If only Frog could have kept WCW afloat

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > The Hammer House: Stinger Splash Zone > If only Frog could have kept WCW afloat

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Who Killed WCW?
	Eric Bischoff
	Hulk Hogan
	Vince Russo
	Jerusalem

jesus WEP: Oct 17, 2004

DJExile posted:

https://twitter.com/DeepCutsWCW/status/1435589278101295108

this is a delight, lol

fuckin mean gene was the god damned best, no-one was even close.

# ? Sep 10, 2021 00:05

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# ? May 23, 2024 04:32

Davros1: Jul 19, 2007; You've got to admit, you are kind of implausible

Luigi Thirty posted:

He�s as incoherent as Scotty but without the Sid charisma, I love this. Nobody did it better than Mean Gene, either.

Funniest thing to me is, he had held the TV title before

# ? Sep 10, 2021 00:14

Admiral Joeslop: Jul 8, 2010

jesus WEP posted:

fuckin mean gene was the god damned best, no-one was even close.

# ? Sep 10, 2021 00:19

Dawgstar: Jul 15, 2017

jesus WEP posted:

fuckin mean gene was the god damned best, no-one was even close.

There is definitely a conversation to be had about how underrated Gene and Bobby were as gets for WWF.

# ? Sep 10, 2021 01:43

SatoshiMiwa: May 6, 2007

Lid posted:

But what about the Champion of Pakistan?

Feuding with Turkish El Santo right now

# ? Sep 10, 2021 02:58

edogawa rando: Mar 20, 2007

You know, I'm actually starting to wonder if Hogan ever tried to get Raja Lion into the WWF or WCW. They already had El Gigante/Giant Gonzalez and The Yet-tay, so it's not like they gave a gently caress about match quality as long as they could get their hands on a freakishly tall lad.

# ? Sep 10, 2021 03:01

NikkolasKing: Apr 3, 2010

So, according to Bryan's account of the Michaels/Hart blow-up fight backstage, HBK wanted out of his deal with WWF and wanted to go to WCW with his buddies.

Obviously that didn't happen but what if it did? Do you think WWF would have been finished? Would it have helped WCW in any major way?

# ? Sep 12, 2021 00:03

Angry_Ed: Mar 30, 2010; Grimey Drawer

NikkolasKing posted:

So, according to Bryan's account of the Michaels/Hart blow-up fight backstage, HBK wanted out of his deal with WWF and wanted to go to WCW with his buddies.

Obviously that didn't happen but what if it did? Do you think WWF would have been finished? Would it have helped WCW in any major way?

I don't think WCW benefits from having another out-of-control ego on top of Nash and Hogan, at least not long-term.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 00:37

SatoshiMiwa: May 6, 2007

NikkolasKing posted:

So, according to Bryan's account of the Michaels/Hart blow-up fight backstage, HBK wanted out of his deal with WWF and wanted to go to WCW with his buddies.

Obviously that didn't happen but what if it did? Do you think WWF would have been finished? Would it have helped WCW in any major way?

WCW gets some monster ratings at first but Micheals backstage speeds up the backstage fighting and causes Nash/Hogan to split apart much quicker. Also the drug culture probably sends Shawn going out of control a lot more

WWF wouldn't be finished as Bret/Austin was turning around house show business and TV but than we probably don't get McMahon/Austin and I'm not sure Austin gets as big without that feud

# ? Sep 12, 2021 00:43

Lid: Feb 18, 2005; And the mercy seat is awaiting,
And I think my head is burning,
And in a way I'm yearning,
To be done with all this measuring of proof.
An eye for an eye
And a tooth for a tooth,
And anyway I told the truth,
And I'm not afraid to die.

not to mention that WCW's steroid policy was even more lax than WWF's, which was still very lax but Vince tried to keep it lower because of the steroid trials, and the thought of uninhibited roided up Shawn Michaels is a depressing one

# ? Sep 12, 2021 00:52

MassRafTer: May 26, 2001; BAEST MODE!!!

Shawn's ego creates a perfect equilibrium with all of the other massive egos in the promotion and WCW lives forever.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 00:55

SatoshiMiwa: May 6, 2007

MassRafTer posted:

Shawn's ego creates a perfect equilibrium with all of the other massive egos in the promotion and WCW lives forever.

Just imagine Sting/Hogan at Starrcade 97 being Hogan/Shawn

# ? Sep 12, 2021 00:56

edogawa rando: Mar 20, 2007

NikkolasKing posted:

So, according to Bryan's account of the Michaels/Hart blow-up fight backstage, HBK wanted out of his deal with WWF and wanted to go to WCW with his buddies.

Obviously that didn't happen but what if it did? Do you think WWF would have been finished? Would it have helped WCW in any major way?

