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Broken Machine
Oct 22, 2010

GPU prices are dropping, btw. You can get a 1050ti at a modest markup on ebay and such, and a bit ago I picked up a new but unusual quadro for below market. If you have thunderbolt as an option there are egpus more available as well. The gpu situation is improving, although we're a long ways from general availability and being able to just pick up a card that supports dlss at retail easily

PC building tip: you know those darn m2 screws you're always losing? Buy a pack of like 50 m2, 3mm screws. Pick up a small jar w/ a closing top. Put a sticker on the jar that says m2 screws. Never worry about losing one again, you have like four dozen chances. Mine are in a nice glass jar w/ a label on it that says m2 3mm :)

Broken Machine fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Aug 25, 2021

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CoolCab
Apr 17, 2005

glem

Surprise T Rex posted:

I'd quite like an NVME drive, I've got a 500gb SSD in my PC at the moment but it's definitely just a SATA one, since it's not M2. Honestly I haven't filled this drive yet but that's probably a function of not being able to play AAA games very well on this thing, and being careful to copy photo/video projects onto a multitude of external drives.

I was planning to get a 1TB NVME drive for Windows plus games, and a bigger, slower HDD for storage of older video projects/photography stuff, etc. The secondary drive is less important atm though, and I could just use my current drive as a secondary for now.

right, sweet

https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/wd...germany-3783263

that's an SN550 from germany, no issues ordering it in the UK and i think they'll even ship it from here but if you don't want to here it is slightly more expensive from the UK site. little over 70 quid and a 2TB version available if you prefer.

https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/wd-blue-sn550-1tb-high-performance-m2-pcie-nvme-ssd-ps7099-delivered-at-amazon-3783378

as for HDDs, here's a seagate barracuda 4tb for 76

https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/seagate-barracuda-4tb-sata-iii-35-hdd-3772747

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


Worth noting with the AWD prebuilt they have the 1tb SN550 as a £60 upgrade option right now (marked as a sale price), which is going to be cheaper than you could find it separate.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Surprise T Rex posted:

Ah, that makes sense - I assumed that when GPU prices shot up that OEM type prices would also rise, but I guess the main problem with GPU prices atm is scalpers and not just "lol demand is high gently caress the consumer" behaviour from companies?

That build looks solid then. Would it be worth upgrading to the 5600x for CPU stuff like video editing/rendering? Also, while things like RAM and storage are probably cheaper elsewhere... since there's no option to say "No, I want no RAM" it seems to be actually cheaper to just upgrade on there than it is to buy with the base (terrible) 8gb of 2666 RAM or 240gb SSD and then upgrade separately and have leftover useless components.

Also, if I currently have Win10 (due to upgrading from 7 ages ago) do I still need to purchase a new copy? I was under the impression it was tied to your Windows login account now but I've never actually tried to swap to a new PC so I'm not sure.

As for the CPU, yeah, I'd say it's worth going with a 5600X along with a B550 board. That should last you a good while. You can recoup the added cost by downgrading the 3070 Ti to a 3070, as I recommended earlier. The Ti version is only around 5 to 10% better than the non-Ti, and is generally considered a rather poor value for the extra cost.

Surprise T Rex
Apr 9, 2008

Dinosaur Gum
Yeah, that's kinda what I mean - the upgrade to a 1TB WD NVME drive is £60 from AWD, and a 4TB Seagate Barracuda is £77 on there as well so really not much difference (unless you keep/resell the baseline AWD deal's components).

Adding that stuff bring me to 1450 or so, still less than my original 1600 part picker list that only had a 3060 on it.

Surprise T Rex fucked around with this message at 15:19 on Aug 25, 2021

Yeep
Nov 8, 2004

Pilfered Pallbearers posted:

Congrats, I think that’s the best result you could have hoped for.

The market is so bonkers you could probably use the card, and as long as you get a FE or something at MSRP you could probably break even or so.

I'm an idiot who forgot to check all 3 dimensions and now have a graphics card that is fine for width and height but 1.5cm too long. Fortunately I noticed this before breaking any seals on the box but it means I've got to either re-negotiate for a different card with the added hassle of return shipping as well now, or try and sell it on somewhere. Either way I'm back to square 1 actually having a GPU that works.

Pilfered Pallbearers posted:

Can you adjust your case? That may be an option.

It's a Dan A4, there's not a lot of room to work with. Max GPU is 295x144x45mm. The Asrock Challenger Pro OC I have on my desk is 303x131x45mm.

