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Yvonmukluk posted:Didn't they show exterior shots of the Enterprise in TWOK's Kobayashi Maru? Not technically a holodeck, but...
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Aug 18, 2021 10:35
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Powered Descent posted:Mariner's exercise program This is the key phrase. I have no trouble believing that Mariner puts dramatic establishing shots in all of her programs. And probably some of her friends programs too.
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Aug 18, 2021 15:08
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I took it as dramatic license for us, the audience. Mariner likely isn't seeing that because she's already in the program but we, the audience, don't know that it's a Holodeck program. Considering that when she gets back into the Cerritos and is fighting all the Cardie ships, I imagine a lot of programming on her part went into this so that she wouldn't suddenly run out of space to fly into (though there probably is a "sky box" barrier) during her escape sequence. So, while Mariner will likely never see those establishing perspectives, we need to see them to establish what seems like an actual prison and heighten the tension before it gets ruined by the simulations being self-aware. Honestly if I was gonna nit a pick it would be that Boimler is aware he's a simulation, I thought Holodeck programs weren't allowed to be self-aware after the whole Moriarty thing
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Aug 18, 2021 16:14
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Aces High posted:I took it as dramatic license for us, the audience. Mariner likely isn't seeing that because she's already in the program but we, the audience, don't know that it's a Holodeck program. Considering that when she gets back into the Cerritos and is fighting all the Cardie ships, I imagine a lot of programming on her part went into this so that she wouldn't suddenly run out of space to fly into (though there probably is a "sky box" barrier) during her escape sequence. So, while Mariner will likely never see those establishing perspectives, we need to see them to establish what seems like an actual prison and heighten the tension before it gets ruined by the simulations being self-aware. Vic knew he was a hologram right? Plus there's the various EMH's that know they're holograms. IIRC the Mengele Cardassian hologram in that one Voyager episode was also aware he was a hologram.
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Aug 18, 2021 16:20
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There are a lot of holograms that are self-aware Voyager alone had like a dozen
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Aug 18, 2021 16:31
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ashpanash posted:That's only a "rule" because it made it easier and cheaper to shoot those episodes, because you didn't need establishing shots. When things get animated, establishing shots become a lot cheaper. Even the stock shots that get re-used all the time, like the Enterprise next to a planet or DS9 hanging there in space? No, it's a deliberate choice not to use them in holodeck scenarios (or similarly unreal situations). Seriously, go re-watch Future Imperfect, or especially The Search Part 2, and then tell me I'm wrong.
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Aug 18, 2021 16:41
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Yeah, at least half of the time on TNG establishing shots were totally reused footage and most of the rest of the time the it was just 'put a new planet colour behind the stock shot'. DS9 even more so, they just reused the exact same clip of the station hanging there between every other scene.
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Aug 18, 2021 17:12
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This episode was much better than last week. I was so certain that Jet was a Lieutenant last season and they managed to retcon it in an impressive way. The Boimler solution was a pretty smart way to hit the reset button without hitting the button. I really like it, but it's bullshit that Bradward was demoted.
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Aug 19, 2021 08:31
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that was so dumb and that made it fantastic
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Aug 19, 2021 10:07
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Mx. posted:that was so dumb and that made it fantastic
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Aug 19, 2021 10:18
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“Get the saw! We need to hit the door with the saw!” Pakleds best Star Trek villains.
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Aug 19, 2021 14:15
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Yvonmukluk posted:Didn't they show exterior shots of the Enterprise in TWOK's Kobayashi Maru? Not technically a holodeck, but... No they did not
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Aug 19, 2021 15:23
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The real enemy is gonna be Will Boimler.
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Aug 19, 2021 15:26
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Holy poo poo, so many easter eggs. I love all the callbacks to TAS, like the giant Starfleet skeleton I can only assume is the giant Spock clone. RIP.
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Aug 19, 2021 16:47
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"eh, it was a bunch of complex characters thrown into heavily serialised battles which always ended in mind-blowing twists and made me question the basic tenants of my reality.  "
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Aug 19, 2021 17:16
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https://twitter.com/MikeMcMahanTM/status/1428243032554414082
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Aug 19, 2021 17:54
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that episode was great, but they better not abandon the Titan, even if we just get 5 minutes an episode I want to see the continuing adventures of "William" Boimler with an unchecked ego
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Aug 19, 2021 18:07
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I suspect there'll be a break for a while and then we'll come back and find the Titan has turned Will Boim into a total dick when the ships have to team up again.
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Aug 19, 2021 18:16
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Sirtis and McFadden looks so badass in those uniforms.
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Aug 19, 2021 18:19
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RIP Spock 2 and I couldn't have asked for a funnier resolution to the Boimler Titan situation. Even if it came kinda early, but we only have ten episodes per season, so that's okay. We are 100% getting more Will Boimler eventually, the evil (?) twin thing is too tempting to ignore. Kayshon was solid, I'm glad they found a way via the UT to still do the metaphorical speech stuff without it being all he says, and I imagine that'll drop off even more as the season continues. The puppet bit was great, really funny design on that thing, they could sell a bunch of them if they put them on the store. Excellent episode, it'll be fun to rewatch it for easter eggs eventually, some of those gallery scenes were way too packed to pick stuff out without a ton of pauses. I feel like they're packing in more detail this season compared to the first, both on single objects and entire rooms full of objects. In fairness, the D was around for 7+ years before someone crashed it, surely they did something insurrection-adjacent in that time. Plus I always felt Insurrection was a bad name to describe the actual events of that movie.
