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Pollyanna posted:I’m not super into wine either, but I love cider, and I’m really curious about mead and the possibility of a nice melomel. Cider is easy. Get decent to awesome sweet cider and add yeast. You can add a couple other things, but they’re extras and refinements. 1 gallon batches are not too bad either. Look for the pressed cider without sorbates (UV pasteurized is ideal, fresh from an orchard is pro). You also don’t need to sweat your temp control on that Wheat beer. They sent an Ale yeast so ambient room temp (around 70) is fine. Lager yeast does have cooler temp requirements, and lagering is around fridge temp.
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Aug 25, 2021 16:56
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| # ? Jun 8, 2024 00:45 |
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Pollyanna posted:If what you say is true, it should be totally done by Monday. Half tempted to pour a bit out from the spigot and taste it to see how far it's gotten - is that going to contaminate the mixture? That should be fine. Do you have any of the sanitizer left? You can sanitize the valve first, draw a sample, then sanitize again to make sure. If your airlock is very full you may suck back some water into the vessel so you might want to take it off briefly so that air can replace the sample you take. Since you may use the spigot to bottle afterwards it’s good to keep it all clean. Yeast can accumulate near the valve so you may have to pull a bit, discard the yeast, then pull a bit more of you want a clean sample. If it tastes really sweet then it’s not fermented enough. I don’t know if you tasted the fresh wort but it’s fairly sweet. And don’t taste it if it fails the sniff test!
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Aug 25, 2021 19:50
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I tasted some. It tasted like...like unsweetened hops-and-wheat-flavored juice, almost. It wasn't sweet or sugary, it was like some random-rear end unimpressive beer-flavored water. I also can't tell if there's alcohol in it or not. I think it's a very young beer, so I'll let it sit for another two weeks and see where it ends up after that.
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Aug 25, 2021 21:12
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You need to carbonate it, it makes a big difference. warmish non-carbonated beer will taste unimpressive
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Aug 25, 2021 21:25
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I mean, there wasn't carbonation in antiquity, right? Technically it's still perfectly good beer.
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Aug 25, 2021 23:31
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Pollyanna posted:I mean, there wasn't carbonation in antiquity, right? Technically it's still perfectly good beer. If you bottle it before the fermentation is done the yeasts make it naturally fizzy
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Aug 25, 2021 23:45
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Rutibex posted:If you bottle it before the fermentation is done the yeasts make it naturally fizzy Don’t do this unless you know your gravity and how far your yeast strain will take it. Let it finish and then add a small amount of bottling sugar to get the carbonation you want. This way can end in over carbed bottles and possibly explosions. No reason to do this when it’s extremely easy to avoid. There also was often some carbonation in ages past, but they were filling casks and glass and still had a good idea of when it was a good idea to package and safe to do this. And they definitely still would have bottles and casks break.
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Aug 26, 2021 01:07
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Anyone played with Omega's Cosmic Punch yet? Got a split batch fermenting now with it and can't wait to see how it compares. Pretty interested to see what else they can do with GM yeasts.
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Aug 26, 2021 14:57
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Is there any evidence they're actually doing what they're implying that they're doing? There's not a lot of transparency in the yeast business, and a lot of products are coming out where the main motivation seems to be to have a trademarkable, and preferably patentable product.
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Aug 27, 2021 01:10
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thotsky posted:Is there any evidence they're actually doing what they're implying that they're doing? There's not a lot of transparency in the yeast business, and a lot of products are coming out where the main motivation seems to be to have a trademarkable, and preferably patentable product. I'm not a microbiologist or anything, but I know several people who work there, and from my understanding they are definitely making genetic hybrid yeasts.