Looking at the SFF master list my options for AMD this gen are a 6700xt reference card (which I can't get in the UK), an Asrock Challenger D/OC, a Gigabyte Eagle or a PowerColor Fighter. Or an equally unavailable 6800 reference. The Eagle is in stock with AWD-IT assuming I can shift the Challenger Pro.
There are a lot more options on the nVidia side, in theory I can fit a 3080ti FE but I'd need a PSU upgrade for that (and an extra £300). There are a good number of 3070 and 3080s that would fit but availability on those is even more limited and prices are stupid high.

Yeep fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Aug 25, 2021

Pilfered Pallbearers
Aug 2, 2007

Yeep posted:

I'm an idiot who forgot to check all 3 dimensions and now have a graphics card that is fine for width and height but 1.5cm too long. Fortunately I noticed this before breaking any seals on the box but it means I've got to either re-negotiate for a different card with the added hassle of return shipping as well now, or try and sell it on somewhere. Either way I'm back to square 1 actually having a GPU that works.

Can you adjust your case? That may be an option.

aparmenideanmonad
Jan 28, 2004
Balls to you and your way of mortal opinions - you don't exist anyway!
Fun Shoe
Dropping back into the thread still happy with all the help I got on my build almost a year ago. I left ATR Stonks and other stock tracking discord servers (Microcenter etc) since I wasn't using them anymore, but now my brother wants a new PC and I said I'd help him get a video card - anyone have a recent invite or new tips on the best way to snag a card? Looking to get him a 3060ti.

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

so my computer was fairly beefy when i got it like 7 years ago and it still does ok (had to replace the GPU after a couple of years because the first one died, replaced with a lower end one that has done just ok). i'd like to build a new computer pretty soon as i'm starting to run into performance issues sometimes when gaming, particularly if i try to do streaming, but i'm not sure how soon that'll happen especially if the state of the market as described in the OP is still "GPUs are impossible to get at a remotely reasonable price." figured while i'm mulling over my options there i'd post the speccy summary for my current PC and see if there's any easy upgrades i can do as a stopgap for a bit, honestly considering the age my computer is doing remarkably well. my RAM tending to fill up quickly is the most noticeable problem i run into so i guess my upgrade opportunities there are the first thing i'm looking at? i know my GPU isn't great either, idk if maybe there's a nowadays lower end GPU that'll be an improvement over my current one while still being affordable/possible to find

https://imgur.com/lwWsXZ3

Butterfly Valley
Apr 19, 2007

I am a spectacularly bad poster and everyone in the Schadenfreude thread hates my guts.

Nope you're in full rebuild territory as your motherboard is on the last gen DDR3 RAM. That said you'd be perfectly fine making the rest of the build and dropping in your 970 to tide you over until you get a new card, for which the market is steadily improving.

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012

bummer. that's good advice though, thanks!

Thom P. Tiers
May 29, 2008

Red Birds
Red Ass
Red Text
I would agree with that advice. You can do a full rebuild whenever you want and move the 970 over. If you get a 5800x you *may* be able to stream from your CPU at an OK rate until you can drop in a new gen card for a reasonable price.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

PRADA SLUT posted:

$300 on eBay

Thanks. I'm leery about pre-owned but when it makes a difference of hundreds of dollars I guess I just need to bite the bullet.

Canna Happy
Jul 11, 2004
The engine, code A855, has a cast iron closed deck block and split crankcase. It uses an 8.1:1 compression ratio with Mahle cast eutectic aluminum alloy pistons, forged connecting rods with cracked caps and threaded-in 9 mm rod bolts, and a cast high

Yeep posted:

It's a Dan A4, there's not a lot of room to work with. Max GPU is 295x144x45mm. The Asrock Challenger Pro OC I have on my desk is 303x131x45mm.

Sell the Dan and buy an nr200?

Sir Sidney Poitier
Aug 14, 2006

My favourite actor


I've got:
- MSI Z390-A PRO ATX LGA1151 motherboard
- i7 9700K
- Patriot Viper Steel 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 memory
- Intel 660p Series 2.048 TB M.2-2280 NVME SSD
- MSI 3080 Ti Suprim X
- Corsair SF750 PSU

I'd been playing games happily one morning but then when I went to wake the PC from sleep later on it turned out it wasn't asleep and it wouldn't boot. This isn't a tech support question, but just for background:

- The 'VGA' warning light on the motherboard came on, meaning no GPU detected. The GPU still powered on, lit up, fans spun.
- The board booted fine using onboard GPU.
- The 3080 Ti worked alright in a friend's PC.
- A friend's 3070 didn't work on this board.
- The 3080 Ti didn't work when connected to one of the small PCI-E things with a riser, just to try it.

I reckon that the board is knackered so I'm looking to get a replacement, so I hoped for a recommendation. What I'm looking for:

- Compatible with all my bits. I've been told that my CPU isn't PCI-E gen 4 compatible so I'll live with 3 if that's the case. If it's possible to get a gen 4 board that only runs at gen 3 due to my CPU then I'd be okay with that for a future upgrade.
- mATX - you may remember from some previous posts I accidentally bought a PC-O11 Dynamic Mini instead of the regular one and fit my ATX board in - if I'm getting a new one I want a smaller one.
- Something that ... looks nice?

