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TheKingslayer posted:Seeing the elf decks makes me wish Abomination of Llanowar were a slightly better commander. My elf deck started off as that but Lathril just seemed to work way way better so I made the swap. Pretty drat satisfying to fill the table with little dudes. I run abomination in Lathril because ELFBALL even though it's so underwhelming every time it hits the board. It makes a nice giant blocker but it's just one creature.
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Jan 8, 2022 07:18
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Batterypowered7 posted:Alright, here's another attempt at a deck with a solid game plan: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/suWR5A_JfE-spJuioCRNLg Alright, I got 100 cards in there, but I don't have any of the one-sided wraths (Plague Wind, In Garruk's Wake, Kindred Dominance, etc), so it's all spot removal at the moment. Some cards that were/are under consideration: -Overwhelming Stampede -Beastmaster Ascension -Natural Order -Finale of Devastation -Various other tutors (Demonic, Vampiric, Worldly, Diabolic Intent) -Casualties of War -Maelstrom Pulse E: And there's no Jeweled Lotus for the chance of a T1 Commander, which is probably a mistake.
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Jan 8, 2022 07:26
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Party Miser posted:Makes total sense now. Your magic posts shall continue to be as good as your video game opinions are bad :P This is my most recent version of my Prosper pre con modified. https://archidekt.com/decks/1699947#Prosper_Work_in_Progress I put big dumb fun things like Dark Depths and Elbrus in just in case I can't get to marionette master or whatever else as a "normal" wincon. Come to think of it I need to stick Fireball, Lava Burst, and or Disintegrate just as a giant gently caress you direct damage spell. Cause I love Kamehamehas.
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Jan 8, 2022 08:27
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Jiro posted:This is my most recent version of my Prosper pre con modified. Banefire, so it can't be countered.
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Jan 8, 2022 08:32
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Batterypowered7 posted:Banefire, so it can't be countered. Banefire can't be countered if X > 5, Disintegrate will exile anything it kills, Lava Burst sort of can't be countered I need to look that one up in Gatherer. 
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Jan 8, 2022 08:48
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Batterypowered7 posted:And there's no Jeweled Lotus for the chance of a T1 Commander, which is probably a mistake. If you're going with cradle/jeweled lotus, is there a reason you don't have all the fast mana?
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Jan 8, 2022 08:59
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LibrarianCroaker posted:If you're going with cradle/jeweled lotus, is there a reason you don't have all the fast mana? I don't have an answer to that question!
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Jan 8, 2022 09:25
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Batterypowered7 posted:Alright, here's another attempt at a deck with a solid game plan: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/suWR5A_JfE-spJuioCRNLg Add Bolas' Citadel, Vitalize and Mobilize to take advantage of Lathril's activated ability
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Jan 8, 2022 16:06
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Silhouette posted:Add Bolas' Citadel, Vitalize and Mobilize to take advantage of Lathril's activated ability Average CMC is low, so will I be good to take advantage of Citadel, or should I also include Wellwisher and Essence Warden? E: I've got six 1-CMC, one 2-CMC (Priest of Titania), and three 3-CMC mana dorks. Do I even want to bother with Arcane Signet, Golgari Signet, Sol Ring, and Talisman of Resilience? That would free up four card slots for Citadel, Vitalize, Mobilize, and one other spell (maybe Natural Order or one of the others mentioned in the list). Batterypowered7 fucked around with this message at 19:28 on Jan 8, 2022 |
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Jan 8, 2022 17:50
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Toshimo posted:If you want my previous edition of "cards that were under a dollar when I made this list a couple of months ago and are actually quite good", then here's that one: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/rAj7puhPlEmtNnrIfeY5aw This is a really great list, thanks for putting it together! This and the other finance talk gets me wondering: I know that the "bottom" edge of budget cEDH as far as the budget brews people are concerned is $500. Looking through a lot of lists, it'll often be that $200-300 is tied up in only 2-3 cards, and the rest are $1 or under. This is unavoidable in some cases, such as Ghave who simply doesn't work without Earthcraft, or Elsha, who goes off best with a Sensei's Divining Top, or any of the various decks that use blinking/recasting Dockside Extortionist to go infinite. It's a lesser form of those budgetless decks where $13,000 of the $14,000 is tied up in Timetwister. So, my question is thus: is it possible to build a deck that could participate at the cEDH level wherein no card other than the commander costs more than $15? (I mean, the answer is yes, and I've seen Urza, Edric, Yuriko, and Yisan lists at $50 budgets (sans commander) that run very well, and where adding in Mox Diamonds and fetch lands and such would be at best slight speed improvements, but what other builds can rush out cheap combos and/or don't rely on terribly expensive combo enablers?)
