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RPATDO_LAMD posted:easy mode sucks rear end and is poo poo do NOT put it in your game ...but how does that help when you now have to keep track of what special you need to use after confirming this normal and whether you have to use MP for it or if you have enough for it and now what's the combo with MP again?
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Dec 19, 2021 05:20
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I would love an easy mode in Type Lumina so I can select “no auto combos please” and my opponent, my brother who is gonna be mashing, can select “yes auto combos please” As it is now, everyone is forced to have TL’s idea of autos and that’s a huge point of contention among players. Because they wanna do the accessibility thing without the segregation.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:24
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Gutcruncher posted:I would love an easy mode in Type Lumina so I can select “no auto combos please” and my opponent, my brother who is gonna be mashing, can select “yes auto combos please” Accessibility via Segregation does not work except in this specific case of two people at home playing against eachother, it also introduces questions for competitive instead of simply giving everyone the same tools and letting those who use them best be good at the game. The goal should be that the game is equally enjoyable for people playing at their own level, which requires good matchmaking more than anything, auto-combos mostly let people get into the rhythm of what they should be doing more than it improves accessibility.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:28
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Gutcruncher posted:So have a “I wanna mash” mode and don’t let the pro rear end players now also have one button specials at any moment they want or, you know, just stop trying to crowbar mechanics into doing a tutorial's job
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Dec 19, 2021 05:29
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like i know every competitive PvP or even decently challenging singleplayer franchise is inevitably doomed to turn to poo poo because capitalism demands constant growth and that conflicts with just making a good game for the people who already appreciate them, but let's not lose sight of the fact that integrated and segregated easy modes both loving suck rear end
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Dec 19, 2021 05:34
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The issue is giving everyone the same tools when your goal is “give a helping hand to the low levels” you are giving a small boost to that intended target and a huge boost to the “enemy” of that target. By splitting it up like, for example Marvel Superheroes Vs Street Fighter, you can have players choose to have auto combos and a limited auto block at the expense of combo freedom. Both player types can have a mode they enjoy without giving the better players even more ways to rip the worse player apart Edit: Tuxedo Catfish posted:but let's not lose sight of the fact that integrated and segregated easy modes both loving suck rear end Oh agreed, I’m more arguing that segregated is the better of the two, not so much “good” Gutcruncher fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Dec 19, 2021 |
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Dec 19, 2021 05:36
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make a game with krushing blows as the primary super mechanic then make a mode where you get a random krushing blow like winning state (land 3 sweeps) that changes each round. new players are now forced to experiment with new moves in new and unique ways, and can blame luck on why they lost. theres the "fun"/"mashing" mode that starts giving new players lots of random bits of info to work with and piece together strategies with when they play ranked.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:38
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Create a centralized database of all players and give them like golf handicaps that make combo timing more lenient and gives them more hp if they suck worse that the opponent. Pros meanwhile start with red health and frame perfect links
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Dec 19, 2021 05:40
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Like, MOBAs (a genre almost as impenetrable as fighting games for the layman) solved this with proper matchmaking. If your goal is "we want low level players to enjoy the game as much as high level players without getting bodied by said high level players" the answer is matchmaking being good. The only recent fighting game I can think of with good matchmaking is Strive, and it for some reason boots people down levels at the end of every month so that people can enjoy getting bodied at levels that were once okay.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:42
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The game is pretty fun and there is some crazy bullshit you can do with most characters. I think if anything there should be more of a penalty for running out of meter because you can make people block 4 or 5 special moves in a block string while trying to guard crush with only one real opportunity to escape before the meter recharges and you can do it again.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:44
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Gutcruncher posted:The issue is giving everyone the same tools when your goal is “give a helping hand to the low levels” you are giving a small boost to that intended target and a huge boost to the “enemy” of that target. By splitting it up like, for example Marvel Superheroes Vs Street Fighter, you can have players choose to have auto combos and a limited auto block at the expense of combo freedom. Both player types can have a mode they enjoy without giving the better players even more ways to rip the worse player apart high level players are not the enemy of low level players. it's not even supposed to be about closing the gap, necessarily 'accessibility' isn't supposed to be about giving them free wins against players better than them. nobody wants that. nobody cares about that. except brainwormed Elo-poisoned MOBA players i guess accessibility in fighting games is about making it so new players can quickly get into "the real game" and start playing in a way that lets them learn and improve (even if they lose) instead of mindlessly mashing. making a "stylish mode" that has the AI do optimal combos when you mindlessly mash does nothing to help with this goal.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:45
