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Yossarian-22 posted:M-Ls are obsessed with claiming that everybody is either a liberal or an op except for them and it's pretty pervasive on this forum. The anarchist podcasters and vloggers who are pro-imperialist, along with breadtube, are probably a good part of why that is I think it’s worth considering how Trotskyism today intersects with US State Dept goals and actions especially with regard to China, given that Trotskyist organizations have strongly supported liberal uprisings in HK and spreads disinformation and other bs about China. from what I can tell it’s one of the more successful recruitment strategies for the impressionable youth of the USA and it’s probably more than a little rooted in racism.
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Aug 26, 2021 02:20
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Trotskyists got to pick up all the pieces to be the flag bearers for communism after the waves of disillusionment with the USSR and China. It's hard to say how much Trotskyist agitation against China is just old Cold War grudges reasserting themselves, or if they're actually Feds. Really if you ask me the biggest problem with Trotskyists is that they're completely incapable of ever letting go of the past, because if they did they'd recognize that there's no real dialectical value in carrying a torch for communism's biggest loser.
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Aug 26, 2021 03:52
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ted hitler hunter posted:https://www.newsweek.com/exclusive-inside-militarys-secret-undercover-army-1591881 lmao if you think that the secret Pentagon army's infiltration efforts are exclusive to any one sect of the left, but yeah it is definitely an issue with Trotskyist parties Also Trotskyists are pretty incoherent and varied on foreign policy fronts. The weirder ones of the bunch (wsws and Spartacist League) wouldn't be caught dead praising the Hong Kong protests, but Socialist Alternative does. They're all a weird mishmash and blaming feds isn't exactly wrong There's just a M-L gatekeeping tendency that I think is overall negative which deflects legitimate criticism as Trotskyite pedophilic propaganda, anarkkkidy poo poo, leftcom cynicism or what have you Yossarian-22 has issued a correction as of 05:04 on Aug 26, 2021 |
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Aug 26, 2021 04:56
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Yossarian-22 posted:There's just a M-L gatekeeping tendency that I think is overall negative which deflects legitimate criticism as Trotskyite pedophilic propaganda, anarkkkidy poo poo, leftcom cynicism or what have you lol
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Aug 26, 2021 05:15
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like what?
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Aug 26, 2021 07:26
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Hodgepodge posted:i had in mind mutual aid by kropotkin, but as this is evidently formally considered an "anarcho-communist" work it may technically be cheating it's not cheating haha. kropotkin was a good egg. i've just been using anarcho-communist to delineate class struggle anarchist thought as compared to the individualist strand, not as a separate ideology.
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Aug 26, 2021 07:53
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Yossarian-22 posted:He helped found the Petrograd Soviet and put bullets in anarchists' heads. He was also a nerd who argued a lot and got really pedantic. It's honestly shocking that he doesn't have more admirers here because he was basically somebody who couldn't log off until the mods banned him once and for all I think most of us understand this in a sense, but also keenly understand that someone without a sufficient degree of humility and self-awareness about it is not someone pleasant to be around or able to productively engage in political critique. It's partly due to also mostly just getting some of the absolute greatest hits of him being a complete moron about something of course. But I think he does just fundamentally seem to trigger a degree of recognition in many of us of qualities we have learned to be suspicious of within ourselves both as people and as a community.
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Aug 26, 2021 10:39
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in short marx was a cspam shitposter while trotsky was a d&d shitposter
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Aug 26, 2021 10:55
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Aug 26, 2021 12:26
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alternatively, this may be a case of confusion on my part between the relatively benign pedantry ("fishmech") response and the rarer but much more serious malignant narcissist ("taintrunner") alert
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Aug 26, 2021 13:18
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The trajectory of Trot ---> CIA/State Dept/NED is so commonplace that people naturally want nothing to do with them
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Aug 26, 2021 15:46
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So Trotsky was Martin Luther, and the neocons are the Evangelical/Religious Right/Prosperity Gospel set.
