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Man, I saw a bunch of anti-vax chuds from work complaining about these new rules on a private Facebook group and it’s just so loving cathartic to see this poo poo thrown in their faces. I’m certain every last one of them who claimed that “it’s not a real vaccine” or tried to claim that “taking an mRNA vaccine causes you to lose your human rights” (that’s a new one!!) will be lining up for the shot. Had one anti-vaxxer even want to meet up this weekend to fight over it, pretty classy poo poo!
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 06:09 |
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# ? May 11, 2024 11:07 |
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7of7 posted:There was also a listener who sent in this paper which I thought was interesting. In the paper they tested patients using lateral flow antigen tests like you'd get at a pharmacy (and which Biden is trying to make more available) as well as with PCR. They then tried to culture virus from the patient samples and it turned out the lateral flow tests were better at predicting the presence of infectious virus than PCR (90% vs 70%) since PCR is so sensitive it tends to be positive even when the patient doesn't have any infectious virus in their nose. It seems to me that they’re using a nonuseful metric to successfully draw attention. quote:As shown in Table 1, the antigen test demonstrated a positive percentage agreement (PPA) of 96.4% (95% CI, 82.3%–99.4%) and negative percentage agreement (NPA) of 98.7% (95% CI, 96.1%–99.7%). The rt-PCR assay demonstrated a PPA and NPA of 100% (95% CI, 87.7%–100%) and 95.5% (95% CI, 91.1%–97.8%), respectively. Based on the study prevalence of 11.2%, as determined by SARS-CoV-2 TMPRSS2 culture positivity and a total specimen number of 251 (based on the total, evaluable specimen set utilized for the Veritor EUA study), the positive predictive value (PPV) for the antigen test was 90.0% (95% CI, 76.3%–97.6%), whereas the PPV for the rt-PCR assay was only 73.7% (95% CI, 60.8%–85.3%). Letting an extra thirty-two people in one thousand people out of isolation early is totally not worth accidentally letting out thirteen certifiably infectous individuals. n = 38 is also deeply problematic for the small effect they’re trying to show
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 06:11 |
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Gynovore posted:What sorta stuff can you do? Well, it's not a certainty I can, but at this point in the name of good moderation I am asking for forgiveness rather than permission. So pretty much anything is on the table as far as I am concerned. Archives, Plat, PMs, Av/Title Change. Probably not someone else's title change, we're trying to be nice in here. So yeah, folks who got quoted can just let me know. I know a lot of cert stuff I've heard rumblings will just be free features down the line, if that affects your decision at all. I will do the best I can to make sure we have admins who can follow through; after all we had a land speed record double perma in the thread already. Also, just a reminder that I'm leaving submissions open like Star Trek spec scripts, so if you have something sourced or sourceable by all means post it and I'll see if it fits the needs of the OP. I have 2 posts to work with currently but I imagine it will be a 3 post OP, and rather sizable. Coronavirus is the current global crisis of our time and the worst pandemic of the modern age; it's going to produce a large OP, but hopefully with a new OP once I've got all submissions edited in I can use the new thread to spread it out a bit more. Thanks for all your patience and cooperation. e: Rescue kitten tax for the page.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 06:17 |
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7of7 posted:I didn't see it posted so I wanted to link this week's episode of TWiV. They had on Shane Crotty who is an immunologist, vaccine researcher, and virologist. They had a really in depth but understandable discussion of the many different aspects of immunity and vaccination.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 06:39 |
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SCOTUS is about to argue that lawfully established administrative entities like OSHA actually can't exist, it says so right here in the - hey look, someone ordered Moe's
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 10:36 |
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covidforever posted:Maybe this belongs in a different thread but how long and to what extent are people in this thread going to obsess over COVID for the foreseeable future? That’s a lot of words to say you think I should put my life and my kids’ lives at serious risk, but I won’t be doing it I’m afraid. I truly hope you can cope with that like my family and I can.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 14:07 |
