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Not So Fast posted:Yeah, Jordan doesn't seem to know what to do with after a while. He should have died in Shadar Logoth or Far Madding, dragging it out to the Last Battle meant he just whiffed. yeah
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Dec 3, 2021 23:11
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fain is another chance for the show to do better by a character's storyline than the books did, so here's hoping he gets used in a satisfactory way instead of just kinda Being There and doing fuckall, whether they have him die earlier or actually serve a narrative purpose later
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Dec 3, 2021 23:13
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The whole Where's Padan? thing is incredible, a really subtle way to make the character stand out
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Dec 3, 2021 23:14
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Johnny Joestar posted:fain is another chance for the show to do better by a character's storyline than the books did, so here's hoping he gets used in a satisfactory way instead of just kinda Being There and doing fuckall, whether they have him die earlier or actually serve a narrative purpose later yeah, definitely Rarity posted:The whole Where's Padan? thing is incredible, a really subtle way to make the character stand out it has been done quite well
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Dec 3, 2021 23:17
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the more i see loial in the show the more i like him, tbh him just rambling on about poo poo is great
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Dec 3, 2021 23:46
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From the TVIV thread:Collateral posted:I had exactly the same issues with them. I think it helps to think of the setting as similar to Italy/HRE before the renaissance and in slow decline. The lack of a central religion to give legitimacy to such an organisation like the Children is something we just have to accept. It is pretty interesting that Randland seems to lack any sort of positive religiosity. There's a lot of negative- everyone is terrified of the Dark One, refusing to speak his name and seeing Darkfriends in every shadow, but there doesn't seem to be any sort of worship of the Light. No temples, no priests, no ceremonies- not even any sort of personal expressions of faith. There are the Whitecloaks, sort of, but they're more against Darkfriends and the Aes Sedai than they are for anything The oaths on the Light are about as close as you get. It's a world with a Devil and no God. And the show is taking that even further- now we've got characters performing rituals to ward off the Forsaken. Do we think that was just a strange oversight on Jordan's part, or was it intended to play into the themes of the world slowly hollowing out?
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Dec 3, 2021 23:48
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I watched this show and now I'm considering going back and leafing through the books again. Thought they were great when I was an adolescent, went off them as I grew up and the middle dragged on. I must have been an adult by the time they were finished and I remember enjoying the last ones. How did the Seanchan end up again? There must have been some political rapprochement or something, cause Mat ended up as their Prince Consort. But they were still a horrible bunch of slavers? Can't remember where their empress eventually sat on that issue, as I think she was confronted with the whole 'your slave-handlers, of which you are one, can actually be trained to channel themselves' thing.
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Dec 3, 2021 23:50
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:From the TVIV thread: there is god, he's called the creator, and there are a shitload of different ceremonies and personal expressions of faith and the reason wot's religion is what it is, is that jimbo was a freemason
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Dec 3, 2021 23:55
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The Dragon Reborn is basically Jesus so people have been waiting for his return for 3000 years, who knows what Christians will do in 1000.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:04
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:From the TVIV thread: there are lots of rituals but nobody really goes to church and there's not really a secular equivalent. there are no temples because the conventional wisdom is the creator is completely hands off and couldn't touch the world if he wanted to. people just throw their hands up and say the wheel weaves as the wheel wills. Rojo attended what he described as a "high church" service often more than once a week so it's not like he was unfamiliar with liturgy. it's a great line of inquiry that I haven't really thought about before. maybe he didn't want to deal with writing a million different subreligions Ghislaine of YOSPOS fucked around with this message at 00:16 on Dec 4, 2021 |
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Dec 4, 2021 00:13
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I believe the argument always was that Randland is a world where there's no need for organised faith because the existence of a creator is known fact
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Dec 4, 2021 00:22
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Which, perhaps, is due to the white tower maintaining itself. They claim that knowledge of the dark one and forsaken are due to them, at any rate.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:25
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Random thought, maybe Rand knew of Dragonmount because Tam told him about it in his fever dream we haven't seen yet. Back to FF14 just had that thought, since there's no reason for Rand to know Dragonmount otherwise
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Dec 4, 2021 00:28
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Ha, the Whitecloaks are just fundamentalist deists.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:28
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Rarity posted:I believe the argument always was that Randland is a world where there's no need for organised faith because the existence of a creator is known fact There are a variety of non-religious belief systems though.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:32
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Hexel posted:Today I learned Min's actor Kae Alexander is a GoT alumni. That expression is pure Min: girl-next-door who’s just kind of amused at everything happening around her.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:36
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:From the TVIV thread: I mean, just in the show we see Lan doing a ceremony to honor the dead of Malkier, the melting of the Aes Sedai ring, the Last Embrace Of The Mother ritual and the Shared Pain ritual as funeral rights, the sending the lanterns down the Two Rivers, and a chat between Logain and Moiraine about whether or not the Wheel of Time itself has a will or if its a colorless cosmic force. I myself have noticed that as far as I could tell there has been no mention of the Creator, but the acknowledgment of the Wheel and the Pattern in god-like terms is pretty evident. The positive religiosity in support of the Wheel and the Dearly Departed as counterpoint to the negative feelings toward the Dark DOES exist.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:38
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ChubbyChecker posted:there is god, he's called the creator, and there are a shitload of different ceremonies and personal expressions of faith But what though? Everything I can remember is people praying to save them FROM the dark. No one is praising the light (except the whitecloaks and for obvious reason I don't count them.)