I remember this discussion coming up before, perhaps in another thread, but my view is

On the WWF end:

1. The Mr McMahon character, or a variation of it, like "WWF President" Gorilla Monsoon or Commissioner Slaughter joining with the Hart Foundation to "clean up the WWF."
2. The Harts replace D-X in the build to WMXIV. Bret wins the WWF title at SummerSlam off of Taker, the Harts and Taker feud through to Survivor Series (maybe a Bret vs. Shamrock programme for the last couple of PPVs?). Austin finally gets his win from Bret in the Mania main event, bringing the rivalry that starts at Survivor Series 1996 full circle.
3. Because Davey Boy never leaves, he doesn't suffer the back injury he would get thanks to Warrior being a weirdo shithead magic man in WCW.
4. Because Bret never leaves, Owen is backed by his family members to push back against doing the Over the Edge stunt.

On the WCW end:
1. Michaels immediately gets put into the nWo. Pretty much a no-brainer
2. The Kliq lads and Hogan probably end up being at odds.
3. Michaels, as a talent, is completely squandered in WCW

# ? Sep 12, 2021 01:09

BrigadierSensible: Feb 16, 2012; I've got a pocket full of cheese🧀, and a garden full of trees🌴.

I am thinking that Shawn becomes like Bret in WCW.

Wasted, under-used, and sleepwalking through the motions to get an over-inflated pay check.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 01:11

TheKingslayer: Sep 3, 2008

I don't feel like Shawn could handle being second or third fiddle in the nWo and that would be a nightmare. I just don't think he and Nash could politic around Bischoff and his boner for Hogan.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 01:18

edogawa rando: Mar 20, 2007

BrigadierSensible posted:

I am thinking that Shawn becomes like Bret in WCW.

Wasted, under-used, and sleepwalking through the motions to get an over-inflated pay check.

Yeah, it's easy to think about all the matches he could have had in WCW - HBK vs Rey before he was broken down! HBK vs Eddy! HBK vs Ultimo Dragon! HBK vs Benoit! HBK vs a less worn-down Flair! HBK vs Macho Man! HBK vs DDP! etc. etc., but you also can't dismiss just how efficient WCW was in squandering the talent that they had on their books.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 01:32

Maxwell Lord: Dec 12, 2008; I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.; Grimey Drawer

Not to mention yeah, WCW's culture just wore people out quickly. Shawn mighta ended up like Hennig or Luger, just already broken down before 2000.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 01:36

Lid: Feb 18, 2005; And the mercy seat is awaiting,
And I think my head is burning,
And in a way I'm yearning,
To be done with all this measuring of proof.
An eye for an eye
And a tooth for a tooth,
And anyway I told the truth,
And I'm not afraid to die.

Maxwell Lord posted:

Not to mention yeah, WCW's culture just wore people out quickly. Shawn mighta ended up like Hennig or Luger, just already broken down before 2000.

I was thinking Randy Savage, from lithe ultra-athletic out of this world seller to jacked up beefcake that can barely move with everything shot

# ? Sep 12, 2021 01:41

disaster pastor: May 1, 2007

NikkolasKing posted:

So, according to Bryan's account of the Michaels/Hart blow-up fight backstage, HBK wanted out of his deal with WWF and wanted to go to WCW with his buddies.

Obviously that didn't happen but what if it did? Do you think WWF would have been finished? Would it have helped WCW in any major way?

disaster pastor posted:

Forget the politicking, he probably would have been dead in 6�12 months.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 12:34

Dawgstar: Jul 15, 2017

I always remember the ICP saying that WCW was the first time they saw somebody use somas. Shawn in that scene with unchecked somas and steroids and God knows what else, he might be dead if he jumped.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 15:11

SatoshiMiwa: May 6, 2007

He would of 100% been on harder drugs as WWE I think for testing them at the time (which is why Shawn went onto sleeping pills as those didn't show up on tests) so yeah he would of been a worse Scott Hall or dead

# ? Sep 12, 2021 17:35

Hammond Egger: Feb 20, 2011; by the sex ghost

I'm struggling to imagine what Shawn Michaels without his WWE trademarked name, moniker and theme music would even look like. Something like a Renegade version of his former self?

# ? Sep 12, 2021 21:50

DeathChicken: Jul 9, 2012; Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Heartbreaker debuting with a Jimmy Hart version of his theme, I imagine

# ? Sep 12, 2021 21:54

Q7kid: Jul 24, 2009

Saul Goode posted:

I'm struggling to imagine what Shawn Michaels without his WWE trademarked name, moniker and theme music would even look like. Something like a Renegade version of his former self?

He used "Shawn Michaels" outside WWE, and WCW would have given him an acceptable Jimmy Hart knockoff theme. He would've been fine.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 21:57

SatoshiMiwa: May 6, 2007

Saul Goode posted:

I'm struggling to imagine what Shawn Michaels without his WWE trademarked name, moniker and theme music would even look like. Something like a Renegade version of his former self?

