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Evil Fluffy posted:I can't think of any RPGs that were designed with "you need to buy the best stuff in town before proceeding" in mind. dq3 no definitely not, they give you access to very strong equipment very early - chain sickles and full leather in allahan counts as "ludicrously expensive" given the GP drops in that area. if a game is easy then i don't stress about buying the best stuff, either. but it's a reasonable baseline for situations of "well, i got my rear end kicked, if i go back and grind enough to get the good stuff i'll be in a better spot" - not many RPGs require you to do it, but almost all of them are basically saying "stop, enough, you can proceed now" once you're fully geared, and if you continue to grind past that you'll trivialize the next section. RareAcumen posted:I ask because I'm a leveling addict because a lot of the games I played would keep giving you the barest incentives to keep aiming for more levels and so I just keep fighting stuff long after I have passed the point I need to be to win the fight safely. Pokemon evolving and giving you new moves, FFtactics mastering abilities and letting you swap to a new class or weapon sooner, DQ8 and 11 giving you skillpoints, The World Ends With You leveling your weapons or digesting food for better stats, getting a chance to roll the dice on stat increases in Fire Emblem, etc. yeah it's easy to fall into that. as far as pokemon goes, i would suggest limiting yourself to the level of the next gym leader - don't level anybody on your team past the level of their best pokemon. i think it helps the games be a bit less trivial while not imposing anything that feels like a challenge condition along the lines of nuzlocke. fft i have no advice because 99% of my fft playtime was grinding for cool abilities and the vanilla balance is incredibly weird so it's hard to know how strong you "should" be for any given fight Jazerus fucked around with this message at 22:42 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 22:36
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) which will absolutely bulldoze the area and sealed tunnel. You are not expected to have stuff like broadswords and half plate on the hero/soldier or a spear and chain mail on your priest before leaving the area around Romaly either. You buy what you can afford from exploring and move on. DQ2 is sorta an exception but that's mainly due to DQ2's original release being a massive tire fire.
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RareAcumen posted:I ask because I'm a leveling addict because a lot of the games I played would keep giving you the barest incentives to keep aiming for more levels and so I just keep fighting stuff long after I have passed the point I need to be to win the fight safely. Pokemon evolving and giving you new moves, FFtactics mastering abilities and letting you swap to a new class or weapon sooner, DQ8 and 11 giving you skillpoints, The World Ends With You leveling your weapons or digesting food for better stats, getting a chance to roll the dice on stat increases in Fire Emblem, etc. Srice posted:My grinding mentality is that I don't run from fights since most jrpgs are tuned such that if you just fight everything in your path you'll be in that sweet spot for difficulty. Then if I get my rear end kicked I examine the options available to me, with grinding always as a last resort. DQ11 was great for that since if I died to a boss I'd mess around with the forge to upgrade my gear, and if that didn't work I'd tinker with the skill tree to try to figure out something that'd work against that specific boss. Kuros posted:Rhapthorne is the goofiest one. Great, I get to fight an ugly hot air balloon.
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Aug 17, 2021 00:08
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Srice posted:My grinding mentality is that I don't run from fights since most jrpgs are tuned such that if you just fight everything in your path you'll be in that sweet spot for difficulty. Then if I get my rear end kicked I examine the options available to me, with grinding always as a last resort. DQ11 was great for that since if I died to a boss I'd mess around with the forge to upgrade my gear, and if that didn't work I'd tinker with the skill tree to try to figure out something that'd work against that specific boss. Same here; I don't like to run away. That last EQ playthrough I did I only ran a few times in the Ice Cave (bullshit dungeon, if you've played it you understand) and in the post-game dungeon when I was max level and couldn't be bothered while I was looking for secrets. Evil Fluffy posted:I can't think of any RPGs that were designed with "you need to buy the best stuff in town before proceeding" in mind. Or we can just agree that not everyone has the same play style and leave it at that. Grinding, or at least the option to do so, is a good feature to me because it allows people who have less skill, experience or knowledge than others to put in a bit of extra work in order to beat the next challenge. Obviously it can go too far. I know that I keep bringing this up, but I continue to mention EQ because it's by far the grindiest game I have ever encountered, for reasons both obvious and less obvious. On one hand, it was the first major subscription game and they wanted to milk it for every penny that they could. On the other hand, more subtly so, the glacial pace compensated for the fact that the game didn't have much content. Jazerus posted:as far as pokemon goes, i would suggest limiting yourself to the level of the next gym leader - don't level anybody on your team past the level of their best pokemon. i think it helps the games be a bit less trivial while not imposing anything that feels like