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WITCHCRAFT
Aug 28, 2007

Berries That Burn
Really liking the Morales rework. Mostly for the ult changes. I used to always go Stim Drone for my ult, even if we didn't have someone like Tychus or Illidan that benefit from the insane attack speed bonus.

Being able to port allies from your fountain to your location starting at level 10 instead of 20 is like... why didn't it do that in the first place? This is how it should be.

Even playing with strangers on your team, you can usually get people to hearth back to base and heal to 100% hp/mana right before an objective, then you zoop them right back to the objective with your shuttle.

Respawns are the hard part. A lot of the time people will ignore your medivac from fountain and just spend a bunch of time walking back into combat.

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Solvent
Jan 24, 2013

by Hand Knit
One of the things I always liked about HotS is that it’s about teamwork with strangers, there’s a need for that everywhere. From the shuttle to the comp, to there’s a need for understanding and cooperation from the start. Otherwise, there’s tons of other things to do, but very few lead to success.

I think the maintenance team is leaning into that with the talent changes, and the game has gotten better since the focus on the highest level of play is gone, in spite of the easy to list failures on the part of the company.

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business
So I switched from D.Va's rockets to her hippity-hoppity ultra and I gotta say, her bunny hopping just feels better.

Is it actually?

No idea, but I feel like I get more kills with it.

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Both secure kills in different ways. If your team has a lot of hard CC that lacks range or speed (Uther or Gazlowe), Micro Missiles' soft CC can make room for their setup. If you've got an abundance of soft CC or displacement (Arthas or Alarak), Bunny Hop is a good follow-up because it nails enemies down.

NoEyedSquareGuy
Mar 16, 2009

Just because Liquor's dead, doesn't mean you can just roll this bitch all over town with "The Freedoms."
Almost had a full page going and ruined it.



Had win streaks as long before so I guess a savage loss streak was inevitable. Feels great when you're playing relatively well and still getting stomped over and over.

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business

Kith posted:

Both secure kills in different ways. If your team has a lot of hard CC that lacks range or speed (Uther or Gazlowe), Micro Missiles' soft CC can make room for their setup. If you've got an abundance of soft CC or displacement (Arthas or Alarak), Bunny Hop is a good follow-up because it nails enemies down.

Stunning 3 enemies at the same time with the hippity-hoppity feels amazing. Rockets feel more "useful", but the bunny hop is addictive.

NoEyedSquareGuy posted:

Almost had a full page going and ruined it.



Had win streaks as long before so I guess a savage loss streak was inevitable. Feels great when you're playing relatively well and still getting stomped over and over.

gently caress, idk how you were not beating your keyboard relentlessly.

Psycho Turtles
Jul 2, 2007

NoEyedSquareGuy posted:

Almost had a full page going and ruined it.



Had win streaks as long before so I guess a savage loss streak was inevitable. Feels great when you're playing relatively well and still getting stomped over and over.

I think my ARAM loss streak stands at 25 spread over 3 days. It was either a hey someone AFKed immediately or ARAM really just screwed my team on picks. Think only 3-4 of the losses were actually "fair" matches so yeah that was a pretty infuriating few days.

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Mesadoram posted:

Stunning 3 enemies at the same time with the hippity-hoppity feels amazing. Rockets feel more "useful", but the bunny hop is addictive.

I personally tend towards Bunny Hop just because Micro Missiles feel awkward to use for me. It's riskier sometimes because it's not the right comp for it, but Bunny Hop is just... nice.

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business

Kith posted:

..but Bunny Hop is just... nice.

:hmmyes:

WITCHCRAFT
Aug 28, 2007

Berries That Burn

Mesadoram posted:

Stunning 3 enemies at the same time with the hippity-hoppity feels amazing. Rockets feel more "useful", but the bunny hop is addictive.

The bunny hop is better because it makes the Mario goomba stomp sound. It is the superior ult for the same reason Varian's colossus smash and Sonya's leap are the right ult choice.

It make a cool sound!!!

I will focus my talents from other tiers just to enable an ult like that. It's so good, every single time.