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While covidforever sounds like he was on the extreme end of open 'er up, I do think there's a tendency to assume an extreme version of everyone's position in regards to risk acceptance, and replace what they're actually saying with a stereotype. Everyone saying that seeing friends outdoors is an acceptable level of risk for them has their argument replaced with "I go to packed bars constantly and lick the faces of everyone there on my way to a lockdown protest" Everyone advocating for more risk avoidance is automatically a basement shut in who hasn't seen the sun since March 2020, and quarantines their groceries for 3 days. I think it would be useful for people to both be clear about what they're advocating for when they talk about accepting risk / avoiding risk. Like with the blowup a few pages earlier, the argument was largely about whether being unmasked outdoors on a patio with fully vaccinated people was OK, which there's definitely not 100% agreement on in here, but it's a far cry from abandoning all precautions.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 14:16 |
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I apologize if this has been answered but I couldn’t find the specific language: Is the mandate for vaccines/testing for companies that have more than 100 employees overall or more than 100 employees per location? Reason I ask: a supermarket chain could have thousands of employees across the nation but less than 100 at any given store. This is how big companies still got PPP loans.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 14:27 |
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Platystemon posted:It seems to me that they’re using a nonuseful metric to successfully draw attention. Yeah it's definitely a tiny study. The problem with PCR positives alone being used to decide if someone should isolate is real though. It can cause staffing problems in medical facilities and other institutions where you might be isolating tons of staff because PCR detected a bit of RNA in their noses whether or not they are actually harboring transmissible virus. So any way to more accurately detect infectious people would be good. Like was said above maybe the best tactic would testing daily with both PCR and antigen. If they pop positive on PCR but are negative on antigen send them into isolation but have them take an antigen test daily for a few days to see if they ever become positive there. The question then is how long would that few days be? Ideally a larger study would be done comparing PCR, rapid antigen, and viral culture to see what makes the most sense. As it is though it does seem like we're over-reliant on PCR results, especially with the questionable amount of infectious virus and questionable length of time for that virus existing in vaccinated individuals who are PCR positive.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 14:43 |
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virtualboyCOLOR posted:I apologize if this has been answered but I couldn’t find the specific language: typically regulations like this are about employees overall - the theory being that a company that size has enough administrative backend to deal with requirements (not sure if this is a requirement to be subject to OSHA, or if it's just the standard way this stuff is done). i can't find the actual text, but everything I've seen says it's that: if you have 100 employees, you're subject to it, even if they're on multiple campuses. where that can break down is franchises, where each location is a separately owned so what you think of as "a business" is in fact multiple businesses. labor law isn't my specialty but I think that even if each supermarket is a separate corporate entity (for liability reasons), but wholly-owned by the holding company, that doesn't get you out of counting all the employees together.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 15:18 |
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And it likely also comes down to the level of enforcement/effort made by the federal government itself. The reason why larger businesses were able to get away with as much PPP money as they did is because the whole thing was basically an unregulated slush fund.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 15:25 |
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enki42 posted:While covidforever sounds like he was on the extreme end of open 'er up, I do think there's a tendency to assume an extreme version of everyone's position in regards to risk acceptance, and replace what they're actually saying with a stereotype. pretty much everyone I know IRL who isn't an anti-vaxxer is relatively comfortable in spaces, indoor or out, where they know everyone is vaccinated. I'm in an area of New England which was never hit hard, so I think people are more relaxed here in general, but I don't know anyone who has gone back to what they were doing in mid-2020. not saying this is a good thing or a bad thing, just echoing the disconnect I see between here and elsewhere.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 15:41 |