a challenge condition along the lines of nuzlocke. Interesting. I've never played pokemon but I've watched a few LPs, and it seemed like levels didn't improve Pokemon very much. I would have expected that a level 90 could solo four or five level 50s, but that wasn't the case in my observation. Also, as far as I know Pokemon (again, unlike EQ) doesn't have an inherent level bias, by which I mean that there is not so far as I could tell an invisible buff/debuff for being higher or lower level than an adversary. It's just stats and abilities versus other stats and abilities. I could easily be wrong about this. Commander Keene posted:I used to play like this, up until I realized (embarrassingly recently) that I just don't have the attention span for it and it's why I had such a poor track record of actually beating the games. Nowadays I wouldn't say I blaze through games but I do play a lot more efficiently and it's helped me get through more games. Not an attention span issue for me, but I still try to get maximum play time and fun out of every game that I play. I've realised that I still have the same mentality as when I was a child: I had very few games and they were very expensive and most had relatively little content which was often compensated for by difficulty and/or grind. This is of course the total opposite of the modern reality where I am an adult, I have tons of games, they are much cheaper than they used to be and are generally much longer and more content-rich than ever. JustJeff88 fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Aug 17, 2021 |
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Aug 17, 2021 01:07
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Bongo Bill posted:If you roll into town and you can't afford all the best gear, your rear end is heading back into the field with the upgrades you can afford. If you can't make it to the next town with that mishmash, head back and spend what you earned in the attempt. Grinding is for when you want to try fighting the superboss. This is how it goes. Gear is expensive in Dragon Quest to have you make decisions. It's not like there isn't good gear in the dungeons anyways
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Aug 17, 2021 02:27
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So I just got to Alltrades Abbey in DQ3 and the old guy won't let me change jobs. WTF Is there a minimum level requirement?
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Aug 17, 2021 05:44
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Elephant Ambush posted:So I just got to Alltrades Abbey in DQ3 and the old guy won't let me change jobs. WTF Level 20
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Aug 17, 2021 05:48
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Jazerus posted:yeah it's easy to fall into that. as far as pokemon goes, i would suggest limiting yourself to the level of the next gym leader - don't level anybody on your team past the level of their best pokemon. i think it helps the games be a bit less trivial while not imposing anything that feels like a challenge condition along the lines of nuzlocke. I burned out on Pokemon back with Sun and Moon. I had Alpha Sapphire and tried to play that but I realized I just didn't care and I don't think I even got to or past Brawly. Also I've never played the original FFT, just the GBA and DS alternatives. You can't give me an katanas as a weapon and not expect me to go crazy trying to get ninjas and Viera leveled up till they can use them. But eventually I did learn from Final Fantasy, Golden Sun, Dragon Quest, and the Tales series that you don't have to buy everything in a shop. Just evaluate your team and decide if anyone needs better armor really badly (+26 points of def) and you can leave everything else behind, because you'll probably see three things that're available in the shop right now in the next dungeon anyway.
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Aug 17, 2021 06:01
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I'm thinking of starting DQ6 soon. It's last game in the series I haven't yet played (excluding 10, of course). I'm looking for some opinions on SFC vs DS versions of it. I'm leaning toward SFC because I have a nice retro setup for it, but is there a compelling reason to play the DS version besides party chat? Does DQ6 DS make the game significantly easier? I like my RPGs to be more on the challenging side. I played through DQ11 with harder monsters enabled and found that to be about perfect. DQ7 3DS and DQ4 DS which I played next were both very easy, but I'm not sure if they were made that way in their DS ports or if the original games were easy as well.
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Aug 17, 2021 07:01
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6 DS was easily the most challenging Dragon Quest for me so I assume it retained most of its difficulty. Monster recruiting is replaced with a side quest to recruit various slimes but as far as i can tell it was pretty poorly implemented in the original 6 SFC since only Monster Mashers could recruit them and you’re definitely not using that vocation game-long. Heck, I think the super famicom version might be harder cause Magic Burst was nerfed in the DS version. Also you’re choosing between a game localized by a fan translator or one localized by 8-4, so there’s that too.
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Aug 17, 2021 07:16
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IMO 6 on DS was about the same as DQ7 on PSX, and while 7 was made shorter on 3DS, I wouldn't say it was that much easier unless you did a bunch of grinding for Monster Hearts in the tablet dungeons. I still played both with everyone but the Hero on AI control for a bit of added challenge.