Anyone got any suggestions please? I'm not really sure what makes one better than another.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

Surprise T Rex posted:

Also, if I currently have Win10 (due to upgrading from 7 ages ago) do I still need to purchase a new copy? I was under the impression it was tied to your Windows login account now but I've never actually tried to swap to a new PC so I'm not sure.

You do not (probably). When you first log into your new PC it'll notice that it's different, but you just de-associate your old PC and claim the license on the new one and you're good to go. There is theoretically a point where they stop letting you do this, but I haven't found it yet.

And if you for some reason want to keep your old one running, find the thread in SA Mart where Windows costs $15, or $10 if you want to donate to charity that day.

Canna Happy
Jul 11, 2004
The engine, code A855, has a cast iron closed deck block and split crankcase. It uses an 8.1:1 compression ratio with Mahle cast eutectic aluminum alloy pistons, forged connecting rods with cracked caps and threaded-in 9 mm rod bolts, and a cast high

Sir Sidney Poitier posted:

I've got:
- MSI Z390-A PRO ATX LGA1151 motherboard
- i7 9700K
- Patriot Viper Steel 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 CL16 memory
- Intel 660p Series 2.048 TB M.2-2280 NVME SSD
- MSI 3080 Ti Suprim X
- Corsair SF750 PSU

I'd been playing games happily one morning but then when I went to wake the PC from sleep later on it turned out it wasn't asleep and it wouldn't boot. This isn't a tech support question, but just for background:

- The 'VGA' warning light on the motherboard came on, meaning no GPU detected. The GPU still powered on, lit up, fans spun.
- The board booted fine using onboard GPU.
- The 3080 Ti worked alright in a friend's PC.
- A friend's 3070 didn't work on this board.
- The 3080 Ti didn't work when connected to one of the small PCI-E things with a riser, just to try it.

I reckon that the board is knackered so I'm looking to get a replacement, so I hoped for a recommendation. What I'm looking for:

- Compatible with all my bits. I've been told that my CPU isn't PCI-E gen 4 compatible so I'll live with 3 if that's the case. If it's possible to get a gen 4 board that only runs at gen 3 due to my CPU then I'd be okay with that for a future upgrade.
- mATX - you may remember from some previous posts I accidentally bought a PC-O11 Dynamic Mini instead of the regular one and fit my ATX board in - if I'm getting a new one I want a smaller one.
- Something that ... looks nice?

Anyone got any suggestions please? I'm not really sure what makes one better than another.


Matx was really bad for the z390 generation. You have very few options. You're also two generations behind and can no longer buy motherboards new for msrp for the most part. https://www.amazon.com/Gigabyte-Z39...ctronics&sr=1-4 I would buy this from Amazon warehouse and see if it works.

change my name
Aug 27, 2007

Legends die but anime is forever.

RIP The Lost Otakus.

Okay, my PC's hibernation problem (it wakes up seemingly at random) is loving driving me up the wall. For reference, here are my specs again:

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/snRBK3

My power plan has the wake from sleep option disabled. My mouse and wifi adapter similarly have that option turned off. If I put my PC into hibernation and physically disable both my mouse and keyboard it powers down, but then immediately after the fans all spin up again and the RAM LEDs light up but with seemingly no signal going out to the monitor. I have to hold down the power button to put it back into hibernation. This didn't happen at all before I rebuilt my system with this new motherboard and RAM, any suggestions?

Sir Sidney Poitier
Aug 14, 2006

My favourite actor


Canna Happy posted:

Matx was really bad for the z390 generation. You have very few options. You're also two generations behind and can no longer buy motherboards new for msrp for the most part. https://www.amazon.com/Gigabyte-Z39...ctronics&sr=1-4 I would buy this from Amazon warehouse and see if it works.

Thanks for this. I'm in the UK and that board isn't available but the one without 'gaming' in the name is - might that be suitable?

Alternatively it looks like I can get the exact same board I've got now, again, for half the price. I feel like that's probably the more prudent option.

Any reason I shouldn't look at ITX?

Sir Sidney Poitier fucked around with this message at 20:26 on Aug 25, 2021

Canna Happy
Jul 11, 2004
The engine, code A855, has a cast iron closed deck block and split crankcase. It uses an 8.1:1 compression ratio with Mahle cast eutectic aluminum alloy pistons, forged connecting rods with cracked caps and threaded-in 9 mm rod bolts, and a cast high

Sir Sidney Poitier posted:

Thanks for this. I'm in the UK and that board isn't available but the one without 'gaming' in the name is - might that be suitable?

