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mmkay
Oct 21, 2010

Saladman posted:

Malta's nice, I spent 5 days there in early December a few years ago. You could probably spend a week there without getting bored. 10 days would probably be pushing it.

Eh I spent 2 weeks there this September, had a very nice and chill time without getting bored or anything.

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MagicCube
May 25, 2004

I really enjoyed Malta - went in January 2017 for a week. Weather was decent, (pretty much) everyone speaks English and they drive on the left. Perfect for Brits in the winter.

I rented a car and drove around Malta and Gozo over 7 days based in Valletta and was able to see everything I wanted and then some. I lean towards Saladman's view, that near the end I was kind of running out of things to do so I spent my last day just driving around off the main roads (which was still very enjoyable).

Was luckily able to see the Azure Window just a couple of weeks before it was destroyed in a storm as well.

kiimo
Jul 24, 2003

I've skied all over the US and sure it is expensive but man did it kill me to go to Garmisch and not ski. Sure we did the spas and the fondue and the molly-laced debauchery but looking out over the dolomites from the train up from Trento, garmisch from the bars and the glacier from the top of zugspitze holy poo poo was the ski fever burning. Drinking in Innsbruck and being surrounded by towering peaks didn't help either. I should have budgeted it in.

Ferdinand Bardamu
Apr 30, 2013

whoa, a tourist in Trento? what did you see? I lived there for 2.5 years. I used to go to with friends/work colleagues to Cortina and Val Gardena. I don't know how to ski (lol), so I would sit by a fireplace and get drunk on amaro or brule. Love that memory.

Busy Bee
Jul 13, 2004

Saladman posted:

I'm assuming you're an intermediate skiier – i.e. can do any slope, but wouldn't do e.g. ski touring? I'd personally vote for the Italian Alps, whether near Torino or in the Dolomites. It's almost half the price of Switzerland or Austria, the infrastructure is nearly as good, and you get to be in Italy (although many of the skiing parts of Italy are culturally, ethnically, and linguistically Austrian, e.g. Merano).

It also kind of depends on where you can get reasonable flights, or if you would be driving from somewhere else in Europe and e.g. bring skis. I'm sure Georgia has great mountains but I doubt it has great infrastructure and you'd have to fly in.

On other thing would be how long would you go to a specific place? Like Meran 2000 is great and super cheap, but one day there and you've done every slope twice, so it'd be a boring place to spend anything more than a weekend unless you're an absolute beginner skier. If you wanted to spend a week, I'd go with either Andermatt, Zermatt (or better yet, Cervinia on the Italian side although I have not been there since they connected them a couple years ago), or St Moritz (if your budget is > €3500/week for a family), Chamonix, or Val Gardena (budget a minimum of like €2500/week for a family for lodging + skiing for France/Italy). All of those places have an absolute ridiculous number of slopes.

On that note though just for budgeting, poo poo's expensive if you don't have your own gear or friend/family place to stay for free/cheap. A weekly ski pass for a family of 4 is around €1000 in most places in Switzerland (or ~€200/day for shorter stays) then budget €250/day for basic lodging, and then maybe €150/week for renting skis+boots+poles (helmet is often free w/ rental of other stuff). If you don't have kids then budget like 70% as much as I've said above.

E: I don't remember where you live, but if you live in the US or Canada, then I wouldn't bother with a ski trip to Europe at all unless you're super rich, super passionate about it, or do it as a novelty single day as part of a larger trip. For a specific ski trip, IMHO spend less money and not have deal with jetlag and have a similar experience.

Really appreciate your advice, thank you!

That's right, I am an intermediate skier and I currently live in Germany.

I don't mind flying / driving and would like to get around 3 full days of skiing in. I've skied a lot at Keystone and Breckenridge and prefer long, well groomed slopes.

I would like to rent all the equipment and I'd say my budget for 3 full days of skiing, lodging, equipment etc should be around 1,000 to 1,500 Euros. More than likely, I would be traveling solo.

Bollock Monkey
Jan 21, 2007

The Almighty

MagicCube posted:

I really enjoyed Malta - went in January 2017 for a week. Weather was decent, (pretty much) everyone speaks English and they drive on the left. Perfect for Brits in the winter.

I rented a car and drove around Malta and Gozo over 7 days based in Valletta and was able to see everything I wanted and then some. I lean towards Saladman's view, that near the end I was kind of running out of things to do so I spent my last day just driving around off the main roads (which was still very enjoyable).

