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checkplease posted:I haven't watched the Wiz, but whats the Man of Steel connection? Man of Steel makes a ton of fairly direct visual references to the Matrix trilogy - most obviously with its pod-grown Kryptonians and an improved version of the ‘Super Burly Brawl’ at the end. In general, “Krypton” is a plausible depiction of a post-truce Matrix universe’s far future, where humanity has fully merged with the matrix-machines. Then, thematically, you have a genuinely new messianic figure “doing [the] superman thing again.” If you want to go real nuts, you could say that the golden skull from which Kal-El is gifted the ‘source code’ of Krypton is literally Neo’s skull.
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Jan 3, 2022 23:33
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moths posted:I wonder if she was aware of the thematic disconnect; Lana is trying to fit a message that boring and safe is bad into a boring film that she was the safe choice to direct. Ressurections takes no real chances, delivers a whole lot of Matrix, and feels like a film full of contempt for itself. 100% otm
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Jan 4, 2022 01:07
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RBA Starblade posted:Saints Row 4 was one giant Matrix reference, though FEAR's the one with the bullet time mechanics and debris flying off the walls. I replayed FEAR last year to see if it was as good as I remember and it's still great really well done bullet time mechanics and great horror atmosphere.
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Jan 4, 2022 01:27
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checkplease posted:Why say its obviously not great if you haven't watched it. Overwhelmingly negative to mixed reviews I've seen so far. Of course they could all be wrong but... unlimited shrimp posted:Love it or forget it, I don't think you'll hate it or regret watching it. sigher posted:I replayed FEAR last year to see if it was as good as I remember and it's still great really well done bullet time mechanics and great horror atmosphere.
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Jan 4, 2022 01:50
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checkplease posted:Why say its obviously not great if you haven't watched it. A guy at the New Year's party I was at started an argument with me about how this wasn't a good movie, after I'd told him I'd seen it and enjoyed it, despite having not seen it, but based on what he'd seen on YouTube Coincidentally I have had the exact same exchange with someone about the Last Jedi who hadn't seen it
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Jan 4, 2022 02:24
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Everybody knows you don't need to watch things or form your own opinions anymore. Just watch YouTube videos, absorb whatever the general consensus is, then regurgitate it. Never watch a movie again, just discuss. Enjoying things is no longer needed, just as long as you can make small talk about the latest media thing.
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Jan 4, 2022 02:43
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King Vidiot posted:I'd like to see a Matrix VR game if nothing else. The closest we have now are Superhot and Pistol Whip, maybe moments in Blade & Sorcery when you slow down time and grab dude's swords and hit them in the face with their own swords. Pistol Whip is much more of a John Wick simulator than a Matrix simulator (and it is also very fun, highly recommend for anyone who has a VR set)
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Jan 4, 2022 03:25
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:Man of Steel makes a ton of fairly direct visual references to the Matrix trilogy - most obviously with its pod-grown Kryptonians and an improved version of the ‘Super Burly Brawl’ at the end. There's some neat relations like where Clark must learn what it is to be an alien/God and Neo in his journey gets to learn what it is to be program/machine. Both have to try to understand what it means to be Gods and what their role is. And both have their relationships (lois/Trinity) that function to keep their humanity. So in this movie we also get a BvS team up with Smith functioning as batman. Sure, they both fight it out at first, but then they come together to defeat some common menace. Only in this one, Trinity keeps Neo from being sacrificed and having to be reborn again.
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Jan 4, 2022 03:36
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mobby_6kl posted:Overwhelmingly negative to mixed reviews I've seen so far. Of course they could all be wrong but... Its about 63% on rotten tomato with both critic and audience. So assuming a normal distribution, you have an overwhelmingly positive review for each largely negative one. But yeah it’s not generic at least, tries some weird things, and you can tell Lana loves the world of the matrix (neo and trinity especially).
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Jan 4, 2022 03:42
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The real problem is that the film isn’t nearly weird enough. There’s some real Force Awakens vibes when the characters stand around the spaceship Memory all hugging and praising each-other. It doesn’t help that Jada Pinkett’s doing a dead-on Maz Kanata. Like, I was told this was a Gremlins 2. I’m not sure people have watched Gremlins 2 recently, ‘cause this ain’t it. It’s worth noting that, if the whole thing is a ‘videogame’, the baddy is crafting the very unmarketable narrative about coping with depression, while the heroes are firmly on the side of dumbassed zombie slaughter (+ endboss where you fight two (2) helicopters!).
