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Harrow posted:Endwalker tells you, directly and in clear words, exactly who the writers think the Warrior of Light is. They do this through the descriptions we get of Azem. How "incorrigible" they are. How often they charge headlong into danger for pretty much any reason they can think of. The joy they take in adventure for adventure's sake. The thrill they feel from danger and risk. And, of course, their ease of making friends, making people care about them, even someone like Emet-Selch, who will roll his eyes and look exasperated but will always come to help if called anyway. Sure, the Warrior of Light is a different person from Azem, but you still remind the people who knew Azem of them, very strongly, and not just because of your shared soul. There's just something about that soul where they're Like This in any incarnation. I dunno because like... I see a lot of that in my WoL but I still don't buy the "you and I are basically the same" poo poo that Zenos loves to throw around. I feel like they stuck the landing as well as they could've with regards to my feelings on the character minus the "don't dangle agency in front of me if you're not going to give me the chance to take it" bit, but I don't think I'm ever going to buy that line of thought. I'm not enough of a hater to admit him Kool-Aid Man-ing his way into Ultima Thule and being like "hey bro, what's taking so long, it's just despair this should be your specialty" was delightful, though. Unabashedly and without reservation, probably the best Zenos narrative beat they've written.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:28
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Kyrosiris posted:I dunno because like... I see a lot of that in my WoL but I still don't buy the "you and I are basically the same" poo poo that Zenos loves to throw around. I feel like they stuck the landing as well as they could've with regards to my feelings on the character minus the "don't dangle agency in front of me if you're not going to give me the chance to take it" bit, but I don't think I'm ever going to buy that line of thought. You don't buy it because the game is completely cool with you not buying it and repeatedly offers alternative thesis options. That's the point of the finale. You can agree with him, you can basically ignore his speech and see dealing with him as a point of duty, or you can frame the WoL as motivated by compassion. Either of the three option's is consistent with the WoLs characterization thus far.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:31
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Kyrosiris posted:I dunno because like... I see a lot of that in my WoL but I still don't buy the "you and I are basically the same" poo poo that Zenos loves to throw around. I feel like they stuck the landing as well as they could've with regards to my feelings on the character minus the "don't dangle agency in front of me if you're not going to give me the chance to take it" bit, but I don't think I'm ever going to buy that line of thought. Well, I think that the ending shows Zenos admitting that you're not really the same. Before he speaks to you as an adventurer he acknowledges the ways you're different from him. You're a hero. You value life, both the lives of others and your own. You're not the same and by that point Zenos has finally figured that out. But he still believes that you share one thing: the thrill of danger, of battle, the sheer joy in the adventure you've gone on. And you can never quite tell him he's outright wrong about that, though "think what you want" (the 2nd option) is pretty close to that. Captain Oblivious posted:Disagreed in some of the details but not in most of the conclusion. Yeah I phrased some stuff poorly there, but I agree that the game leaves the motivation open. In my reading it was clear that Azem is motivated by a desire to help, by compassion and just a general inability to let a wrong go un-righted, but I also thought the writing made it clear that Azem enjoys it. That might not be their reason for doing what they do, but they find joy in it nonetheless, or at least that's how I read it. Harrow fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Dec 20, 2021 |
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Dec 20, 2021 17:32
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Ibblebibble posted:We can start with Vrtra, who's basically a walking mirror to Heavensward in his relationship to his people. He's also a symbol of how even alien visitors can thrive in a foreign star and how Middy's hopes were not for naught. It also gives Estinien some good lines and more of a reason to be along for the ride this time, given his own history with dragonkind. He gets to show, now that the circumstances are different, he can have a different attitude towards dragonkind despite his history. He gets to show he's grown, and he doesn't feel like the Scions' awkward hanger-on which he easily could have if he didn't have any non-comedic moments to contribute early on.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:39
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TGLT posted:Do you like a good boss fight? Did you think Endsinger was fun? There you go that's what Zenos is talking about when he says you enjoy the conflict at least a bit. A fair chunk of that scene is him talking directly to the player. Did you enjoy the fights? Did you find the story fulfilling? Personally, no, I don't enjoy a good boss fight and the Endsinger was a drag. I'm here for the story, the setting, and the characters, I actively dislike how difficult many story-mandated fights have become. I think that whole thing falls so completely flat for me because no, I don't enjoy the boss fights. I enjoy the feeling of helping people and making the world a better place.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:40
