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Old granary was "good mid but the rest is pretty bad", current granary is just an all-around good map. Badlands is good, the revision that makes the last point cap slower is good for pubs but doesn't really matter for comp. Process is good. Gullywash is good. Snakewater is decent. Things start getting less fine after that. Stuff like Yukon and Coldfront are like, yeah, they are technically maps, but I don't know anyone who's excited to play them. Jabor fucked around with this message at 02:01 on Dec 13, 2021 |
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Dec 13, 2021 01:59
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I liked cp_powerhouse before they added the time limit. 
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Dec 13, 2021 02:17
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CP_Steel
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Dec 13, 2021 02:55
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Warmfront is great but coldfront has the superior snow theme.
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Dec 13, 2021 03:22
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On a similar note CTF would be a decent mode if you overhauled the rules; Current Rules: first to three captures wins, no time limit, this results in one of two things; either no one plays the objective at all and it becomes a glorified TDM server or some overzealous Scouts focus on the objective and the match is over in like 3 minutes My Proposed Rules: unlimited captures, time limit of 10 to 15 minutes, team with most captures at time limit wins, this should encourage playing the objective while still allowing for people to focus on other things as well A For Effort posted:I think badwater and upward are by far the best casual maps but in 6s I think badlands is still super viable and people are being unreasonable. The turtle heavy last is absolutely possible to overcome and the perfect spire/mid certainly makes up for it. I have the fondest memories watching and playing on that map. I have similar feelings about another now shunned 6s map: granary. A version of Badlands with only the middle three points would probably be really fun Jabor posted:Old granary was "good mid but the rest is pretty bad", current granary is just an all-around good map. More maps where being either 3CP or KOTH would be a massive improvement Gwyneth Palpate posted:I liked cp_powerhouse before they added the time limit. Would be better as a KOTH map
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Dec 13, 2021 03:26
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drrockso20 posted:My Proposed Rules: unlimited captures, time limit of 10 to 15 minutes, team with most captures at time limit wins, this should encourage playing the objective while still allowing for people to focus on other things as well What you'd end up with is a game where one team scored 5 points within a few minutes, everyone on the other team gives up, and then it's perpetually 12v3 or 4 while the score gets more and more lopsided, every time a new player joins they're assigned to the losing team that's hemorrhaging players, see it's 12-1 and quit in seconds. This happens all the time in Rocket League and those matches are like 5 minutes and only 3v3.
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Dec 13, 2021 03:31
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Once you capture the point one time there is a time limit on the KOTH round before it gets reset. It is the perfect casual game type.
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Dec 13, 2021 03:36
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Baron von Eevl posted:What you'd end up with is a game where one team scored 5 points within a few minutes, everyone on the other team gives up, and then it's perpetually 12v3 or 4 while the score gets more and more lopsided, every time a new player joins they're assigned to the losing team that's hemorrhaging players, see it's 12-1 and quit in seconds. It's not perfect but it's worlds better than the current rules where it's either ignore the objective entirely or the match ends stupid fast Reiley posted:Once you capture the point one time there is a time limit on the KOTH round before it gets reset. It is the perfect casual game type. Agreed, even if a good chunk of KOTH maps are a tad flawed in having too open of Sniper sightlines, and not having many good spots for Engineer's buildings(but these are problems with most official TF2 maps honestly)
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Dec 13, 2021 03:48
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It's actually a good thing when a bad game ends, and a very bad thing when it stretches on for 15 minutes of getting stomped.
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Dec 13, 2021 03:49
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can we just put Captchas on Casual games?
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Dec 13, 2021 03:51
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drrockso20 posted:Agreed, even if a good chunk of KOTH maps are a tad flawed in having too open of Sniper sightlines, and not having many good spots for Engineer's buildings(but these are problems with most official TF2 maps honestly) KOTH maps are similar to 5CP maps except they are just mid and two yards, this is how the ones with 5CP cousins are adapted. I don't recall many points that lack some sort of cover from snipers. TF2 is generally pretty good about Sniper lines, both from a map design point and from a limit on how often a Sniper can fire without giving a tell where they intend to aim.
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Dec 13, 2021 04:05
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Hihohe posted:can we just put Captchas on Casual games? “Please select all the screenshots that contain hats.”