Was luckily able to see the Azure Window just a couple of weeks before it was destroyed in a storm as well.

Malta is sounding really interesting. How was driving around? Proximity to Italy makes me anxious about road etiquette!

kiimo
Jul 24, 2003

WaryWarren posted:

whoa, a tourist in Trento? what did you see? I lived there for 2.5 years. I used to go to with friends/work colleagues to Cortina and Val Gardena. I don't know how to ski (lol), so I would sit by a fireplace and get drunk on amaro or brule. Love that memory.

I was only there for a night and walked around the city for hours which isn’t that big so I did laps and had a fantastic meal. At first I was going to go to that restaurant that has Michelin stars but there was a wait turns out the food is just excellent everywhere there. Took a train out the next morning that was the most gorgeous train ride I’ve ever been on through the Alps in a blizzard

MagicCube
May 25, 2004

Bollock Monkey posted:

Malta is sounding really interesting. How was driving around? Proximity to Italy makes me anxious about road etiquette!

I didn't have any issues. Was actually my first time driving on the left and went very smoothly. Would say it's probably not far off from Italy in terms of road etiquette, but same as anywhere just drive defensively and you'll be fine. The biggest thing for me was how narrow some of the streets were. Didn't drive in Valletta and glad I didn't since the streets were tiny and some were quite steep. When I had gone they had just built a huge parking garage outside the city where I kept the rental car for my time there.

The ferry to Gozo is quick and frequent as well so it's a breeze to head over anytime. Overall it takes about 45 minutes to drive from one end of Malta to the other to give you an idea of the size.

asur
Dec 28, 2012

Busy Bee posted:

Really appreciate your advice, thank you!

That's right, I am an intermediate skier and I currently live in Germany.

I don't mind flying / driving and would like to get around 3 full days of skiing in. I've skied a lot at Keystone and Breckenridge and prefer long, well groomed slopes.

I would like to rent all the equipment and I'd say my budget for 3 full days of skiing, lodging, equipment etc should be around 1,000 to 1,500 Euros. More than likely, I would be traveling solo.

My knowledge is a little out of date, but Italian skiing was a lot cheaper than France, Switzerland, and Austria. Lift tickets are around 50 Euros, lodging can be found for about 100, and restaurants are fairly cheap. I would recommend Dolomiti SuperSki if you like long groomed mid level slopes. Only downside is getting there as you can't fly so you'd need to drive or see if there's a bus.

mmkay
Oct 21, 2010

Bollock Monkey posted:

Malta is sounding really interesting. How was driving around? Proximity to Italy makes me anxious about road etiquette!

If you're staying nearish Valetta, then you can also consider just using the buses - no need to worry about parking or narrow streets. The lines radiating outwards of the capital region should carry you to basically anywhere you'd want to sightsee. Also there's a new direct water tram from Valletta to Gozo that takes 45 minutes (pedestrians only, no cars on board). The ticket costs 21€ if you're staying for a week (the water tram route isn't included though).

meanolmrcloud
Apr 5, 2004

rock out with your stock out

Picture of the aforementioned Land Rover. A bit worried about driving this beast though Europe in a few years

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

Busy Bee posted:

Really appreciate your advice, thank you!

That's right, I am an intermediate skier and I currently live in Germany.

I don't mind flying / driving and would like to get around 3 full days of skiing in. I've skied a lot at Keystone and Breckenridge and prefer long, well groomed slopes.

I would like to rent all the equipment and I'd say my budget for 3 full days of skiing, lodging, equipment etc should be around 1,000 to 1,500 Euros. More than likely, I would be traveling solo.

TBH for me it'd depend more on how far I'd want to drive or where the cheapest direct flights go to. That budget should be no problem for a long weekend, even in Switzerland or Austria if you get the most budget possible room (probably ~€100/night). I think I'd suggest Andermatt or Val Gardena, although there are a ton of major resorts I haven't been to, particularly I've never skied in Austria. Andermatt has some crazy long slopes, and it has been connected with Sedrun (via Oberalppass) since like 2018. I notice it's not even all updated on Google Maps - so maybe check out their actual resort flyer.

meanolmrcloud posted:

Picture of the aforementioned Land Rover. A bit worried about driving this beast though Europe in a few years



Nice! You're the person who posted a while back whose like rich uncle bought a land rover and was converting it into a semi-camper, right? Sounds like a good way to spend a few weeks in summer.