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Puppy Galaxy posted:pretty much everyone I know IRL who isn't an anti-vaxxer is relatively comfortable in spaces, indoor or out, where they know everyone is vaccinated. I'm in an area of New England which was never hit hard, so I think people are more relaxed here in general, but I don't know anyone who has gone back to what they were doing in mid-2020. not saying this is a good thing or a bad thing, just echoing the disconnect I see between here and elsewhere. I definitely see more variation. Anytime I'm trying to organize something social with friends, there's a bit of a dance figuring out everyone's comfort levels, and depending on the group, it can go anywhere from "indoor dining is totally fine, let's share a ride there" to "I'm only comfortable meeting in a park, and everyone needs to be vaccinated" (at the very extreme end, I know a couple of people who won't socialize at all and won't enter a building that has been occupied by another person in the past 24 hours, but they are definitely outliers). I was very pleasantly surprised that parents and kids were 90%+ mask compliant outdoors when dropping kids off at school on their first day. (despite there being no mandate and not particularly strong pressure to mask outdoors in Ontario). No N95, but in a universally masked environment, cloth masks get a lot better, since they're not great but not abysmal at source control. enki42 fucked around with this message at 15:53 on Sep 10, 2021 |
# ? Sep 10, 2021 15:50 |
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Even pre-Delta at the end of the Spring and beginning of the Summer when I felt 100% immune due to the vaccination I didn't jump right back into 'old life'. We started going to the gym, which was *awesome* and had plans to ease back into large social gatherings but then Delta arrived before we really were able to do so.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 15:56 |
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I miss my gym time too. I never got to have my hot vaccinated girl summer.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 15:58 |
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I'm not sure if this is helpful for a new OP, being a few months out of date, but here's Total Deaths, All Causes, US, Weekly from a CDC/NCHS dataset I grabbed earlier this year. I put this together to respond to claims about how (a) covid isn't actually killing people, (b) it's not actually that deadly, or (c) deaths are being mislabeled as covid for nefarious reasons. It's no-frills, but I tried to make it as simple and self-explanatory as possible.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 16:07 |
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dwarf74 posted:I'm not sure if this is helpful for a new OP, being a few months out of date, but here's Total Deaths, All Causes, US, Weekly from a CDC/NCHS dataset I grabbed earlier this year. I put this together to respond to claims about how (a) covid isn't actually killing people, (b) it's not actually that deadly, or (c) deaths are being mislabeled as covid for nefarious reasons. This is a really great figure, thank you for sharing.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 16:47 |
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dwarf74 posted:I'm not sure if this is helpful for a new OP, being a few months out of date, but here's Total Deaths, All Causes, US, Weekly from a CDC/NCHS dataset I grabbed earlier this year. I put this together to respond to claims about how (a) covid isn't actually killing people, (b) it's not actually that deadly, or (c) deaths are being mislabeled as covid for nefarious reasons. Hey, thanks for this. It'll go into the OP and if you feel like updating down the road a bit just let me know.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 17:24 |
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dwarf74 posted:I'm not sure if this is helpful for a new OP, being a few months out of date, but here's Total Deaths, All Causes, US, Weekly from a CDC/NCHS dataset I grabbed earlier this year. I put this together to respond to claims about how (a) covid isn't actually killing people, (b) it's not actually that deadly, or (c) deaths are being mislabeled as covid for nefarious reasons. That's a great plot. Could you possibly plot excess deaths as well? Something like 2020-21 deaths less the mean of 2014-2019. It's a bit hard to eyeball, although it's obvious that total deaths follow the covid curve pretty closely.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 17:44 |
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dwarf74 posted:I'm not sure if this is helpful for a new OP, being a few months out of date, but here's Total Deaths, All Causes, US, Weekly from a CDC/NCHS dataset I grabbed earlier this year. I put this together to respond to claims about how (a) covid isn't actually killing people, (b) it's not actually that deadly, or (c) deaths are being mislabeled as covid for nefarious reasons. That's very nice! I was going to suggest coloring the portion of the bottom curve that's 2021 a slightly different shade that 2020 to make it obvious which section is which year, but it tracks the all-cause mortality so closely it's pretty obvious already and might actually detract from readability to change it. If it's possible in your graphing software, I'd try to remove the line segment going from week 4 to week 6 since it's just an artifact. E: Is the year with the extra mortality in January-February 2018? That was a brutal flu season with almost double the typical deaths. Stickman fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Sep 10, 2021 |