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Dec 13, 2021 04:41
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drrockso20 posted:It's not perfect but it's worlds better than the current rules where it's either ignore the objective entirely or the match ends stupid fast this is why nucleus is the best KOTH map, because the snipers have great sightlines on the point and lovely sightlines for all the flanking routes, so snipers are relevant but can't lock down the map by themselves (and crucially, there are flanking routes that pop out right in their faces)
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Dec 13, 2021 05:10
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Delete sniper. 
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Dec 13, 2021 05:24
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Nucleus is also fun because you can equip the conch and the cow mangler and just hop around on the roofs and other high areas forever annoying the other team.
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Dec 13, 2021 05:24
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the holy poopacy posted:this is why nucleus is the best KOTH map, because the snipers have great sightlines on the point and lovely sightlines for all the flanking routes, so snipers are relevant but can't lock down the map by themselves (and crucially, there are flanking routes that pop out right in their faces) Nucleus has the other problem I mentioned where Engineers are often kind of useless as there's not really anywhere safe to set up a nest
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Dec 13, 2021 05:35
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drrockso20 posted:Nucleus has the other problem I mentioned where Engineers are often kind of useless as there's not really anywhere safe to set up a nest This is why you go funslinger, drop a mini to cover that medium health pack on the bottom of the map, and just go DM randos.
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Dec 13, 2021 05:36
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Yeah I love playing engineer but hate nesting. Just dropping a sentry in odd places to fall back to, providing your own covering fire while playing a slow Scout (and dispenser/tele when convenient for some easy passive support) . I'll even do it without gunslinger sometimes for some classic battle engineer -- the L1 damages people almost twice as fast as the mini once it's up, and really catches people off guard. ...I'm speaking in present tense even though I don't think I've launched the game in a couple years now. It's still installed. I still consider it A Game I Play. Entirely irrationally, possibly.
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Dec 13, 2021 05:58
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drrockso20 posted:Nucleus has the other problem I mentioned where Engineers are often kind of useless as there's not really anywhere safe to set up a nest yes, this is another reason nucleus is the best.
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Dec 13, 2021 06:03
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Ditocoaf posted:Yeah I love playing engineer but hate nesting. Just dropping a sentry in odd places to fall back to, providing your own covering fire while playing a slow Scout (and dispenser/tele when convenient for some easy passive support) . I'll even do it without gunslinger sometimes for some classic battle engineer -- the L1 damages people almost twice as fast as the mini once it's up, and really catches people off guard. Yeah, part of actually getting good at Engineer is realizing that you aren't there for your sentry -- you're there for your teleporter. Dispenser too, if you can manage it, but mostly your teleporter. Lately, I tend to play completely without my dispenser nearby. I put it up closer to where everyone else is fighting. For example, on pl_pier first point defense, I put my dispenser at the bottom of that small flight of stairs next to BLU's second spawn room, my sentry on the crate next to the van facing the tunnels, and my teleporter back in the corner with the large ammo and medium health kit. Then, I just sit back there, and rely on that ammo kit only to keep my metal up. That way my team can get healed close to that high ground area, which is pretty important to holding that point.
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Dec 13, 2021 06:04
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drrockso20 posted:It's not perfect but it's worlds better than the current rules where it's either ignore the objective entirely or the match ends stupid fast
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Dec 13, 2021 06:31
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the holy poopacy posted:yes, this is another reason nucleus is the best.
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Dec 13, 2021 06:40
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Gwyneth Palpate posted:Delete sniper. Just need to change it so all of his Rifles work off The Classic's rules and need to full charge to get crits on head shots(anything below full just mini-crits*) *to slightly compensate for this the amount of damage Sniper Rifles deal on Mini-Crits gets a bit of a buff Gwyneth Palpate posted:This is why you go funslinger, drop a mini to cover that medium health pack on the bottom of the map, and just go DM randos. That technically works though having 2/3 of your buildings rendered useless and you being reduced to a mildly obese Scout does put a damper on playing Engineer on that map, especially if you're like me and are an oddly bad shot with Shotguns/Scatterguns(and not in a way that makes any sense either, like I'll have a perfectly lined up shot at optimal range but still only do like 5 damage)
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Dec 13, 2021 06:51
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drrockso20 posted:especially if you're like me and are an oddly bad shot with Shotguns/Scatterguns(and not in a way that makes any sense either, like I'll have a perfectly lined up shot at optimal range but still only do like 5 damage) Are you flinching or putting so much force on your mouse clicks that you're throwing your crosshairs off-target before your shot can register?