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Jan 8, 2022 18:28
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You could probably just populate a blank decklist with staples and then filter by cost to see what gets cut off by budget, and then do an overlay of cards left vs a decklist. You could probably get reasonably close to some of the 4-5 color lists using only the good cheap stuff
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Jan 8, 2022 18:52
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At the level of $50/$15 per-card, I think you're gonna have a lot of trouble. You can cut the decks to the bone with budget replacements, but there's always something irreplaceable that is gonna rub up against that. Like the 3 big Orbs for Urza, all $20-$30 each. I just tried to budget-ify Urza, and it's hard getting under $1000, even. Urza has Snow Islands, and those alone are $50, and you need 0-cmc/1-cmc artifacts and mana positive rocks to generate infinite mana, few of which are actually cheap. If you're cutting basically everything in the $10-$50 range, you are missing basically all the good value cards like Rhystic Study, Esper Sentinel, Dockside, Sylvan Library, Necropotence, also. The combos will probably still work for the decks that work on a budget, but all the actual gameplay of developing boardstates and earning value goes away; I don't think it would feel like cEDH, it would just feel like mid-power EDH, with the occasional blowout when someone draws a combo + the limited fast mana in the deck. The $300-$500 range is probably the cheapest that is still gonna have the real feel of the matchups, even if you're building the decks that truly don't need any expensive pieces.
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Jan 8, 2022 19:26
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Toph Bei Fong posted:This is a really great list, thanks for putting it together! There's a Mikaeus the Unhallowed deck that can supposedly be made for $20, I'll try to dig it up. The idea is to use Mikaeus + Triskelion to blow away everyone.
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Jan 8, 2022 19:30
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Gynovore posted:There's a Mikaeus the Unhallowed deck that can supposedly be made for $20, I'll try to dig it up. The idea is to use Mikaeus + Triskelion to blow away everyone. I don't want to gatekeep the game based on price, I just want to see a deck I can click a link on and actually have it cost the same as the title of the article claims.
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Jan 8, 2022 19:46
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The notion that a $50 deck, or just about any precon, is going to run at a level that really even consistently hits its gameplan is one that Content Creators looking to get cheap clicks push readily and is largely incompatible with reality. The $100-200 range really can net you a competent deck in 1-2 colors fairly often, though, and a lot of that is in transferrable staples (and things you may already have), so much so, that I won't even look at the $50 decks full of mega-trash compromises, because the stuff there is often not really repurposable so you are really just pissing away money to make a bad deck to have to do the same thing again for your next deck. As far as keeping out $15 cards, that was a lot more tenable 5 or 10 years ago before people started driving up playables on the regular. It's probably somewhat doable now without totally compromising your deck, but it certainly cuts down a lot of viable commanders. Irreplaceable stuff like Phyrexian Altar just make certain lines unplayable. So, my general suggestion is: either start budgeting out key pieces that you want and just play what you have a little longer, or find a group that is comfortable with proxies so you don't have to worry about cost at all.
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Jan 8, 2022 19:50
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Yeah. I play on a "budget," but that has gone from "about 50 bux" six years ago to "ehhhhhh a couple hundo? 500?!" in 2022. That said, I'm never paying retail for any of that because I flip money cards on Cardsphere for moderately priced staples. (Flipping a foil fetchland for 2-3 shocklands/fastlands/painlands, for example). I'm a fan of playable jank as much as the next Filthy Casual, but even I can't build a fun, competitive deck for under 50 bux. You could have barely done that six years ago, and the market has blown that idea apart since then. There's plenty of ways to wheel and deal this dumb game for idiots, and there's enough formats to make several differentiated markets, that you can *spend* 50 bucks and add some old poo poo you might have lying around and make a decent non-cEDH deck. But the retail *value* of the deck is going to be $200+.
