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Weka posted:That's a bit rich for a guy who loves to defend the ERE. I believe you'll find those were Romans. 
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Oct 24, 2021 07:42
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ulmont posted:These guys absolutely used rabbit glue in their replicas and wrote a book about the whole thing: https://jhupress.wordpress.com/2013/04/24/unraveling-the-linothorax-mystery-or-how-linen-armor-came-to-dominate-our-lives/ Okay, that sounds rad as hell. quote:While we subjected our laminated linen patches to hundreds of carefully measured arrow tests, we also engaged in some less scientific testing of their durability. Greg’s students enthusiastically stabbed, hacked, slashed, and pounded them with various maces, axes, spears, and swords, helping us to demonstrate what kind of protection laminated linen armor would have provided. While all of this mayhem (both scientifically controlled and free-form) convinced us that our linothorax was ancient-battlefield-ready, we still felt compelled to try a real-life scenario, so Scott donned the armor and Greg shot him. And while we had confidence in our armor, our relief was still considerable when the arrowhead stuck and lodged in the armor’s outer layers, a safe distance away from flesh.
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Oct 24, 2021 13:13
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Really is amazing how much effort went into things like 'having clothes to wear' before industrialisation.
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Oct 24, 2021 14:05
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Bar Ran Dun posted:This cannot be stressed enough, the methods range from very gross to literally the grossest smelling thing in the planet. Please do not underestimate the grossness of making leather: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmN_2VXY23M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fr5OZbF0XyA I was looking for a documentary about the tanners area in London who used human excrement and urine that ultimately was flushed into the Thames, but couldn't find it.
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Oct 24, 2021 14:38
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The real wild part is wondering how people figured these methods out.
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Oct 24, 2021 17:17
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The real wild part is wondering how people figured these methods out. Probably by getting piss and poo poo on their poorly-tanned leather and discovering that it was improved by it. There wasn't any organized research, it was just trial-and-error incremental improvements over thousands of years. I'm sure some of their recipes included irrelevant stuff that they didn't realize made no difference.
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Oct 24, 2021 17:28
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There must have been some incentive for paleolithic hunter gatherers to make animal hides last longer and stay soft. Perhaps "try pissing on it" is a sensible natural urge that civilization has sadly beaten out of us.
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Oct 24, 2021 17:36
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Do you guys not piss on all your clothes?
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Oct 24, 2021 17:38
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Grand Fromage posted:Do you guys not piss on all your clothes? The Romans washed their clothes in urine on the regular. It's an effective stain remover (once it's a couple days old and decomposing into ammonia).
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Oct 24, 2021 17:42
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The real wild part is wondering how people figured these methods out. Vegetable tanning is pretty obvious to suss out and was almost certainly the first process discovered.
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Oct 24, 2021 18:30
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Half of protochemistry is piss. And the other half is yeast
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Oct 24, 2021 19:22
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Didn't alchemists try to make gold or the Philosopher's Stone from urine? On an unrelated note, something I'm trying to find: what's that ancient Egyptian drawing of a foreign queen who's really fat and weirdly proportioned? I remember there's some controversy about whether this was an accurate illustration, perhaps of someone with a medical condition such as elephantiasis, or a political caricature.
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Oct 24, 2021 19:37
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The real wild part is wondering how people figured these methods out. Cheese is another one of those "someone definitely tasted the curdled milk in a still-nursing calf/goat/lamb gut" things.
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Oct 24, 2021 19:41
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ScienceSeagull posted:Didn't alchemists try to make gold or the Philosopher's Stone from urine? It's how we first isolated phosphorus! Dude tried to refine massive quantities of piss.
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Oct 24, 2021 19:44
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ScienceSeagull posted:On an unrelated note, something I'm trying to find: what's that ancient Egyptian drawing of a foreign queen who's really fat and weirdly proportioned? I remember there's some controversy about whether this was an accurate illustration, perhaps of someone with a medical condition such as elephantiasis, or a political caricature. It’s the Queen of Punt on the temple of Hatshepsut at Deir el Bahri 
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Oct 24, 2021 19:47
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Thanks! And is it likely a caricature? Definitely looks quite different from the more standardized style of Egyptian art. I'm imagining a distant future where for some reason no photographs survive, and the only visuals we have of important figures are political cartoons.
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Oct 24, 2021 19:49
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drat as historian Hella Jeff noted, she's RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPED Or yeah looks more like fat to me. Were they ever known to caricature anyone else though? I know foreigners would get stereotypical features so you knew exactly who had been defeated/was sending tribute. But that is a generalisation, almost the opposite of exaggerating a specific person... Strategic Tea fucked around with this message at 19:55 on Oct 24, 2021 |
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Oct 24, 2021 19:52
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FAUXTON posted:Cheese is another one of those "someone definitely tasted the curdled milk in a still-nursing calf/goat/lamb gut" things. Probably, the stomach contents of animals is a somewhat common food source.
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Oct 24, 2021 20:04
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Didn’t the Egyptians actually write down that the “Puntese” rulers kept their women fat as a status symbol? I swear I read that somewhere.
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Oct 24, 2021 20:13
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Grand Fromage posted:Do you guys not piss on all your clothes?
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Oct 24, 2021 22:42
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Grand Fromage posted:Do you guys not piss on all your clothes? I have cats for that.
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Oct 25, 2021 03:36
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Piss is big business. I think Vespasian tried to tax piss at one point but I forget if it worked out.
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Oct 25, 2021 03:58
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Jamwad Hilder posted:Piss is big business. I think Vespasian tried to tax piss at one point but I forget if it worked out. "money doesn't stink"
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Oct 25, 2021 04:17
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WoodrowSkillson posted:"money doesn't stink" I always imagine Vespasian having big Dad Joke energy.
