Deltarune: Asriel Weird Sciencing Sans out of the computer

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Deltarune: Asriel Weird Sciencing Sans out of the computer

Brandfarlig: Nov 5, 2009; These colours don't run.

Tulip posted:

I'm not saying its impossible, I'm saying it's boring. It's cool and fun to see characters iterated on in a new fictional context, literalizing the iteration is 99.99% of the time very very boring.

You must already be bored then considering characters are very much alike in the two games. It's not like every character has to be the same person with their memories wiped and transported to another universe.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 17:44

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 22:04

Zereth: Jul 9, 2003

BisbyWorl posted:

It was long enough that most monsters don't even recognize Frisk as human, so we might be looking at decades from Chara and Asriel's death to UT proper.

Decades from the previous human. There were five other humans between Chara and Frisk. And the only non-boss monster other than Undyne (captain of the royal guard) and Sans (sans) who can recognize Frisk as a human is super loving old.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 17:46

Tulip: Jun 3, 2008; yeah thats pretty good

Brandfarlig posted:

You must already be bored then considering characters are very much alike in the two games. It's not like every character has to be the same person with their memories wiped and transported to another universe.

What? I like the way the characters are similar, it's fun and feels like it's going somewhere as a kind of commentary on fan-fiction, in addition to just being a kind of clever way of getting us up to speed on how certain people are. It's also a bit of a fun twist on Flowey's whole thing from UT about the unchanging nature of the world he lived in, since he found it so boring how predictable everyone is so to see some unexpected twists on characters we previously knew, I dunno it works for me. "X person but what if Y" tends to be one of my favorite types of episodes of TV shows.

I just don't see how an in universe set of physics explaining how these are all transporter clones or whatever would make the story better than just taking for granted that Undyne, Chief of Police, is a fictional iteration of Undyne, Captain of the Royal Guard.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 17:50

ikanreed: Sep 25, 2009; I honestly I have no idea who cannibal[SIC] is and I do not know why I should know.

syq dude, just syq!

Tulip posted:

I'm not saying its impossible, I'm saying it's boring. It's cool and fun to see characters iterated on in a new fictional context, literalizing the iteration is 99.99% of the time very very boring.

And I'm not saying it's possible, I'm saying it's natural

# ? Nov 24, 2021 17:55

Brandfarlig: Nov 5, 2009; These colours don't run.

That's not the only option though. You could have Sans and Papyrus as bony versions of Rick and Morty hopping to another dimension because the old one blew up. It's not everyone or no one. Gaster also seems more involved in DR so it's likely something will come of that.

Come to think of it, that might be why we haven't met Papyrus yet. He knows too much and wouldn't be able to not talk about it.

Brandfarlig fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Nov 24, 2021

# ? Nov 24, 2021 17:55

Zulily Zoetrope: Jun 1, 2011; Muldoon

Anyways all these questions will be answered when we get to chapter 3 and learn that the Toriel's House/TV dark world is the birthplace of all our weird skeleton font friends in both games.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:03

Son of Thunderbeast: Sep 21, 2002

Brandfarlig posted:

Sans and Papyrus as bony versions of Rick and Morty

Well that took me on a journey

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:12

Icedude: Mar 30, 2004

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRFuetWUGlk

Son of Thunderbeast posted:

Well that took me on a journey

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:17

Feels Villeneuve: Oct 7, 2007; Setter is Better.

Tulip posted:

What? I like the way the characters are similar, it's fun and feels like it's going somewhere as a kind of commentary on fan-fiction, in addition to just being a kind of clever way of getting us up to speed on how certain people are. It's also a bit of a fun twist on Flowey's whole thing from UT about the unchanging nature of the world he lived in, since he found it so boring how predictable everyone is so to see some unexpected twists on characters we previously knew, I dunno it works for me. "X person but what if Y" tends to be one of my favorite types of episodes of TV shows.

I just don't see how an in universe set of physics explaining how these are all transporter clones or whatever would make the story better than just taking for granted that Undyne, Chief of Police, is a fictional iteration of Undyne, Captain of the Royal Guard.

there's some sort of connection at the very least since Asriel seems to have literally wrote Undertale, assuming the flavor text on his PC isn't some kind of one-off. i actually wonder if he did some sort of variant of the popular post-modern novel trope where an author accidentally wills fictional characters (i.e. the underground cast, based off people he knew) into existence, but it's hard to tell at this point.

i do like the idea that the underground cast is based off Asriel's points of view of the people he knew around town, though there are too few purple dragons in Undertale for this to really work

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:19

Zulily Zoetrope: Jun 1, 2011; Muldoon

I didn't get the impression that he wrote Undertale, just that he also at some point envisioned himself as the god of hyperdeath, but yeah ok that's a really cool idea.