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bagrada posted:How do retainers work with alts? Shared inventory, only available to the first character that recruits them, full space available for all of them? Each character has their own retainers
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Dec 20, 2021 17:40
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Macaluso posted:I'm working on leveling up crafting. I'm using a guide to power level with the firmament. But now I need to craft a 40 HQ set before moving forward. I have all the mats listed to gather, but does anyone have low level macros to ensure that I 100% get the HQ version when I'm crafting the pieces? I don't want to waste my time and then try and fumble my way through this rotation nonsense and not make an HQ one or fail it completely. I'd also just recommend labbing them in teamcraft, since they depend pretty heavily on your gear.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:42
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Cythereal posted:Personally, no, I don't enjoy a good boss fight and the Endsinger was a drag. I'm here for the story, the setting, and the characters, I actively dislike how difficult many story-mandated fights have become. I think that whole thing falls so completely flat for me because no, I don't enjoy the boss fights. I enjoy the feeling of helping people and making the world a better place. I mean those are literally the most important thing you do to make the world a better place narratively. Yes you go around helping people, but the biggest help you perform is stuff like defeating Thordan or the Endsinger or so on or so forth. It's always been the case narratively. Defeating these things helps people, immensely so.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:44
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i love all my friends in ffxiv, especially alphinaud
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Dec 20, 2021 17:44
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Lord_Magmar posted:I mean those are literally the most important thing you do to make the world a better place narratively. Yes you go around helping people, but the biggest help you perform is stuff like defeating Thordan or the Endsinger or so on or so forth. It's always been the case narratively. Defeating these things helps people, immensely so. And it's easily my least favorite part of the game. Shadowbringers and Endwalker have started to legitimately frustrate me with their difficulty. My group finally got the last EW trial down with about ten minutes left on the clock. I think it's why I've taken such a shine to the crafting beast tribes. No fighting (except for the ixal ones), no battles, just making things and helping people.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:47
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(Thavnair spoilers) A fun little connection I made while doing Bozja last night: the items you need to start a Resistance weapon are Thavanairian Scalepowder. The item description doesn't say much, just that it's made in Radz-at-Han and "designed to promote aetherial conductivity". Scalepowder, from Radz-at-Han, with special aetherial properties. It's totally just ground-up Vrtra scales.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:47
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I think Harrow's on the money, personally, though I do agree it can be sorta up to interpretation. As for my character, and myself as a player, I do enjoy the fighting, the adventuring, the boss fights and the grand, noble conflict of it all. Narratively speaking, it's much more satisfying to work and fight for the good of the world than to just be handed it. Zenos had me dead to rights, motivations-wise - I could only agree. Helps that my WoL is a black mage, who I assume enjoy blowing things up as a job requirement. So much the better if it's for a good cause.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:48
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Cythereal posted:Personally, no, I don't enjoy a good boss fight and the Endsinger was a drag. I'm here for the story, the setting, and the characters, I actively dislike how difficult many story-mandated fights have become. I think that whole thing falls so completely flat for me because no, I don't enjoy the boss fights. I enjoy the feeling of helping people and making the world a better place. It is not a writing flaw that the game assumes you did not hate the gameplay of the game you put 200+ hours in.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:50
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Magil Zeal posted:It also gives Estinien some good lines and more of a reason to be along for the ride this time, given his own history with dragonkind. He gets to show, now that the circumstances are different, he can have a different attitude towards dragonkind despite his history. He gets to show he's grown, and he doesn't feel like the Scions' awkward hanger-on which he easily could have if he didn't have any non-comedic moments to contribute early on. Good shout, I didn't even think of that. Thavnair is just Ishgard 2!!!!
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Dec 20, 2021 17:50
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Cythereal posted:And it's easily my least favorite part of the game. Shadowbringers and Endwalker have started to legitimately frustrate me with their difficulty. My group finally got the last EW trial down with about ten minutes left on the clock. I mean, the trials in Endwalker didn't seem that difficult, but I recognise this is more a personal taste thing and I've been doing extremes and savages in the lead up to Endwalker (also the visual spectacle of the trials in Endwalker owns and make them some of the most fun I've had in this game). ImpAtom posted:It is not a writing flaw that the game assumes you did not hate the gameplay of the game you put 200+ hours in. Basically this I guess?
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Dec 20, 2021 17:51
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ImpAtom posted:It is not a writing flaw that the game assumes you did not hate the gameplay of the game you put 200+ hours in. it's truly incredible that someone has to be told this lmfao
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Dec 20, 2021 17:54
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The final trial of EW is probably the easiest of the expansion. Now trial 2, trial 2 destroys pug groups to a comical degree.ImpAtom posted:It is not a writing flaw that the game assumes you did not hate the gameplay of the game you put 200+ hours in. SurprisedPikachu.jpg
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Dec 20, 2021 17:54
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I spent 45 mins in the 2nd trial helping a friend clear because the randos we got matched with just weren't picking up the mechanics, so there's deffo some harder skill checks being added to the game as times goes on. I do generally like that the game pushes you a bit as you move through the expansions, even if it leads to the rare "I keep explaining susano to these brand new healers but they're not getting it and we're two pulls away from timing out the instance" moments.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:55
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ImpAtom posted:It is not a writing flaw that the game assumes you did not hate the gameplay of the game you put 200+ hours in. The trials and big fights are a tiny part of that 200+ hours. They're a nuisance I put up with to get at the gameplay I do enjoy.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:55
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I actually found Trial 2 pretty easy, even on its EX version. Now, trial 1 and specially THAT attack, on the other hand...
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Dec 20, 2021 17:56
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Cythereal posted:Personally, no, I don't enjoy a good boss fight and the Endsinger was a drag. I'm here for the story, the setting, and the characters, I actively dislike how difficult many story-mandated fights have become. I think that whole thing falls so completely flat for me because no, I don't enjoy the boss fights. I enjoy the feeling of helping people and making the world a better place. It's a combat focused game which uses its combat to help convey the game's narrative. Not even just its boss fights, In From The Cold only works as a bit of story telling in the context of how much better we typically are at fights. If you don't like the game's core mechanics that's cool but it's weird to then say the game is determined to piss away its own story by utilizing and toying with said core mechanics.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:56
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Vitamean posted:I spent 45 mins in the 2nd trial helping a friend clear because the randos we got matched with just weren't picking up the mechanics, so there's deffo some harder skill checks being added to the game as times goes on. I do generally like that the game pushes you a bit as you move through the expansions, even if it leads to the rare "I keep explaining susano to these brand new healers but they're not getting it and we're two pulls away from timing out the instance" moments. But... you can trial 2 with a Trust and just blindly follow your allies?
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Dec 20, 2021 17:57
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stop responding to that poster
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Dec 20, 2021 17:57
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Cythereal posted:The trials and big fights are a tiny part of that 200+ hours. They're a nuisance I put up with to get at the gameplay I do enjoy. Crafting is an entirely optional part of that 200+ hours, the Trials are mandatory for the MSQ and have been the entire time. As are the dungeons, which have also gotten more difficult over time.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:57
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Cythereal posted:And it's easily my least favorite part of the game. Shadowbringers and Endwalker have started to legitimately frustrate me with their difficulty. My group finally got the last EW trial down with about ten minutes left on the clock. So wait is your problem just with trials or combat in general in the game? Why would you spend at minimum 300 hours on a game with probably 70% of stuff that you dislike?
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Dec 20, 2021 17:57
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Nibble posted:(Thavnair spoilers) Oh drat! Cool! I do think that the game's instanced fights have gotten gradually more and more challenging as time has gone on, but it's been a fairly gradual upwards ramping. More is asked of the player because the player can assume to have been exposed to more expected mechanics and concepts. They've got a hard balance to strike, making a fight feel cool while also be reasonably clearable by a team of randos of varying experience, and I think they succeed more often than they fail... and also, trials are generally a lot more butt-clenchy at launch with the mechanics being generally unknown and everyone's gear being a bit bad. I had to work for my story trial clears, at least a little, but I also enjoy that kind of challenge. There's not much the game can do to correct for "doesn't actually care much for the gameplay part of the game" when a percentage of the story is genuinely told through gameplay mechanics and engagement, though.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:58
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GiantRockFromSpace posted:I actually found Trial 2 pretty easy, even on its EX version. Now, trial 1 and specially THAT attack, on the other hand... You do EX1 enough and it's like you're plugged into the matrix and can see the mechanics happen before they happen. It's a weird sensation.
