Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Cugel the Clever
Apr 5, 2009
I LOVE AMERICA AND CAPITALISM DESPITE BEING POOR AS FUCK. I WILL NEVER RETIRE BUT HERE'S ANOTHER 200$ FOR UKRAINE, SLAVA

SMEGMA_MAIL posted:

Okay your turn to provide examples of this ever happening
The previous government of Montenegro, for example, received a massive loan from China for a major infrastructure project leading from nowhere to nothing. The government is unable to repay the loan and the project is as of yet unfinished. The loan contract entitled China to seize Montenegrin land should repayment not take place.

quote:

Grgic is finishing his doctoral thesis on Chinese projects like this one in the Balkans, and he says all of them have one thing in common. "These kinds of projects are always political," he says. "And it's basically how everything is done in the Balkans. You use public money to redistribute them to your crony network ... and then use it for political purposes, and so on."

The previous government of Zambia had done similar, with the leader enriching his cronies while placing an incredible burden on subsequent governments.

These have only surfaced in the international media because the states involved had transitions of power to new governments. Others undoubtedly have similar circumstances, just lack the press freedoms or rotating ruling parties that might shine a light on them.

MazelTovCocktail posted:

Well let's not go crazy here. Western Foreign Aid has been at times equally if not more hilariously corrupt then even what the East was doing (look at the France and The Central African Empire).
Oh for sure! That's why I tried to call out the West's historic track record being pretty lovely, but there has been some halting progress toward higher expectations on recipient governments in the last few decades (though whether that just amounts to demanding they fake a bunch of documentation that they totally are handling the money appropriately, it's hard to say).

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Marshal Prolapse
Jun 23, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Cugel the Clever posted:


Oh for sure! That's why I tried to call out the West's historic track record being pretty lovely, but there has been some halting progress toward higher expectations on recipient governments in the last few decades (though whether that just amounts to demanding they fake a bunch of documentation that they totally are handling the money appropriately, it's hard to say).
Yeah, it's a question of whether there are actually positive effects or it's just a new shell game.

Also I always joked that Managing Nuclear Operations was like a strat guide for Bravo Romeo Delta...but looking at the manual...it's actually a cited source with a few other books.

facialimpediment
Feb 11, 2005

as the world turns
Good news: Devin Nunes is gone

Bad news: he's cashing out

https://twitter.com/JakeSherman/status/1467971604017815557?t=Uw5fpMrfEgoxCXKVJ5naMA&s=19

Soul Dentist
Mar 17, 2009
Good news: that cash out train is in a weird crypto coin nobody's heard of

Cugel the Clever
Apr 5, 2009
I LOVE AMERICA AND CAPITALISM DESPITE BEING POOR AS FUCK. I WILL NEVER RETIRE BUT HERE'S ANOTHER 200$ FOR UKRAINE, SLAVA

Soul Dentist posted:

Good news: that cash out train is in a weird crypto coin nobody's heard of
That just means you're getting in early! BUY BUY BUY

Bored As Fuck
Jan 1, 2006
Fun Shoe
And hopefully it fairs as well as all the other conservative social networking train wrecks so far.

CRUSTY MINGE
Mar 30, 2011

Peggy Hill
Foot Connoisseur
I wonder how his cow is taking this.

piL
Sep 20, 2007
(__|\\\\)
Taco Defender

PeterCat posted:

https://twitter.com/NatButterflies/status/1467598873334067215?s=20
https://twitter.com/NatButterflies/status/1467611224783429632?s=20

Consider Texas national Guard is now allowed to be armed to guard the border and Texas is a stand your ground slash castle doctrine state.

How long till the TX ARNG gets in a gunfight with some homeowners?

Add to the 2022 bingo space list: "Murder trial outcome appealed using the third amendment."

Butter Activities
May 4, 2018


Cool cool but that’s exactly zero times the United States “enforced democracy” or “prevented corruption” via IMF or similar loans. You’re not even responding to what I’m saying unless your point is “it’s okay for the US to do something bad because China did something bad”

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


https://twitter.com/Sulliedsubjects/status/1467870174887956489?t=WL9BF4ojzmv-z7dX1uUJjQ&s=19

Shitposters United Local 42069

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Enjoy every sandwich.

Smellrose

Nick Soapdish posted:

Shitposters United Local 42069

What are the dues like and can I join?

MA-Horus
Dec 3, 2006

I'm sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome I am.

Vincent Van Goatse posted:

What are the dues like and can I join?

:10bux:

You're already here, aren't you?