If the Flowey/Chara/child murderer Asgore all came from the imagination of our adolescent goat brother, inspired by him, us and our incredibly divorced dad, that's a real dark shade of paint on his character. I respect that.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:29

Shadow Hog: Feb 23, 2014; Avatar by Jon Davies

To be fair, we never got to meet Clam Lady's neighbor's daughter Suzy. (...Although on that note, Susie hasn't met Asriel, either. I can't rule out Asriel having noticed Susie and she just didn't pick up on it, but I have doubts of that.)

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:29

Feels Villeneuve: Oct 7, 2007; Setter is Better.

there's also the idea that Toriel/Asgore's writing would have been based on someone with knowledge of the family dynamics which is interesting

also maybe he's a scaly so he did So Sorry

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:30

Everdraed: Sep 7, 2003; _{spankety, spankety, spankety}

if anyone ever wanted to hold a pipis in the palm of their hand and have it sing the song of its pipis, that is now terribly possible

https://twitter.com/Fangamer/status/1463558468082626561

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:32

Tulip: Jun 3, 2008; yeah thats pretty good

Feels Villeneuve posted:

there's some sort of connection at the very least since Asriel seems to have literally wrote Undertale, assuming the flavor text on his PC isn't some kind of one-off. i actually wonder if he did some sort of variant of the popular post-modern novel trope where an author accidentally wills fictional characters (i.e. the underground cast, based off people he knew) into existence, but it's hard to tell at this point.

i do like the idea that the underground cast is based off Asriel's points of view of the people he knew around town, though there are too few purple dragons in Undertale for this to really work

Oh interesting, even just being kind of a Don Quixote thing? Like DR is the framing device for UT? If UT is in some way DR Asriel's perspective, then that paints a picture of Asriel as being pretty drat unhappy about something, quite possibly even just going to college being contextualized as a traumatic experience. Huh.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:34

Zereth: Jul 9, 2003

Zulily Zoetrope posted:

I didn't get the impression that he wrote Undertale, just that he also at some point envisioned himself as the god of hyperdeath, but yeah ok that's a really cool idea.

I assumed that UT Asriel also did this, but the difference is he had a chance to make it real.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:37

Zulily Zoetrope: Jun 1, 2011; Muldoon

Feels Villeneuve posted:

there's also the idea that Toriel/Asgore's writing would have been based on someone with knowledge of the family dynamics which is interesting

I had never even considered Undertale as a metastory from inside the Deltarune world, but yeah, it'd have to be written by Asriel or Kris.

Though to be clear that still means the Sans and Papyrus in Undertale are dimensional travelers who were not written into the story but traveled there on their own somehow. :colbert:

Zereth posted:

I assumed that UT Asriel also did this, but the difference is he had a chance to make it real.

Yeah, UT Asriel clearly always liked the idea and got to live his dream because he's in the world where magic is real.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:40

Feels Villeneuve: Oct 7, 2007; Setter is Better.

Zulily Zoetrope posted:

Though to be clear that still means the Sans and Papyrus in Undertale are dimensional travelers who were not written into the story but traveled there on their own somehow.

which in itself is a pretty common thing from metafictional/postmodern stories about fictional worlds, so :yeah:

e) since dark world characters seem to be at least somewhat based on stuff in the light world, you'd even have the idea that Undertale as we know it is effectively the existent dark world of Asriel's computer game, which sounds cool though I've not given it any thought

Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 18:51 on Nov 24, 2021

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:48

Everdraed: Sep 7, 2003; _{spankety, spankety, spankety}

Everdraed posted:

if anyone ever wanted to hold a pipis in the palm of their hand and have it sing the song of its pipis, that is now terribly possible

they're gone... all the pipis, ravenously snatched up in the blink of an eye......

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:55

ChickenHeart: Nov 28, 2007; Take me at your own risk.; Kiss From a Hog

Everdraed posted:

they're gone... all the pipis, ravenously snatched up in the blink of an eye......

aaaaa i was at work aaaa there is no god

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:59

Dieting Hippo: Jan 5, 2006; THIS IS NOT A PROPER DIET FOR A HIPPO

Everdraed posted:

they're gone... all the pipis, ravenously snatched up in the blink of an eye......

i can't wait to get my Pipis in the mail

# ? Nov 24, 2021 18:59

Everdraed: Sep 7, 2003; _{spankety, spankety, spankety}

ChickenHeart posted:

aaaaa i was at work aaaa there is no god

~~you have ten seconds~~

chunk of safety stock pipis were permitted to escape, they were greedily grabbed up in the blink of the other eye

Everdraed fucked around with this message at 19:40 on Nov 24, 2021

# ? Nov 24, 2021 19:05

Space Cadet Omoly: Jan 15, 2014; ~Groovy~

I managed to grab a Spamton Funpack before they sold out, I am GOD!

I also got the cybers world deskmat and the two new Undertale pens! I've been saving up for this sale and it was worth it!