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Jan 8, 2022 20:23
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I think I'm gonna proxy that cEDH Adeline deck and maybe the Lathril deck once I feel like I've got a list I'm happy with. Thank you for all the help with it so far!
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Jan 8, 2022 20:45
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Railing Kill posted:Yeah. I play on a "budget," but that has gone from "about 50 bux" six years ago to "ehhhhhh a couple hundo? 500?!" in 2022. I stopped playing for about ten years and recently got back into it and I've run into this and it really stings. Several of the powerhouse decks that I had built when Wizards hadn't officially recognized the format are just too slow for Commander now. The only way I've been able to get the broken cards that are now considered color or format staples is to trade out of the collections I inherited from other people. (And while the classic money cards are long gone from those collections, I've been able to capitalize on the nouveau riche money cards.)
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Jan 8, 2022 21:01
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I brought my Drake posted:I stopped playing for about ten years and recently got back into it and I've run into this and it really stings. Several of the powerhouse decks that I had built when Wizards hadn't officially recognized the format are just too slow for Commander now. The only way I've been able to get the broken cards that are now considered color or format staples is to trade out of the collections I inherited from other people. (And while the classic money cards are long gone from those collections, I've been able to capitalize on the nouveau riche money cards.) I played from 1994-2001, sold off my collection no regrets; it helped pay for college), and got back in on the cheap back in 2015. I got back in with the help of a friend's collection that he gave to me as thanks for helping him with some poo poo. It wasn't a great collection, which is why he gave it away, but it had scores of Unglued lands. Because people who play this game are often insane, I was able to flip those lands alone for enough to float a substantial collection of EDH staples, just as/before the format was blowing up and prices were somewhat reasonable. Since then I spend modestly (maybe 50-100 bucks a year) getting new stuff to broaden the collection and flip money cards. I almost always get singles through Cardsphere, but I could easily see someone spending ten times what I do per year on this dumb game for idiots if they bought them. There's a reason a lot of folks ITT proxy heavily. Anyone playing cEDH would be daft not to, with the prices of cEDH staples being what they are.
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Jan 8, 2022 21:48
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Toph Bei Fong posted:This is a really great list, thanks for putting it together! Anje madness worldgorger used to be really cheap, and still is cheap, you just don't run badlands or imperial seal.
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Jan 8, 2022 22:01
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Am I the only one that doesn't look to buy singles at "near mint" most of the time?
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Jan 8, 2022 22:10
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Alright, I went ahead and just added cards to Lathril that I had under consideration: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/suWR5A_JfE-spJuioCRNLg I'm at 108 cards right now, so I'd have to cut eight. I was already considering just cutting the four mana producing artifacts, since I have ~10 dorks. I'm medium on Song of Freyalise and Harald Unites the Elves. They feel like cards the thread has warned against running before, ones that don't really do anything much when you're behind and are just winmore when you're ahead. Casualties of War can be a big X for One, but it's a sorcery and expensive to cast. Do I really want to take a turn off to blow up some permanents when I'd rather be turning elves sideways? What would you guys trim from the list, and are there any obvious adds that I missed? Batterypowered7 fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jan 8, 2022 |
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Jan 8, 2022 22:16
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Jiro posted:Am I the only one that doesn't look to buy singles at "near mint" most of the time?
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Jan 8, 2022 22:26
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You can build a good Gargos deck for less than $50, especially since it doesn't NEED expensive rocks to function. I think the most expensive card in my personal Gargos deck is Guardian Project, and it's only in there because I had one lying around.
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Jan 8, 2022 22:30
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Party Miser posted:lightly played can be almost indiscernible from near mint, but then i ordered a near mind that had a big ol dent in the middle. gotten some really good moderately played but also really bad. I got a great deal on an Ice Age MP Necropotence that I expected to look terrible but when I arrived it was pretty alright! Always be slumming it in LP/MP, especially if you're using one of the card trade sites. Lots of folks just default all of their want lists to NM without thinking to change it, so if you request LP or MP you can get hooked up in a hurry.
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Jan 8, 2022 22:49
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Railing Kill posted:I got a great deal on an Ice Age MP Necropotence that I expected to look terrible but when I arrived it was pretty alright! This is good advice. I’ll keep it in mind when I’m ordering cards after in the future.