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Aug 26, 2021 15:51
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they should cycle out which fallen from grace russian revolutionary figure to kick around. that Bukharin fellow seemed like a real goofball
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Aug 26, 2021 15:55
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Aug 26, 2021 15:55
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tankies are Slytherin
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Aug 26, 2021 15:57
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https://twitter.com/InfraHaz/status/1430263755825373188
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Aug 26, 2021 15:59
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look, you can be against anarchism but keep your complaints in the realm of reality ffs
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Aug 26, 2021 16:06
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e: nvm
AnimeIsTrash has issued a correction as of 22:58 on Aug 26, 2021 |
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Aug 26, 2021 16:15
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Leon Trotsky owns  
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Aug 26, 2021 16:18
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https://twitter.com/COMPLETEANAR/status/1430293415984566274
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Aug 26, 2021 16:24
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dire
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Aug 26, 2021 16:37
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thank you, haz
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Aug 26, 2021 17:05
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reading this dumbass’ tweets he’s probably just a kid who needs his rear end kicked once or twice to not be such a little shithead. if he’s not a kid he might be the most pathetic man alive
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Aug 26, 2021 17:12
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AnimeIsTrash posted:Ferrinus if you act in RL like you post I can understand why they would hate you. how do i post. are you saying i should post in a trot-acceptable way here was what trotsky argued for in 1920: "....a regime in which every worker feels himself a soldier of labour, who cannot dispose of himself freely; if the order is given to transfer him, he must carry it out; if he does not carry it out, he will be a deserter who is punished. Who looks after this? The trade unions. It creates the new regime. This is the militarisation of the working class." which i think points to the biggest and most obvious criticism of the guy, specifically that he blows with the wind and becomes an iron-fisted dictator or champion of individual autonomy based purely on whether he's in charge or if somebody else he doesn't like had the opposite idea first Ferrinus has issued a correction as of 18:53 on Aug 26, 2021 |
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Aug 26, 2021 18:48
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Yeah it's insane that softcore dem socs have a thing for Trotsky. There's just a complete disconnect between the man and the following ofc that's partially Trotsky's fault for positioning himself cynically as a more democratic alternative to stalin when he likely would have been just as ruthless Yossarian-22 has issued a correction as of 18:56 on Aug 26, 2021 |
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Aug 26, 2021 18:54
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R. Mute posted:like what? I think the amorphous nature of state socialist regimes to become capitalist writ large is too easily passed off as "well they're just trying to survive the CIA" and any left opposition to them is way too easily dismissed as pushing Western agendas. Workers on strike in China are often young Maoists for example. Of course there are the color revolutionists who are dupes and agents provocateur though and so many anarchists/Trots fall for color revolution because anything involving people in the streets is basically pornographic for them
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Aug 26, 2021 19:01
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Cerebral Bore posted:in short marx was a cspam shitposter while trotsky was a d&d shitposter Stalin was an ADTRW shitposter, Lenin only ever posted in QCS, Engels was a BFC shitposter, and Mao mostly lurked BFC and PMed Gotase to landlords in the landlord thread before he was ultimately made a mod of the Pet Island forum and his thread on caring for sparrows was goldmined.
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Aug 26, 2021 19:10
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stalin was probably the least poster brained of them all. in fact he may have even been Normal
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Aug 26, 2021 19:14
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Actually I'm changing my answer, he posted in Coupons and Deals
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Aug 26, 2021 19:14
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F Stop Fitzgerald posted:stalin was probably the least poster brained of them all. in fact he may have even been Normal There's probably no reason it should but it still blows my mind that Stalin was interviewed by H.G. Wells at one point. So clearly he posted mostly in Sci-Fi Wifi
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Aug 26, 2021 19:18
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say what you want about leon but his modern day adherents are just contrarians. thats it, they just love to argue. its what brought them to communism to start with, because everybody hates it, and then they found the thing in communism that all the communists hate
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Aug 26, 2021 21:41
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croup coughfield posted:say what you want about leon but his modern day adherents are just contrarians. thats it, they just love to argue. its what brought them to communism to start with, because everybody hates it, and then they found the thing in communism that all the communists hate Mr. G is a very intellectual young man who was an infant prodigy. He has been concerned with general ideas since the age of ten and has one of those minds that can scintillatingly rationalize everything. I have known him for ten years and in that time have heard him enthusiastically explain Marx, social credit, technocracy, Keynesian economics, Chestertonian distributism, and everything else one can imagine. Mr. G will never be a Nazi, because he will never be anything. His brain operates quite apart from the rest of his apparatus. He will certainly be able, however, fully to explain and apologize for Nazism if it ever comes along. But Mr. G is always a “deviationist.” When he played with communism he was a Trotskyist; when he talked of Keynes it was to suggest improvement; Chesterton’s economic ideas were all right but he was too bound to Catholic philosophy. So we may be sure that Mr. G would be a Nazi with purse-lipped qualifications. He would certainly be purged.
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Aug 26, 2021 22:06
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https://twitter.com/COMPLETEANAR/status/1251546958025707521
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Aug 26, 2021 22:58
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lol this is just "never held power" and "held power"
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Aug 26, 2021 23:17
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Ah yes the Rosa Luxemburg the "anarchist" https://www.marxists.org/archive/luxemburg/1906/mass-strike/ch01.htm "But apart from these few “revolutionary” groups, what is the actual role of anarchism in the Russian Revolution? It has become the sign of the common thief and plunderer; a large proportion of the innumerable thefts and acts of plunder of private persons are carried out under the name of “anarchist-communism” – acts which rise up like a troubled wave against the revolution in every period of depression and in every period of temporary defensive. Anarchism has become in the Russian Revolution, not the theory of the struggling proletariat, but the ideological signboard of the counter-revolutionary lumpenproletariat, who, like a school of sharks, swarm in the wake of the battleship of the revolution. And therewith the historical career of anarchism is well-nigh ended."
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Aug 27, 2021 00:21
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Lmao I didn't even realize they split marx and engels.
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Aug 27, 2021 00:48
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as a marxist-engelsist, i hold that engels really completed the body of marxist theory and made it ready to take state power through revolution
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Aug 27, 2021 00:54
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venture capitalists love being angel investors, but tell them your're an engels investor...
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Aug 27, 2021 01:07
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when you think about it engels was just holding marx back from true utopia
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Aug 27, 2021 01:13
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AnimeIsTrash posted:Lmao I didn't even realize they split marx and engels. When you're extremely not mad at "The Bakuninists at Work"
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Aug 27, 2021 01:17
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