Space Cadet Omoly fucked around with this message at 19:23 on Nov 24, 2021

# ? Nov 24, 2021 19:17

kaleedity: Feb 27, 2016

I'm just excited to get some monster-human relations exposition through the conflicts or interactions between anthropomorphized cookie cutters

# ? Nov 24, 2021 20:10

Zamujasa: Oct 27, 2010; Bread Liar

The goofy poo poo fangamer does with their store is always pretty great, reminds me of when you could get a $1 discount via Flowey on one of the old bundles.

Also, the code is littered with 1997 references (and of course Everdraed is in the list of random names that are used)

code:

var spamletters = 1997;
var counter = Math.floor(Math.random() * 1997) + 1997;
var counterupdate = 1997;
var socialcounter = Math.floor(Math.random() * 1997);
var socialcounterupdate = 1997;
var quantity = 1997;
var quantityupdate = 1997;
var toastcount = 1997 * 0;
var toastposttimer = 1997 * 4;

var is_available = ($('#price-field.sold_out').length == 0);

var toast_names = ['Aaron', 'Alex', 'Alma', 'Amanda', 'Anea', 'Angela', 'Audrey', 'Brian', 'Brittney', 'Camila', 'Camille', 'Canden', 'Carissa', 'Casey', 'Cedric', 'Charlie', 'Chihiro', 'Chris', 'CJ', 'Clara', 'Clyde', 'Dan', 'Daniel', 'Dean', 'Derek', 'Dylan', 'Elaine', 'Erika', 'Everdraed', 'Heidi', 'Hiiro', 'Ian', 'Ikuno', 'Jack', 'Jazzy', 'Jeremy', 'Jon', 'Jordan', 'Jorge', 'Kaori', 'Karen', 'Kari', 'Kathryn', 'Kenshi', 'Laura', 'Lindsay', 'Liz', 'Marcos', 'Mark', 'Matt', 'Michael', 'Nancy', 'Naoko', 'Natsue', 'Nina', 'Noah', 'Noriko', 'Rachel', 'Reid', 'Robert', 'Ryan', 'Saber', 'Sam', 'Samantha', 'Sanae', 'Saori', 'Sara', 'Seraiah', 'Shinichiro', 'Steph', 'Steve', 'Steven', 'Teresa', 'Toby', 'Tony', 'Troy', 'Yesica', 'Kai', 'Aghshleigh', 'Brayntaungh', 'Garbanza', 'Homer', 'Aloysius'];
var toast_locations = ['Alabama', 'Alaska', 'Arizona', 'Arkansas', 'California', 'Colorado', 'Connecticut', 'Delaware', 'Florida', 'Georgia', 'Hawaii', 'Idaho', 'Illinois', 'Indiana', 'Iowa', 'Kansas', 'Kentucky', 'Louisiana', 'Maine', 'Maryland', 'Massachusetts', 'Michigan', 'Minnesota', 'Mississippi', 'Missouri', 'Montana', 'Nebraska', 'Nevada', 'New Hampshire', 'New Jersey', 'New Mexico', 'New York', 'North Carolina', 'North Dakota', 'Ohio', 'Oklahoma', 'Oregon', 'Pennsylvania', 'Rhode Island', 'South Carolina', 'South Dakota', 'Tennessee', 'Texas', 'Utah', 'Vermont', 'Virginia', 'Washington', 'West Virginia', 'Wisconsin', 'Wyoming', 'Internet', 'Rancha Cucamanga', 'Kokomo', 'Exoplanet', 'Poughkeepsie', 'Kalamazoo', 'Walla Walla', 'Springfield', 'ERROR 500', 'Pacific Ocean', 'Atlantic Ocean', 'Moon', 'Surprise, Arizona', 'A Dumpster'];
var toast_sold_out_messages = ['[Wishes] they could buy this!', '[Missed Out]!', 'is [Staring] longingly at this product!', '[Wants] this!', '[NEEDS] this!', '[Signed Up] for email alerts!', 'is [Refreshing] constantly!'];
var toast_sold_out_popover_messages = ['SORRY KID!!! THIS OFFER IS [SOLDOUT!]', 'ALL OF THE [Pipis] IS SLEEPING IN BED,<br>WITH VISIONS OF [hOchi mama\'s] DANCING IN [they\'re heads...]', 'YOU MISSED YOUR<br>YOU MISSED YOUR [Chance to be a].', 'YOU WILL [Regret] NOT [regretting this purchase,]!!'];

# ? Nov 24, 2021 20:24

Looper: Mar 1, 2012

whether or not you want to buy a bag of cheap garbage, everyone def check out the product page

# ? Nov 24, 2021 20:46

Tunicate: May 15, 2012

Ah the exclusive benefits of having a SA account: getting a 10 second head start

# ? Nov 24, 2021 20:54

Framboise: Sep 21, 2014; To make yourself feel better, you make it so you'll never give in to your forevers and live for always.; Lipstick Apathy