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Dec 4, 2021 00:38
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Genghis Cohen posted:How did the Seanchan end up again? There must have been some political rapprochement or something, cause Mat ended up as their Prince Consort. But they were still a horrible bunch of slavers? Can't remember where their empress eventually sat on that issue, as I think she was confronted with the whole 'your slave-handlers, of which you are one, can actually be trained to channel themselves' thing. There was never really any resolution to their plotline. Rand made the deal that they were to to stick to the lands they controlled and weren't allowed to take channeling captives from his allied forces, and then Mat had Artur Hawkwing himself go over and talk some chill in to Tuon at the end of the battle as they were cleaning up. The empire back in Seandar was in total shambles because Semirhage murdered everyone in charge on the other continent, so that was a giant ???? It was one of the biggest things that I wish Jordan had been around to follow up on, because Tuon and Mat's excellent adventure and building/reforming a crazy culture from the wreckage would have been such a fertile ground for cool situations.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:41
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Genghis Cohen posted:I watched this show and now I'm considering going back and leafing through the books again. Thought they were great when I was an adolescent, went off them as I grew up and the middle dragged on. I must have been an adult by the time they were finished and I remember enjoying the last ones. Since we have some first time readers in here, and this is a really big plot point. Semirhage exterminated the entire Imperial Family except for Tuon, plunging the entire empire except for the invasion force into civil war. After Tuon learns of this and succeeds to the throne, she marries Mat and continues the invasion for a time (including a strike on Tar Valon) until Rand all but forces a peace. There's no significant reform to their practices during the series - Mat has an influence, and Arthur Hawking stops by to have a (offscreen) chat with her during the Last Battle, but that's the end of it. Prophecy says that the Seanchan would have eventually conquered the entirety of Randland and exterminated the Aiel, but there's signs that prophecy was averted. Mat and Tuon in Seanchan was supposed to be a sequel series, but that didn't happen.
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Dec 4, 2021 00:43
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RC Cola posted:
The big thing they'd lose with Rahvin is I'm pretty sure that's where they first show off the pattern rewriting effects of Balefire - or at least such as is personally applicable to the cast - as Rahvin kills Mat and Aviendha (among others) when he blows out the wall at the beginning of the Caemlyn fight. Shortly thereafter Rand hits him with very strong Balefire and removes that event. And obviously if he's nuked with Balefire, he can't retreat to another country. They can of course remove that scene, but it's pretty powerful imagery so if they do merge Rahvin I suspect that scene probably gets moved somewhere else. Not sure where though, as Rand isn't using Balefire yet at Tear (and Moraine isn't tossing around powerful enough Balefire), and his other Forsaken kills aren't in that sort of confused battle. edit: Technically they'd also lose the emotional aspect of him immediately dropping everything to go murder the one who (supposedly) killed Elayne's mother, but given we've got no idea how that meeting is being changed I'm not speculating on anything on the relationship front. It WOULD mean skipping some of the Forsaken socials scenes though, since Rand going after Rahvin was a surprise (he was supposed to attack Sammael, wherupon him plus Rahvin, Lanfear and Graendal would trap Rand). Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 00:55 on Dec 4, 2021 |
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Dec 4, 2021 00:49
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Lord Koth posted:The big thing they'd lose with Rahvin is I'm pretty sure that's where they first show off the pattern rewriting effects of Balefire - or at least such as is personally applicable to the cast - as Rahvin kills Mat and Aviendha (among others) when he blows out the wall at the beginning of the Caemlyn fight. Shortly thereafter Rand hits him with very strong Balefire and removes that event. And obviously if he's nuked with Balefire, he can't retreat to another country. yeah i legit don't think anyone will get rid of that sequence, it's basically a perfect season finale that sees staggering disaster because of his hubris and him only barely clawing it back by going loving apeshit
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Dec 4, 2021 00:54
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Lord Koth posted:The big thing they'd lose with Rahvin is I'm pretty sure that's where they first show off the pattern rewriting effects of Balefire - or at least such as is personally applicable to the cast - as Rahvin kills Mat and Aviendha (among others) when he blows out the wall at the beginning of the Caemlyn fight. Shortly thereafter Rand hits him with very strong Balefire and removes that event. And obviously if he's nuked with Balefire, he can't retreat to another country. That's why I'm iffy on it. You can have Rand balefire someone else who kills Mat though. Or balefire a different forsaken earlier. aka Moiraine could balefire Be'lal in the stone, but change that scene so that she does it saving someone. I'm just saying there are work arounds, but I agree that is a super powerful scene, including having Nynaeve seeing rand come physically in the world of dreams while Moghedien freaks out. And also Nynaeve surprise attacking Rahvin with everything she he and it doing almost nothing to him to show Rahvin's strength. I want the scene, I just don't know how we do it with only 8 forsaken I guess is my point.