WITCHCRAFT
Aug 28, 2007

Berries That Burn

Psycho Turtles posted:

I think my ARAM loss streak stands at 25 spread over 3 days. It was either a hey someone AFKed immediately or ARAM really just screwed my team on picks. Think only 3-4 of the losses were actually "fair" matches so yeah that was a pretty infuriating few days.

ARAM can be completely unbalanced compared to other modes, so you just have to grin and bear it when you get the short straw.

A long time ago when ARAM was different events every week, I had a bunch of lovely matches. Then I got one where everyone on both teams was Illidan. People using Metamorphosis to engage. People using Metamorphosis to escape. People using The Hunt to catch people that were escaping by using Metamorphosis. People using The Hunt to bait out 3+ casts of Metamorphosis then ZOOP to another area of the map. Illidans doing backflips over another Illidan's head, only for they themselves to have a third Illidan do a backflip over their head. Everyone was playing chicken with their Evasion cast on hold the whole time. One of my favorite matches ever.

ARAM should up the ante so more matches are like that. Let's get weird!!!

NoEyedSquareGuy
Mar 16, 2009

Just because Liquor's dead, doesn't mean you can just roll this bitch all over town with "The Freedoms."

WITCHCRAFT posted:

The bunny hop is better because it makes the Mario goomba stomp sound. It is the superior ult for the same reason Varian's colossus smash and Sonya's leap are the right ult choice.

It make a cool sound!!!

I will focus my talents from other tiers just to enable an ult like that. It's so good, every single time.

It's unfortunate that Taunt Varian is usually considered the "good" choice when Smash Varian is the one that's actually fun. If I'm playing Varian it's because I want to 100-0 explode a Valla in one second while screaming at her.

Psycho Turtles
Jul 2, 2007

WITCHCRAFT posted:

ARAM can be completely unbalanced compared to other modes, so you just have to grin and bear it when you get the short straw.

A long time ago when ARAM was different events every week, I had a bunch of lovely matches. Then I got one where everyone on both teams was Illidan. People using Metamorphosis to engage. People using Metamorphosis to escape. People using The Hunt to catch people that were escaping by using Metamorphosis. People using The Hunt to bait out 3+ casts of Metamorphosis then ZOOP to another area of the map. Illidans doing backflips over another Illidan's head, only for they themselves to have a third Illidan do a backflip over their head. Everyone was playing chicken with their Evasion cast on hold the whole time. One of my favorite matches ever.

ARAM should up the ante so more matches are like that. Let's get weird!!!

I miss those days too. Had some "everyone is murky" games that were pretty hilarious.

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


NAZEEBO GOT SPIDER COLONY BACK

WE IN THERE

NoEyedSquareGuy
Mar 16, 2009

Just because Liquor's dead, doesn't mean you can just roll this bitch all over town with "The Freedoms."

Kith posted:

NAZEEBO GOT SPIDER COLONY BACK

WE IN THERE

Maybe people will stop complaining when I go spider build instead of toads now.

Leoric changes are good, having to split push made Kneel Peasants feel mandatory and making it baseline should allow for more versatility.

Not sure if the Zagara changes are the right move, from what I've experienced the overpowered part is being able to sit in fog of war and spam banelings at the enemy towers without them even being able to see you. Maybe the trio of longer cooldown/lower damage/higher mana cost will do enough to make it unviable as a strategy but I think changes should be made to the level 1 talent instead of adjusting the base stats of the banelings themselves.

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business
Any buff to Leoric makes me happy.

bobthenameless
Jun 20, 2005

NoEyedSquareGuy posted:

It's unfortunate that Taunt Varian is usually considered the "good" choice when Smash Varian is the one that's actually fun. If I'm playing Varian it's because I want to 100-0 explode a Valla in one second while screaming at her.

It never felt like the "correct" build, but smash varian with the 4s charge talent always felt fun as hell rushing around everywhere.

WITCHCRAFT
Aug 28, 2007

Berries That Burn
LORENADO DOES DAMAGE NOW!!!

Friendship ended with WHITEMANE
Now DECKARD is my best friend

Ort
Jul 3, 2005

Proud graduate of the Andy Reid coaching clinic.

bobthenameless posted:

It never felt like the "correct" build, but smash varian with the 4s charge talent always felt fun as hell rushing around everywhere.