Julio Cruz
May 19, 2006

meanolmrcloud posted:

Picture of the aforementioned Land Rover. A bit worried about driving this beast though Europe in a few years



just make sure you don't try to drive in any medieval Italian town centres and you'll be fine

Residency Evil
Jul 28, 2003

4/5 godo... Schumi
Update on our Spain trip from early this month:

It was great. We originally booked tickets in the Spring when COVID numbers were down. Our flights got cancelled this summer, and we were unsure about going, but ended up rebooking a few months ago when numbers were lower in Spain than the US. Couldn't have worked out better.

We ended up flying in to Madrid and immediately taking a train down to Seville, where we stayed for 3 days. In retrospect, we could have spent our entire trip in Southern Spain. Seville was gorgeous and we didn't run out of things to do. Tons of palaces, cathedrals, houses, etc to see. We ended up staying in downtown Seville the entire time and loved it. We would go back in a heartbeat.

We then took the train back to Madrid and were there for 5 days as our home base. We ended up doing Madrid for 3 days and then renting a car to see some things around the area, such as Segovia, Toledo, El Escorial, the Valley of the Fallen, etc. The cathedral in Toledo was incredible, El Escorial was a bit of a letdown, and the rooms in the Royal Palace in Madrid are absolutely insane in their decoration. I can't quite put my finger on it, but for some reason, I didn't totally gel with Madrid. I could easily spend a week in Paris again, but even though it was impossible so see all of Madrid in the time we were there, I don't have a burning desire to go back.

In any case, super glad we ended up going.

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010
Has anyone been around much of the Balkans? I haven't seen it posted here much. I have a friend visiting from the states for a couple weeks in August (if it doesn't get cancelled again like the last two years) and we were thinking about going down to like the Croatia-Montenegro area, probably skipping Bosnia completely since the Dubrovnik bridge will be - probably - open by then.

I've read the Wikitravel entries, but can't quite tell what the best way to get around is. How are the buses for anything other than major cities (Kotor/Dubrovnik/etc)? If we want to do a couple hikes, does that basically mean we have to rent a car? It seems like there aren't really international dropoffs, so I guess we'd have to pick up in Split, do a tour, and return in Dubrovnik or back in Split - although I guess I'd have to make sure car rental companies insure their cars for driving in the whole region since it seems like some don't (E: just found this, https://www.rhinocarhire.com/Car-Hire-Blog/May-2019/Can-I-take-a-Rental-Car-to-Montenegro-from-Croatia.aspx ). It's too far for me to want to bother with driving from Switzerland to Split (~14 h each way).

Anything people found that was super cool and not on a Top 10 Croatia / Montenegro list, and/or that was on the Top 10's but overrated and worth a hard pass? We like food, nature, old cities/sites (e.g. remote bizarre monasteries), and photography. Like for instance I can't tell if Dubrovnik will be cool-touristy, or if it is a glorified Disney World crammed to the gills with people selling magnets and shot glasses.

Do people generally speak a language other than Serbo-Croat-Montenegrian-Bosnian? None of us have ever been to the Balkans, except for Slovenia which from what I've heard is much more central European in terms of culture and landscape than it is Balkan.

HookShot
Dec 26, 2005

Saladman posted:

Has anyone been around much of the Balkans? I haven't seen it posted here much. I have a friend visiting from the states for a couple weeks in August (if it doesn't get cancelled again like the last two years) and we were thinking about going down to like the Croatia-Montenegro area, probably skipping Bosnia completely since the Dubrovnik bridge will be - probably - open by then.

I've read the Wikitravel entries, but can't quite tell what the best way to get around is. How are the buses for anything other than major cities (Kotor/Dubrovnik/etc)? If we want to do a couple hikes, does that basically mean we have to rent a car? It seems like there aren't really international dropoffs, so I guess we'd have to pick up in Split, do a tour, and return in Dubrovnik or back in Split - although I guess I'd have to make sure car rental companies insure their cars for driving in the whole region since it seems like some don't (E: just found this, https://www.rhinocarhire.com/Car-Hire-Blog/May-2019/Can-I-take-a-Rental-Car-to-Montenegro-from-Croatia.aspx ). It's too far for me to want to bother with driving from Switzerland to Split (~14 h each way).

Anything people found that was super cool and not on a Top 10 Croatia / Montenegro list, and/or that was on the Top 10's but overrated and worth a hard pass? We like food, nature, old cities/sites (e.g. remote bizarre monasteries), and photography. Like for instance I can't tell if Dubrovnik will be cool-touristy, or if it is a glorified Disney World crammed to the gills with people selling magnets and shot glasses.