# ? Sep 10, 2021 18:38 |
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Thanks, folks. Yeah, I can add excess deaths when I next grab the data set. It's a great set - but really annoying to sanitize because it uses flu season rather than year, and the sorting gets way out of whack. (Example: Week 1 of 2018-19 comes after Week 52 of same, which is great for flu but poo poo for showing spring-summer 2020 for a less-data-literate audience.) It's also got helpful columns like "flu deaths" and "all respiratory deaths combined". Or used to, last I snagged it. If you want to play with these numbers yourself, you can get them from https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/fluview/mortality.html - click Downloads and make sure you check all the boxes. It'll spit out a csv file for you. It's been a few months and has changed a few times since I started doing this, so no promises it's the same now or will be in the future.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 18:51 |
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Stickman posted:That's very nice! I was going to suggest coloring the portion of the bottom curve that's 2021 a slightly different shade that 2020 to make it obvious which section is which year, but it tracks the all-cause mortality so closely it's pretty obvious already and might actually detract from readability to change it. If it's possible in your graphing software, I'd try to remove the line segment going from week 4 to week 6 since it's just an artifact. Yeah, that's Jan-Feb 2018. I looked it up myself because it's a clear spike. That was pandemic-level for flu deaths. Part of the reason I'm not looking forward to updating this is figuring out how to cleanly display the covid deaths area plot when it starts to overlap. I played with ways to fix that weird end of data, there, but I didn't find a way I liked better than this awkward one. Thanks, though, and good suggestions.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 18:56 |
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Tayter Swift posted:Not sure if there’s room for good news but it looks like Sacramento County is getting over its spike. Hoping Placer follows suit... (lol)
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 19:09 |
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I know that the US is leading the world in awful responses to covid, particularly given the means and resources the country should have at it's disposal, but I wouldn't mind getting some contributions from folks outside the US in order to get a slightly more global perspective in the final version of the OP. If you're not sure if you have a resource that's fit for the OP I would say share it anyway and I'll try to make my best judgment as to what to include so I can thread the needle between comprehensive and less unwieldy. Thanks for all the contributions and feedback so far, it's been really great so far and I really appreciate you all keeping this thread at least at the 3 star level of quality lol
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 19:18 |
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Medullah posted:I'm trying to at least see where his POV is coming from. This stems from being against the vaccine mandate, his position being "I'm vaccinated, I want people to get vaccinated but this is worrying me because of government overreach. Every study I've read showed people who have had the virus have more antibodies than those vaccinated, so why should they be forced to vaccinate? The government refuses to even STUDY natural immunity". There are factors that go into government policy beyond just the reach of what is safe and healthy. It is financially burdensome for the government to deal with the medical costs with giving everyone natural immunity. That's putting aside the not inconsequential truth that some people are gonna die. Even if we could guarantee everyone could get COVID and come out of the hospital with more resistance than the vaccinated, that's an enormous expense compared to just giving them the vaccine. But also, the uhhhh you know the deaths... That part too.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 20:05 |
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Anywhere I can donate to help get shots in the arms in developing countries? Friend of mine is selling Joe Rogan charity tix and I told her I'd donate if she burns the tickets.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 20:18 |
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Tayter Swift posted:Anywhere I can donate to help get shots in the arms in developing countries? Friend of mine is selling Joe Rogan charity tix and I told her I'd donate if she burns the tickets. Money isn't the bottleneck here.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 20:36 |
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Professor Beetus posted:Well, it's not a certainty I can, but at this point in the name of good moderation I am asking for forgiveness rather than permission. So pretty much anything is on the table as far as I am concerned. Archives, Plat, PMs, Av/Title Change. Probably not someone else's title change, we're trying to be nice in here. So yeah, folks who got quoted can just let me know. I know a lot of cert stuff I've heard rumblings will just be free features down the line, if that affects your decision at all. I will do the best I can to make sure we have admins who can follow through; after all we had a land speed record double perma in the thread already. Can you change my name to "Covid Cures Stupid"? Yeah I'm kidding about that, but seriously an av change would be great, this one isn't even correct anymore. Gynovore fucked around with this message at 20:42 on Sep 10, 2021 |
