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I mean the movie is already self indulgent so might as well go all in
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Oct 2, 2021 22:00
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I don't understand what david chase's problem is with respect to TV. I'm hard pressed to say not only how being a movie benefited this project at all, but also what david chase imagined the benefits would be
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Oct 2, 2021 22:16
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Not gonna lie, got a little caught up when Gandolfini’s kid says “I missed you dad” when he hugged Berenthal. E: Everyones saying that was Jackie Tony’s fighting with at the phone booth, but I thought Jackie was the kid with light hair in the ice cream truck. The way he called Tony “Joe jerkoff” I figured it was Tony B. Another thing that hosed me up was the old guy who brought the phone to Joey Diaz at the wedding played one of the kids in Bronx Tale. E2: now that I’m thinking about it I guess this exonerates the cop Christopher killed. ruddiger fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Oct 2, 2021 |
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Oct 2, 2021 22:27
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No Mods No Masters posted:I don't understand what david chase's problem is with respect to TV. I'm hard pressed to say not only how being a movie benefited this project at all, but also what david chase imagined the benefits would be Who said he had a problem with TV? Or do you mean his bitching about people streaming the movie instead of going to a theater?
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Oct 2, 2021 23:03
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Refer to discussion on the previous page.Escobarbarian posted:Apparently Chase was insistent not just that this be a movie but that it be 2 hours or less, which…..might have worked better had he not made it so sprawling lol
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Oct 2, 2021 23:09
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A movie is still seen as more prestigious than TV. Especially one with a theatrical release
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Oct 2, 2021 23:09
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Source.quote:Though Many Saints contains enough characters and stories to fill a three-hour-plus version — if not a season of prestige television — Chase was determined that the final cut be two hours or less, “just to keep the drive going.” While this necessarily doesn’t read like Chase has an anti-TV sentiment, the choice to make this a feature despite there being more than enough material for a miniseries is a reminder that films were his first love and what he always wanted to make, even to the point of hoping the Sopranos pilot wouldn’t get picked up so he could shoot extra footage to finish off the story and submit it to Cannes. CharlestheHammer posted:A movie is still seen as more prestigious than TV. Especially one with a theatrical release I think Chase is still stuck in this mindset.
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Oct 2, 2021 23:13
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CharlestheHammer posted:A movie is still seen as more prestigious than TV. Especially one with a theatrical release I mean I will take david chase's vanity as an answer I suppose, but still that's not really something that actually manifests in any benefit for the end product
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Oct 2, 2021 23:13
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CharlestheHammer posted:A movie is still seen as more prestigious than TV. Especially one with a theatrical release So was it just the ego trip of having a Sopranos movie in cinemas? I'd have thought HBO would've been begging him for a six episode series.
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Oct 2, 2021 23:14
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CharlestheHammer posted:A movie is still seen as more prestigious than TV. Especially one with a theatrical release That's changing a lot though. More and more people don't give a poo poo and a lot of them prefer the comfort and convenience of watching stuff at home. They also don't get crushed at the concession stand
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Oct 2, 2021 23:19
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David chase is 76 years old, you would think the hollywood respect chasing impulse would be on the wane. But I suppose in that cohort it's never going to die
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Oct 2, 2021 23:27
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I liked the movie, but I think in terms of "long revived beloved tv series gets a movie", Deadwood a couple years ago was better. But they got the bonus of bringing everyone back except Powers Boothe.
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Oct 2, 2021 23:39
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Nothing wrong with fan service. Other than Silvio, I feel like the performances were solid which helped.
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Oct 3, 2021 05:34
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The Harold arc is way too shallow. Gangsters in The Sopranos are always shown to be petty murderous buffoons, but the movie seems to view Harold as kind-of an underdog hero even though he is a murderer and parasite. At least that was my read. I feel a lot is missing here. I wonder how it would have been different if he were given half a miniseries rather than a third of a movie.