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Oct 25, 2021 04:53
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My favorite tanning method is to rub fresh dog poo poo on the hide then wash it off in 5 minutes. It makes the hide super absorbent, so you can get your tanning chemicals in to it easier. You can really see the effect, it goes super spongy. Grand Fromage posted:I believe you'll find those were Romans. Of course. Greek Romans.
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Oct 25, 2021 09:01
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were romans? They only wore togas during a full moon?
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Oct 25, 2021 09:18
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 Dang this guy loved the linothorax so much he's wearing it under his jacket.
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Oct 25, 2021 09:18
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The real wild part is wondering how people figured these methods out. I work reconstruction iron/viking age interpretation, and just had a gig for the last week doing a viking market aid station, and when explaining the various antiseptic stuff we had like sloe thorns and linden honey, the number one question from guests in return was always "How did they figure it out?" It comes down to absurd amounts of trial and error, really. Also, if all you do all day is work/farm/treat people, you have a lot of idle headspace to think about what would work better. It's come to the point where researchers now think that people in the middle ages had both better concentration ability and memory than we have now. It makes sense to me, considering feud culture and family as organizational unit, you always had to know exactly who were related to any given person you met and disagreed with, because if you cheat or kill someone, the strength of their combined relatives and allies was information that could save your own family. E: Also, no mass culture tailored for passive consumption. Netflix and HBO has gotta choked a couple budding geniuses out there.
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Oct 25, 2021 11:35
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Tias posted:It's come to the point where researchers now think that people in the middle ages had both better concentration ability and memory than we have now. It makes sense to me, considering feud culture and family as organizational unit, you always had to know exactly who were related to any given person you met and disagreed with, because if you cheat or kill someone, the strength of their combined relatives and allies was information that could save your own family. Yeah pretty much. Odin’s first piece of advice to man at large in the Havamal is “whenever you enter a room, figure out where all the exits are, it might save your life.” Literally the next 80 stanzas are about how to behave around other men so you don’t get an axe in the guts, before he moves onto the next important topic, how women are whores and you can’t trust them.
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Oct 25, 2021 14:21
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skasion posted:Odin’s first piece of advice to man at large in the Havamal is “whenever you enter a room, figure out where all the exits are, it might save your life.” That sounds surprisingly like the sigma-male life advice bullshit that's peddled to gullible man-children on YouTube
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Oct 25, 2021 15:49
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Tias posted:Yaargh, hold up. ST is extremely cool and good, it's a premier source on all things saga-related and I cannot recommend it enough - but sagas are almost never reliable sources! This saga brief draws primarily on Kormakssaga, and so is heavily , though not completely, based in fiction. I know the sagas have all sorts of fiction blended in, but - well, you know this era better than me, what's a better source for this than the sagas?
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Oct 25, 2021 15:56
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I listened to some episodes and they're pretty clear that sagas are for the most part works of fiction.
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Oct 25, 2021 16:11
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Warden posted:That sounds surprisingly like the sigma-male life advice bullshit that's peddled to gullible man-children on YouTube Or Hesiod, for that matter
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Oct 25, 2021 16:22
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Warden posted:That sounds surprisingly like the sigma-male life advice bullshit that's peddled to gullible man-children on YouTube has odin just been trying to sell protein shakes this whole time???
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Oct 25, 2021 16:35
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Speaking of sigma males and protein shakes, did ancients have some hilarious bro science how to get massive gains?
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Oct 25, 2021 19:05
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Fish of hemp posted:Speaking of sigma males and protein shakes, did ancients have some hilarious bro science how to get massive gains? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_soup "it was no great thing for the Spartans to seek death in the wars in order to escape so many hardships and such a wretched life as theirs." Not strictly gains in the biological sense but same social role of "nasty culinary ritual to signal gender and social performance"
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Oct 25, 2021 19:14
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This is kinda a shot in the dark, but I'm at a dead end and don't know my ancient history quite as well as I should: I've read references of other Jesus like figures in the Near East popping up with some regularity around the turn of the millennium, so much so there was almost a checklist of miracles that prospective divines went through to prove their divinity. Does anyone know of a monograph or article that describes this -- and maybe who these other people were -- in depth? Curiosity has been gnawing at me.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:12
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BUG JUG posted:This is kinda a shot in the dark, but I'm at a dead end and don't know my ancient history quite as well as I should: I've read references of other Jesus like figures in the Near East popping up with some regularity around the turn of the millennium, so much so there was almost a checklist of miracles that prospective divines went through to prove their divinity. Does anyone know of a monograph or article that describes this -- and maybe who these other people were -- in depth? Curiosity has been gnawing at me. Apollonius of Tyana is the one I've seen mentioned in the past.
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Oct 25, 2021 20:56
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skasion posted:Yeah pretty much. Odin’s first piece of advice to man at large in the Havamal is “whenever you enter a room, figure out where all the exits are, it might save your life.” Literally the next 80 stanzas are about how to behave around other men so you don’t get an axe in the guts, before he moves onto the next important topic, how women are whores and you can’t trust them. Seems to be a bit rich for Odin to be saying that.
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Oct 26, 2021 00:05
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Tias posted:I work reconstruction iron/viking age interpretation, and just had a gig for the last week doing a viking market aid station, and when explaining the various antiseptic stuff we had like sloe thorns and linden honey, the number one question from guests in return was always "How did they figure it out?" People are pretty good of keeping track of large social structures anyways - but now we keep a web of celebrity gossip and social media memes in our heads where people used to keep family names and epic sagas. We don't remember as much as people used to because we developed crutches for memorization like writing stuff and having books. Instead we train other mental skills. Just because it's impressive doesn't mean it's superior.
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Oct 26, 2021 01:17
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