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Dec 4, 2021 01:03
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There is an earlier scene involving Darkhounds that shows the effects of balefire. Mat's behind a door where the Darkhounds are trying to chew through, one starts to break through and drools poison onto his arm, then the Hound gets hit with balefire.
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Dec 4, 2021 01:07
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rocketrobot posted:Shohreh Aghdashloo I'm sure I heard Shohreh Aghdashloo had already been cast in the show, but I don't recall where.
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Dec 4, 2021 01:08
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Gnoman posted:Since we have some first time readers in here, and this is a really big plot point. Gwaihir posted:There was never really any resolution to their plotline. Thanks, very interesting. I guess when you cast the scale and scope of a plot that wide, there will always be fairly major unresolved points.
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Dec 4, 2021 01:11
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Gnoman posted:There is an earlier scene involving Darkhounds that shows the effects of balefire. Mat's behind a door where the Darkhounds are trying to chew through, one starts to break through and drools poison onto his arm, then the Hound gets hit with balefire. yeah this is a good point. But then again what about the balefiring everything memes Edit: for this repost https://imgur.com/K2HxLhs
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Dec 4, 2021 01:14
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RC Cola posted:yeah this is a good point. But then again what about the balefiring everything memes If I never laugh when I see this gif, bury me for I am dead.
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Dec 4, 2021 01:28
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:The Dragon Reborn is basically Jesus so people have been waiting for his return for 3000 years, who knows what Christians will do in 1000. He's also Lucifer and a few other analogues Edit: Quetzalcoatl is my favorite rocketrobot fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Dec 4, 2021 |
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Dec 4, 2021 01:38
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Omnomnomnivore posted:Min's also the most prominent non-channeling woman character, right? Siuan. 
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Dec 4, 2021 04:28
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Lol at Rand being randomly bonded to a Aes Sedai , just got to that part in Lord of Chaos. Lord of Chaos is good so far. I enjoy seeing what the Forsaken are up to, I'm non plussed about all the stuff with the White Cloaks. I'm sure its important in the grand scheme of everything but I am just not interested in Niall and Morgase at all. Hopefully it all makes sense later on. Nyaeive training to get rid of her block is pretty good and them keeping Moghedian captive is kind of stressful . Seriously she's one of the Forsaken , they could come up with a better plan.
Hollismason fucked around with this message at 05:00 on Dec 4, 2021 |
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Dec 4, 2021 04:56
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Omnomnomnivore posted:Min's also the most prominent non-channeling woman character, right? Faile has more POV and probably screentime overall
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Dec 4, 2021 05:10
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Kinda giggling at thought of how much damage Rand could have done by just being in Tar Valon at any point in the books. I guess you can use it as a jumping off point for literally any plot you want, here?
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Dec 4, 2021 05:25
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Zore posted:Faile has more POV and probably screentime overall Lol I completely forgot she existed when thinking of non channeling women. Holy poo poo
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Dec 4, 2021 06:03
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Zore posted:Faile has more POV and probably screentime overall I'm not certain on total word count from everyone's POVs, though I suspect it may favor Min even more given she pops up interacting with a number of characters (plus obviously a bunch with the #1 POV character) whereas Faile is almost exclusively in her own and Perrin's chapters, but Min's absolutely got more personal POV chapters (and unsurprisingly more words total in them) then Faile. Specifically, she's got 8 more POVs, and is slightly wordier overall per POV as well.
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Dec 4, 2021 06:25
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Someone mentioned Loial referring to Rand as an Aiel in the TV thread and it did make me realize that having these scenes moved to Tar Valon should have made people react to Rand more. The Aiel were just outside the city walls around 20 years ago so some people also should have known he was an Aiel as well.
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Dec 4, 2021 06:29
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I think the show is in some serious trouble when Rosamund Pike makes her exit. Rewatching the latest episode, when Perrin and Egwene made their escape... that was rough. The dude playing Perrin can't act and the wolf scenes felt like The CW.
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Dec 4, 2021 06:37
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if the show can't survive without rosamund pike by the time it's literally at the climax of book 5... then yes, they are in trouble.
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Dec 4, 2021 06:40
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eke out posted:if the show can't survive without rosamund pike by the time it's literally at the climax of book 5... then yes, they are in trouble. Was she around for that long? Been a long time since I read the books. With the way they are chopping up the story, I'd be surprised if Rosamund is around for two full seasons.
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Dec 4, 2021 06:42
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Hughmoris posted:Was she around for that long? Been a long time since I read the books. 3 at least
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Dec 4, 2021 06:45
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