Do people generally speak a language other than Serbo-Croat-Montenegrian-Bosnian? None of us have ever been to the Balkans, except for Slovenia which from what I've heard is much more central European in terms of culture and landscape than it is Balkan.

Yeah, basically, rent a car. You will save yourself ten thousand times the hassle of dealing with busses and everything will be much more flexible. Everyone speaks English. You will find car rental companies that are fine with whatever, you just have to do a bit of research. We used Sixt that let us go from Slovenia to Croatia and Bosnia, but we didn't go as far as Montenegro.

Dubrovnik is very touristy but still extremely cool, especially if you get up early in the morning and get out and about before the cruise ships arrive. With covid, if there are no cruise ships, it might actually be amazing. Find a place to rent on top of the hill. We did, and even though it was like 300 stairs and a 15 minute hike home at the end of each night which was killer on the lungs, we'd stop halfway and get cevcici from one of the local shops, and eat on the balcony watching the sun set over the city and it was loving amazing.

Plitvice Lakes was absolutely, 100% a must-do, but stay at one of the local hotels and get there right at open for the best experience. Split was very overrated. The parts of Diocletian's palace are great, but the town as a whole actually has more of a touristy party vibe than Dubrovnik, IMO.

Carbon dioxide
Oct 9, 2012

Saladman posted:

I've read the Wikitravel entries

From what I understand, wikitravel went commercial at some point and started putting ads on and then all the regular wikitravel editors took their stuff and left and set up wikivoyage.

That means that wikitravel and wikivoyage are mostly clones of each other but wikivoyage tends to be slightly more up to date.

SurgicalOntologist
Jun 17, 2004

About ten years ago I drove a rental from Dubrovnik to Sarajevo (with Sixt) and it was awesome, got to do the small towns and nature spots on the way. Didn't go north or south to Split or Montenegro (would love to do that someday) but I'd recommend the rental if you want to do anything outside the bigger cities.

Between the cities people didn't speak English and at least once we ate something picked at random. Nowadays with mobile data, those situations are easier to avoid. Kind of exciting though!

For a specific recommendation, I think Mostar and Kravica falls are probably worth a detour from the coast, but I don't know how they compare to other options along your route.

SurgicalOntologist fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Dec 4, 2021

HookShot
Dec 26, 2005
Yeah, Mostar is definitely worth it if you decide to go into B&H. The actual touristy center of town is quite small, and you can do it in an hour, but I highly recommend wandering out past it to the rest of the town, which is largely in ruins and extremely moving. Also, go up the minarets of the mosques, the view is incredible.

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

SurgicalOntologist posted:

About ten years ago I drove a rental from Dubrovnik to Sarajevo (with Sixt) and it was awesome, got to do the small towns and nature spots on the way. Didn't go north or south to Split or Montenegro (would love to do that someday) but I'd recommend the rental if you want to do anything outside the bigger cities.

Between the cities people didn't speak English and at least once we ate something picked at random. Nowadays with mobile data, those situations are easier to avoid. Kind of exciting though!

For a specific recommendation, I think Mostar and Kravica falls are probably worth a detour from the coast, but I don't know how they compare to other options along your route.

Thanks all, looks like car it is. So many online resources really seem committed to a backpacker audience, although since we'd be 4 people even on a backpacker's budget a car is probably cheaper. My wife still also always expects that every other country has public transport as comprehensive, regular, and organized as Switzerland's, so our social contract dictates that I at least attempt to see how buses and trains work (or don't work) any time we go anywhere before I can rent a car with her seal of approval. I just bought the Bradt and DK guides for Montenegro and Croatia respectively - looks like there's a new one coming out for Bosnia soon, and I imagine those are among the rare countries where using a guidebook that is 5 or 10 years out of date would actually make a difference. Presumably / hopefully landmines are not so much of a thing anymore for hiking, at least not anywhere close to signed paths.

We don't really have a route yet, and god knows what will happen in the meantime, but anyway I like planning trips and they do eventually happen. There are a crazy number of airports in the region with direct flights to Zurich, or I guess if we wanted to suffer to save €100/ea we could get an overnight 13 hour Flixbus to Zagreb and start from there.

mobby_6kl
Aug 9, 2009

by Fluffdaddy

Saladman posted:

Thanks all, looks like car it is. So many online resources really seem committed to a backpacker audience, although since we'd be 4 people even on a backpacker's budget a car is probably cheaper. My wife still also always expects that every other country has public transport as comprehensive, regular, and organized as Switzerland's, so our social contract dictates that I at least attempt to see how buses and trains work (or don't work) any time we go anywhere before I can rent a car with her seal of approval. I just bought the Bradt and DK guides for Montenegro and Croatia respectively - looks like there's a new one coming out for Bosnia soon, and I imagine those are among the rare countries where using a guidebook that is 5 or 10 years out of date would actually make a difference. Presumably / hopefully landmines are not so much of a thing anymore for hiking, at least not anywhere close to signed paths.