Alternatively it looks like I can get the exact same board I've got now, again, for half the price. I feel like that's probably the more prudent option.

Any reason I shouldn't look at ITX?

ITX is just fine. The asrock Z390 Phantom Gaming-ITX/ac is the itx board to get if you can followed by the strix z390-i gaming.

Edit: You might have access to the Asus ROG Maximus XI Gene since you're in the UK. We didn't get that in the states. Its a very good matx board.

denereal visease
Nov 27, 2002

"Research your own experience. Absorb what is useful, reject what is useless, add what is essentially your own."

Sir Sidney Poitier posted:

Any reason I shouldn't look at ITX?
If you're looking at ITX boards, be mindful of the number of PWM fan headers that have: I think the standard is one CPU_FAN, and two CHA_FAN if you're lucky

Also you probably want to think a little harder on how much RAM you're buying/have, since you'll only get two slots

Sir Sidney Poitier
Aug 14, 2006

My favourite actor


denereal visease posted:

If you're looking at ITX boards, be mindful of the number of PWM fan headers that have: I think the standard is one CPU_FAN, and two CHA_FAN if you're lucky

Also you probably want to think a little harder on how much RAM you're buying/have, since you'll only get two slots

Fan ports isn't an issue since I'm using a controller attached to an internal USB hub. With RAM I presently have two sticks and wouldn't be changing that until I go for a board/CPU/RAM upgrade at some point.

Ryuga Death
May 14, 2008

There's gotta be one more bell to crack
Fun Shoe

quote:

What country are you in?
What are you using the system for? Web and Office? Gaming? Video or photo editing? Professional creative or scientific computing? Shitposting?
What's your budget? We usually specify for just the computer itself (plus Windows), but if you also need monitor/mouse/whatever, just say so.
If you're gaming, what is your monitor resolution / refresh rate? How fancy do you want your graphics, from “it runs” to “Ultra preset as fast as possible”? Seriously answer this. It drastically changes the recommendations you will get.
If you’re doing professional work, what software do you need to use? What’s your typical project size and complexity? If you use multiple pieces of software, what’s your workflow?

1. USA
2. Gaming
3. Budget is flexible and I have over 900 dollars in amazon gift cards.
4. 1440p and 144hz gsync and I wouldn't mind spending more for fancy graphics.

Current machine:

i7 7700k
16gb memory
gtx 1070

In the past, I usually relied on the OP for a recommended build but I don't know anything about the current mobos or CPUs. I've been an Intel/Nvidia person for a long time but it seems AMD is the way to go now. I have a GTX 1070 that I'll probably have to reuse for a while. The OP says that it's better to spend the money on an HDD towards more SSD space but stuff like pictures and music files shouldn't ever be on an SSD, right? How much would I be looking to spend for a new machine and how much of the 900 would cover that? The OP says 16gb of ram is still fine for gaming, so there's absolutely no point in getting 32gb if I just plan to play games? What would the best theoretical gpu be for me if the gpu situation was normal?

Sorry if a lot of this is pointless, I like to plan ahead and just get a general idea of how much I need to spend.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Ryuga Death posted:

1. USA
2. Gaming
3. Budget is flexible and I have over 900 dollars in amazon gift cards.
4. 1440p and 144hz gsync and I wouldn't mind spending more for fancy graphics.

Current machine:

i7 7700k
16gb memory
gtx 1070

In the past, I usually relied on the OP for a recommended build but I don't know anything about the current mobos or CPUs. I've been an Intel/Nvidia person for a long time but it seems AMD is the way to go now. I have a GTX 1070 that I'll probably have to reuse for a while. The OP says that it's better to spend the money on an HDD towards more SSD space but stuff like pictures and music files shouldn't ever be on an SSD, right? How much would I be looking to spend for a new machine and how much of the 900 would cover that? The OP says 16gb of ram is still fine for gaming, so there's absolutely no point in getting 32gb if I just plan to play games? What would the best theoretical gpu be for me if the gpu situation was normal?

Sorry if a lot of this is pointless, I like to plan ahead and just get a general idea of how much I need to spend.

AMD offers the best upper-midrange CPU right now with the 5600X, but NVidia has them beat in the GPU department. Correct about having to reuse the 1070 for a while. You should start checking the Newegg Shuffle after midnight EST daily because it's the only way to get a new GPU in America without camping out in front of Best Buy for a couple days before their drops (next one happening tomorrow). Micro Center sometimes has some in-store, but they're marked up to hell and back.

