|
Which horse film is your favorite? This poll is closed. |
|||
|---|---|---|---|
| Black Beauty |
|
2 | 1.06% |
| A Talking Pony!?! |
|
4 | 2.13% |
| Mr. Hands 2x Apple Flavor |
|
117 | 62.23% |
| War Horse |
|
11 | 5.85% |
| Mr. Hands |
|
54 | 28.72% |
| Total: | 188 votes | ||
|
smoobles posted:My plan is to get boosted whenever the CDC advises it minus 3 months, for the rest of my life. At this point I've given up on everyone who isn't me or my immediate family. have there been studies on the effects of multiple boosters yet? all the studies i've seen describe the effects of a single booster. obviously there hasn't been much time for such a study to exist, but i feel like we should start seeing them fairly soon. surely israel is studying this, right?
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 12:12 |
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Yes, this was before the delta variant, which completely changed the calculus. Why is this so loving hard to understand? This isn't really true. Delta was absolutely wrecking India in April (https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/india/). Walensky's announcement on no masks for vaccinated people was in May (https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/cdc-director-stands-firm-mask-guidance-calls-individual/story?id=78990692). I wouldn't anticipate the average American to be aware of what was going on in India, but the CDC absolutely should have been looking at it and realized that Delta was a game changer. They then continued to stick to that guidance throughout the summer. The performance of the CDC and FDA has been poor during this pandemic.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:15
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:And their advice changed with new information, so you're still complaining about professionals not being able to see into the future with perfect agency. That must be so tedious for you! What I’m complaining about is professionals not being able to see into the future with at least as much agency as the pig balls forum. I don’t expect them to know that B.1.617.2 will be a big deal in December 2020. I do expect them to know that it will be a big deal after it has burned through millions of people in India and is rapidly rising in prevalence in the United States. That’s not even foresight. That’s just looking out the loving window.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:16
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Prove it. Go back to May and read the many, many criticisms of the CDC's reckless moves here and from many experts. Go back to April and find the surveys of experts who predicted we'd still need months of NPI's, maybe more than a year. Read the many experts who have been saying this all along and are still saying it. Or look at when other countries eased npi's with far higher standards and far slower easing. This whole "you can't criticize X unless you're an expert yourself" is dumb and I'm not sure why you think it's meaningful. Especially when plenty of actual experts make the same criticism. "Put up or shut up" is just a lazy thought terminating response, as if anyone here has control over public policy in any sector. Guess we better shut down the whole forum.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:21
|
|
|
The country that doesn't have a functional enough government to pass policies that have the overwhelming support of the populace isn't going to suddenly grow the teeth to do what needs to be done to get to covid zero. It's a pipe dream. Get vaxxed, get boosted, wear masks, and live your life the safest way you can. That's it, that's the best this loving poo poo hole country is going to get. Deal with it better than logging on to yell at a bunch of people who also don't have any loving control over public policy and remember that this thread isn't solely for people in the US.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:25
|
|
|
The prime example of how obviously stupid the CDCs decision on masks (in May 2021, to clarify for anyone who is so confused they thought anyone was talking about March 2020) was how quickly it undercut iirc Virginia's phased easing plan. They had population vax thresholds to begin rolling back things like mask requirements. They were immediately abandoned when the CDC went mask-off. The results of this have been predictable, and indeed were predicted by many experts and non experts alike. The move to drop masks in May 2021 is and was indefensible.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:26
|
|
|
In good news we're apparently going to approve kid vaccines here in Canada tomorrow.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:27
|
|
|
I believe that there are many people in the employ or orbit of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention who do have more foresight than the pig balls forum. I wish that they were listened to. The fruits of their talents are sadly lacking in many of the decisions made by the organization.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:28
|
|
|