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Aug 17, 2021 08:15
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Elephant Ambush posted:So I just got to Alltrades Abbey in DQ3 and the old guy won't let me change jobs. WTF Yes. Luckily there's plenty of xp to be had in the tower to the north.
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Aug 17, 2021 15:34
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Modoh posted:I'm thinking of starting DQ6 soon. It's last game in the series I haven't yet played (excluding 10, of course). I'm looking for some opinions on SFC vs DS versions of it. I'm leaning toward SFC because I have a nice retro setup for it, but is there a compelling reason to play the DS version besides party chat? I've played both and the difficulty felt kinda comparable. The quality of life improvements in the DS remake means it's probably the easier version overall by a small margin (and to be fair those improvements are good at fixing some of the tedium) but it's still the most challenging of the DS remakes.
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Aug 17, 2021 15:42
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TurnipFritter posted:Level 20 Evil Fluffy posted:Yes. Thanks. I'm not too far off now. This game is really fun and a completely different experience from DQ2. I try really hard not to use guides for games but with DQ2 I felt like I had to the whole time for a bunch of reasons. In DQ3 the only thing I've looked up so far is the Personality book stuff. Just got the boat last night and I'm looking forward to sailing around and exploring. I don't even care where I need to go. I'm just meeting people and making friends and hanging out and shopping.
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Aug 17, 2021 17:05
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Commander Keene posted:IMO 6 on DS was about the same as DQ7 on PSX, and while 7 was made shorter on 3DS, I wouldn't say it was that much easier unless you did a bunch of grinding for Monster Hearts in the tablet dungeons. Man, I keep forgetting that I bought 7 for DS and never even got to the first battle. Probably doesn't help that I played the hell out of the PSX version
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Aug 17, 2021 17:13
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I wouldn't recommend the SFC version of DQ6 unless you can read Japanese. The fan-patch is nearly 20 years old and it was never fully finished. You can play it all the way through, but you'll likely encounter a number of broken strings. Plus, there's a nasty bug that crashes the game if you cancel out of the "Info-All" window, which I most certainly did more than once. The DS remake is also on mobile if you'd rather do it that way.
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Aug 17, 2021 20:46
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So in DQ3 it looks like after you get the boat none of the cities you visit by sailing get added to your list of Zoom locations. Am I missing something here? Because this is bullshit.
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Aug 18, 2021 03:32
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Its been a long time since I played that game but.... Are there multiple pages of destinations
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Aug 18, 2021 04:36
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There are an inconvenient number of towns in DQ3 that aren't Zoom destinations, yeah. But it's not all of the ones off the Eurasian mainland.
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Aug 18, 2021 05:11
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CaptainJuan posted:Its been a long time since I played that game but.... Are there multiple pages of destinations Yes there are multiple pages and I am aware of it. Looks like for some reason Jipang got added but a bunch of others didn't. This is weird. Anyway other than this and the frustrating encounter rate I really like this game so far. I have 2 of the 6 orbs and I'm just sailing around looking for the rest. I found Orochi but itt people said he's hard so I'll come back later. Got the ultimate key also which is really nice. It's so frustrating being gated by that thing.
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Aug 18, 2021 05:36
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I think several of the locations not added to the list are places intended to evoke a feeling of being cut off from the rest of the world. That's certainly the feeling I got with the small town with some extra back story and the tiny island.
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Aug 18, 2021 07:24
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Ofecks posted:I wouldn't recommend the SFC version of DQ6 unless you can read Japanese. The fan-patch is nearly 20 years old and it was never fully finished. You can play it all the way through, but you'll likely encounter a number of broken strings. Plus, there's a nasty bug that crashes the game if you cancel out of the "Info-All" window, which I most certainly did more than once. When I played DQ3's SFC version I'm pretty sure it was 100% translated and I don't recall encountering any broken strings. Elephant Ambush posted:So in DQ3 it looks like after you get the boat none of the cities you visit by sailing get added to your list of Zoom locations. Am I missing something here? Because this is bullshit. I can think of 1, maybe 2, that don't get added to the list and thematically it makes sense not to do so.
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Aug 18, 2021 17:54
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Evil Fluffy posted:When I played DQ3's SFC version I'm pretty sure it was 100% translated and I don't recall encountering any broken strings. DQ3 on SFC is fully translated and is fine. It's DQ6 which is only mostly translated but never finished some minor things and never did any bug fixing passes or edits.
