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Does anyone else find it sorta odd that it's widely accepted by, if not actual Biblical canon, then wider Christian cultural tradition, that if you go far enough East you just find Sorcerer Kings? Like if you go just a little past the Tigris and Euphrates there are just civilizations apparently ruled by enlightened Magicians who can intuit the will of God better than any other mortal at the time, and can anticipate the coming of Christ. And they show up to give baby Jesus symbolically important riches, leave, and they are never mentioned anywhere before or since. What? Like people were writing the Bible and were all "Hey, you think we should talk more about these kingdoms of unfathomable wealth and esoteric knowledge just past the Parthian Empire? I hear they're ruled by benevolent Wizard Saints." "...naw, more Letters to the Ephesians"
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Dec 21, 2021 19:00
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 19:10 |
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Tldr
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Dec 21, 2021 19:00
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They were wise guys, OP. Jesus was eh... ya know. A friend of ours, let's say.
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Dec 21, 2021 19:04
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I think it’s implied that they were dimensional travelers
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Dec 21, 2021 19:10
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The number three is never actually specified in the Bible, either. So there may very well have been an army of powerful mages who gathered for the birth of Jesus. Realistically, we probably had at least one magical duel take place.
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Dec 21, 2021 19:13
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It was made up after the fact, which is why it makes no sense, because it didn’t actually happen.
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Dec 21, 2021 19:14
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we three kings be stealin' the gold my friends all drive porsches i must make amends
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Dec 21, 2021 19:16
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They’re gay OP
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Dec 21, 2021 19:21
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A Fancy Hat posted:The number three is never actually specified in the Bible, either. His birth was a real bloodbath if you simply read between the lines.
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Dec 21, 2021 19:23
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idk what actual christian theologians say, there's probably books and books written exploring this, but the real answer is it was probably just widely accepted at the time that there was something magic over there, so when the story was written it didn't seem weird, right? afaik it's a pretty common thing in human history for cultures to regard certain foreign cultures with which they have limited contact as having mastered some unexplained mystical knowledge or practice (for a while the west saw the middle east and later india this way, and I want to say traditionally japan saw china this way) there's like a whole school of bible studyers that just try to figure out what in the bible is historical record and what's made up (like, sans religious belief)mand my understanding is they think basically the whole story of jesus' birth is hosed, because the idea that the romans made mary and joseph return to their homeland for tax purposes or whatever doesn't make sense and isn't based on anything we know of roman law, and it's also extraordinarily convenient because it establishes jesus as a descendent of king david which was a requirement to be the messiah or something. wouldn't be at all surprised to learn the people who wrote the bible just had folk beliefs about their neighbors the way we used to think shaolin monks could float and poo poo source: heresy, hearsay
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Dec 21, 2021 19:28
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op you should ask gene cos hes old
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Dec 21, 2021 19:32
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Them being three wise men is due to a mistranslation of the Greek dialect the New Testament was written in. Modern interpretations reveal that the three wise men were actually a English man, a Spaniard, and a Frenchman, and they gave Jesus the punchline to a racist joke.
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Dec 21, 2021 19:33
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we three king of orient are full of magic and sorcerous fire meteor swarm, acid storm wishing for more power oh, spells of wonder, spells of night magic missiles shining bright bigby's grasping hand's collapsing may our foes all flub their rolls
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Dec 21, 2021 19:36
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*Balthasar slides into the stable* "I got the baby a gift" "what'd you get him?" "Frankincense" "Frankincense? What's a baby gonna do with frankincense?"
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Dec 21, 2021 19:39
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A Fancy Hat posted:The number three is never actually specified in the Bible, either. Well, things like that always seem to happen in threes or sevens. And if it's seven wise guys? Gold, frankincense, myrrh, silver, pearls, uh...did I say frankincense already? And Sneezy.
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Dec 21, 2021 19:42
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gleebster posted:Well, things like that always seem to happen in threes or sevens. And if it's seven wise guys? Gold, frankincense, myrrh, silver, pearls, uh...did I say frankincense already? And Sneezy. Sneezy was the name of the slave he was gifted.
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Dec 21, 2021 20:01
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What kind of names are Kaspar, Melchior, and Balthasar anyway?? Doesn't sound very past-Parthian Empire if you ask me.
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Dec 21, 2021 20:37
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Kaspar the Friendly Wise Man Melchior is melancholy and Balthasar is a bit of a B
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Dec 21, 2021 20:41
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The Three Wise Men is just a euphemism for three dudes suckin each other's dicks on a daisy chain, not really a big deal.