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Dec 13, 2021 06:59
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Gwyneth Palpate posted:Delete sniper. I'd be willing to let sniper go because I am 100% certain that once you see how TF2 genuinely plays when there is no sniper, you'll come crawling back. 
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Dec 13, 2021 07:01
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drrockso20 posted:especially if you're like me and are an oddly bad shot with Shotguns/Scatterguns(and not in a way that makes any sense either, like I'll have a perfectly lined up shot at optimal range but still only do like 5 damage) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjWbtUBKuUc&t=353s
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Dec 13, 2021 07:20
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Reiley posted:Are you flinching or putting so much force on your mouse clicks that you're throwing your crosshairs off-target before your shot can register? As far as I can tell no, this problem also exists to varying degrees with basically every other hitscan weapon in the game(except mini-guns and wrangled sentries but I figure the higher rate of fire is working in my favor there), projectiles I'm much more consistent at landing reignofevil posted:I'd be willing to let sniper go because I am 100% certain that once you see how TF2 genuinely plays when there is no sniper, you'll come crawling back. True no sniper at all is bad, but Quick Scoping as it currently works gives good Snipers(or cheaters/bots) way too huge an advantage, especially in Pubs where the odds are way too much in their favor about there being a comparable Sniper on the other team to counter them, hence my suggested change earlier that would allow them to still one shot everyone but they can't do it so quickly and consistently That definitely happens occasionally for me with Rifles but that's something different from what I'm experiencing with other guns
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Dec 13, 2021 07:39
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Quick scoping is strong but even if a sniper can hit it 99% you can still beat them by straight up overwhelming them. They've got 125 hp and can only shoot every other second basically. But if people go out one at a time into a sightline then yeah it's pretty easy for the sniper to shut them down and I think that's why snipers are so strong in pubs. Playing sniper is one of the easiest ways to differentiate two evenly matched pub teams, but I think I'd rather play soldier or demo if I wanted to have more direct impact if my team really sucked.
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Dec 13, 2021 08:42
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It is significantly harder to pull off an up close headshot on someone than it is for a Soldier to blast the Sniper with two rockets. There is no reason to make surviving that encounter even more difficult for the Sniper.
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Dec 13, 2021 09:28
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Way I see it Sniper not only being one of only two classes with a consistently accessible way of instant killing but also being able to do it at long distances means he should have to put in work to be able to pull it off and Quick Scoping makes it too easy and safe for him to do so, plus Sniper should be hosed when approached from close range, close range quick scoping should especially be impossible Plus where getting killed by a Soldier with a rocket normally only feels unfair when it's from a Crocket(or maybe a Direct Hit if you're a light class), but getting Sniped pretty much always feels like bullshit(admittedly the same applies to getting backstabbed but at least Spy has to put a modicum of effort in there*) *though in a better world the mechanics behind back stabs would get as much of an overhaul as I'm suggesting Sniping should, cause it's still honestly too easy for Spy to pull those off
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Dec 13, 2021 10:42
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It is quite the argument to claim two of the more difficult classes to master need to work harder for their rewards while also bemoaning some maps not having safe places to grow an aimbot.
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Dec 13, 2021 10:48
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hmm i got matadored and stair-stabbed three times in a row by the same spy. could it be that they earned those kills by mastering some tricky skills while i lack the skill to properly anticipate and counter them? nah, it must be that spy is an imba class that needs a massive overhaul
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Dec 13, 2021 10:52
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The difference being that a high tier Sniper* or Spy in a pub or casual environment will probably end up dominating the whole server and ruin everyone else's ability to enjoy the game, while a similar tier Engineer rarely will do the same unless the opposing team is so brain dead as to not just go Direct Hit Soldier or LnL Demo for a life or two to ruin his day in turn *or a bot/cheater playing Sniper as the last few years have shown on a grand scale
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Dec 13, 2021 10:58
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Jabor posted:hmm i got matadored and stair-stabbed three times in a row by the same spy. could it be that they earned those kills by mastering some tricky skills while i lack the skill to properly anticipate and counter them? nah, it must be that spy is an imba class that needs a massive overhaul Most of that is only possible because Source is a barely functioning mess of an engine(especially the TF2 branch of it), in a more competently made engine most of the variations of "Trick Stabbing" would and should be impossible and Spy would only be able to Back Stab in a very narrow and specific cone Also Melee in general would be a much less buggy pile of manure but that's a whole other kettle of fish
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Dec 13, 2021 11:02
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I'm not sure a competently-made engine can magically remove lag from the internet but okay. (Matadors are literally about using the delay between the spy switching direction to move behind you, and your computer actually finding out that they've switched direction, to get behind you before you can react to it). And stair-stabs are literally the spy outplaying you by using the maneuverability offered by the terrain, they should work reliably because the spy deserves that kill 100%.