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Aug 18, 2021 22:25
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DQ3:SFC Does the encounter-rate jack up in the last quarter? It feels especially crowded in the dark world. One trope I hope the 2D remake gets rid off is the Run command not being worth a drop of piss. It's completely pointless as it seldom works and leaves you open to abuse. Same principle with the Vivify spell. Permanent Quick-save will probably be a thing, and a streamlined UI. Maybe an in-game hint-system or a checklist. Despite being so long there are only 5 bosses: 2 fights against the Klansman, 3 against Hans Moleman, 1 against the troll, 3 against the Hydra, and Zoma. Definitely feels strange for a JRPG to not punctuate the plot with them. Music gets samey as there's only a half-hour of music to spread across a 20+ hour playthrough. Can defintely feel how FF3 cribbed from this title given its success: multiple world-maps, job-switching, little setpieces, and a wider degree of customization.
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Aug 18, 2021 23:11
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Inspector Gesicht posted:Despite being so long there are only 5 bosses: 2 fights against the Klansman, 3 against Hans Moleman, 1 against the troll, 3 against the Hydra, and Zoma. Definitely feels strange for a JRPG to not punctuate the plot with them. Maybe Baramos has generals and such and you just don't face them (or it's the few enemies like Orochi and Boss Troll). For most of the game they'd have little to no reason to notice your existence. Sure you're on an adventure to stop Baramos but you you're just wandering and trying to figure out how to do so. You aren't seeking out his forces and thwarting invasions or so on. They might take notice when you're gathering the orbs and kill the two aforementioned bosses but even then you're getting ready to knock on his door. I think I like that about DQ3. It's a hero's journey where you aren't constantly fighting off attacks from a dumb Big Bad whose too stupid to just send a massive horde of his best warriors at you from the outset, or even an elite kill squad. At least Saro knows you exist in 4 and wants to remedy that whole "you're alive" problem before you come into your power.
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Aug 19, 2021 01:38
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Evil Fluffy posted:I think I like that about DQ3. It's a hero's journey where you aren't constantly fighting off attacks from a dumb Big Bad whose too stupid to just send a massive horde of his best warriors at you from the outset, or even an elite kill squad. At least Saro knows you exist in 4 and wants to remedy that whole "you're alive" problem before you come into your power. Psaro is arguably the most successful because he set the hero's training back months or years. They were going to learn Zap on the day that their village got destroyed. That would have mattered if it was like, an RTS or something, I guess...
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Aug 19, 2021 05:55
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Hokuto posted:Psaro is arguably the most successful because he set the hero's training back months or years. They were going to learn Zap on the day that their village got destroyed. That made me so mad as a kid. "Wow I get to start with Zap? That rules. ...wait what's happening? Noooooooo." Also really curious as to how that old dude in a mountain village knew lightning magic since for a long time lightning spells were a very "literally nobody but the hero can use these" group of spells. I don't think any monsters had zap/lightning/thordain either until stuff like DQM or maybe DQ9? Evil Fluffy fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Aug 19, 2021 |
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Aug 19, 2021 19:44
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Inspector Gesicht posted:Despite being so long there are only 5 bosses: 2 fights against the Klansman, 3 against Hans Moleman, 1 against the troll, 3 against the Hydra, and Zoma. Definitely feels strange for a JRPG to not punctuate the plot with them. That's one of the things about the design of DQ3 that I really liked. The bulk of the challenge of the game is portioning out your resources to make it through the dungeon to simply reach the end or other side. Or even just traveling on foot in the overworld to make it from one town to another. This is why the final chests in the original game giving you the Sage's Stone to completely negate that resource management felt like such an amazing reward. For the people going through the versions with the Recall spell for the Hero, try not to record too many lines throughout the game and you'll get a neat easter egg if you use it once you get the highest tier version.
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Aug 19, 2021 19:56
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Evil Fluffy posted:Also really curious as to how that old dude in a mountain village knew lightning magic since for a long time lightning spells were a very "literally nobody but the hero can use these" group of spells. Old man was probably a Hero himself in his younger days. Maybe it's Dai from the manga/anime?
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Aug 20, 2021 16:00
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So I'm maybe 1/3 in to Act 2 and I only did one tinkerton quest.. I feel like I should do more. Are they worth it or they just set pieces? I'm having a fantastic time btw. The first 10hrs were zzzzzzz JRPG poo poo but I haven't been able to put it down since then.
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Aug 20, 2021 18:22
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nuketulsa posted:So I'm maybe 1/3 in to Act 2 and I only did one tinkerton quest.. I feel like I should do more. Are they worth it or they just set pieces? Tickington has some really good rewards, plus you have to complete it to unlock more bonus content. However there are parts that only unlock as you progress further into the story, so you can do it at your own pace.