Professor Beetus posted:The country that doesn't have a functional enough government to pass policies that have the overwhelming support of the populace isn't going to suddenly grow the teeth to do what needs to be done to get to covid zero. It's a pipe dream. Get vaxxed, get boosted, wear masks, and live your life the safest way you can. I'm puzzled how any of the national lockdown steps folks are advocating could realistically happen right now in late 2021 USA, no matter which party or individual (or even lack thereof) is in the executive branch. Gotta keep enforcement mechanisms in mind for the answer. It's all well and good to shout into the void about ideal worlds disconnected from practical realities, and to shout at people who bring them up, but I don't know what good it does.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:32
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Yes, this was before the delta variant, which completely changed the calculus. Why is this so loving hard to understand? I am siding with others on that they absolutely were not making a decision on the best information they had. They made a maneuver to try to say "you can take your mask off to get vaccinated" because they thought, stupidly, that it would get people to go get vaccinated. There was absolutely no reason to believe this would be the case. It didn't have any measurable effect on vaccination because predictably no one, anywhere, could actually enforce a mask mandate for the unvaccinated. Everyone saw this coming and in retrospect it looks like the political decision that it was. The actual, rational, scientific take based on the CDC saying "unvaccinated people don't really need masks" would have been tying mask mandates to local vaccination numbers. There is no where else on earth that has taken the "masks just for the unvaccinated" policy, for all the reasons that they knew it was a failure of an idea. Xombie fucked around with this message at 17:42 on Nov 18, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:39
|
|
|
dwarf74 posted:Yup, this. It's a situation where "ought" and "is" might as well be light years apart. There's all kinds of theory crafting of what could have been done or what should have been done, but I don't know how anyone looks at the tire fire of US government and thinks any of that was possible here. Pre-vaccine was the only time this country was going to see significant NPI measures and even that was half-assed and left to the states to bungle on their own (and sometimes intentionally because the government at the time assumed that it would kill more Democratic voters than GOP, which, in hindsight turned out to be pretty lol).
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:42
|
|
|
Professor Beetus posted:It's a situation where "ought" and "is" might as well be light years apart. There's all kinds of theory crafting of what could have been done or what should have been done, but I don't know how anyone looks at the tire fire of US government and thinks any of that was possible here. Pre-vaccine was the only time this country was going to see significant NPI measures and even that was half-assed and left to the states to bungle on their own (and sometimes intentionally because the government at the time assumed that it would kill more Democratic voters than GOP, which, in hindsight turned out to be pretty lol). If I go to any of the little towns around? Those red counties? There's nothing. Absolutely nothing. No masks, <50% vax rate, no distancing whatsoever - just a wide sea of corn, soybeans, Casey's, pickups, and TRUMP 2020 signs. How do you get those rural counties to take this poo poo seriously? What's the magic incantation to get them to take precautions? Who's going to enforce it - the antivax county sherriffs? You're not hitting covid zero without it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:54
|
|
|
dwarf74 posted:It's not merely states - it's counties. I'm in a blue state, but in a purple county surrounded by deep red. Enforcement here in town? Spotty but not terrible. We've got functional city government by and large, and there's broad local govt support for mask mandates, vaccination, etc. Yep, the states are just a macro for the micro of poo poo going on within the states as well, that's a great point.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 17:56
|
|
|
I think countries should adopt china’s covid policies to get to China’s levels of infection and monitoring instead of as accept failure. It’s been done. Accepting less is for lazy rock eaters.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:01
|
|
|
no lube so what posted:I think countries should adopt china’s covid policies to get to China’s levels of infection and monitoring instead of as accept failure. Better get started on a time machine then.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:15
|
|
|
no lube so what posted:I think countries should adopt china’s covid policies to get to China’s levels of infection and monitoring instead of as accept failure. If you can show us how we can get there in the USA we live in right now then go for it, man. E: I also think that bad things are bad, and wish they hadn't happened, and I don't like them.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:18
|
|
|
You guys keep talking like advocating for covid zero policies is simultaneously preaching to the choir and politically infeasible due to massive unpopularity. Someone definitely believes that covid zero is actually wrong and bad, not just infeasible, and I am angrily confronting that person
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:27
|
|
|