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Oct 3, 2021 06:50
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PostNouveau posted:I don't read the prison scenes with Sally as all in Dickie's head because Dickie doesn't know they had Jews in the Middle Ages but Sally gives him a basic outline on Buddhism. Hard to think that Dickie doesn't even know super basic poo poo about his own religion but would have an understanding of a religion he'd likely never have come into contact with Tony hallucinates Isabella, who speaks perfect Italian and knows random obscure facts about italy, and sits down at a restaurant with her. It's admittedly a little more in-depth about Buddhism but it does seem like an interesting theory. The guy immediately talks about being in jail for killing a made guy in his own family at 25, and how he deserves to be here. It's probably intentionally open-ended, if it's a thing at all. Junior making a negative comment about Tony being an athlete and then hurting his back makes dementia Junior's obsession with it seem more poignant. He doesn't really seem suited for mob life and somehow ends up in it anyway. I think I had some dread when Van Morrison started playing and realized later it was because Christopher and Tony Blundetto both die right after he plays. Smh...Irish mob...
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Oct 3, 2021 08:07
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Still sitting with this one. I definitely don’t think it detracts from the Sopranos at all and probably adds a little something to it but there’s some real highs and lows in the film. Alessandro Nivola is a fantastic lead, he gives you just enough charisma to draw you in before horrifying you. Michael Gandolfini also impressed. In his first couple scenes I was a little concerned but he really showed his chops by the end. I would totally be down for him to take the lead in another film about Tony. My only real big glaring issue I can’t get over is the revelation that Junior hit Dickie is so barely possibly foreshadowed that it feels like a gag. Juniors barely in the film. If you don’t have any knowledge of Junior it must be completely baffling. I actually quite like the idea that Junior killed Dickie, both over spite and possibly to help clear the way for his advancement within the Mob, but that’s really only something someone who is familiar with the show could piece together. The Paulie, Silvio, Pussy stuff was awful. It felt like SNL impressions of the characters. Would have been better to not show up at all. Jon Bernthal is great as Johnny in a relatively small part, but it’s a very different Johnny Boy from the series. This Johnny is much more rough around the edges, almost animalistic, which is interesting. Which is the real Johnny?
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Oct 3, 2021 08:34
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indiscriminately posted:The Harold arc is way too shallow. Gangsters in The Sopranos are always shown to be petty murderous buffoons, but the movie seems to view Harold as kind-of an underdog hero even though he is a murderer and parasite. At least that was my read. I feel a lot is missing here. I wonder how it would have been different if he were given half a miniseries rather than a third of a movie. Yeah this was the worst part of the movie. As a whole I thought it was pretty mediocre but fine, but Harold was so underdeveloped it was sort of baffling that the movie thought I was going to be rooting for him. Like, they try to get you on his side via a bunch of screen time that involves racial injustice (that tbh was mostly a waste because they did nothing interesting with it. it was all just a shallow prop to set up Harold). But he is this huge piece of poo poo that murders kids because of his bruised ego, forcibly drags his friends who want nothing to do with it into his bullshit and gets them murdered, goes on a killing spree of mafia dudes who are fine with him for his own personal gain...Which is all fine and dandy in Sopranos world. But then it just feels like the movie sends this message at the end that I am supposed to be happy that everything worked out for Harold after he did nothing but gently caress over literally everyone in his general vicinity. If it was the first episode of a show. If it was setting up a character I was going to see more of... it would be fine. But it was a movie and presumedly this is the end so it was weird to end it on that note. Really felt like the movie wants you to go "nice the anithero came out unscathed", but he really wasn't an antihero he was just straight up an awful dude.