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Aug 27, 2021 01:17
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thotsky posted:Is there any evidence they're actually doing what they're implying that they're doing? There's not a lot of transparency in the yeast business, and a lot of products are coming out where the main motivation seems to be to have a trademarkable, and preferably patentable product. I read this a while back. No idea who the author is, but he sure talks a lot about yeast and thiols. http://scottjanish.com/genetically-...haracteristics/. Like I said can't say anything about the author and what his expertise is so IDK how good of a writeup it is. It seems plausible that you can include genes in a yeast to adjust how all the organic compounds are treated during fermentation. Of course whether or not the yeast will reliably deliver on a significantly different aroma/flavor profile is really the ultimate question, and maybe not as well answered by that post. I think it lays out the case why people are interested in GM yeast and specific types of hops at least. I did find it interesting that supposedly one of the hardest part for these transgenic yeast was getting the right amount of expression of whatever gene they add. Presumably it's easy enough to add in a gene, but some strains were having troubles with like extra sulfur production or other off-flavors if it's over-done. The author seemed to imply that was one of the bigger R&D efforts for Omega or whatever, figuring out the right balance of doing whatever biochemistry they want but not adding anything undesired.
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Aug 27, 2021 01:29
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They could be doing whatever most easiesly let's them make that claim, or they could be straight up lying. Patents are all the rage in the yeast business right now. http://suigenerisbrewing.com/index.php/2020/12/08/lachancea-patent-wars/ thotsky fucked around with this message at 01:39 on Aug 27, 2021 |
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Aug 27, 2021 01:34
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Hardware question: I have some of that standard plastic line for a picnic tap, which I want to connect up to a standard plastic spigot on a fermenter (this isn't for brewing, it's for my darkroom so I can have running-ish water). Only problem is the tubing is too small to fit directly on the spigot; I thought it might fit onto a cut off section of bottling wand that could then be fitted to the spigot, but even after heating it it's too large. Is there an easy solution to this? Jhet posted:Cider is easy. Get decent to awesome sweet cider and add yeast. You can add a couple other things, but they’re extras and refinements. 1 gallon batches are not too bad either. Look for the pressed cider without sorbates (UV pasteurized is ideal, fresh from an orchard is pro). Any recommendations for a hop that goes well with cider, either/both as dry hop or hop tea? I have a good supplier for fresh pressed juice locally and while the resulting cider is decent (I just toss yeast in and forget about it, don't bother with nutrients, etc) it is a bit one-note.
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Sep 2, 2021 02:25
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Ethics_Gradient posted:Any recommendations for a hop that goes well with cider, either/both as dry hop or hop tea? I have a good supplier for fresh pressed juice locally and while the resulting cider is decent (I just toss yeast in and forget about it, don't bother with nutrients, etc) it is a bit one-note. Cascade, Citra, Simcoe, Chinook, Centennial would all work great. I like the citrus and pine to put into cider. Herbal heavy ones I haven’t tried, and Loral or Pekko might be interesting but I haven’t tried or found someone who has. I don’t think I would like the tropical hops for cider, but they could still work great if it suits you. You can just dry hop with them like it’s beer, it works great. I’ve never used nutrients with cider, but I’ve used beer yeast and whatever is already on the apples. Never had issues and they finish pretty dry. 3711 French Saison finishes predictably low, but the glycerol production gives it a great mouthfeel.
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Sep 2, 2021 02:52
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Jhet posted:Cascade, Citra, Simcoe, Chinook, Centennial would all work great. I like the citrus and pine to put into cider. Herbal heavy ones I haven’t tried, and Loral or Pekko might be interesting but I haven’t tried or found someone who has. I don’t think I would like the tropical hops for cider, but they could still work great if it suits you. You can just dry hop with them like it’s beer, it works great. That's awesome advice, thanks. It's obviously a "to taste" thing but what would be a good starting point for a 20L batch?
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Sep 2, 2021 03:20
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Ethics_Gradient posted:Hardware question: If you're not very far off you can heat the line, then use some needle nose pliers to stretch it out.
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Sep 2, 2021 04:22
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Ethics_Gradient posted:That's awesome advice, thanks. It's obviously a "to taste" thing but what would be a good starting point for a 20L batch? I like 2oz to start (60g or your nearest round package) for 3-7 days right before bottles/keg. It’ll be strong enough to give a presence.
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Sep 2, 2021 06:29
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Jhet posted:Cider is easy. Get decent to awesome sweet cider and add yeast. You can add a couple other things, but they’re extras and refinements. 1 gallon batches are not too bad either. Look for the pressed cider without sorbates (UV pasteurized is ideal, fresh from an orchard is pro). So when we say sweet cider, we're talking about this stuff, right?  Or are we talking apple juice?