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Jan 4, 2022 04:02
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The action is exceedingly generic unfortunately, which is a big problem if you are making an action blockbuster. Some of the story is fairly interesting, but if that's what you are after then why watch an action blockbuster?
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Jan 4, 2022 04:44
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that's the beauty of it: it's not an action blockbuster
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Jan 4, 2022 04:52
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VROOM VROOM posted:that's the beauty of it: it's not an action blockbuster There are like a dozen distinct action sequences.
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Jan 4, 2022 05:00
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Sure there’s action. But this feels like an issue of labels. Though why does it even matter if it is or isn’t called an action blockbuster. You can critique the action scenes regardless.
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Jan 4, 2022 05:03
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:The real problem is that the film isn’t nearly weird enough. There’s some real Force Awakens vibes when the characters stand around the spaceship Memory all hugging and praising each-other. It doesn’t help that Jada Pinkett’s doing a dead-on Maz Kanata. Agreed calling it Gremlins 2 isn’t quite right. Both are self aware and critique sequels, and both are wb, but I think the tones differ. Gremlins 2 is much more cartoony (which is a lot of fun there). New matrix by the end is happy to have neo and trinity back. Also in Rambo 2, John Rambo only had to fight one helicopter. 2 is twice is difficult.
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Jan 4, 2022 05:07
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:There are like a dozen distinct action sequences. The Matrix has maybe 7 depending on how you slice them, but is what what makes it an action movie? checkplease posted:Agreed calling it Gremlins 2 isn’t quite right. Both are self aware and critique sequels, and both are wb, but I think the tones differ. Gremlins 2 is much more cartoony (which is a lot of fun there). New matrix by the end is happy to have neo and trinity back. in The Matrix they fight one helicopter and in Resurrections they fight 2 AND they have pilots this time! that's AT LEAST twice as difficult!
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Jan 4, 2022 05:25
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imagine if you were the agent that took over the helicopter pilot in The Matrix and decided to fight them and lose instead of just shooting them with the helicopter. I'd be so embarrassed
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Jan 4, 2022 05:26
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Rabelais D posted:The action is exceedingly generic unfortunately, which is a big problem if you are making an action blockbuster. I’m watching a movie called the matrix resurrections
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Jan 4, 2022 05:28
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I mean sure, label it what you will, but there are half a dozen action setpieces that aren't filmed particularly well and aren't that interesting to watch.
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Jan 4, 2022 05:38
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Yeah. But the movie was still very enjoyable.
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Jan 4, 2022 05:38
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I wish there were a hundred more cuts per second in each fight scene and I wish it was 9 hours long instead of the paltry 7 we were given.
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Jan 4, 2022 05:57
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checkplease posted:Sure there’s action. But this feels like an issue of labels. Though why does it even matter if it is or isn’t called an action blockbuster. You can critique the action scenes regardless. Calling it a blockbuster action movie isn’t terribly important, but it is important to look at the form of the narrative. Like, a popular take ITT is that ‘Matrix 4 subverts expectations by being a love story’. “This logic of the production of the couple has a long history in Hollywood. Whatever the story is about - it may be about the end of the world, an asteroid threatening the very survival of humanity, or a great war, whatever - as a rule, we always have a couple whose link is threatened and who somehow through this ordeal at the end happily gets together. ... We can see how ideology works effectively here. We have two superficial levels. All the fascination of the accident, then the love story. But all this, which is quite acceptable for our liberal progressive minds, all this is just a trap. Something to lower our attention threshold, as it were - to open us up, to be ready to accept the true conservative message of rich people having tried to re-vitalize themselves by ruthlessly appropriating the vitality of the poor people.” Zizek is referring to how the moneyed character Rose, in Titanic experiences an emotional/spiritual awakening through what we could call poverty tourism. And this, in a way, serves as a redemption of the Titanic disaster: it teaches us that rich and poor can put aside their differences, work together and get along.... All that’s necessary is to do away with those Billy Zanes. This is the ideology of the film. Matrix 4 isn’t altogether different here. People who’ve paid attention to prior Matrix films might note that this flying-into-the-sunset ending actually just brings us back to partway through Matrix 2, where Neo doesn’t yet know that he was designed to bring a false freedom that guarantees stability. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 07:04 on Jan 4, 2022 |
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Jan 4, 2022 06:02
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Holy poo poo, I completely forgot they fought two helicopters. I think I forgot about them the moment they went off-screen.