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Oct 3, 2021 08:44
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Mike N Eich posted:My only real big glaring issue I can’t get over is the revelation that Junior hit Dickie is so barely possibly foreshadowed that it feels like a gag. Juniors barely in the film. If you don’t have any knowledge of Junior it must be completely baffling. I actually quite like the idea that Junior killed Dickie, both over spite and possibly to help clear the way for his advancement within the Mob, but that’s really only something someone who is familiar with the show could piece together. I feel like that goes for most of the movie. The only way to know for sure is to ask someone who's never heard of The Sopranos before watching the film (I'm sure there are plenty who just put on the new HBO gangster flick without looking at what it actually was) but I feel like it would be utterly incomprehensible to a newcomer. So much of it is referential, and other than Dickie and Harold's groups all of the characters rely on the development and familiarity they built up in the show. Junior killing Dickie would surely make sense to anyone who saw season one of the show though. Looking back I can't believe they went with Chris narrating from beyond the grave. It's such a bizarre choice and so out of kilter with the tone of both the show and movie. That opening shot of the cemetery looked incredibly cheap too. If they really needed a framing device then someone like Paulie or even Sil (assuming he ever came out of his coma) would have made more sense - they could have been reminiscing about the good old days. Or even Junior - still rotting away in some hole with barely a thread of memory left - would make sense given the ending.
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Oct 3, 2021 12:04
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I think I heard as well as the cut Edie Falco scene, they had a version with Paulie as the opening as well. I disagree with you tbh, since this version of the film ended up being the Dickie story, Christopher narrating was the only one that made sense. Maybe earlier drafts were more of an ensemble. Like Edie Falco would be bizarre to open the film since we only see young Carmela once.
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Oct 3, 2021 12:16
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stev posted:Or even Junior - still rotting away in some hole with barely a thread of memory left - would make sense given the ending. The Father but it's about Junior. Tony switches between being played by Robert Iler, Jon Bernthal, and Michael Gandolfini, and Dickie switches between Michael Imperioli and Alessandro Nivola. Half the scenes end with Junior asking the nearest woman where Bobby is. Dominic Chianese awkwardly wins an Oscar over a beloved actor who died, and is not able to attend the ceremony.
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Oct 3, 2021 13:07
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Annabel Pee posted:I think I heard as well as the cut Edie Falco scene, they had a version with Paulie as the opening as well. This is true. Chase clearly really struggled with how to open this film
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Oct 3, 2021 13:12
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Another odd thing strangely omitted from the film : I guess Dickie wasn’t an addict after all? A pivotal scene in the Sopranos is when Christopher reveals to Tony that his father was just another junkie like him, which doesn’t appear to be the case at all. Unless we’re talking about an addiction to murderous rages.
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Oct 3, 2021 15:27
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I realize now that Many Saints looks and feels like the last season or two of Boardwalk Empire, moreso than any Sopranos season. That gunfight outside the restaurant, when that guy's head explodes, that's straight up BE style violence. That's a huge glaring plot hole to me. Harold's crew lights up the mobsters, killing two. But in this world where firing at a made guy is an automatic death, Harold still walks free. They were gearing up to get Harold, but then Dickie dies, and the hunt stops. Who do they think killed Dickie?
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Oct 3, 2021 16:23
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Mike N Eich posted:Another odd thing strangely omitted from the film : I guess Dickie wasn’t an addict after all? A pivotal scene in the Sopranos is when Christopher reveals to Tony that his father was just another junkie like him, which doesn’t appear to be the case at all. He had the pills for livia in his pockets when he died, and livia ably the funeral started gossiping about it while the body was still warm. Most likely the rumor grew out of thay
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Oct 3, 2021 16:25
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ProperCoochie posted:I realize now that Many Saints looks and feels like the last season or two of Boardwalk Empire, moreso than any Sopranos season. Yeah I thought for sure he was a dead man walking until the post credit. Hell even during that I was waiting for him to get lit up.
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Oct 3, 2021 16:27
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The movie would be easier to evaluate positively if we knew that Chase's ambition is to kick-off further story with some of these same characters in this same era. If he wants to be equivocal about it that's his right but then you have to look at the movie as a singular/concluding work. It's got some great moments but also obvious & disappointing structural problems. Reminds me of the lopsidedness of the X-Files revival seasons.