HDDs can still be useful for mass storage. If you have a lot of media storage or intend to have a lot of it, then you'll want a beefy HDD from seagate or WD. Otherwise SSDs are the way to go. NVMe drives are the current trend, with them offering better performance than SATA drives on paper (and in practice with windows games, they're noticeably better but only by a little—this may change when DirectStorage hits). Having a one terrabyte NVMe boot drive (like the WD SN550 or Inland Premium, two good affordable drives) plus a HDD for media storage would be a perfectly acceptable route to go.

With the RAM situation, I can't confidently say that 16GB will be good enough for years to come or anything. Personally that's one area I'd consider future proofing myself and getting 32GB, but it's true that right now that doesn't offer much benefit to gamers. Flight Simulator was one of the most RAM-heavy games and it did indeed benefit from having 32GB instead of 16, but then they patched it so now it uses like a third as much RAM as before lol. There's no telling when another RAM-hungry monster of a game could appear though.

Your eventual GPU selection in theory would depend on how much extra above that $900 you'd be willing to spend. A 5600X rig with a new SSD and maybe a new HDD as well as 32GB of RAM would probably already eat up most of that $900. If you want a cheaper option, you'll probably have to get a last-gen chip. In practice, you will probably have to settle for a GPU that may not be ideal if you don't want to wait out the current market weirdness (which may last another six months). A 3080 will be required to hit 144 FPS in a lot of games at 1440p and max game settings ($700 MSRP, 4-digit actual price currently). If you just want to hit higher-than-60 framerates, a 3070 would do ($500 MSRP, ~$800+ actual price). A 3060 Ti can do 60 at 1440p in a lot of games but it will have to dial back the settings in some of the more gpu-intensive games ($400 MSRP, like $600+ currently) and it will fall behind more quickly than the others at that resolution (though I expect it to be a 1080 champ for a while).

Anyway, welcome to hell. It's fun here.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Aug 25, 2021

Z the IVth
Jan 28, 2009

The trouble with your "expendable machines"
Fun Shoe
1. Country - UK
2. Usage - Mainly work (browser based applications, VPN) some light Photoshop, 3D work and the option to play some 3D games.
3. Budget - Ideally £600 or less but I am flexible. Not more than £700 unless a discrete GPU is included.
4. Gaming needs - Med/low details is fine. I am more likely to play stuff like Stellaris/Total War. I would like to play some open world games (eg Cyberpunk) but I'm not a Battlefield/CoD person.
5. Other considerations - Has to be small.

Between small, cheap and quiet I will take small and cheap as long as its quiet under regular us (web browsing, word processing)

My current PC is a 5 year old XPS13 (9330) and it's starting to show its age. I've already changed the battery twice and there aren't any branded (and hence problem free) replacements available any more. It meets all the needs I have bar 3D gaming which it just can't handle.

I have an even older, but more capable desktop but it's a gigantic ATX tower and I want to get rid of it. I still want a second PC for when the laptop eventually croaks. I am hoping to build a more compact machine cheaply with the option of slotting in a GPU in the future when prices improve and/or I find time to play games again.

I posted this in the SFF thread and I've adjusted it with some feedback


PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 5600G 3.9 GHz 6-Core Processor (£234.98 @ Amazon UK)
Motherboard: Gigabyte B550I AORUS PRO AX Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard (£149.99 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory (£80.39 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Western Digital Blue SN550 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£70.98 @ Amazon UK)
Case: Cooler Master MasterBox NR200 Mini ITX Desktop Case (£77.51 @ Amazon UK)
Power Supply: Fractal Design Ion SFX-L 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply (£95.47 @ Scan.co.uk)

Questions
1. Does RAM speed matter a huge amount given my modest needs?
2. I will never use a high-end GPU - do I need the extra 600w supply or can I get away with 450w. A 3060Ti brings this to to about 350w consumption.

Ryuga Death
May 14, 2008

There's gotta be one more bell to crack
Fun Shoe

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

AMD offers the best upper-midrange CPU right now with the 5600X, but NVidia has them beat in the GPU department. Correct about having to reuse the 1070 for a while. You should start checking the Newegg Shuffle after midnight EST daily because it's the only way to get a new GPU in America without camping out in front of Best Buy for a couple days before their drops (next one happening tomorrow). Micro Center sometimes has some in-store, but they're marked up to hell and back.

HDDs can still be useful for mass storage. If you have a lot of media storage or intend to have a lot of it, then you'll want a beefy HDD from seagate or WD. Otherwise SSDs are the way to go. NVMe drives are the current trend, with them offering better performance than SATA drives on paper (and in practice with windows games, they're noticeably better but only by a little—this may change when DirectStorage hits). Having a one terrabyte NVMe boot drive (like the WD SN550 or Inland Premium, two good affordable drives) plus a HDD for media storage would be a perfectly acceptable route to go.