My highest win rate hero is taunt Varian running charge. He does good damage that people don’t expect and can really help snowball fights if they start to retreat. I climbed from bronze to gold 1 mostly using him a few years ago in hero league.

WITCHCRAFT
Aug 28, 2007

Berries That Burn

Ort posted:

My highest win rate hero is taunt Varian running charge. He does good damage that people don’t expect and can really help snowball fights if they start to retreat. I climbed from bronze to gold 1 mostly using him a few years ago in hero league.

Taunt is the least fun of his ults but it's really good if anyone on your team has a stun/disable that is hard to land. If they are paying attention, they get a 100% chance to land that stun. Taunt feels underpowered compared to Varian's other ults on its own,

until you get a teammate to chain off of it. It is a guaranteed starter for stun/aoe wombo combo bullshit that the enemy team could otherwise just walk away and avoid.

If your team got that bullshit to spill on an enemy they are donezo.

Marx Headroom
May 10, 2007

AT LAST! A show with nonono commercials!
Fallen Rib

WITCHCRAFT posted:

If your team got that bullshit to spill on an enemy they are donezo.

Can confirm, I know a team that runs taunt Varian for exactly this reason and it's pretty disgusting

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


newzeebo rules

nazeebo's big-rear end health pool is "balanced" because his range is unimpressive. then thing of the deep embiggens your range!!! but most importantly. a special shout-out goes to how it makes zombie wall an initiation tool'

blood ritual makes vile infection a sure thing while also being an incredible sustain talent. show up to teamfights, there's stacks there

spirit of arachyr makes jars more gooder but absolutely loving punishes if it's on a single target. a single jar will straight up kill abathur up to four levels ahead of you

gargantuan is real good for throwing at lanes to make stacks and get easy xp and oh wait it's also good at teamfights! get hosed azmodan your demonic invasion ain't poo poo

ice block is ice block. throw spiders on someone and then chill out while they die

SPIDER!!!! COLONY!!!!!!!!!!! THROW SPIDERS AND SPAM YO poo poo, IT'S LATE GAME AND YOUR MANA POOL IS MASSIVE. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS CONSERVATION

vile infection pretty much doubles all of your damage and makes your basic attacks v. scary. take it

thats my review goodbye

Kith fucked around with this message at 09:16 on Aug 24, 2021

Nybble
Jun 28, 2008

praise chuck, raise heck

Kith posted:

newzeebo rules

blood ritual makes vile infection a sure thing while also being an incredible sustain talent. show up to teamfights, there's stacks there

spirit of arachyr makes jars more gooder but absolutely loving punishes if it's on a single target. a single jar will straight up kill abathur up to four levels ahead of you

did these things this morning, absolute game changer. definitely feel better about missing a wave if I can get two or three kills in QM per team fight and have my 175 stacks by level 13

and Aba hunting or going 1v1 in lane is so good with the single target spiders, they don’t understand where their HP goes until it’s too late

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


also big shout-out to thing of the deep's 10% spell power making vile infection deal more damage :getin:

WITCHCRAFT
Aug 28, 2007

Berries That Burn
No matter what they do to other Nazeebo ults, Vile Infection gives you an insane DPS boost on your spells and attacks. It is the kind of lvl 20 talent that can change the outcome of a game on its own..

I play Nazeebo like Azmodan. Even if you aren't trying to finish that huge requirement quest, you should still have it ready to complete when you reach that tier.

Get your stacks, split push when you can. Show up for objectives but Always Be Stackin'

If it really comes down to the wires late game you get an insane boost at 20 if you stacked your quest enough. And you should be stacking that poo poo right out the gate at level 1 no matter your build.

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Nazeebo's Heroic Level 20s are absolutely "2nd place" choices; they're for when you don't have enough stacks for Vile Infection and definitely won't be getting enough in the next two minutes. At this point, they need to roll Vile Infection into the baseline quest, especially since Blood Ritual makes it so easy to get.