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Embrace Smash Brothers and the rabbithole of complexity model. Choose your own difficulty. Deliver a stunning blow.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:51
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If we had all just played Guilty Gear 2 we'd already be living in the fighting game MOBA fusion future
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Dec 19, 2021 05:53
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:
This is the problem I have though. Games are putting “stylish mode” combos in, except since nobody does the easy mode anymore there’s no way to choose to not have it. In KOF15 for instance you can just mash the same button 5 times and it does a decent simple combo into whatever the highest level super your meter will allow. I’d love to switch that off even if my opponent would rather keep it. This is besides my other rant about single button specials in gbvs. Same family of whining but not quite the same
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Dec 19, 2021 05:57
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Spanish Manlove posted:but they are idiot children who don't know what gauges are the year is 2021 if you're playing a video game you know what a gauge is
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Dec 19, 2021 05:57
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This game just looks like GranBLue with decent netcode and slightly bigger normals. Which is to say, pretty dope.
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Dec 19, 2021 05:59
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i have no idea what any of you are talking about but i want to say that dnf owns and it's the most fun i've had playing a fighting game in 2021 i'll gladly give 8ing my hard earned dollars for this when it comes out
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Dec 19, 2021 06:00
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:This game just looks like GranBLue with decent netcode and slightly bigger normals. Which is to say, pretty dope. dnf's netcode is better than strive's i've played matches that would give me rollbacks in strive but were fine in dnf
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Dec 19, 2021 06:00
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DNF is nothing like GB and it took some getting used to but I’m having loads of fun with it and will gladly buy it when the time comes.
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Dec 19, 2021 06:01
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Devs should go whole hog but in the other direction - in the next Halo make it so when you pick up a new gun you have to look up what button combinations to press to shoot, alt fire, and throw the different types of grenades.
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Dec 19, 2021 06:19
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teh_Broseph posted:Devs should go whole hog but in the other direction - in the next Halo make it so when you pick up a new gun you have to look up what button combinations to press to shoot, alt fire, and throw the different types of grenades. As long as I can grapple, smash, sticky combo its fine, I don't need other buttons
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Dec 19, 2021 06:20
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teh_Broseph posted:Devs should go whole hog but in the other direction - in the next Halo make it so when you pick up a new gun you have to look up what button combinations to press to shoot, alt fire, and throw the different types of grenades. Ask someone if they liked Doom Eternal and you will know if someone is up for that kinda poo poo. I kinda would, not gonna lie.
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Dec 19, 2021 06:24
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Looks like FighterZ has more dlc coming? https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1jqWOhwoQfQ
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Dec 19, 2021 06:59
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TheKingofSprings posted:Looks like FighterZ has more dlc coming? Wonder if this is like Avatar Belial where they're like "well it wouldn't be too hard with existing assets"
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Dec 19, 2021 08:02
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Knocking Marys and Terrys out of their bullshit with a Spray can never gets old. Isla owns  Also Antanov might be one of my favorite "Grappler" designs ever. It's just so satifying to smash a dude with a back breaker or Tanguska Bomber
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Dec 19, 2021 08:12
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please stop playing DNF so that the population stops bleeding away from blazblue tia
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Dec 19, 2021 08:16
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I'm just gonna keep playing Strive and you can't stop me
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Dec 19, 2021 08:24
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Dias posted:I mean, that's still part of what I'm complaining about, just give characters strong tools with no resource management attached to them and a meter burn button tied to a regular super meter if you wanna go that route. Why reinvent the wheel if you're trying to be "accessible"? I think it makes sense from a psychology perspective. It encourages players to spend meter and treat it as a renewable resource
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Dec 19, 2021 08:30
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Doesn't blazblue have an opt-in auto combo mode
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Dec 19, 2021 08:41
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Tae posted:Doesn't blazblue have an opt-in auto combo mode It's got "Stylish" mode but idk what it actually does
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Dec 19, 2021 09:09
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Tae posted:Doesn't blazblue have an opt-in auto combo mode Yeah it does but it's a completely different mode that IIRC makes you unable to do normal combos. Rev2 has the same thing.