Stereotype posted:You guys keep talking like advocating for covid zero policies is simultaneously preaching to the choir and politically infeasible due to massive unpopularity. It's almost as if a web forum where being a soc dem is considered a hard right position is not representative of mainstream american political thought.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:50
|
|
|
Stereotype posted:You guys keep talking like advocating for covid zero policies is simultaneously preaching to the choir and politically infeasible due to massive unpopularity. There's maybe two people who post in this thread who I can kind of see fit that bill but it seems like a waste of time and energy on your part anyway. I would like a functioning government to pop into existence here in the US but unfortunately I have to live in reality and I don't see much point in indulging in fantasy scenarios that would have to undo at least 60-70 years of targeted bad government. e: Although now I'm imagining a massive jobs program for contract tracing/testing and I'm getting sad. gently caress. Professor Beetus fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Nov 18, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 18:55
|
|
|
I personally find the talk of a COVID zero strategy via extremely strict lockdowns, enforced quarantines, and mandatory test-and-trace in the US exhausting for the reasons described--it just isn't ever going to happen with the current situation of the US politically. Endlessly posting in this thread about how these interventions would solve all our problems, while perhaps true, only serves to derail conversation from more grounded discussions. At the same time, I think it's right to be critical of the US for lack of a coherent strategy, but blaming that on Biden or the CDC would be a mistake too, when many Republican governors are throwing as many resources as they can into undermining every proposed intervention via the courts and legislation. The US public health system is also particularly fragmented due to a variation in state-level policies as well as a lack of centralized public health infrastructure. Cities, counties, states, and the federal government all have separate layers of public health agencies, rules, and oversight. The solution here is better cooperation and standardization across these layers, but processes for doing so have been slow even in the face of the pandemic and are even actively stymied by political disagreements. This is to say nothing of our fragmented health care system which makes data collection and reporting its own special nightmare. All that being said, the questions I have that I am thinking about as an epidemiologist when I think about COVID are: 1. How do we increase vaccination rates? 2. How do we reduce disparities in health outcomes from COVID particularly among historically marginalized populations? 3. Given the political realities in the US, how do we minimize risk of COVID as much as possible? To me these are interesting and difficult questions that there aren't clear answers for.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:25
|
|
|
Went to bed feeling okay, if not maybe a dash of nausea. Woke up at 6AM like a freight train hit me. Fingers crossed we don't need more boosters down the line—this fuckin' sucks.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 19:43
|
|
|
Abner Assington posted:Went to bed feeling okay, if not maybe a dash of nausea. Don’t be shy about pain meds after the shot. For some reason I tried to Superman through my pain after dose 2 and it wasn’t worth it at all. I took some several hours after my booster and it was still bad but not *awful*.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 20:16
|
|
|
Vaccine mandates seem to be slowly coming into effect among big huge conglomerates and corps, so that's positive. I figure that getting to even 80% fully vaccinated in the US is going to take years at this point. It's pretty depressing. But, the vaccination rate can only go up. Kids 5-11 have been able to get shots for a few weeks now, so hopefully the rest of the winter will go better for them (and their families). We really are living in a vaxxed America vs unvaxxed America at this point. The division is only going to grow sharper, I expect the anti-vaxxers to continue to double down for as long as they can continue to remain employed and unvaccinated.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 20:51
|
|
|
Mr. Pardiggle posted:Don’t be shy about pain meds after the shot. For some reason I tried to Superman through my pain after dose 2 and it wasn’t worth it at all. I took some several hours after my booster and it was still bad but not *awful*. Searching for "can I take Tylenol after vaccine/booster X" is just an endless series of contradictions and I couldn't (in the middle of the night with a massive migraine) figure it out, so I waited. I got my Moderna booster Monday and it was a bit less of effects that shot #2, but still was lovely - fever/chills and huge headache. Around T+18 hours I took a Tylenol which got rid of most of it, I think I did the same after shot #2.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 20:55
|
|
|
How are u posted:Vaccine mandates seem to be slowly coming into effect among big huge conglomerates and corps, so that's positive. I figure that getting to even 80% fully vaccinated in the US is going to take years at this point. It's pretty depressing. But, the vaccination rate can only go up. Kids 5-11 have been able to get shots for a few weeks now, so hopefully the rest of the winter will go better for them (and their families). If a bunch of people don't bother to get boosters, and the definition of "fully vaccinated" does change (as it is currently expected to) then the vaccination rate could actually go down.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:09