That "Floralsei" shirt is rly cute :unsmith:

# ? Nov 24, 2021 21:27

Space Cadet Omoly: Jan 15, 2014; ~Groovy~

Framboise posted:

That "Floralsei" shirt is rly cute

It's super soft too, when they restock I'd say it's worth a buy.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 21:45

Oxxidation: Jul 22, 2007

the numbers for one of my other stories jumped up today, looks like this is why

https://twitter.com/halfmoonstruck/status/1463525612354609154

# ? Nov 24, 2021 22:13

Neuronyx: Dec 8, 2016

Brandfarlig posted:

Abandoning your post is equivalent to multiple murders, got it.

Abandoning your post and causing multiple murders to be necessary because you refused to offer any other solution from your position of influence makes you complicit.

# ? Nov 24, 2021 23:52

Brandfarlig: Nov 5, 2009; These colours don't run.

Neuronyx posted:

Abandoning your post and causing multiple murders to be necessary because you refused to offer any other solution from your position of influence makes you complicit.

Why is it Toriels responsibility more than Asgores? When she left he had already made his choice. Do I need to remind you that kings tend to outrank queens?

Sure, she didn't offer another solution but she refused to take part in a reprehensible one. What else do you want?

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:09

Oxxidation: Jul 22, 2007

Brandfarlig posted:

Why is it Toriels responsibility more than Asgores? When she left he had already made his choice. Do I need to remind you that kings tend to outrank queens?

this is irrelevant, everyone knew that toriel wore the pants in that marriage

but yes, the brunt of responsibility was asgore's and she did what she could to countermand it, and after she failed she was right to quit herself of the whole thing. the backlash against toriel is a combination of her relatively underdeveloped character, plus the game sort of using her as its authoritative moral voice in the end - after what we learn about asgore, having her swoop in with hardass realpolitik made a lot of people reject the game's framing outright

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:12

Fangz: Jul 5, 2007; Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

Personally, I think the pacifistic ending implies that if Toriel came back and demanded Asgore stop killing humans he would absolutely have obeyed her.

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:17

Brandfarlig: Nov 5, 2009; These colours don't run.

Maybe so, but it isn't her hand on the trident.

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:28

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

Brandfarlig posted:

What else do you want?

If I were one of the monsters she was governing, I'd personally appreciate some kind of plan to avoid the agonizing slow extinction everyone keeps talking about in the game

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:30

Zulily Zoetrope: Jun 1, 2011; Muldoon

look buddy if you played toby fox' undertale and came away with a message other than "sometimes you just have to murder children" i don't know what to tell you

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:31

Danaru: Jun 5, 2012; 何 ??

Zulily Zoetrope posted:

look buddy if you played toby fox' undertale and came away with a message other than "sometimes you just have to murder children" i don't know what to tell you

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:33

Oxxidation: Jul 22, 2007

Danaru posted:

If I were one of the monsters she was governing, I'd personally appreciate some kind of plan to avoid the agonizing slow extinction everyone keeps talking about in the game

they're not suffering an "agonizing slow extinction" - on the contrary, their main problem is overpopulation and the despair of their captivity. asgore "fixed" the problem of that despair by directing it to bloodlust instead, and toriel (who was already deep in grief herself) was so disgusted by their eagerness and her husband's inability to lead them positively that she quit herself of the whole kingdom

like the other bosses you face, she's locked herself into a pattern of negative behavior that's only broken by your actions - her attempts to make a difference from her self-exile simply don't work, but she's unable to accept that before you fight her - but asgore's actions are both considerably worse and considerably harder to snap him out of

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:37

Scarodactyl: Oct 22, 2015

One sort of issue with Undertale is the lack of a real sense of that claustrophobia. They talk about it but all we see are a quaint town, expansive mountain vistas, comfortable one family homes and a few rpg tunnels. It definitely makes the experience more pleasant for the player, but it doesn't quite convey why the monsters are so upset.
I guess that's a lot of temmies for one room(?)

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:38

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# ? Jun 7, 2024 22:04

Oxxidation: Jul 22, 2007

Scarodactyl posted:

One sort of issue with Undertale is the lack of a real sense of that claustrophobia. They talk about it but all we see are a quaint town, expansive mountain vistas, comfortable one family homes and a few rpg tunnels. It definitely makes the experience more pleasant for the player, but it doesn't quite convey why the monsters are so upset.
I guess that's a lot of temmies for one room(?)

yeah that's where the game's small scale works against it. my personal rationalization is that the zones you trek through are too inhospitable to support the majority of monsters (too cold, too wet, too incendiary) so they all stay in the capital, which is conveniently locked

# ? Nov 25, 2021 00:45

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