Nybble
Jun 28, 2008

praise chuck, raise heck
I’ve certainly played with (never felt like I played against) Nazeebos that could not stack. I’m not sure what they were(n’t) doing except trying to team fight because they had 40 stacks at level 20. Not all zeebos are that bad but I think they still have to keep Vile Infection as a quest for the folks who aren’t getting 175.

Also something I just realized: 5 stacks per takedown? ARAM Zeebo will actually get a chance at Vile Infection!

Lt. Broccoli
Jun 4, 2006

It just sits there. Completely harmless.
Man, the potion speed change to Deck already feels lightyears better. I'm not good enough at math to say what the level 1 root quest talent did differently than before, but certainly getting a lot more damage out of stone curse.

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013
I've been playing HOTS for years and never once have I managed to get Vile Infection setup by level 20.

Sucks being bad :smithicide:

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


cmdrk posted:

I've been playing HOTS for years and never once have I managed to get Vile Infection setup by level 20.

Sucks being bad :smithicide:

It used to be that you'd get it after dedicated soaking and coordinating with your team to let you tag as many waves as possible. It was something you had to actively plan for and work around.

Now you just get it by killing people and soaking waves. It rules.

My rotation for clearing a wave is: spiders on the archers, zombie wall on the melee minions, then toads at the frontline. Usually that has enough coverage to hit my lane opponent, too, so that's nice. The rotation is a little mana-intensive early on, but that stops being a problem once you hit 4 and get Blood Ritual.

Rexicon1
Oct 9, 2007

A Shameful Path Led You Here
Hots continues to be the best blizzard game because they hate it and just let the maintenance crew have fun with it.

beepsandboops
Jan 28, 2014

cmdrk posted:

I've been playing HOTS for years and never once have I managed to get Vile Infection setup by level 20.

Sucks being bad :smithicide:
It's very map-dependent imo--more doable on Tomb of the Spider Queen than Braxis Holdout or something.

As long as you're having fun :unsmith:

Nybble
Jun 28, 2008

praise chuck, raise heck
Just played a match where I got 175 right at 20 on Braxis Holdout but was definitely due to it being QM without healers. Get the takedowns and make sure you tag every wave of creeps with a spell.

3 lane maps, know the route for safe double-soaking. It definitely teaches you map awareness so you know how to not get ganked in the jungle. And even if you're 150 by 20, that can be fine as well. But a ton of his power comes from that spike at 20, so it's the priority.

No Wave
Sep 18, 2005

HA! HA! NICE! WHAT A TOOL!
The main trick to stacking vile infection is throwing spider colony at minions waves as much as you can afford. It's really not so much a question of skill as it is using abilities on minions.

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013
I was playing some HOTS for the first time in a couple of weeks and wow, the only people left playing this game are salty mother fuckers. Got some nerds very upset, two people sending a litany of messages after the game about how we suck, don't play the game if you aren't going to learn the character, :argh: etc etc . This was Quickmatch, btw.

Nybble
Jun 28, 2008

praise chuck, raise heck
I love when people say "stay in Bronze" ... in Quickmatch.

been playing a ton of FF14 and while it's not PvP... people are just so chill, even after bad party wipes.

Mesadoram
Nov 4, 2009

Serious Business

Rexicon1 posted:

Hots continues to be the best blizzard game because they hate it and just let the maintenance crew have fun with it.

Note Block
May 14, 2007

nothing could fit so perfectly inside




Fun Shoe

Nybble posted:

I love when people say "stay in Bronze" ... in Quickmatch.

been playing a ton of FF14 and while it's not PvP... people are just so chill, even after bad party wipes.

My Blizzard name is a FFXIV reference and I've had two people respond positively and one person absolutely loving freak out and harass me about it.

cmdrk
Jun 10, 2013

Nybble posted:

I love when people say "stay in Bronze" ... in Quickmatch.

I've been on both sides of this, lol. From the "lol your Medivh is only level 35, bronzie" salty private messages to "you want to win in Quickmatch? ok tryhard"

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ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

somehow i've never gotten angry whispers from the enemy team in hots, even when i do really obnoxious stuff like go mines aba and completely lock down the turn in/jungle area in blackheart bay

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