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Dec 19, 2021 09:21
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teh_Broseph posted:Devs should go whole hog but in the other direction - in the next Halo make it so when you pick up a new gun you have to look up what button combinations to press to shoot, alt fire, and throw the different types of grenades. monster hunter world had a little ui element in one of the top corners of the screen that just constantly showed all the different buttons you could press for weapon moves at your current position mid-combo it was actually pretty helpful for learning cus MH weapons are very combo/state-based, like you can only do the charge blade's big bread-and-butter explosion move after getting into a specific stance which you could access through either a slow transforming move or cancel into instantly off of a parry
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Dec 19, 2021 09:28
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:monster hunter world had a little ui element in one of the top corners of the screen that just constantly showed all the different buttons you could press for weapon moves at your current position mid-combo As someone who started MonHun gaming with World that was a FANTASTIC feature and it's a crime that Rise doesn't have it.
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Dec 19, 2021 09:31
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TheKingofSprings posted:Looks like FighterZ has more dlc coming? -farmer goku -bulma in a mech suit throwing capsules -yajirobe thats all i want
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Dec 19, 2021 09:40
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teh_Broseph posted:Devs should go whole hog but in the other direction - in the next Halo make it so when you pick up a new gun you have to look up what button combinations to press to shoot, alt fire, and throw the different types of grenades. Receiver 2 sorta does this and it's awesome. I had to go to wikipedia to find how to not kill myself using the final gun the game gave me.
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Dec 19, 2021 10:10
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If easy specials in DnFD work on the same premise as the ones in GBVS, they won't even limited to an accessibility tool- even high level GBVS play involves at least some Easy Special use as the tradeoff is worth it to get some specials on demand (especially anti-airs, but sometimes to frame-perfect inputs for other specials like lunges/lariats in punish situations since windows could be very tight) or to cut down the difficulty of execution in some combos routes to gain consistency, which is nice since GBVS combos were ultimately very timing and link-focused despite having gatlings and the trappings of a standard anime fighter, and getting the right directional inputs and timings for stuff like command normals could already be tricky enough without having to roll out circle or multi-tap motions. Easy specials wound up being a very important part of GBVS at every level of play so I have some faith their return in DnFD are to serve a lot of similar purposes- like the ability to trade resource availability for consistency- although I have to wonder if Eighting will be quite as deliberate with their design as the team that made GBVS was.
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Dec 19, 2021 11:05
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maybe this was already covered earlier in the thread but is there even a tradeoff in this game? I saw someone say there doesn't seem to be any difference between the easy specials and the motion specials, except that it says "Good" when you do the motion version.
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Dec 19, 2021 12:14
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People were saying mana regen starts faster with the motion inputs.
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Dec 19, 2021 12:21
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Ghosthotel posted:If you're referring to the cool down on MP regen then the answer is to not use the simple inputs. Using the motion instead makes it so your MP regen starts right away.
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Dec 19, 2021 14:23
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I wonder whether easy-input options actually reach the audience they're intended to reach - I know the FEXL devs said it was the veteran players who all used the easy-input system, but the novices largely didn't touch it because they had hang-ups about it being sub-optimal or too much of a baby mode or whatever.
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Dec 19, 2021 14:26
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