Marshal Prolapse
Jun 23, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

MA-Horus posted:

:10bux:

You're already here, aren't you?

Yeah, but Lowtax stole it all.

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!

MazelTovCocktail posted:

Yeah, but Lowtax stole it all.

Yeah, but thats a dead end...

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010


I mean if it's true it means dude golden parachutes into a cesspit, so how is that bad news? Like dude looked at the last forever history of Trump and Trump owned properties and thought to himself "yea, the checks will definitely always clear"....idiot.

Sacrist65
Mar 24, 2007
Frunnkiss
Isn't Ways and Means Chair the third most powerful position in the house? And isn't he in an R+10 district? I don't buy this "retirement" to run an obvious bullshit money laundering scam. This feels more like "go away or we press charges".

not caring here
Feb 22, 2012

blazemastah 2 dry 4 u
I think he was about to get redistricted into nothingness.

Butter Activities
May 4, 2018

I don’t understand US politics to puzzle that one. What on earth drove him to leave?

Cugel the Clever
Apr 5, 2009
I LOVE AMERICA AND CAPITALISM DESPITE BEING POOR AS FUCK. I WILL NEVER RETIRE BUT HERE'S ANOTHER 200$ FOR UKRAINE, SLAVA

SMEGMA_MAIL posted:

Cool cool but that’s exactly zero times the United States “enforced democracy” or “prevented corruption” via IMF or similar loans. You’re not even responding to what I’m saying unless your point is “it’s okay for the US to do something bad because China did something bad”
Woops, my bad, I misread the initial post as specifically asking for examples of Chinese imperialism via aid/loans/trade instead of a Western example showcasing leveraging the same to advance democracy. That's what I get for firing off a quick reply during a work break.

I don't have anything specific to the aid and loans, though there are undoubtedly plethora articles, theses, and books written on the subject in the last century, each assessing varying levels of efficacy of expectations placed on the recipient (and, for that matter, the sincerity behind the ask). One obvious example of the US actively conditioning its support (in the form of trade policy, which I don't think is meaningfully shifting the goal posts) is when the US Congress overrode Reagan's veto of the Comprehensive Anti-Apartheid Act, which was a significant nail in the coffin of South African apartheid.

Seems like a meaningful step to me and one I hope to see repeated to finally force Israel to its own apartheid regime.

TheWeedNumber
Apr 20, 2020

by sebmojo

MazelTovCocktail posted:

Yeah, sadly there is very very little coverage out there. Luckily you can find the game all over the internet.

And holy poo poo I found the manual. Had it once years ago, before I lost it in a hard drive crash.
https://retro-commodore.eu/files/downloads/amigamanuals-xiik.net/Games/Bravo%20Romeo%20Delta%20-%20Manual-ENG.pdf

This is pretty rad. I’m having fun just leafing through the manual.

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS

FrozenVent posted:

The idea is that if you’re already at DEFCON 2 or 3, you don’t do poo poo that could possibly piss off the other guy.

It’s kind of silly, but so is the the scare that Able Archer created in the Soviet government, or that loving bear in Minnesota, or the Norwegian rocket incident.

not caring here
Feb 22, 2012

blazemastah 2 dry 4 u

SMEGMA_MAIL posted:

I don’t understand US politics to puzzle that one. What on earth drove him to leave?

Census made California lose some seats. Districts get redrawn and now he's got an election coming that he will almost certainly lose.

So he takes his reelection fund and just walks off with it. Goes grifting with trump.

Stanley Goodspeed
Dec 26, 2005
What, the feet thing?



I'm honestly here to talk about Twilight Struggle more but in a bit of an oopsie it looks like the US Navy has managed to infuse Pearl Harbor's ground water supply with delicious fuel products.

https://www.npr.org/2021/12/03/1061194511/pearl-harbor-tap-water-petroleum-fuel

Not a lot of other aquifers when you're on an island so kind of an extra poo poo move.

MazelTovCocktail posted:

Like I said I do get it, just the idea of Andropov sitting at the opening games and going, "oh they didn't show up GLASS EVERYTHING" is just very silly, but that's the point I assume.

IIRC the instructions actually mention something that it's a game designed to simulate the assumptions of the Cold War, so things like domino theory are actually kind of supported by the gameplay. It's a pain in the rear end to set up but if you can get the digital version on Steam for < :10bux: it's probably worth a spin if only to read about all the cards.

That Works
Jul 22, 2006

Every revolution evaporates and leaves behind only the slime of a new bureaucracy


https://twitter.com/KToropin/status/1465450133341065221?s=20

Not bad!

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?