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Jan 4, 2022 06:17
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That’s because they went through the effort of filming on a real building with real helicopters, and then directed them to hover still and shoot at one spot. They put so much effort into these practical stunts and they have absolutely zero weight to them. What a waste of…everything?
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Jan 4, 2022 06:38
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moths posted:Holy poo poo, I completely forgot they fought two helicopters. I think I forgot about them the moment they went off-screen. well you're supposed to forget the second one when it goes offscreen so they can kiss, which is why it's a funny punchline when it returns and you get scared and then they literally say "bye" and fly away without fighting it yes yes, much like Reloaded, Resurrections challenges one to question the revolutionary potential of The Matrix, and of commercial entertainment in general. but you say it as if it is a bad thing.
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Jan 4, 2022 07:18
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At the end of the matrix 2, Neo learns that his Messiah tale has been coopted as a system of control. But he likely still has the ideal of freeing everyone in the matrix and stopping the machines. In Resurrections, Neo has by now seen that Man, Machine, Program are all equivalent life and have a right to exist. An uneasy peace has been formed with IO being the utopia city and the machines still have a matrix for their power source. At the end of the film, Neo and Trinity do not seek to end the Matrix or free all from it. They learn that they can also not remove the Analyst. Instead they promise simply to use their great power to make it a better matrix. Rainbow skies and all. Here it seems its an acceptance of capitalism but of the social democracy flavor. This won't be a total free market with the invisible hand of the Analyst ruling it all. This will be the matrix of universal healthcare and affordable housing.
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Jan 4, 2022 07:57
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Given that in the world of the Matrix the human mind can't accept anything too fantastical, aren't they just going to end up killing people by creating "rainbow skies?"
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Jan 4, 2022 08:51
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It's 14,000 years ago and we've hit extinction level environmental ruin. Scientists are trying to figure out how to keep humanity occupied as cool squid robots clean up the Earth, Wall-E style. Eventually they settle on moving the population underground, using a self-sustaining artificial reality that keeps our minds occupied. Group shot of an androgynous group in a science lab. Everyone is dressed like this KMFDM promo photo:  "But what will power all these machines?" asks President Tesla Zuckerberg of the Neo-Liberal MechaEarth 3 Alliance. "That's the magical part," says Lead Techbro Roark (Hugo Weaving in a conventional busines suit.) "We will!" "But what about the poor and non-English speakers? The post-terfs and hyper-conservatives? The working class?" "Well..." Weaving closes a drawer, concealing a bookmarked and worn copy of Atlas Shrugged "we can't save everybody." A mediocre Rage Against the Machine cover plays as credits roll. Ok that's my pitch for Matrix: REORIGINS.
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Jan 4, 2022 10:14
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checkplease posted:
Considering that the Matrix got a lot of its power from edging Neo and Trinity in their pods, and now that humans helped break them out, won't a new war start up again tho?
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Jan 4, 2022 10:22
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:It doesn’t help that Jada Pinkett’s doing a dead-on Maz Kanata. Holy poo poo you're right. PeterCat posted:Given that in the world of the Matrix the human mind can't accept anything too fantastical, aren't they just going to end up killing people by creating "rainbow skies?" I mean, technically yes, but Neo murders tons of normal people in the original film so who cares about that. However flies around so... but, how is anything in the Matrix going to be "too much" for the human mind when Neo wakes up in the literal nightmare that is the real world and comes out of it just fine.
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Jan 4, 2022 10:33
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Morpheus should have been played by a mo-capped all cgi Cowboy Curtis with the voice sounding like fishburnes using deep fake audio.
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Jan 4, 2022 10:37
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causing matrix citizens stress and anxiety (social media) makes them heat up more for the matrix battery charger (engagement) so rainbow skies would rile them up further for mad gains
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Jan 4, 2022 10:46
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sigher posted:Holy poo poo you're right. SMG dropping truth bombs like this is what makes CineD worth reading.
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Jan 4, 2022 11:52
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I guess my biggest issue with the movie is that it takes all the worst parts of the old movies (story doesn't make sense, high school philosophy) and focuses on that while completely abandoning all the best parts of the old movies (stunts, everything is GREEN, trench coats). The Matrix trilogy was not that deep of a story. Resurrections is kind of dissecting the butterfly. I think this is one instance where they should have just made the "safe" reboot.
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Jan 4, 2022 13:46
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Nuts and Gum posted:That’s because they went through the effort of filming on a real building with real helicopters, and then directed them to hover still and shoot at one spot. They put so much effort into these practical stunts and they have absolutely zero weight to them. What a waste of…everything? It's even dumber because vehicles that aren't crashing are one of the few things that look great 100% CGI'd. CGI cars and trucks are all over the place in movies and we never notice them.