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Dec 21, 2021 20:45
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was there ever a three stooges short where they were the three wise men? seems like a missed opportunity if not
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Dec 21, 2021 20:46
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two of them were just Alatar and Pallando coming back from the far east after having finally sobered up a bit
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Dec 21, 2021 20:50
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The three wise men were just Shaman Kings, that's easy, they made a whole show about that. What I really wanna know is their deal with the little drummer boy. Who would tell a kid they need to come see a newborn, and then add "yeah, bring your drum and play that by the baby. Everyone will love that, including the newborn"
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Dec 21, 2021 21:01
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Nigmaetcetera posted:It was made up after the fact, which is why it makes no sense, because it didn’t actually happen. It's real, I was there, I can testify three wizards came bearing gifts of gold, murre, and frankenstein.
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Dec 21, 2021 21:04
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sometimes there are three wise men and they simply know what's up. that's all there is to it.
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Dec 21, 2021 21:05
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im saint germain posted:The three wise men were just Shaman Kings, that's easy, they made a whole show about that. What I really wanna know is their deal with the little drummer boy. Who would tell a kid they need to come see a newborn, and then add "yeah, bring your drum and play that by the baby. Everyone will love that, including the newborn" He's a musician, gotta jump on any gig you can get. Especially when you hear there are wise men and stuff? Plus a baby being born? Easy money, get in there, play some songs, get out with some cash.
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Dec 21, 2021 21:07
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extremely wise man sitting in his castle with all his goats and computers and gold. "drat I just did the math and this baby is gonna be born in a way so bad rear end i'm getting in on it." meanwhile another wiseman is sifting through his data lakes coming to the same conclusion. The third? He simply knew.
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Dec 21, 2021 21:07
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Mystery cults and magicians were a big thing back then. It's like a meme. Flossing over the baby and doing gangnam style will be how the Lord's return will be announced.
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Dec 21, 2021 21:13
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More like three extremely dumb men following some stupid star. Whoa the north star, it's telling me to go... north! 
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Dec 21, 2021 21:15
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Do Shemp, Joe Besser, or Joe DeRita count as wise men?
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Dec 21, 2021 21:15
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Mooey Cow posted:More like three extremely dumb men following some stupid star. Whoa the north star, it's telling me to go... north! mooey have you considered following your star?
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Dec 21, 2021 21:18
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if i was a wise man i would probably get jesus Dragon Quest XI S: Echoes of an Elusive Age - Definitive Edition so he could experience the best jrpg ever made
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Dec 21, 2021 21:25
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Their names are different in different traditions, too. From Wikipedia:quote:Balthasar, Melqon, Gaspar Those are all awesome names. According to the first source, Balthasar was king of India, Melqon was king of Persia, and Gaspar was king of Arabia. Obviously, Indian and Arabia were not politically unified in 4 BC, and the king of the Parthians at the time was Phraates IV, so yeah, that's kind of silly. I'm mostly familiar with Catholic scholarship on the subject, so all I can say is that it's typically taken steps to isolate the sparse details in Matthew 2 from the millennia of folklore that have accumulated around it. For example, as mentioned, there's no mention of three visitors, just three gifts. They weren't even necessarily kings: seeing the Magi as royal may originate in a desire to have the nativity fulfill messianic readings of Psalm 72, "May all kings fall down before him, all nations serve him". Pope Benedict XVI said it's possible that they were Zoroastrian priests from Persia, or something else entirely.
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Dec 21, 2021 21:40
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Maybe the real question OP is why are three men bringing gifts to a new born child? The mom is a virgin so it's not like they had sex with her and thought the kid was theirs or something. "Hey, there's a bastard kid that just got birthed in this manger over here, lets bring him all sorts of gifts!"
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Dec 21, 2021 21:49
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They were blue wizards mentioned in historical document Silmarillion
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Dec 21, 2021 22:16
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Pee pies when?
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Dec 21, 2021 22:47
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The real real question is what happened to all that cash? I think Joseph just blew it all at a casino.
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Dec 22, 2021 01:23
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The King of Ethiopia always gets put in the back of the nativity.
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Dec 22, 2021 01:30
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SLICK GOKU BABY posted:Maybe the real question OP is why are three men bringing gifts to a new born child? The mom is a virgin so it's not like they had sex with her and thought the kid was theirs or something. They were dumb out-of touch gifts, too. Hey, let’s give this newborn baby which we know nothing about gold and tree resin instead of, you know, diapers and formula. Yeah, real wise, men 
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Dec 22, 2021 02:07
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What the hell, man? You got the kid gold? We set a 50 dollar gift limit!
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Dec 22, 2021 02:14
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 19:10 |
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Mozi posted:was there ever a three stooges short where they were the three wise men? seems like a missed opportunity if not Moe smacking the poo poo out of Jesus, Mary, and Joseph with one long, continuous open hand slap
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Dec 22, 2021 02:20
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