Platystemon posted:

It’s kind of silly, but so is the the scare that Able Archer created in the Soviet government, or that loving bear in Minnesota, or the Norwegian rocket incident.

What about a bear

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS

Milo and POTUS posted:

What about a bear

A bear tried to climb a fence in Minnesota at the height of the Cuban Missile Crisis, and because the “intruder” alarm was miswired as the “Soviet hardware incoming, get airborne” alarm, pilots scrambled to do just that.

There was also that time in 1960 when U.S. early warning RADAR mistook the Moon for Soviet ICBMs.

That Works
Jul 22, 2006

Every revolution evaporates and leaves behind only the slime of a new bureaucracy


Hah wild I never heard about the bear story before. The others are familiar at least.

Bored As Fuck
Jan 1, 2006
Fun Shoe
https://twitter.com/JackMurphyRGR/status/1467983264484835329?t=Gzj6EU1prRUg3xp2kuGtSg&s=19

Tiny Timbs
Sep 6, 2008


o7

Bored As Fuck
Jan 1, 2006
Fun Shoe
https://twitter.com/JackMurphyRGR/status/1467893125171617801?t=RzRrHHqpV8tjadE-cx_KnQ&s=19

FrozenVent
May 1, 2009

The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.

Platystemon posted:

A bear tried to climb a fence in Minnesota at the height of the Cuban Missile Crisis, and because the “intruder” alarm was miswired as the “Soviet hardware incoming, get airborne” alarm, pilots scrambled to do just that.

There was also that time in 1960 when U.S. early warning RADAR mistook the Moon for Soviet ICBMs.

Didn’t a lightning strike take out a transformer somewhere in flyover country once, loving up SAC phones lines and leaving them to think the Soviets were for sure coming since they were degrading their C3?

pantslesswithwolves
Oct 28, 2008

Update on this critical topic:

https://twitter.com/JackMurphyRGR/status/1468225920565719043

Baconroll
Feb 6, 2009
The Futurama suicide booth is now a reality in Switzerland !

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10281763/3D-printed-coffin-like-suicide-capsules-legalised-Switzerland.html

You can even be buried in it when you are dead.

Bored As Fuck
Jan 1, 2006
Fun Shoe

Aww damnit

Loucks
May 21, 2007

It's incwedibwe easy to suck my own dick.

I am an “eat my rear end” truther.

Does anyone have enough mandarin to confirm that the translation is correct? Just curious; not contemplating a new tattoo.

Dum Cumpster
Sep 12, 2003

*pozes your neghole*

Baconroll posted:

The Futurama suicide booth is now a reality in Switzerland !

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10281763/3D-printed-coffin-like-suicide-capsules-legalised-Switzerland.html

You can even be buried in it when you are dead.

Why is it that while I agree with the idea that suicide should be made available to those who choose it in the correct conditions, every motherfucker I see that's publicly related to the idea gives the vibe of "I jerk off to the thought of each person I help kill"

jerman999
Apr 26, 2006

This is a lex imperfecta

Loucks posted:

I am an “eat my rear end” truther.

Does anyone have enough mandarin to confirm that the translation is correct? Just curious; not contemplating a new tattoo.

It’s correct

CRUSTY MINGE
Mar 30, 2011

Peggy Hill
Foot Connoisseur
/\ Sweet.

Dum Cumpster posted:

Why is it that while I agree with the idea that suicide should be made available to those who choose it in the correct conditions, every motherfucker I see that's publicly related to the idea gives the vibe of "I jerk off to the thought of each person I help kill"

Kevorkian would never have been jailed if he just told people to buy a shotgun and a box of slugs.

facialimpediment
Feb 11, 2005

as the world turns
Omicron updates (still fuzzy, wait a week):

https://twitter.com/megtirrell/status/1468222459652489224?t=_RENRtWavTGI4lsejdnz5g&s=19

https://twitter.com/Misopogon/status/1468229745057935361?t=_cuZ961TVxzx5GW3WVJ7Pw&s=19

The one development is that the Merck anti-COVID pill really took a poo poo in the final numbers. End-effectiveness was only like 30%, after being like 70%-plus in early clinical data. The FDA advisory panel went 13-10 in favor of it, for only emergency use, because it turns out the end data was so iffy - the scientists were worried it could be a variant-maker if people don't finish the course of pills.

The Pfizer pills use a different mechanism completely, so everyone's hopeful the end-stage data matches the early data, unlike the Merck.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

pantslesswithwolves
Oct 28, 2008

Seems like it’s going to be a rough winter even if Omicron is potentially less deadly.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply