD8
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Aug 17, 2021 19:08
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Based on the news, reviews, and battle reports coming out I foresee my group being ambivalent to start out and completely on board once we actually play a few games. I totally get the backlash over the compendium and prescribed fire teams, but the actual game seems a hell of a lot more fun than KT2018. In any case I was already playing KT like an intro war game by creating relatively balanced, uncompetitive teams from different races and letting my opponent choose from that. NuKillTeam seems all the better for that sort of philosophy.
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Aug 17, 2021 19:27
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mllaneza posted:I just watched the start of another of Guerilla Games' battlereports, T'au versus Aeldari. The clear problem is that a lot of reviewers didn't bother actually playing the game before posting their rants.
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Aug 17, 2021 19:33
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Booley posted:The clear problem is that a lot of reviewers didn't bother actually playing the game before posting their rants. As is the way of the GW fan. I mean, reservations aside, I'm still in - if nothing else, I'm gonna have some cool Ork fort to use in Gorkamorka.
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Aug 17, 2021 19:38
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mllaneza posted:I just watched the start of another of Guerilla Games' battlereports, T'au versus Aeldari. That is good to hear, although I still find it extremely offputting that listbuilding has been reduced to almost nothing. It feels very odd to me to make a skirmish game where you can only take your models in packs of 5 identical ones. Space marines are the worst off, being only able to take a single 5-pack of identical dudes.
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Aug 18, 2021 00:42
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Geisladisk posted:That is good to hear, although I still find it extremely offputting that listbuilding has been reduced to almost nothing. It feels very odd to me to make a skirmish game where you can only take your models in packs of 5 identical ones. Space marines are the worst off, being only able to take a single 5-pack of identical dudes. Some races can sub out dudes in their 5 person fire teams. Only examples I recall is an ork for two grots, or Tau for drones. But yeah marines, I wish at least you could mingle intercessors, or the sneaky/raiding boys together.
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Aug 18, 2021 00:49
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berzerkmonkey posted:As is the way of the GW fan. Orkaforta
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Aug 18, 2021 01:16
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Geisladisk posted:That is good to hear, although I still find it extremely offputting that listbuilding has been reduced to almost nothing. It feels very odd to me to make a skirmish game where you can only take your models in packs of 5 identical ones. Space marines are the worst off, being only able to take a single 5-pack of identical dudes. One or two narrative games and that should change real quick. I'm looking forward to the eventual league at my store.
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Aug 18, 2021 05:14
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Leperflesh posted:Good to hear the list worked out! Definitely need to play a couple or three times to see how swingy dice can be. A few notes: I took that list for another spin - got absolutely slaughtered this time. Went up against codex marines. Turn one they jumped Terminators onto my Revenant, no damage sustained but the Rev broke and fled. Terrible start. Turn two it lost another assualt, turn three it failed to activate and couldn't shoot a thing, Turn four it killed some stuff, but too little too late. The guardians got pulled apart in assualts, they could dish fire as good as the marines, but just can't take it in return. It didn't help that somehow in 4 turns I failed 6 activations, which is impressive as I never had more than 3 activations on the field at one time. I'll use the list a bit more, the marines played an exceptional game, and my rolls were terrible, but I can see that the list is pretty fragile. I know the concern was getting shot apart, but it seems the list really falters against good assualters. Still, more games are required.
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Aug 18, 2021 07:24
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My resin printer just arrived. God help me.
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Aug 18, 2021 21:05
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Another day, another KT21 battle report. This time it's Necrons vs Deathwatch. Both lists have a lot of options. The Necrons get 4 fireteam choices with 4-5 troops including a leader. The Deathwatch gets 5 models, including a sergeant and a few options for trooper types. Both have extremely nasty weapons. I got a look at the Deathwatch Tactical Ploys, that's where all the Space Marine special abilities are. So those will all cost a CP, but with only 5 models that's not terrible. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n3nrV38VOs I have rarely seen the dice screw a player that badly in anything.
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Aug 18, 2021 21:07
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Crackbone posted:My resin printer just arrived. I imagine most people with printers quickly drown under the sea of gray. I would. Good luck though!
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Aug 19, 2021 09:08
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 From the Killteam core rulebook. This makes me so happy, I love shape math!
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Aug 19, 2021 15:58
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But you see, it was done to assist those with vision issues / who don't use Western numbering systems / to reduce complexity / whatever else I can think of to help explain away GW making a dumb decision.
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Aug 19, 2021 16:06
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It's so the propriety measuring tool doesn't need to be localized.
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Aug 19, 2021 16:19
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