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Dec 20, 2021 17:59
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Clarste posted:But... you can trial 2 with a Trust and just blindly follow your allies? I say that to myself every time I get the fight in trials roulette with a first timer
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Dec 20, 2021 17:59
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central dogma posted:Is DRK still the worst feeling tank to sync lower level content due to the loss of TBN? Is there a tank that feels best? My tanks are all over level 60 but I haven't played them since EW. I haven't played any of them past leveling up to 60 (WAR), 70 (DRK) and 80 (GNB) yet except Paladin, which is my main at 90, so I may be off base. From what I'm aware of for the changes, I'd say Warrior would be the best when being synched down. They have a good self healing cooldown at 56 with Raw Intuition, followed immediately by Equilibrium at 58. Their rotation is also pretty satisfying by 50. Meanwhile, Paladin has basically all of it's defensive tools up and running before 50, with Clemency at 58 being the most notable exception, but they don't start getting really good until above 80 (for example, their TBN analogue shows up at 35 but is really weak until 74 and doesn't get really good until 82). Their rotation is also really unsatisfying and rote until 68 with Requiescat, or maybe even 80 with Confiteor. I love it at anything 80 and up, but getting down below Requiescat it isn't nearly as fun. For Gunbreaker and Dark Knight I know basically nothing since I haven't played them enough in lower levels, so maybe they fit better.
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Dec 20, 2021 18:00
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Ibblebibble posted:You do EX1 enough and it's like you're plugged into the matrix and can see the mechanics happen before they happen. It's a weird sensation. EX1 has exactly one mechanic with any sort of serious haste/tight timing and it totally throws off my groove for the entire thing because otherwise it's a bunch of stand in the safe spot up to several seconds in advance fight.
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Dec 20, 2021 18:00
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Spudd posted:Man I didn't pick up any of that in my entrie experience of this game I thought it was more like the characters liked me because of just how insanely strong I am and how I charge head first into any problem without a care just because it's the right thing to do. Honestly WoL perfectly reflects me in being a deep, deep oblivious idiot who doesn’t have a romantic bone in their body. The difference is that I’m aware of it and Ceail is not.
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Dec 20, 2021 18:01
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GiantRockFromSpace posted:I actually found Trial 2 pretty easy, even on its EX version. Now, trial 1 and specially THAT attack, on the other hand... I agree, Trial 2 EX just feels easier to read and adapt to for me, at least as a healer. Also, assuming you mean the same THAT attack as I think you do, perfect username/post combo. 
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Dec 20, 2021 18:02
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Erwin the German posted:I think Harrow's on the money, personally, though I do agree it can be sorta up to interpretation. As for my character, and myself as a player, I do enjoy the fighting, the adventuring, the boss fights and the grand, noble conflict of it all. Narratively speaking, it's much more satisfying to work and fight for the good of the world than to just be handed it. Zenos had me dead to rights, motivations-wise - I could only agree. Helps that my WoL is a black mage, who I assume enjoy blowing things up as a job requirement. So much the better if it's for a good cause. Exactly the same but as RDM. The wry, pumped smile you give during the response under that stylish as gently caress RDM hat was amazing
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Dec 20, 2021 18:05
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both of them in general have really lax timings for mechanics, imo. especially fond of the spread mechanic in the first half of EX2 cause it comes out seconds after its paired mechanic that I've seen some cold blooded murders happen from people closing in before the whole mechanic resolved.
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Dec 20, 2021 18:05
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Vitamean posted:both of them in general have really lax timings for mechanics, imo. *laughs awkwardly in Shining Saber -> Water Crystallize*
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Dec 20, 2021 18:08
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Neurotic Roleplay posted:stop responding to that poster I think I've been saying this for at least three MMOs now.
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Dec 20, 2021 18:09
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Cythereal posted:The trials and big fights are a tiny part of that 200+ hours. They're a nuisance I put up with to get at the gameplay I do enjoy. Trials, dungeons, and duties make up a significant part of the majority of the game's story. Like if you play for just crafting that is fine but the MSQ does not let you craft through it as hilarious and rad as that would be. It is like complaining the main story doesn't reflect the fact you only play the game for PVP.
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Dec 20, 2021 18:11
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I am extremely bad at the game's combat mechanics and that is frustrating at times but I get through them for the sake of seeing more story
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Dec 20, 2021 18:11
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(ending spoilers) I have no real issue with Zenos kool-aid manning himself into the final boss arena. but I'm annoyed that his central thesis statement of "you're just like me" goes unopposed really, even if you pick the "you're a rabid dog who needs to be put down" line. He's come to the realization that the motivation doesn't matter so long as he gets the fight he wants, but he still wants you to be a fight man like himself and rejects any other option.
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Dec 20, 2021 18:13
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ImpAtom posted:It is not a writing flaw that the game assumes you did not hate the gameplay of the game you put 200+ hours in. can we make this the subtitle of the entire Games forum somehow
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Dec 20, 2021 18:14
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