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Aug 19, 2021 18:36
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I like how the sonic showers censored everyone.
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Aug 19, 2021 18:36
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Also it's clear they've gotten way better at figuring out ways to just stuff this thing full of a dozen obscure references a minute and not make it seem as unnatural. On a different note, did they clarify which one was the clone? MikeJF fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Aug 19, 2021 |
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Aug 19, 2021 18:43
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There's a bunch of stuff in the gallery, worth pausing through. Giant Spock Clone skeleton was great. I wasn't expecting so many shots taken at recent Trek either, I don't remember the first season having jokes like that.
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Aug 19, 2021 18:54
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I look forward to Kayshon saying random memes throughout the show now
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Aug 19, 2021 19:49
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Shirt this week is badass. 
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Aug 19, 2021 21:08
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MikeJF posted:Also it's clear they've gotten way better at figuring out ways to just stuff this thing full of a dozen obscure references a minute and not make it seem as unnatural. The one that changed the name? Episode was great. Actual stuff not too tied to references, but still full of references. Great pacing and two strong plots. Perfect, imo.
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Aug 19, 2021 22:16
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They didn't say it explicitly, but I think Cerritos Boims is the original and Titan Boims is the perfidious clone.
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Aug 19, 2021 22:24
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Grand Fromage posted:There's a bunch of stuff in the gallery, worth pausing through. I just noticed Odo's bucket in one of the display cases so I'm pretty happy about that. Something I enjoy about these gallery scenes is they've got me second-guessing my own memory a lot trying to recall which things are actual easter eggs and how many are just random objects that don't actually refer back to anything, like did someone in older Star Trek own a drum kit or high-top sneakers, probably not, but what if I'm wrong? Delsaber fucked around with this message at 22:30 on Aug 19, 2021 |
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Aug 19, 2021 22:27
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Grand Fromage posted:They didn't say it explicitly, but I think Cerritos Boims is the original and Titan Boims is the perfidious clone. I'm pretty sure HE said the other one was the clone when he met back up with his buds But.... That's what a soulless quantum duplicate WOULD say
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Aug 19, 2021 22:28
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They're going to bring back Tom Riker, I can feel it in my bones.
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Aug 19, 2021 22:46
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Riker's "I love my jooooooob" made me grin like a big drat idiot.
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Aug 19, 2021 22:59
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MillennialVulcan posted:They're going to bring back Tom Riker, I can feel it in my bones. I always felt like DS9 did him dirty by bringing him back for one episode and immediately throwing him in prison with no follow-up, so I'd appreciate this a lot. Also I vaguely recall Star Trek Online killing him off in backstory, and then cutting that episode from the game entirely years later, so he really gets screwed even in non-canon materials
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Aug 19, 2021 23:03
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I liked this episode and I think they nailed a few small things that other shows haven't been doing. 1. Riker's pep talk to Boimler felt like a genuine Riker thing to do. 2. Boilmer being competent even if he is anxiety ridden and also finding out he likes exploration side way more than the boom action-y stuff. Loved that he earned the respect of the spec ops action crew. 3. Mariner actually showing growth! I wonder if they are going to incorporate Jet more going forward. Anyways, I know they had to rest to the status quo but I agree Boimler getting demoted was poo poo.
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Aug 19, 2021 23:09
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"I joined up because I love beaming!" got a genuine laugh.
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Aug 20, 2021 00:06
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Delsaber posted:I always felt like DS9 did him dirty by bringing him back for one episode and immediately throwing him in prison with no follow-up, so I'd appreciate this a lot. I can only imagine what ST:Picard would have done to his character. He catches ultra hyper Vulcan AIDS? Maybe his brain melts out his nose?
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Aug 20, 2021 00:22
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It still baffles me they didn’t even ask the old Maddox actor to come back for Picard. Like, I think he’s still teaching in LA lol That show is a series of bizarre choices
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Aug 20, 2021 00:31
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It really felt like this Lower Decks episode in particular pitted old Trek (TOS, TNG, VOY) against new Trek (later DS9, TNG Movies, New Trek) and Boimler, the show's representative came out decisively on the side of Old Trek and that's mostly where Lower Decks wants to live. When Boimler was talking about the Enterprise-D, he brings up that they did "Insurrection" (INCORRECTLY!) but I think the writers really wanted that in there regardless because to me, the big line in Insurrection is Picard near the beginning of the movie asking "Does anyone remember when we used to be explorers?" (I know VOY isn't earlier than DS9, but they intentionally wanted that series to go back to the exploration feel, so that's where i'm placing it for the purpose of this here forums post) Did not expect Boimler to get Crichtoned, gimme a hell yeah. Hope Jet joins the club despite Mariner's quickness to boot him out.
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Aug 20, 2021 00:50
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I could be misremembering but iirc the Thomas Riker TNG episode made a point of saying that neither of them, not the Riker who made it through the interference or the Riker who bounced off, had any greater or lesser claim to being "the original" versus "a transporter clone."
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Aug 20, 2021 01:01
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My only problem with this episode is I would much rather watch Star Trek:Titan
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Aug 20, 2021 01:36
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sbaldrick posted:My only problem with this episode is I would much rather watch Star Trek:Titan Get whoever is doing What If for Marvel to do a Star Trek Titan show. Problem solved.
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Aug 20, 2021 02:04
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