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Jan 8, 2022 22:53
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 This is an MP Cover of Darkness I bought (unsleeved for the picture). You can barely see any of the knicks once it's sleeved. I'd gladly buy MP old cards if they all look about the same.
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Jan 8, 2022 22:57
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That's about what my Necropotence looks like. A+++ would by broken cardboard again
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Jan 8, 2022 22:59
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Jiro posted:Am I the only one that doesn't look to buy singles at "near mint" most of the time? Yesterday I traded for an HP Empress Galina for a dumb Zedruu deck and the other person wanted some older LP/MP 2-3 dollar cards for it. I have mixed feelings about Deckbox but people will usually cut you a deal on non-English cards or cards in bad condition. I'm one of those weirdos who doesn't mind either.
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Jan 8, 2022 23:14
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I brought my Drake posted:Yesterday I traded for an HP Empress Galina for a dumb Zedruu deck and the other person wanted some older LP/MP 2-3 dollar cards for it. I have mixed feelings about Deckbox but people will usually cut you a deal on non-English cards or cards in bad condition. I'm one of those weirdos who doesn't mind either. I’ve been (slowly) sorting through my childhood collection for stuff to put into commander decks and I’m sure some people in this thread would cry seeing the shape some pretty expensive cards are in. Doesn’t really matter to me since I don’t plan on selling ever but I do (double) sleeve everything now. Buying a few more ratty cards on the cheap would just fit right in.
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Jan 8, 2022 23:46
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My Ancient Tomb, Enlightened Tutor, and the Plateau in my Osgir deck are all damaged. I really enjoy finding damaged versions of cards I want for Commander and giving them safe and cozy forever homes in my decks, double sleeved and safe forever 
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Jan 9, 2022 00:02
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I'll take anything that's sleeve playable.
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Jan 9, 2022 03:27
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Jiro posted:Am I the only one that doesn't look to buy singles at "near mint" most of the time? My personal (loosely defined and malleable) algorithm: $1 or less: best quality and art, foil if possible $5 or less: best condition or art if possible, foil if it's a staple and not just a card I'm using just for one deck $10 or less: best condition or art if possible, foil if the price difference is just a couple dollars or if it's a staple card $50 or less: any card at this price or higher better be a staple. Best condition if possible, but LP/MP is fine. Foil if the price difference isn't too different from the nonfoil. Above $50: I'll usually take the best deal in the best condition I can get. If I'm buying a card at this price point I'm doing it because it is not only a staple but also a piece I typically expect to grow in value, so I want it to be as good as I can get. That's just my brainworms though. The logical side of me knows damaged cards are just as good, the lizard brain just isn't as excited to buy them. Also "near mint" and "lightly played" are pretty much the same thing in my eyes.
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Jan 9, 2022 03:27
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I got to see Wedding Ring in action for the first time yesterday. I got one and just stuck it in my Jared Carthalion deck because hey, it has white in it. Turns out Wedding Ring + Monarch is great
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Jan 9, 2022 17:35
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Honestly, I really like Blossoming Bogbeast as a cheap overrun effect. By itself, it gives +2/+2 and trample to your team, but with big life gains (Wellwisher?) you can make poo poo super fat.
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Jan 9, 2022 20:53
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Aniodia posted:Honestly, I really like Blossoming Bogbeast as a cheap overrun effect. By itself, it gives +2/+2 and trample to your team, but with big life gains (Wellwisher?) you can make poo poo super fat. Also, how could I forget the best Elf, Chameleon Colossus?
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Jan 9, 2022 20:59
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Batterypowered7 posted:Also, how could I forget the best Elf, Chameleon Colossus? my favorite elf is taurean mauler. it's amazing in my dwarf deck
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Jan 10, 2022 04:53
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Mitch, Jesus loving Christ, please go back to using a script, holy poo poo
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Jan 10, 2022 18:48
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Heath posted:Mitch, Jesus loving Christ, please go back to using a script, holy poo poo They doing the Neon Genesis Kamigawa thing today?
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Jan 10, 2022 18:51
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LoL Captain Mitch
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Jan 10, 2022 18:53
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