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Dec 13, 2021 11:45
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You can't necessarily blame the existence of lag or aimbots on the engine, but maybe designing classes that are busted by known limitations of the engine isn't a great idea? On the other hand, I have a hard time getting up in arms about the spy since the rest of their kit is generally mediocre. Yeah, it sucks that you can't guarantee that keeping a spy in your fov is any defense against them instakilling you from "behind" but a low mobility class having a janky melee instakill is not exactly difficult to play around.
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Dec 13, 2021 15:00
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A good spy is easier to avoid than a good sniper by a mile. A good spy only has a few spots where they can really leverage impact, and most just pick of people that are in aware. You can’t get trick stabbed if you don’t enter melee range. So avoiding melee range, something difficult to naturally get in, saves you from the majority of their Arsenal. A good sniper will be behind their team at all times, meaning the 1v1 fights rarely happen. Sure up close a scout or solider easily wins, but if you have to go past a couple engies and heavy medic combo beige your at the sniper, and the sniper is actively targeting you too, it becomes pretty demoralizing. Even bombing in makes you relatively easy to at least body shot to keep away. There’s a reason Highlander is so sniper centric.
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Dec 13, 2021 15:50
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Few thoughts on sniper game is all about closeup combat and he us the onlt one who isnt. Doesnt mean he cant have that niche to himself, but he stands out Has way too much ammo which menas he desnt have to reposition/take breaks often to go pick up ammo and out himself in risk/give up a sightline for a bit. This is one i agree with the sniper haters on. His design is super one dimensional. You click heads. Thats about it. Theres no rocket jumping, no airblast, no metal management, no double and or triple and or quadruple jump, no crit heals, nothing. At least hes got huntsman which changes his gameplay a lot and is imo very fun. All this doesnt mean he should get added complexity, and he does have to have awareness to not get turned into a paste by roaming soldiers or stabbed by spies, and shoot head good is its own reward, but man, it feels like theres only really one way to play him when talking regular sniper. But also i feel people are out of their mind when talking about how snipers dont have to work for their frags. Dude have you seen how small and fast a scout is? Have you tried consistently hitting that rocketjumping god? Shits not easy. You gotta grind that admittedly linear raw mechanical skill of clicking heads. Plat snipers didnt get there magically.... Unless they were one of those that use aimbots lol. I think the better term people are looking here is risk. Snipers dont put themselves at enoigh risk when sniping and yeah i can see that argument. Now a class i hate to play because its loving boring slow and linear? My man heavy. Good god i hate playing heavy. I think i have like 3 hours total as him.
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Dec 13, 2021 18:06
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People get frustrated playing against a specific class on a pub because the way the game is going. Like some one was saying earlier that 5 cp is bad on pubs. That is only if people turtle constantly. If both teams attack each other it's fun. A sniper that is turtling on a PL or A/D map surrounded by sentries so he can't be stabbed or being countered by other snipers or under any sort of pressure from the other team pushing in with uber can dominate. No class is "overpowered" in tf2 it's all just situational. Like scout is the strongest class in 6 v 6 but can't do anything against a load of f2p engies. This video always makes me smile because if you get a load of heavies with shotguns to all run around together it's actually really effective (and hilarious) if you surprise people. I want to rush some snipers with a team of fat scouts.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XD_XtW3liQE
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Dec 13, 2021 18:23
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| # ? May 30, 2024 06:24 |
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Jippa posted:No class is "overpowered" in tf2 Except for solider
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Dec 13, 2021 18:36
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