We don't really have a route yet, and god knows what will happen in the meantime, but anyway I like planning trips and they do eventually happen. There are a crazy number of airports in the region with direct flights to Zurich, or I guess if we wanted to suffer to save €100/ea we could get an overnight 13 hour Flixbus to Zagreb and start from there.
I think WizzAir operates a ton of flights to the Balkans from Basel, so check it out.

What time of year are you planning on going? Croatia is super touristy in the summer so I've avoided it so far. But this year I was planning on going to on a big road trip through the region (mainly for Romania though) and we put together a map with some PoIs. Not super detailed in the Balkans but might be helpful.
https://goo.gl/maps/37ctAwgZqTY6CirC9

I'd imagine public transport is somewhat functional but just get a car if there are 4 of you. It'll be cheaper than Swiss public transport probably :)

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

mobby_6kl posted:

I think WizzAir operates a ton of flights to the Balkans from Basel, so check it out.

What time of year are you planning on going? Croatia is super touristy in the summer so I've avoided it so far. But this year I was planning on going to on a big road trip through the region (mainly for Romania though) and we put together a map with some PoIs. Not super detailed in the Balkans but might be helpful.
https://goo.gl/maps/37ctAwgZqTY6CirC9

I'd imagine public transport is somewhat functional but just get a car if there are 4 of you. It'll be cheaper than Swiss public transport probably :)

That's a mega roadtrip! Thanks for the POIs, like half of this stuff I've never heard of. Actually like 100% of the stuff in Romania I'd never heard of except for Timisoara.

We're going in mid-August - one of the guys is military so his dates are super fixed and restricted way in advance. They're coming here for a couple days and then we'd have something like 10-13 days on the spot in the Balkans if travel is easy, if not then I guess we'd go somewhere in the EU/Schengen area. We'd spend probably 6-7 days at/near the coast and then 3-4 days somewhere in the mountains, so I guess we would pick 3 places. The Bay of Kotor looks amazing and presumably the cruise ship people, even if the tours are not cancelled, never get beyond the shoreline. I think my main source of stress for busy summer travel is people driving campers at 15 kph who have zero situational awareness and never pull off to the side of the road even if there are safe pullouts but no safe passing spots. The Kotor serpentine looks like a road to rival even many in Switzerland.

EricBauman
Nov 30, 2005

DOLF IS RECHTVAARDIG

Saladman posted:

Anything people found that was super cool and not on a Top 10 Croatia / Montenegro list, and/or that was on the Top 10's but overrated and worth a hard pass? We like food, nature, old cities/sites (e.g. remote bizarre monasteries), and photography. Like for instance I can't tell if Dubrovnik will be cool-touristy, or if it is a glorified Disney World crammed to the gills with people selling magnets and shot glasses.

This is my experience from two years ago and I haven't been back since, so some things may have changed, others they may have not:

The old city in Dubrovnik is kind of disneyfied, and 100% geared toward tourists. Think Venice but worse because there's less architectural variation in the city itself.
At the time, it was hard to find a tour of the city and the sights that was about the actual history of the town and NOT Game of Thrones themed. GoT made people forget that actual history is also interesting and worth telling people about.

Outside the old city, it feels like any Mediterranean tourist town, basically.

Chikimiki
May 14, 2009
Echoing what has already been said, getting around by car is much easier than by public transport. While there are some local buses as far as I recall, they are quite "local" in that there is very little info on the internet, the hours are geared towards people going to and from work, and the punctuality is more mediterranean than swiss.

That being said, Plitivce Lakes and Kotor Bay are must-dos, as is Dubrovnik but we didn't get a chance to stop there. Sarajevo & Mostar in Bosnia and the Tara River in Montenegro are also great destinations. Lastly, don't forget the Croatian islands! We went to Korcula and Mljet and had a great time there, laid back towns and quaint countryside.
Split isn't worth it in summer in my opinion, wayyy to crowded and touristy as HookShot said. The other cities on the coast (Zadar, Sibenik, Trogir...) are pretty standard mediterranean coastal towns with nice but small old city centers, but if you're in the vicinity why not?