# ? Sep 10, 2021 20:38 |
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Gynovore posted:Can you change my name to "Covid Cures Stupid"? Lol yeah if you were serious I would say shoot for the moon but I will tally all the requests up at the end of the week and once the new OP is finalized and posted with attributions, I will go ahead and make a list of names and requests for admins approval and I'll ask very nicely and see what happens.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 21:15 |
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Tayter Swift posted:Anywhere I can donate to help get shots in the arms in developing countries? Friend of mine is selling Joe Rogan charity tix and I told her I'd donate if she burns the tickets. Yes there is. So Covax is the global effort to vaccinate poor countries, and it is run jointly by three organizations: The World Health Organization (WHO), the Gavi vaccine alliance (Gavi), and the Coalition for Epidemic Preparedness Innovations (CEPI). WHO and Gavi have set up donation funds that are specific to Covid-19 (CEPI has an investment portal, which is more intended for large-scale funding). WHO is focused on medical training and advocacy efforts, whereas Gavi is focused on vaccine distribution. Here's more information about the Covax program: https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-middle-east-africa-europe-coronavirus-pandemic-5e57879c6cb22d96b942cbc973b9296c Gavi posted:In addition to our core work, Gavi launched the Gavi COVAX Advance Market Commitment (AMC) in June 2020. It’s the financing instrument that will enable people in 92 lower-income economies to access safe and effective donor-funded COVID-19 vaccines through the COVAX Facility at the same time as 98 higher-income, self-financing countries receive their doses. The more funds Gavi receives, the more people will be protected against the virus. WHO posted:WHO has launched an appeal for US$ 1.96 billion to fulfil the requirements of the 2021 Strategic Preparedness and Response plan (SPRP2021).
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 21:26 |
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Objective Action posted:Given the mechanism of action for half mask valves it should be on par with the disposables they tested for droplet blocking but may not be sufficient for aerosols. If true would mean it would've likely been enough to cut transmission on OG covid but maybe not sufficient for Delta; won't know for sure till the studies finish and we get data. I want to add that I don't have any data to suggest that their efficacy for covid source control is not analogous, but having used a lot of different EHMRs for non-covid, non-source control stuff (wood- and metalworking, yard work, painting, dealing with wildfire smoke, and so on) there are a lot of differences in e.g. the direction of the exhaled air (out the front on a 3M 620x, downward on a 3M 650x, for example), how much condensation you get around the exhaust port, and so on. I don't know that these differences would affect the efficacy in covid source control (or that if there are differences EHMRs would be worse), but at very least it seems like the basis for a reasonable concern. And for that matter the mechanism of action of exhalation valves on FFRs is not the same as on EHMRs. FFRs are made of permeable material that's part of the airway, on EHMRs the only airway in is via the inhalation valve(s) and the only airway out is via the exhalation valve(s). Again: I don't have a stack of data to suggest that this difference is significant, but it is a difference. And again: I'm not saying this to advocate for a particular course of action (or inaction), just trying to make sure the quality of information people are using to make decisions is as high as possible.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 22:20 |
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Has anyone done any modeling to figure out what spread would look like if you dropped an infectious vaccinated person into a population of vaccinated people at varying intervals from last booster? I really feel like while the vaccines don't prevent spread totally they do reduce viral load and see to be mostly-sterilzing in the months after a boost 🤔 I don't know if we know enough about how the efficacy trails off over time do make any decent models but I think it's something worth while to try to figure out.
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# ? Sep 10, 2021 23:53 |
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I think we talked about the 3M 604 source control filter for the 6100/6200/6300 a few weeks ago. I got some and tried it out. I can’t test it quantitatively, but it seems to be well-made. It makes exhalation moderately harder—less resistance than intake through OG/AG carts, more than through particulate-only filters. Not too heavy even sticking way out the front. The fit and feel of the 6200 is great on me, I like it better than the Secure Click half-mask, for one, so that’s good for me. I recognize that there are people for whom that’s not true, so it’s a shame that there are no exhalation filters made for the downward-venting models. I wear it to most places I need to go indoors, because it doesn’t bother me and it’s the considerate thing to do. No mask enforcers have asked me about it, so I have yet to see how well it goes over on that front.