Shawn used his name in the AWA so WWE wouldn't be able to stop him from using it in WCW.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 21:58

Hammond Egger: Feb 20, 2011; by the sex ghost

I could have sworn I read somewhere back in the 90s that they had ownership of it and that was one theory behind why he hadn't really tried to jump ship when he could have. Long time ago though, either my memory or the thing I read could be full of poo poo lol.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 22:03

Maigius: Jun 29, 2013

Q7kid posted:

He used "Shawn Michaels" outside WWE, and WCW would have given him an acceptable Jimmy Hart knockoff theme. He would've been fine.

Of Sexy Boy or Heartbreaker by Led Zeppelin?

# ? Sep 12, 2021 22:10

LividLiquid: Apr 13, 2002

Saul Goode posted:

I could have sworn I read somewhere back in the 90s that they had ownership of it and that was one theory behind why he hadn't really tried to jump ship when he could have. Long time ago though, either my memory or the thing I read could be full of poo poo lol.

They owned Diesel, Razor, and 1-2-3, and all those fellas became way bigger stars without them, so even if he couldn't use it, he would've come up with something besides Hickenbottom, probably, and would've been fine.

Until he died of an overdose, anyway.

# ? Sep 12, 2021 23:39

Claytor: Dec 5, 2011

SatoshiMiwa posted:

He would of 100% been on harder drugs as WWE I think for testing them at the time (which is why Shawn went onto sleeping pills as those didn't show up on tests) so yeah he would of been a worse Scott Hall or dead

He wasn't even a draw in the nineties, so Michaels is probably all downside for WCW.

# ? Sep 13, 2021 00:59

Rusty Shackelford: Feb 7, 2005

Maigius posted:

Of Sexy Boy or Heartbreaker by Led Zeppelin?

Pat Benatar.

# ? Sep 13, 2021 01:06

MassRafTer: May 26, 2001; BAEST MODE!!!

Claytor posted:

He wasn't even a draw in the nineties, so Michaels is probably all downside for WCW.

Michaels was big with certain younger demos WCW struggled with so he might have helped WCW. He was death with adult men, but I doubt they would have changed the channel since WCW was so strong with that age group overall. Would have definitely hurt WWF's house show business in 96 to lose him.

# ? Sep 13, 2021 01:16

rujasu: Dec 19, 2013

Maigius posted:

Of Sexy Boy or Heartbreaker by Led Zeppelin?

HEART-Break Kid (Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo)

Let's be real though. There were only two themes he might have had. The nWo theme, or the nWo Wolfpack theme.

# ? Sep 13, 2021 01:19

DJExile: Jun 28, 2007

https://twitter.com/DeepCutsWCW/status/1437485275400359936

lmao god Regal owns

# ? Sep 13, 2021 19:37

Conrad_Birdie: Jul 10, 2009; I WAS THERE
WHEN CODY RHODES
FINISHED THE STORY

Incredible

# ? Sep 13, 2021 20:27

Lid: Feb 18, 2005; And the mercy seat is awaiting,
And I think my head is burning,
And in a way I'm yearning,
To be done with all this measuring of proof.
An eye for an eye
And a tooth for a tooth,
And anyway I told the truth,
And I'm not afraid to die.

https://twitter.com/DeepCutsWCW/status/1437570695756718086?s=19

Late era Evan push was very odd.

# ? Sep 14, 2021 09:04

TheKingslayer: Sep 3, 2008

This is probably the best thread for it, I'm watching a Shotgun Saturday Night match, Brian Christopher vs David Jericho. Is this a petty shot naming a jobber after Chris Jericho or a coincidence?

# ? Sep 14, 2021 11:42

disaster pastor: May 1, 2007

TheKingslayer posted:

This is probably the best thread for it, I'm watching a Shotgun Saturday Night match, Brian Christopher vs David Jericho. Is this a petty shot naming a jobber after Chris Jericho or a coincidence?

Coincidence. He'd been David Jericho since 1995. Though he became much more famous once he changed his ring name to "Kid Kash."

# ? Sep 14, 2021 12:25

DJExile: Jun 28, 2007

https://twitter.com/deepcutswcw/status/1437752749811240964?s=21

# ? Sep 14, 2021 13:32

Ganso Bomb: Oct 24, 2005; turn it all around

Lid posted:

https://twitter.com/DeepCutsWCW/status/1437570695756718086?s=19

Late era Evan push was very odd.

Iaukea is a bit at fault here too. Looks like he pushes Evan a bit too hard on the whip and also gets in his way - kind of looks like Evan trips on Iaukea's let because he wasn't in his own lane.

The Iaukea pushes were also odd.

# ? Sep 14, 2021 13:52

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# ? May 23, 2024 04:32

DJExile: Jun 28, 2007

disaster pastor posted:

Coincidence. He'd been David Jericho since 1995. Though he became much more famous once he changed his ring name to "Kid Kash."

oh poo poo THAT'S who that was? I'll be damned.

# ? Sep 14, 2021 14:00

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > The Hammer House: Stinger Splash Zone > If only Frog could have kept WCW afloat

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