Also, English is widely spoken in the touristy & coastal areas but less so in the country side. However a lot of people spoke German in my experience.

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

Chikimiki posted:

Echoing what has already been said, getting around by car is much easier than by public transport. While there are some local buses as far as I recall, they are quite "local" in that there is very little info on the internet, the hours are geared towards people going to and from work, and the punctuality is more mediterranean than swiss.

That being said, Plitivce Lakes and Kotor Bay are must-dos, as is Dubrovnik but we didn't get a chance to stop there. Sarajevo & Mostar in Bosnia and the Tara River in Montenegro are also great destinations. Lastly, don't forget the Croatian islands! We went to Korcula and Mljet and had a great time there, laid back towns and quaint countryside.
Split isn't worth it in summer in my opinion, wayyy to crowded and touristy as HookShot said. The other cities on the coast (Zadar, Sibenik, Trogir...) are pretty standard mediterranean coastal towns with nice but small old city centers, but if you're in the vicinity why not?

Also, English is widely spoken in the touristy & coastal areas but less so in the country side. However a lot of people spoke German in my experience.

One thing I was kind of worried about for the islands in midsummer is transit to/from seems like a hassle, e.g. some people were mentioning 1-2 hours of queuing if they had a car to ensure they got on the ferry. It does look pretty magical though: https://www.google.com/maps/@42.687...!7i13416!8i6708

Who knows how things will be this summer though. I went to Portugal in August 2020 and the tourist sites ranged from like 95% empty to like 80% empty, even like the Pena palace in Cascais, since British people were banned from travelling, but I think we'll lean more towards Montenegro and Bosnia and less towards Croatia in case travel is at/near normal. I don't really mind places that are busy though, so long as it's not busy with groups of 20-50 people on guided tours standing, immobile and unaware of their surroundings, listening to earpieces. I think I have a pretty high tolerance for that though, the only place I've visited where I thought "this is a hellhole" was Florence a few years ago in May. I haven't been to Venice since I was a kid though.

Doctor Malaver
May 23, 2007

Ce qui s'est passé t'a rendu plus fort
Islands are great and ferries are great too. One of my favorite part of summer vacation is taking a ferry and then going from the air conditioned salon to the windy open deck, sipping a drink, watching passing sailboats, breathing the salty air... None of this applies if you take the catamaran, which is faster but more like a bus. For the ferry, you can buy the ticket online in advance but they require you come early (I think an hour) regardless. And yes, it can be messy, especially in Split harbor. It will likely be hot, congested, confusing. So if you can, leave the car and take the ferry for a day trip. Passengers with no cars can board without any stress and concern, there's always room.

OldSenileGuy
Mar 13, 2001
Not sure if this is the right thread but here goes anyway -

I'm going to London after Christmas for the first time (unless Omicron changes that.) I'm looking for the easiest way to get my phone working while I'm there. I thought I'd just be able to buy a pre-paid SIM with like 30GB of data on it, pop it in my phone, and be on my way. But every website I look at has mechanisms for "topping off" your card and stuff like that. I really don't want to futz with signing up for an account with one of these rando UK wireless companies and linking a credit card - is it going to be possible to buy a prepaid SIM and start using it without making an account? Or is that not really a thing?

The other option is to just use my Verizon "travel plan", but for $20/day for both my and my wife's phones, that would come to a total of $160 for the trip which seems high to me.

distortion park
Apr 25, 2011


You could get one of those pocket WiFi rental things - I used one in Japan and while a little annoying it was easier than messing around with sims.

Carbon dioxide
Oct 9, 2012

OldSenileGuy posted:

Not sure if this is the right thread but here goes anyway -

I'm going to London after Christmas for the first time (unless Omicron changes that.) I'm looking for the easiest way to get my phone working while I'm there. I thought I'd just be able to buy a pre-paid SIM with like 30GB of data on it, pop it in my phone, and be on my way. But every website I look at has mechanisms for "topping off" your card and stuff like that. I really don't want to futz with signing up for an account with one of these rando UK wireless companies and linking a credit card - is it going to be possible to buy a prepaid SIM and start using it without making an account? Or is that not really a thing?

The other option is to just use my Verizon "travel plan", but for $20/day for both my and my wife's phones, that would come to a total of $160 for the trip which seems high to me.