|
|
|
Lager posted:If a bunch of people don't bother to get boosters, and the definition of "fully vaccinated" does change (as it is currently expected to) then the vaccination rate could actually go down. I expect the vast vast majority of people who have already gotten vaccinated to continue to keep up with boosters. These are the people who respond to public health measures. I don't think people who poo poo on boosters were vaccinated anyway.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:12
|
|
|
How are u posted:I expect the vast vast majority of people who have already gotten vaccinated to continue to keep up with boosters. These are the people who respond to public health measures. I don't think people who poo poo on boosters were vaccinated anyway. I hope that's correct, but I don't know that I've seen any evidence of this. Anecdotally, I've only seen the opposite - I've had to pull teeth to get some of my friends and family to get their drat boosters, even among those who got the J&J and really, really need to get it done. Edit: dwarf74 posted:It's important to remove as much friction with the booster process as possible. At-work clinics, drive-through, etc. I agree with this completely.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:14
|
|
|
It's important to remove as much friction with the booster process as possible. At-work clinics, drive-through, etc.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:14
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Yes, this was before the delta variant, which completely changed the calculus. Why is this so loving hard to understand? Lmao we knew about Delta in February my dude.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:25
|
|
|
I'm pretty annoyed that there is a booster gap in the US that no one seems to be talking about and it's the 12-18 age group. It's almost exactly 6 months after the first of the 12-18 group got their second shots but the boosters are for 18+ only. I've got a 16 year old who got the second shot on may 7th and by all accounts should be due a booster, but can't. I have heard no rumblings about boosters for this group but maybe I just haven't been looking in the right places. Is this on the horizon? We live in a really highly vaccinated place with school and town mask mandates and we've been notified twice this year so far that there was a close contact (someone that sits close in class I guess) that tested positive. I'd really like my kid who actually cares about this stuff and tries really hard to avoid it to be protected from all the dicknosers and antimask teenagers (of which there are many) at school.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:29
|
|
|
Lager posted:I hope that's correct, but I don't know that I've seen any evidence of this. Anecdotally, I've only seen the opposite - I've had to pull teeth to get some of my friends and family to get their drat boosters, even among those who got the J&J and really, really need to get it done. My guess is it will partly depend on the reasons people have for getting vaccinated in the first place--if they're doing it for personal health or public health reasons, I think they'll be relatively likely to get a booster. If they're only doing it because they want to travel or go to concerts, or because their work is requiring it, or whatever, then I suspect they'll do the bare minimum to comply, and if a booster isn't required for travel, concerts, work,or whatever, then I think they'll be relatively unlikely to get a booster. It's one of the limits of that kind of public health measure, if it's not updated.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:45
|
|
|
GutBomb posted:I'm pretty annoyed that there is a booster gap in the US that no one seems to be talking about and it's the 12-18 age group. It's almost exactly 6 months after the first of the 12-18 group got their second shots but the boosters are for 18+ only. I've got a 16 year old who got the second shot on may 7th and by all accounts should be due a booster, but can't. I have heard no rumblings about boosters for this group but maybe I just haven't been looking in the right places. Is this on the horizon? Some of the pushback against authorizing boosters for adults under 50 was that incidence of myocarditis is much higher for third shots, especially younger males. I'm not sure how safety and efficacy trials are progressing for boosters for people under 18. Maybe Israel is working on booster trials in that age range? I'm also not sure how much data we have on waning of protection for 12-18 year olds since vaccines were authorized more recently. The CDC and FDA would need to weigh risk of myocarditis vs. benefit of a booster. edit: as in, it's possible the increased risk of myocarditis outweighs the benefit of a booster (with regard to protection against severe disease, hospitalization, death) at 6 months for 12-18 year olds. That's why the trials would need to be done. Fritz the Horse fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Nov 18, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 21:59
|
|
|