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Jan 4, 2022 15:52
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VROOM VROOM posted:much like Reloaded, Resurrections challenges one to question the revolutionary potential of The Matrix, and of commercial entertainment in general. but you say it as if it is a bad thing. The issue is: what revolutionary potential? This is where various commentators will jump in to say that the (bad) matrix-machines represent facebook or transphobia or 'SJWs' or immigrants or whatever. As Zizek notes, on the topic of Jaws: “the function of the shark is to unite all these fears so that we can, in a way, trade all these fears for one fear alone.” On Matrix 1: "is it not that The Matrix is one of the films which function as a kind of Rorschach test, setting in motion the universalized process of recognition, like the proverbial painting of God which seems always to stare directly at you, from wherever you look at it - practically every orientation seems to recognize itself in it?" This is the proper insight of the 'brainstorming session' sequence: the Matrix movies aren't a metaphor 'for' anything. They are just straightforwardly presenting the fantasy that everything bad in life can be traced back to the actions of the giant robot head: "another Other who, hidden behind the Other of the explicit social texture, programs (what appears to us as) the unforeseen effects of social life and thus guarantees its consistency: beneath the chaos of market, the degradation of morals, etc., there is the purposeful strategy of the Jewish plot... This paranoiac stance acquired a further boost with today's digitalization of our daily lives: when our entire (social) existence is progressively externalized-materialized in the big Other of the computer network, it is easy to imagine an evil programmer erasing our digital identity and thus depriving us of our social existence, turning us into non-persons." As noted before, the basic pernicious trick of the whole Matrix series is to say that systemic problems inside the matrix (and the symptoms thereof) aren't real. Extreme poverty and homelessness inside the matrix are just an illusion, as one person argued earlier in the thread; the homeless are all secretly well-taken care of by the bad machines and, in return, function as their secret footsoldiers.
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Jan 4, 2022 16:14
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moths posted:Group shot of an androgynous group in a science lab. Everyone is dressed like this KMFDM promo photo: Killing Morpheus loving Didn't Matter
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Jan 4, 2022 16:19
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checkplease posted:At the end of the matrix 2, Neo learns that his Messiah tale has been coopted as a system of control. But he likely still has the ideal of freeing everyone in the matrix and stopping the machines. Neo had already learned that machines had individual self-determination in Reloaded and that they have a right to exist is fully reinforced by Revolutions in the Mobil Ave scene. It's actually worse when we see that in IO, machines are forced to live in the human domain. If IO was an egalitarian society it should have been a mix of the real and virtual, a place where programs and people can live, have relationships and work together in the caves or in digital constructs. The ending of Resurrections is the "paradise" Matrix that Smith described in the first movie in which everything will likely collapse again making the conclusion even more farcical than the rainbow "no meaningful change to the economy" ending of Revolutions. I'm fully pushing that Matrix 4 is worse than any of the trilogy now.
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Jan 4, 2022 16:51
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Bedshaped posted:Neo had already learned that machines had individual self-determination in Reloaded and that they have a right to exist is fully reinforced by Revolutions in the Mobil Ave scene. It's actually worse when we see that in IO, machines are forced to live in the human domain. If IO was an egalitarian society it should have been a mix of the real and virtual, a place where programs and people can live, have relationships and work together in the caves or in digital constructs. We literally see humans and programs working together in IO. They are not "forced" to be there with humans. You dont see a program in chains with a guard. And besides, we do see everyone interact with Sati in a virtual construct, just as you want to see. And in the ship, machine, program, and humans are all working as one team in the real world and in the matrix. Its fair to want more time in IO, but its definitely shown and described by all as the revolutions ideal society.
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Jan 4, 2022 16:57
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Archer666 posted:Considering that the Matrix got a lot of its power from edging Neo and Trinity in their pods, and now that humans helped break them out, won't a new war start up again tho? From the plot, when neo is broken out of his pod, the matrix destablizes and a fail safe should have been activated to revert the matrix back to 1999 version. The Analyst halted this because he was sure he could get Neo to come back. When Trinity is finally removed and they meet together at the end, the Analyst states that the higher level machines tried to use this fail-safe, but could not because Trinity and Neo are preventing it. It seems that Neo and Trinity are keeping this version of the matrix stable at least and preventing another such war. The implication of course is that there is no going back to the old Matrix or the good/bad of 1999 society.
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Jan 4, 2022 17:05
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