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Sep 4, 2021 01:32
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In the US there's no legal distinction between apple juice and apple cider. Over here in Europe we only call fermented apple juice cider, whereas Americans will usually say "hard cider" to make the distinction explicit. That seems to becoming less common, adding to the confusion. Yes, you can just add yeast to apple juice, although I hear for the best results one should use a neutral wine yeast, a half dose of organic nitrogen (Fermaid O) and ferment at as low a temp as the yeast allows. That said, I have had pretty decent Cider made with the cheapest from concentrate juice and baking yeast fermented in a closet. thotsky fucked around with this message at 02:22 on Sep 4, 2021 |
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Sep 4, 2021 02:19
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Pollyanna posted:So when we say sweet cider, we're talking about this stuff, right? Probably not, but it could work. It’s the right sort of pressed cider, but if you can find something UV pasteurized instead of having preservatives that will do much better. Even a clear apple juice off the shelf will behave better than something with preservatives. Treehouse is UV treated and works, but if you have an orchard nearby that is likely to be the best option. Even honey crisp blends will do fine, but cider apples are the sweetest out there, and it’ll come down to your taste. Buy a good tasting starting product and it has a great chance to tasting just as good on the other end. And trotsky is right about the language. Cider or juice would be fine, but legally it’s called hard cider still for the end result when they go to tax it.
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Sep 4, 2021 02:40
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I brewed an English bitter that was meant to be a sort of Landlord/Boddington clone. Just straight up Golden Promise, WLP066 and like 40 IBUs of EKG and Celeia. I ended up getting much better efficiency than I expected so it became a Strong Bitter / English Pale Ale instead. Kegged it with a 1 oz EKG dry hop. I grabbed WLP066 since WY1318 was unavailable. It definitely has the same slick mouthfeel thing going on, but it feels a lot more neutral in character. Might repitch the yeast in a hazy or dark beer, but I think I will look elsewhere for beers that need more "English" character. The clean spelt Saison I brewed a ways back turned out nice, although I am surprised that the Blaugies yeast I use threw a sort of smokey phenol. I used a ton of EKG hops, including a 4 oz whirlpool addition, maybe that's why. It's not out of style, I just normally expect Blaugies to be more estery than phenolic. I repitched onto my usual session saison, which also has plenty of hops (Mittelfrüh and Celeia), following the same fermentation regimen with no issues. Maybe it's a bottle conditioning thing that will clean up with time... thotsky fucked around with this message at 02:46 on Sep 4, 2021 |
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Sep 4, 2021 02:44
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Jhet posted:Probably not, but it could work. It’s the right sort of pressed cider, but if you can find something UV pasteurized instead of having preservatives that will do much better. Even a clear apple juice off the shelf will behave better than something with preservatives. Treehouse is UV treated and works, but if you have an orchard nearby that is likely to be the best option. Even honey crisp blends will do fine, but cider apples are the sweetest out there, and it’ll come down to your taste. Buy a good tasting starting product and it has a great chance to tasting just as good on the other end. Right yeah, I'm talking about what sweet cider means here. I def know that you need to avoid preservatives. UV pasteurized works for me, I'll take a look once this beer finishes!
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Sep 4, 2021 16:13
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Sanitization/cleansing question: what am I meant to use to prep a ? I've heard to just swish around Campden tablets (sodium bisulfite) in buckets, carboys, and fermenters, but I've also heard to use Star-San (phosphoric acid + benzenesulfonic acid) instead, as well as a combination of the two. I've also seen people put Campden tablets into juice, crushed fruit, and on top of wine caps before(???) pitching the yeast. Anything wrong with using only Campden tablets? And what's the thing with steeping Campden tablets in juice and berries?
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Sep 4, 2021 17:29
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Sanitize with the star-san or iodophor solution (I use the iodophor). Campden tabs are best used to stop fermentation in finished must, but you have to be judicious with their use or they'll leave a nasty sulfur flavor behind.
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Sep 4, 2021 17:39
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Hmm, got it. I'll pick up both and prefer washing/cleaning my buckets+equipment with the star-san, then use Campden tablets when it calls for it (e.g. a melomel). Thanks!