With the RAM situation, I can't confidently say that 16GB will be good enough for years to come or anything. Personally that's one area I'd consider future proofing myself and getting 32GB, but it's true that right now that doesn't offer much benefit to gamers. Flight Simulator was one of the most RAM-heavy games and it did indeed benefit from having 32GB instead of 16, but then they patched it so now it uses like a third as much RAM as before lol. There's no telling when another RAM-hungry monster of a game could appear though.

Your eventual GPU selection in theory would depend on how much extra above that $900 you'd be willing to spend. A 5600X rig with a new SSD and maybe a new HDD as well as 32GB of RAM would probably already eat up most of that $900. If you want a cheaper option, you'll probably have to get a last-gen chip. In practice, you will probably have to settle for a GPU that may not be ideal if you don't want to wait out the current market weirdness (which may last another six months). A 3080 will be required to hit 144 FPS in a lot of games at 1440p and max game settings ($700 MSRP, 4-digit actual price currently). If you just want to hit higher-than-60 framerates, a 3070 would do ($500 MSRP, ~$800+ actual price). A 3060 Ti can do 60 at 1440p in a lot of games but it will have to dial back the settings in some of the more gpu-intensive games ($400 MSRP, like $600+ currently) and it will fall behind more quickly than the others at that resolution (though I expect it to be a 1080 champ for a while).

Anyway, welcome to hell. It's fun here.

Thanks for the warm welcome to hell.

Probably sounds lazy but I'll deal with the 1070 for however long I need to, that newegg lottery thing sounds like a massive pain. I thought the GPU situation wasn't going to stabilize to MSRP prices until maybe late 2022? Is DirectStorage a new hardware format or something or just a software thing in how it interacts with nvme drives?

I was honestly planning to go with 32gb of ram for my next build unless I got talked down hard enough, but it doesn't sound like it's the worst idea unless ram is really expensive and rare right now. That 900 dollars is not the total budget, it's more of just a large discount and I'm looking to spend as much as I need to to make a really nice machine. Took the past 4 or 5 years to save up that much in gift card money. I was thinking of getting two nvme drives plus an HDD just so space wouldn't be an issue whatsoever.

I don't understand AMD numbering or names so is the 5600x just a midrange CPU? Is there anything better and if so, are they worth it? Also, how outdated is the i7 7700k for games? Do new GPUs have DVI slots anymore or is it all display ports and an HDMI?

Thanks for the answers you've provided and if you give any more.

Takes No Damage
Nov 20, 2004

The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far.


Grimey Drawer
AMD 5600 is on the high side of mid-range CPUs right now (I think?). There are more powerful CPUs of course but the benefits, especially for gaming, drop off sharply as you continue on. If I was building from parts that's probably what I'd get, it's the current bang-for-buck sweet spot.

I don't know if DVI is actively being phased out, but I just got a prebuilt with a GeForce 2060 which has 3 DP and one HDMI, though they do make DP > DVI converter patch cables if your monitor needs it.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Ryuga Death posted:

Thanks for the warm welcome to hell.

Probably sounds lazy but I'll deal with the 1070 for however long I need to, that newegg lottery thing sounds like a massive pain. I thought the GPU situation wasn't going to stabilize to MSRP prices until maybe late 2022? Is DirectStorage a new hardware format or something or just a software thing in how it interacts with nvme drives?

I was honestly planning to go with 32gb of ram for my next build unless I got talked down hard enough, but it doesn't sound like it's the worst idea unless ram is really expensive and rare right now. That 900 dollars is not the total budget, it's more of just a large discount and I'm looking to spend as much as I need to to make a really nice machine. Took the past 4 or 5 years to save up that much in gift card money. I was thinking of getting two nvme drives plus an HDD just so space wouldn't be an issue whatsoever.

I don't understand AMD numbering or names so is the 5600x just a midrange CPU? Is there anything better and if so, are they worth it? Also, how outdated is the i7 7700k for games? Do new GPUs have DVI slots anymore or is it all display ports and an HDMI?

Thanks for the answers you've provided and if you give any more.

So, 5600X is a $270 - $300 CPU, and I consider "midrange" CPUs being around the $150 to $300 mark, with going over that being largely unnecessary for gaming (in intel terms, these would be your i5 chips). With AMD this gen, they have the 5600X (six-core), the 5800X (eight-core), 5900X (twelve-core), and 5950X (sixteen-core). At 1440p, getting a better CPU than the 5600X won't benefit you since you'll be GPU bottlenecked 95% of the time. It should do you fine for some time to come.