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Oct 3, 2021 19:49
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Annabel Pee posted:
I get that, and I don't think incorporating Christopher was in itself a bad idea - but having him explicitly be a ghost retelling events that he wasn't present for and didn't know about felt really odd. Especially when he's quipping about how Tony killed him and how he's in hell. They could easily have had him recapping events from a point before he died since he's not on screen anyway. He could even have gotten details wrong about how Dickie was killed and had a whole unreliable narrator thing going on.
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Oct 3, 2021 19:52
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My first thought hearing the ghostly Christopher voiceover, 5 seconds into a 2 hour movie: "oh no..."
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Oct 3, 2021 20:08
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I mean couldn’t they just have a character in the movie narrate? I don’t think having a returning cast member actually adds anything other than, I know that character
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Oct 3, 2021 20:27
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It’s funny because I couldn’t hear him at all, the mixing was really bad in that opening boat scene.
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Oct 3, 2021 20:27
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Christopher doesn’t even narrate that much, so it’s jarring when it comes up. Why does he need to say the part about Johnny moving to the suburbs? No other way to introduce that information? Random, but my favorite line of the movie: tony: “ah cool man, a hamburger” the delivery kills me. VladimirLeninpest fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Oct 3, 2021 |
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Oct 3, 2021 20:33
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Years from now maybe it'll go down as this decade's Blade Runner narration and it'll be fixed one day. ruddiger posted:It’s funny because I couldn’t hear him at all, the mixing was really bad in that opening boat scene. That part was OK for me but some scenes had real audio issues. The one that jumps out is the kitchen scene with the big sausage - there's a long shot that sounds like it was filmed in a huge echoey hallway.
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Oct 3, 2021 20:41
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VladimirLeninpest posted:Christopher doesn’t even narrate that much, so it’s jarring when it comes up. Why does he need to say the part about Johnny moving to the suburbs? No other way to introduce that information? Yeah, he talks like what, 3 or 4 times? Insane decision, I really want to see how bad the carmella/paulie options were that this is what they ended up going with
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Oct 3, 2021 20:48
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I’m pretty sure it is just there to get a character you know in there in a form you know
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Oct 3, 2021 21:25
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Speaking of sound, the scene with Tony talking to Dickie about the pills at the funeral with them standing under the umbrella, every time Tony spoke the audio of the rain came in and out with his lines pretty jarringly to the point it was hard to hear what he was saying. It was pretty terrible. Did they have no time for ADR on this or something?
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Oct 3, 2021 21:32
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Mike N Eich posted:
Series Johnny Boy is from Tony's memory - and other than a few moments of clarity that quickly fade - Tony's memory is one of adoration and respect, so we see him played with bravado, charm, and as a victim of a maniac mother. I assume the POV for the movie is the ghost of Christopher who relays the story with the omnipotence of the afterlife. (Unless we consider he pieces it together from stories he was told after the fact, which wouldn't make any sense with several scenes)
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Oct 3, 2021 21:41
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they should do a movie narrated by ghost paulie. paranormal spooky poo poo.
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Oct 3, 2021 22:09
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Johnny Boy firing a pistol at Livia's beehive point-blank in a car should have deafened her, no? The sudden cut-to-black ending of the show with the (ambiguous) implication that Tony has died and is no more is undercut by there being a ghostly Christopher, an all-knowing conscious raconteur, with personality, e.g. still inclined to malapropism. Tony's ghost is somewhere out there too whining to himself in self-pity. His chronicle continues.
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Oct 3, 2021 22:19
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indiscriminately posted:Johnny Boy firing a pistol at Livia's beehive point-blank in a car should have deafened her, no? It would have deafened everyone in the car and done a lot more to her. Theres a reason you dont even shoot blanks that close to someones head. The Chris narration was so awkward. Like he just pops in here and there to poo poo on Tony then leaves. If you've seen the show you know his feelings about him and what happened already and if you haven't seen it its just pointlessly making GBS threads on this kid who the movie mostly isn't even about.
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Oct 3, 2021 22:27
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I've fired a shotgun from inside a car and the hearing loss was only for a couple minutes.
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Oct 3, 2021 22:36
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