I don't know about the UK but here in the Netherlands there's some providers that offer SIMs that you can top off by going to a phone shop or supermarket, paying them cash, and they print a code for you you need to send to a special phone number. No further signup required (the SIM still comes with a sign-up form. They do want your data and don't offer customer support without it. But it should *work* without it.) That said, prepaid doesn't come with a dedicated internet plan which means you're prob paying a relatively high amount per MB.

Also check if your phone isn't SIM-locked. I dunno if they still do that, used to be real common in the past and you had to poke your original supplier to undo it.

Just note that they permanently block your SIM if you don't top it up at least once a year or whatever.

Carbon dioxide fucked around with this message at 08:51 on Dec 15, 2021

super nailgun
Jan 1, 2014


OldSenileGuy posted:

Not sure if this is the right thread but here goes anyway -

I'm going to London after Christmas for the first time (unless Omicron changes that.) I'm looking for the easiest way to get my phone working while I'm there. I thought I'd just be able to buy a pre-paid SIM with like 30GB of data on it, pop it in my phone, and be on my way. But every website I look at has mechanisms for "topping off" your card and stuff like that. I really don't want to futz with signing up for an account with one of these rando UK wireless companies and linking a credit card - is it going to be possible to buy a prepaid SIM and start using it without making an account? Or is that not really a thing?

The other option is to just use my Verizon "travel plan", but for $20/day for both my and my wife's phones, that would come to a total of $160 for the trip which seems high to me.

I used an Airalo virtual SIM in Germany and it was great. Looks like they have coverage in the UK, might be worth checking out if your phone supports it. Was way cheaper than my carrier roaming option, and no problem tethering either which was extremely handy. Was also nice that my carrier allowed pass through of SMS on my normal plan without additional charges, so I could still do 2FA without problems or spending anything extra (just make sure to turn off data roaming on your primary SIM!)

https://www.airalo.com/

Not every phone supports eSIM but my 2020 iPhone SE did without issue. Nicest thing was I was able to buy and set it up before we left and verify things worked, then only activate the block of data allowance once we got there. Can also pre-buy additional blocks of data and it will automatically activate them as needed, and let you know when you're getting close to using one up. For our trip I only got an eSIM for my phone, and my partner just tethered to my hotspot. We were able to do that plus laptops when on trains or at hotels without issue. We were traveling for three weeks and used up a little over 20GB of data in that time with heavy chat app, maps, etc. usage.

super nailgun fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Dec 16, 2021

Entropist
Dec 1, 2007
I'm very stupid.

OldSenileGuy posted:

I thought I'd just be able to buy a pre-paid SIM with like 30GB of data on it, pop it in my phone, and be on my way.

This is the only way (make sure it is a prepaid data sim). No need to touch the topping up stuff, you are not going to run out of 30GB. I haven't tried the UK but it worked in various other countries for me (Japan, Peru, Turkey, Israel). I don't see why it would be any different in the UK. You can usually buy them at the airport (though overpriced) or at any phone store. Just pop it in and it works, it's never needed any extra configuration for me.

pointsofdata posted:

You could get one of those pocket WiFi rental things - I used one in Japan and while a little annoying it was easier than messing around with sims.

Pocket wifi is the same thing, but twice as expensive for people who are too dumb to spend 5 seconds to switch a sim card. If you need wifi or connect multiple devices, make a hotspot with your phone instead.

Entropist fucked around with this message at 20:30 on Dec 15, 2021

Saladman
Jan 12, 2010

OldSenileGuy posted:

Not sure if this is the right thread but here goes anyway -

I'm going to London after Christmas for the first time (unless Omicron changes that.) I'm looking for the easiest way to get my phone working while I'm there. I thought I'd just be able to buy a pre-paid SIM with like 30GB of data on it, pop it in my phone, and be on my way. But every website I look at has mechanisms for "topping off" your card and stuff like that. I really don't want to futz with signing up for an account with one of these rando UK wireless companies and linking a credit card - is it going to be possible to buy a prepaid SIM and start using it without making an account? Or is that not really a thing?

The other option is to just use my Verizon "travel plan", but for $20/day for both my and my wife's phones, that would come to a total of $160 for the trip which seems high to me.

Yeah as everyone else has said, just get a SIM on arrival at the airport. Maybe it will cost you £10 more than in town, but probably not as usually those prices are standard for each provider regardless of where you purchase the SIM. Lebara is a very common SIM card sold in Europe at basically every airport, although I haven't had to buy any European SIMs since like 2017 or whenever it was that the roaming deal went into effect. You could shop around for better prepaid SIMs (more data, less minutes) but it will probably save you such a trivial amount of money to not be at all worth the time invested in it. IMHO just go for Orange/Lebara/whatever-the-first-thing-you-see-with-data-is.