Your storage plan seems solid. DirectStorage is a new upcoming API from Microsoft that allows graphics cards to load assets from your storage directly to their VRAM buffers without the CPU being involved. This will in theory speed up game loading and stuff quite a bit, though it's unproven by how much. Faster drives will have an advantage here, clearly.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Aug 26, 2021

Ryuga Death
May 14, 2008

There's gotta be one more bell to crack
Fun Shoe
Cool, thank, guys. Do nvme drives like the WD SN550 need a heat sink? I've read conflicting reports on this.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Ryuga Death posted:

Cool, thank, guys. Do nvme drives like the WD SN550 need a heat sink? I've read conflicting reports on this.

No. Most gaming branded motherboards come with heat spreaders that are more than sufficient for the SN550. I'd reckon it'd work okay bare, even. There are a handful of faster drives that can run hot, but even those aren't usually a problem with the simple heat spreaders your mobo comes with. It's only in server applications and poo poo that you have to worry about heat.

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010



Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

Z the IVth posted:

1. Country - UK
2. Usage - Mainly work (browser based applications, VPN) some light Photoshop, 3D work and the option to play some 3D games.
3. Budget - Ideally £600 or less but I am flexible. Not more than £700 unless a discrete GPU is included.
4. Gaming needs - Med/low details is fine. I am more likely to play stuff like Stellaris/Total War. I would like to play some open world games (eg Cyberpunk) but I'm not a Battlefield/CoD person.
5. Other considerations - Has to be small.

Between small, cheap and quiet I will take small and cheap as long as its quiet under regular us (web browsing, word processing)

My current PC is a 5 year old XPS13 (9330) and it's starting to show its age. I've already changed the battery twice and there aren't any branded (and hence problem free) replacements available any more. It meets all the needs I have bar 3D gaming which it just can't handle.

I have an even older, but more capable desktop but it's a gigantic ATX tower and I want to get rid of it. I still want a second PC for when the laptop eventually croaks. I am hoping to build a more compact machine cheaply with the option of slotting in a GPU in the future when prices improve and/or I find time to play games again.

I posted this in the SFF thread and I've adjusted it with some feedback


PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 5600G 3.9 GHz 6-Core Processor (£234.98 @ Amazon UK)
Motherboard: Gigabyte B550I AORUS PRO AX Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard (£149.99 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Crucial Ballistix 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3600 CL16 Memory (£80.39 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Western Digital Blue SN550 1 TB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive (£70.98 @ Amazon UK)
Case: Cooler Master MasterBox NR200 Mini ITX Desktop Case (£77.51 @ Amazon UK)
Power Supply: Fractal Design Ion SFX-L 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply (£95.47 @ Scan.co.uk)

Questions
1. Does RAM speed matter a huge amount given my modest needs?
2. I will never use a high-end GPU - do I need the extra 600w supply or can I get away with 450w. A 3060Ti brings this to to about 350w consumption.

Hey I'll give you feedback here too! Looking a lot better. If you really plan to never use a high end card 450W in your rig, the Corsair SFF PSU you had before would be just fine. I figured since you were holding out for a GPU you wanted something beefier.

You can back off to 3200 CL14 for roughly equivalent performance (1-3% hit estimate), but going down to that 2666 stuff you had before is going to be significantly slower. It would make more sense for me for your incremental $ to go towards the better RAM and the cheaper ASRock B550 versus the (better) Gigabyte board and worse RAM.

Lovable Luciferian
Jul 10, 2007

Flashing my onyx masonic ring at 5 cent wing n trivia night at Dinglers Sports Bar - Ozma
My old x99/5820k based system kicked the bucket today. I'm not sure if the Mobo/PSU/CPU failed or if there's a short somewhere in the system. Regardless I think it would be wise to replace the motherboard, CPU, and PSU to be safe. Since money is a little tight I'm looking at the Ryzen 5600x with a decent B550 board. My main question is how badly will 2400 speed ram bottleneck the system? I'd like to salvage my old ram and use it for a while until I can afford 3200+ ram. However if the bottleneck will severely hinder performance then I may as well get the ram now. For reference the GPU will be taken from the 5820k machine and it's a RTX 2080.
For the PSU I assume 650+ watt should be adequate is that correct?

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Lovable Luciferian posted:

My old x99/5820k based system kicked the bucket today. I'm not sure if the Mobo/PSU/CPU failed or if there's a short somewhere in the system. Regardless I think it would be wise to replace the motherboard, CPU, and PSU to be safe. Since money is a little tight I'm looking at the Ryzen 5600x with a decent B550 board. My main question is how badly will 2400 speed ram bottleneck the system? I'd like to salvage my old ram and use it for a while until I can afford 3200+ ram. However if the bottleneck will severely hinder performance then I may as well get the ram now. For reference the GPU will be taken from the 5820k machine and it's a RTX 2080.
For the PSU I assume 650+ watt should be adequate is that correct?