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 00:29 |
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IVAC are routinely collating all the studies on vaccine effectiveness. Posting the tweet here because clicking the link will directly download the file. https://twitter.com/jakescottMD/status/1436448080736391169
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 01:01 |
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Professor Beetus posted:I know that the US is leading the world in awful responses to covid, particularly given the means and resources the country should have at it's disposal, but I wouldn't mind getting some contributions from folks outside the US in order to get a slightly more global perspective in the final version of the OP. I'm in NZ. What would you like to hear?
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 10:59 |
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Puppy Galaxy posted:pretty much everyone I know IRL who isn't an anti-vaxxer is relatively comfortable in spaces, indoor or out, where they know everyone is vaccinated. I'm in an area of New England which was never hit hard, so I think people are more relaxed here in general, but I don't know anyone who has gone back to what they were doing in mid-2020. not saying this is a good thing or a bad thing, just echoing the disconnect I see between here and elsewhere. We had been doing some stuff during the summer including a family gathering that we wouldn't have done in 2020, but scaled all that back as Delta emerged (and we have two kids < 5). We are basically back to what we were doing in mid 2020 except older kiddo is in outdoor preschool. We did not trust that last year because my wife was actually pregnant. Of course, I work from home so mostly I just don't do the one social thing a week that I had been doing consistently from 2016-2020 and instead have a regular discord video call with myriad friends, and doing grocery pickup and using masks. I think preschool, masked and outdoors, is still our highest vector for bringing COVID home. I do not like operating in this mode, but gritting our teeth and letting kiddo have some semblence of a normal childhood year isnthe decision we made. I get depressed about all this pretty regularly, but we are at present in a better situation than most people including the entire rest of my immediate family, so, not much to do except keep trudging on with the occaisional muttered "gently caress Plague World!" Our overall numbers and hospitalization here in VT are as bad or worse than ever.
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 11:39 |
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Cabbages and Kings posted:I get depressed about all this pretty regularly, but we are at present in a better situation than most people including the entire rest of my immediate family, so, not much to do except keep trudging on with the occaisional muttered "gently caress Plague World!" We’ve been exceptionally careful, at least as much as we can. I work as a 911 medic in a busy system but I have been extremely cautious w PPE from day one. I’m vaccinated. My wife has been working from home since last March. She is vaccinated. Local grandparents are all vaccinated. We’ve had no interruptions in income. We have had to have our 4yo in daycare since it reopened so we can work. She caught covid last month from an outbreak there and thankfully she had mild sniffles and nothing else. Wife and I have never tested positive and still didn’t catch it from the kid. We catch ourselves being really down about all this in spite of having it *significantly* better than the vast majority of Americans and immediately feel guilty, but I think it’s ok to feel put upon with this hell world sometimes.
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 15:13 |
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Kaal posted:Here's more information about the Covax program: https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden-middle-east-africa-europe-coronavirus-pandemic-5e57879c6cb22d96b942cbc973b9296c Thank you a ton for the link. I wound up donating to MSF before seeing this, but I'll try to send them something next paycheck.
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 15:26 |
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Weatherman posted:I'm in NZ. What would you like to hear? What's it like living in what appears to be 2062 to most of the rest of the world? But seriously, it's really up to the thread. I'm trying to compile stats/important news stories/up to date useful info for people. And a catch all anything else that might fit the needs of a thread about coronavirus. I realize most of those are subjective guidelines, but the OP is going to be more regularly updated going forward so feel free to submit anything that you think will be useful to someone reading for the first time.
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 17:23 |
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# ? May 11, 2024 11:07 |
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For some reason I can't explain, I love reading the Quora digest emails I get every day. It's always either some reasonable question that gets insane answers, or vice versa. Today I got this one, and I was wondering if this guy's numbers check out. He never provides any sources, of course, and I don't know how you'd break the death numbers by party without a lot of assumptions. quote:The USA now has 100,000 daily hospitalizations for covid-19. Why is Biden having a hard time keeping this pandemic under control and what can he do differently to fix the problem?
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# ? Sep 11, 2021 17:44 |