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Sep 4, 2021 17:42
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You can use Camden tablets to make a sanitizing solution, but you need a lot. It used to be very popular among winemakers before starsan became a thing.
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Sep 4, 2021 19:35
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https://youtu.be/nPtMHSYtPc4?t=7s   That glass I poured off ended up getting me nice and tipsy, so I think it did in fact work! Next up is the cider, mead, and melomel. Plus I saw this and figured why not:  Cause stouts are my favorite of the beers.
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Sep 4, 2021 20:46
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Hey welcome to the hobby! Good to see you had a good first batch. Inspiring me to hurry up and bottle this batch I have now. And I need to go outside and harvest my sterling hops soon...
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Sep 4, 2021 21:16
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Pollyanna posted:Hmm, got it. I'll pick up both and prefer washing/cleaning my buckets+equipment with the star-san, then use Campden tablets when it calls for it (e.g. a melomel). Thanks! Just to set you up for success, but you need to wash/clean with a cleaner. They'll be a basic compound of some sort, and PBW (powdered brewery wash) is what you'll see a lot of people use. The more frugal will use OxyClean Free (no scents) as it's similar enough to clean really well. These will take off any proteins and yeast that clumps and sticks to the glass/plastic pretty well. After they're clean is when you want to use the StarSan (Iodophor works too) to sanitize. Sanitizing your cold and finished product surfaces and utensils will help avoid any infections leading to bad tasting or gushing results. Campden tabs are sort of a chore, but will knock back any naturally occurring yeast/bacteria to allow the ones you add to be in charge. Just wait 24 hours after adding and gently stir so the sulfur can off-gas. I stopped using them in cider (or the powdered Potassium version-KMS) as I wanted the natural yeast/bacteria to come to the party too. That will depend on what product you end up getting though. It's entirely unnecessary in pasteurized cider. But mostly, just welcome to the hobby. It's only as complicated as you end up making it, and that first brew looks great. The stout kit will work great too, and there's nothing wrong with extract. It's very convenient to use and can make good tasting beer.
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Sep 4, 2021 22:56
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Jhet posted:Just to set you up for success, but you need to wash/clean with a cleaner. They'll be a basic compound of some sort, and PBW (powdered brewery wash) is what you'll see a lot of people use. The more frugal will use OxyClean Free (no scents) as it's similar enough to clean really well. These will take off any proteins and yeast that clumps and sticks to the glass/plastic pretty well. After they're clean is when you want to use the StarSan (Iodophor works too) to sanitize. Sanitizing your cold and finished product surfaces and utensils will help avoid any infections leading to bad tasting or gushing results. god loving dammit  this is stuff i need to know BEFORE i hit up the store aaaaaaaa. is there no alternative other than PBW? guess i'll stop by again tomorrow.quote:Campden tabs are sort of a chore, but will knock back any naturally occurring yeast/bacteria to allow the ones you add to be in charge. Just wait 24 hours after adding and gently stir so the sulfur can off-gas. I stopped using them in cider (or the powdered Potassium version-KMS) as I wanted the natural yeast/bacteria to come to the party too. That will depend on what product you end up getting though. It's entirely unnecessary in pasteurized cider. Hmm, good to know. I'm not as confident in what Campdens are for compared to something like Star-San. quote:But mostly, just welcome to the hobby. It's only as complicated as you end up making it, and that first brew looks great. The stout kit will work great too, and there's nothing wrong with extract. It's very convenient to use and can make good tasting beer. Yeah, I'm actually rather surprised - it's actually beer. For a while, it seemed like just wort-flavored juice, but apparently it got somewhere  Looking forward to the rest!
Pollyanna fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Sep 5, 2021 |
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Sep 5, 2021 02:23
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Pollyanna posted:god loving dammit You can use dish soap really. Just make sure you rinse it very completely or you may pick up soapy flavors. I can find Oxyclean Free at the grocery store and places like Target/Walmart and Home Depot too. No need to make an extra trip to the specialty store for it if you have other errands to run.
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Sep 5, 2021 03:02
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Okay, phew. Just re-rinsed the fermenter and I think that should do it. I'll grab some OxyFree tomorrow, thanks!