It will hurt, but I don't think it will be all that severe. I accidentally ran my 5600X PC with my ram clocked at 2133 for a couple months, and while the system is noticeably snappier now at 3200, it wasn't bad enough at 2133 for me to notice. I only realized my mistake when I saw the memory speed in some system info app. It's going to be a big improvement over your current CPU even without the new RAM.

Butterfly Valley
Apr 19, 2007

I am a spectacularly bad poster and everyone in the Schadenfreude thread hates my guts.

Z the IVth posted:

4. Gaming needs - Med/low details is fine. I am more likely to play stuff like Stellaris/Total War. I would like to play some open world games (eg Cyberpunk) but I'm not a Battlefield/CoD person.

Just to add to feedback, between Total War and Cyberpunk you've listed two of the most CPU and GPU intensive games that exist, so you really need to either revise your expectations down or your budget up because even at low resolutions and detail you'll struggle to get playable performances out of an APU in either of those games.

The 5600G will be more than sufficient for your other needs and would give you decent gaming performance when paired with a GPU like the 3060ti, which my friend in the UK was just able to get for ~£440

Butterfly Valley fucked around with this message at 10:10 on Aug 26, 2021

Z the IVth
Jan 28, 2009

The trouble with your "expendable machines"
Fun Shoe

Butterfly Valley posted:

Just to add to feedback, between Total War and Cyberpunk you've listed two of the most CPU and GPU intensive games that exist, so you really need to either revise your expectations down or your budget up because even at low resolutions and detail you'll struggle to get playable performances out of an APU in either of those games.

Well I've always figured that the FPS-es like Cyberpunk is something for the future with a proper GPU. Also since when did total war become a resource hog? I used to play Shogun 20 years ago and while the modern stuff is prettier it's still no Crysis. Potato mode surely exists if needed?

KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

Hey I'll give you feedback here too! Looking a lot better. If you really plan to never use a high end card 450W in your rig, the Corsair SFF PSU you had before would be just fine. I figured since you were holding out for a GPU you wanted something beefier.

You can back off to 3200 CL14 for roughly equivalent performance (1-3% hit estimate), but going down to that 2666 stuff you had before is going to be significantly slower. It would make more sense for me for your incremental $ to go towards the better RAM and the cheaper ASRock B550 versus the (better) Gigabyte board and worse RAM.

Thanks for the thoughts, this is very helpful. Having done more checking:

1. I have to use the MSI mobo as the Asrock one isn't compatible without a BIOS update and I can't do it without a CPU installed.

2. There's only about a £15 difference between a Corsair 450w Platinum and a Fractal node 650w Gold. Is there any major difference in quality? I'm tempted to just pay a little extra for the 650w in this case.

3. Is the partpicker accurate for prices or are there reputable retailers who are not on it? Having played with the numbers downgrading components doesn't look like it's saving me a huge amount.

4. Do I need a custom cooler at this stage or is it something to consider once I get a GPU?

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

I would expect Shogun 2 and Rome II to run okay at 1080p on medium settings. Warhammer and Warhammer II may need to be bumped down to low. Three Kingdoms will probably need to be on low AND have its resolution bumped down to be playable on a 5600G. That game is intense, but it will probably be playable by turning down the settings far enough. Though "playable" is subjective here (is 30fps at 720p low playable for you?)

edit: Here's a rather extensive video showing the 5600G in action in a wide variety of games:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCbybCYLJog

You can find some videos of people running some Total War benchmarks on youtube too if you search.

Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 12:01 on Aug 26, 2021

Z the IVth
Jan 28, 2009

The trouble with your "expendable machines"
Fun Shoe

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

Though "playable" is subjective here (is 30fps at 720p low playable for you?)

edit: Here's a rather extensive video showing the 5600G in action in a wide variety of games:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCbybCYLJog


This is also very helpful. It may sound strange but I unironically prefer 30fps. Too high fps and/or motion blur and screen lensing, bloom etc and I get a headache. So low fps (without stutter) and detail are pretty good!

Another question - is the NR200 the best case I can use? I considered the SG13 but it's apparently a bugger to fit everything in and it's really finicky with what GPUs work with it.

Ryuga Death
May 14, 2008

There's gotta be one more bell to crack
Fun Shoe
Oh yeah, another question. I don't have any current plans for VR but is the 5600x cpu good enough to handle VR? I know next to nothing about VR requirements.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

Ryuga Death posted:

Oh yeah, another question. I don't have any current plans for VR but is the 5600x cpu good enough to handle VR? I know next to nothing about VR requirements.

VR is very GPU-heavy due to how high VR headset resolutions are, with the CPU not being involved much more than a typical game. The 5600x is more than good enough for the job.

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njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


VR's mostly a GPU thing, but yes the 5600x will be a fine CPU to pair to your 1070. My PC now is a 3600/2060S and not much in the VR world even makes it sweat beyond the more demanding sim stuff.

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