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Aug 20, 2021 18:35
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I'm at Baramos' castle in the Switch version of DQ3 and I'm getting my rear end kicked by Baramos so I'm currently grinding metal babbles in his castle. Is there any other good place to find metal babbles? And are there good ways to kill them other than hoping my Martial Artist goes first and crits? Also here is my current party and gear. If there's anything I'm missing or there's a recommended level let me know: Martial Artist level 31 - never class changed Knuckledusters Stealth Suit Pot Lid Silver Tiara Meteorite Bracer Hero level 32 - never class changed Thunderbolt Blade/Edged Boomerang Spiked Armor Tempest Shield Ortega's Helm Mighty Armlet Sage level 27 - only class changed once from Goof-off Zombiesbane Magic Armor Magic Shield Pointy Hat Care Ring Sage level 28 - only class changed once from Priest Zombiesbane Magic Armor Magic Shield Pointy Hat Scholar's Specs I have a ton of stuff in my bag that I haven't sold and I've only found 52 mini medals to exchange for stuff. Any advice?
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Aug 22, 2021 22:10
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Multiheal on a sage would be nice. Any buffs like insulatle and kabuff help reduce the damage too. Oomph should help the MA punch through the defense. See what debuffs you can land too.
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Aug 22, 2021 22:29
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Mustached Demon posted:Multiheal on a sage would be nice. Sap is huge because bosses like to dispel your buffs, but they never dispel their own debuffs. For that reason alone I consider Sap more useful than Oomph. But once you have Sap up, definitely use Oomph on your martial artist. Magic damage against bosses isn't as useful as just buffing your physical damage, for the most part.
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Aug 23, 2021 02:44
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Baramos can't dispel buffs so if you spend the first several turns turtling up it makes it hard for him to kill you unless he spams really damaging breaths multiple times in a row. HealUs will make the fight a lot easier if you can conserve the MP to have it, but it's overkill IMO. Pick up a Yggdrasil leaf from the overworld if you don't have one (check the spot on the map where four mountains in the middle of nowhere intersect) to have an extra combat revive.
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Aug 23, 2021 03:34
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Was it a rule that you couldn't have more than one Yggdrasil leaf on you in 8? For some reason I feel like I found some kind of workaround to have like 5 of them but I might just be mixing up when I played DQ 11.
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Aug 23, 2021 03:45
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I think it’s usually a Dragon Quest rule that the world tree only gives you one if you don’t have one, but also I think in 8 you can trick the game by using the alchemy pot.
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Aug 23, 2021 03:49
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From what I remember, DQ games usually have one spot with a free Yggdrasil Leaf that respawns if you don't have one in your inventory. You could trick it a little in DQVIII by throwing it into the Alchemy Pot and retrieving it later, but I think only works on the PS2 version, because alchemy is instant on the 3DS. However! The 3DS has Red, who has a passive steal ability and she's stolen so many loving Yggdrasil Leafs for me.
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Aug 23, 2021 04:01
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i should get around to playing my copy of DQ8 3DS. did they make the bosses less prone to doing icy pulse or
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Aug 23, 2021 04:29
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Elephant Ambush posted:I'm at Baramos' castle in the Switch version of DQ3 and I'm getting my rear end kicked by Baramos so I'm currently grinding metal babbles in his castle. Is there any other good place to find metal babbles? And are there good ways to kill them other than hoping my Martial Artist goes first and crits? Buffs and debuffs should win you the fight at those levels. I forget if it’s the case in the SNES version but in the NES version Baramos is not immune to sleep or surround, though they can take some tries to land. Oomp on the hero and martial artist and sap on Baramos should let you shred him though. If you’re grinding metal enemies, stock up on poison moth powder to use on them. You can also lower their agility with spider webs or whatever that item is called. It’s very useful when paired with BeDragon.
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Aug 23, 2021 04:46
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Since you don't have a Soldier (Warrior), moving the Hero to the first slot is probably a good idea since he would be the tankiest in this setup. Enemies are more likely to target the party lead for ST attacks. It's been said already, but focus on buffs/debuffs. Have one sage spam StopSpell (Fizzle?) until it works. Sap twice to delete physical defense. Bikill (Oomph) both physical hitters. Barrier (Insulate?) if you've learned it. Increase (Kabuff) is good too.
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Aug 23, 2021 16:10
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