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Sep 5, 2021 03:15
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Fuuudge. I just brewed my wet hop beer. 90% Golden Promise 10% Rye Malt (I can't stop myself from adding something like rye). I thought I nailed the brew day but my gravity is super low compared to what I expected.  Hopefully my Tylt is just...miscalibrated and it ends super low???
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Sep 5, 2021 04:01
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For cleaning I feel like the PBW/percarbonate cleaners or the alkaline cleaners are much more important for things like valves, tubing, or bottles. Stuff you can't get at with a sponge kind of needs a soaking cleaner that gets everything off. It seemed like PBW was a not insignificant cost of a batch of beer, but I didn't crunch the numbers on it really. Starsan is not that much, I can just use a spray bottle and make a little go a long way. But I'd soak the important stuff with PBW and do it in several batches (once for kettle stuff, once for fermenter stuff) and it really seemed to add up.
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Sep 5, 2021 04:40
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PBW is not that expensive to wash with unless you're mixing at the recommended strength, which to my understanding is the strength you'd use if you're pumping it through tubing and not soaking. If you let it sit, you can get away with a lot less IIRC.
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Sep 5, 2021 05:06
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Yeah for the actual cleaning part I just use Dawn soap. The sanitation part is still iodophor.
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Sep 5, 2021 05:49
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PBW was expensive before it was pulled from the market in Europa for a while, but since it has returned its even more so. There are other alkaline, acid based and/or oxidizing cleaners that are better value pound for pound, and have lower dosage recommendations, but it does feel like PBW is especially quick and thorough.
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Sep 5, 2021 11:05
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Corking question, the one I bought is poo poo, this type: It either pushes the corks in too far and leaves a depression in the centre, or doesn't push them far enough if I try and stop it going too far:  Can someone recommend a better one I can get in the UK? Also a question about losses. I was making a rosé from a kit and between the various finings/settling/racking steps how much should I expect to lose? I ended up with 5 1/2 bottle of slightly too sweet (my fault) wine which I'm not complaining about but I wondered what everyone else did. Also I picked up a couple more demijohns from someone getting out of the hobby... 
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Sep 5, 2021 12:52
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If you have the space for it, a floor corker is really nice. In the US, there's one that's usually called the "Portuguese floor corker", which is pretty cheap and works well. Here's one on UK amazon: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Garhe-Semi...oor+cork&sr=8-7
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Sep 5, 2021 16:51
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Okay, I'm gonna get started on making cider. Someone doublecheck my procedure. Step 1: Clean and Sanitize  In a bucket, add some water and some OxyClean Free, mix to make some cleanser, and submerge all your fermenting equipment. (The siphon is there, but I won't be using it yet, so ignore that part.) Let sit for 10 minutes. Then, drain. In the same bucket, add some more water and some Star-San (TODO: how much per gallon?), mix to make some sanitizer, and submerge all your fermenting equipment. (Don't bother rinsing or drying after the cleaning.) Let sit for 10 minutes. Then, remove and thoroughly dry fermenting equipment. Reserve sanitizing solution in bucket for later. Step 2: Pour Juice and Pitch Yeast  Pour 1/2 tsp of S-04 yeast into 1 cup of warm water (no more than 90F), stir, and let sit. Check after a few minutes, and if the mixture has some small bubbles, then your yeast is alive and you can proceed. If not, your yeast is dead, and you need a new packet. Pour your gallon of organic (i.e. no preservatives, but apparently pasteurized) apple juice into your fermenter. Then, pour in your cup of watery-rear end yeast. Step 3: Add Spices For this batch, I'll be trying to make something similar to J.K.'s Winterruption. My guess is that I'll be adding: - 2x 2" sticks of cinnamon (too little?) - 2x Tbsp of maple syrup (too little?) - 2x tsp of vanilla extract (too much?) but I don't know yet if those will be enough, and I don't know if any of that will compromise the fermenting process. Any reason this wouldn't work? Step 4: Wait Close up the fermenter, shake lightly, add airlock with some sanitizer, and keep in a roughly 74~75F cupboard for two weeks. Step 5: Bottle Clean and sanitize the apple juice carboy and the siphon, then bottle the cider. --- Anything I'm missing?
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Sep 5, 2021 20:43
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