I think you'd be hard pressed to use more than 5 GB/week/person unless you're synchronizing dropbox or something, but if you keep track of your data and know how much you use normally, then go for whatever. I have an unlimited plan that throttles at 40 GB/mo and I've never even come close to using that even with tethering.

AFAIK all Verizon phones have had SIM card slots for many years - the days of Verizon-specific SIM-less phones are long gone, I think. Anyway double-check your phone to make sure it has a SIM card slot but it likely does. If you bought a non-subsidized phone, which is basically any phone since like... 2016? 2018? then it should be unlocked but I guess you might want to make sure.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007



Saladman posted:

AFAIK all Verizon phones have had SIM card slots for many years - the days of Verizon-specific SIM-less phones are long gone, I think. Anyway double-check your phone to make sure it has a SIM card slot but it likely does. If you bought a non-subsidized phone, which is basically any phone since like... 2016? 2018? then it should be unlocked but I guess you might want to make sure.

Verizon started using SIMs when they got away from CDMA. Any 3G or later Verizon phone will have a SIM slot.

Residency Evil
Jul 28, 2003

4/5 godo... Schumi
https://prepaid-data-sim-card.fandom.com/wiki/Prepaid_SIM_with_data

I’ve used this website when traveling for a general idea of what SIM card to buy. Helpful to look at before leaving for a new country.

webmeister
Jan 31, 2007

The answer is, mate, because I want to do you slowly. There has to be a bit of sport in this for all of us. In the psychological battle stakes, we are stripped down and ready to go. I want to see those ashen-faced performances; I want more of them. I want to be encouraged. I want to see you squirm.

pointsofdata posted:

You could get one of those pocket WiFi rental things - I used one in Japan and while a little annoying it was easier than messing around with sims.

Just to reiterate what another poster said - don't bother with the pocket wifi hotspot things, they're insanely overpriced. A lot of the companies selling them did promotional work with travel bloggers, so you'll constantly see them recommended on travel blogs (complete with handy affiliate links!), but they're almost never worth the extra money.

If you're going in a group of four or so, then maybe the cost of the wifi device vs four SIM cards will make sense, but even then, you have to stay together constantly to be able to use it. Suitable for families I guess, but if you're a group of adults travelling together it'll get real old real fast.

When I did my two year Europe trip a few years back, I used a Vodafone UK SIM the entire time (mainly because I knew people back in the UK who could buy vouchers and send me the activation codes).

super nailgun
Jan 1, 2014


I looked at getting a separate SIM but ended up going the eSIM route for a few reasons... Highest of them was being able to keep my primary SIM installed and able to get service so I could still get SMS messages and do 2FA. Incoming SMS and calls internationally are covered by my telco under my normal domestic plan with no additional fee for whatever reason, was nice to be able to still receive that stuff while abroad.

Entropist
Dec 1, 2007
I'm very stupid.
That's why I never buy a phone without dual sim capability!

RCarr
Dec 24, 2007

Edit: Nvm

Ally McBeal Wiki
Aug 15, 2002

TheFraggot

Residency Evil posted:

Update on our Spain trip from early this month:

I can't quite put my finger on it, but for some reason, I didn't totally gel with Madrid. I could easily spend a week in Paris again, but even though it was impossible so see all of Madrid in the time we were there, I don't have a burning desire to go back.

In any case, super glad we ended up going.

I've been through Madrid many times, sometimes for one night, sometimes many, and it's never really grabbed me, either. The rest of Spain, yes. Even Barcelona has its charms. But I'm all about everywhere but Madrid. I don't hate the place by any means, but it just, meh.

Granada, Sevilla, Cordoba, Almeria/the deep southern coast, or further north to Logrono/La Rioja, Bilbao, San Sebastian, Gijon, Oviedo, Santiago de Compostela, all those places are spectacular in their own (sometimes small) ways. I hear good things about Valencia and Salamanca too.

But Madrid... I still can't quite 'get' Madrid either. Cool museums, pretty buildings and some gorgeous parks and gardens, but...

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Doctor Malaver
May 23, 2007

Ce qui s'est passé t'a rendu plus fort
I found everything too big and grandiose - fountains, statues, squares, Escorial, Prado... Like it was constantly trying to impress. Barcelona gave a much friendlier vibe.

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