Solkanar512 posted:Folks keep saying this without any evidence what so ever, while continuing to poo poo all over the folks who are actually doing the hard work. This is getting tedious. I'm not even really sure if you warrant correction on this and every other topic on which you're so plainly incorrect, given others attempts above. Potato Salad fucked around with this message at 22:04 on Nov 18, 2021 |
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 22:02
|
|
|
Gonna have a serious talk with my mom about getting her moderna booster before December, when she plans to go to a themepark with the family. The amusement park thing is definitely happening and im not going to spend any time convincing her to cancel that. She had a recent annual visit with her doctor, and her doctor advised against the booster because she didn't have any pre-existing conditions, but she's still in her late 50s. She's been sort of wary about the booster because 1) she gets pretty sick like I do from the reactions of moderna #2 2) no consensus about who needs boosters Do you all have any talking points I can bring up when talking to her? I figure boosters in her age group reduce hospitalization by some significant percent right? Is there lesser chances of long covid/complication? Does it reduce her contagiousness if she does get covid (she lives in a multi generation household with an elderly person w cancer, yes that person is also going to the themepark) I'm basically going to start with 1)do these for me, your son who wants you alive and healthy 2)keep great aunt safe (household member with cancer) 3)this will reduce risk of hospitalization (by how much?) 4)no health downside that we know of aside from feeling like crap for a few days? 5)her depression diagnosis means she qualifies since that's a pre-existing condition under the wide net (for california at least?) what else do you all suggest?
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 22:24
|
|
|
That honestly sounds like a really solid list of reasons, and I hope she responds favorably.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 22:34
|
|
|
Stereotype posted:You guys keep talking like advocating for covid zero policies is simultaneously preaching to the choir and politically infeasible due to massive unpopularity. You've been responding to me and I've never expressed that view. You're just making poo poo up. My whole point is that folks like you do little else but poo poo all over those who are busting their rear end trying to save lives, and brag about how much more you know than they do. Let me repeat it again because everyone keeps dodging this point - you're doing nothing but making GBS threads all over those people who are working with limited time, resources and agency to save lives. You are also ignoring all those who are actively ignoring every group who is sabotaging public health efforts. DR FRASIER KRANG posted:Lmao we knew about Delta in February my dude. Knowing that it exists is not the same as having a full understanding of how it's going to affect things here in the United States or that it will even make it here in the first place. Plenty of variants have only shown up regionally and quickly died out before spreading to other areas. But hey, LMAO MY DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUDE. Potato Salad posted:This is getting tedious. I'm not even really sure if you warrant correction on this and every other topic on which you're so plainly incorrect, given others attempts above. Is tedious the new word of the day for folks? So you think I'm incorrect that medical professionals and public health officials should be treated with respect but that "it would be too tedious to correct me"? Where do you get off saying something so patronizing?
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 22:39
|
|
|
Is there any data on what proportion of the population supports various interventions (mask mandates, contact tracing, lockdowns, etc)?
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 22:50
|
|
|
Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Is there any data on what proportion of the population supports various interventions (mask mandates, contact tracing, lockdowns, etc)? There's been surveys done on all of the above, at least I remember some from last year, but actual observed behavior is a much better marker for what people will tolerate and for how long.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2021 23:13
|
|
|
Mr. Pardiggle posted:Don’t be shy about pain meds after the shot. For some reason I tried to Superman through my pain after dose 2 and it wasn’t worth it at all. I took some several hours after my booster and it was still bad but not *awful*.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2021 01:01
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 23, 2024 12:12 |
|
|
https://twitter.com/CDCgov/status/1461420449733218317 They are so bad at communication. This makes the protection sound much worse than it is for a couple of reason. They should have rolled the infection ratio into the other two. People on Twitter, even serious journalists, are going to think that vaccinated people are dying at three times the ratio they actually are. At least as bad is that these are crude rates, not adjusted for independent risk factors of the groups. Unvaccinated people skew younger. They’re starting from a better baseline, once again making vaccines look worse than they are at protecting any individual person.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2021 01:38
|
|