COVID-19: People on the internet are judging me for going outside. It used to be the reverse.

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Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

Denmark - 21 January 2022

I am having a hard time drawing any observations today other than things seem to be a little lower than yesterday, drop in hospitals.

Observation of the day:

The 0-19s are 31.8% of cases, 6.45% of admissions, and 0.08% (3 of 3596) of deaths.
The 20-39s are 32.8% of cases, 17.5% of admissions, and 0.6% of deaths.
The 40-64's are are 28.8% of cases, 25.1% of admissions, and 4.0% of deaths (age 40-59 only).*
The 65-80's are 5.1% of cases, 23.1% of admissions, and 34.6% of deaths (age 60-79 only).*
Over 80s are 1.4% of cases, 17.9% of admissions, and 59.4% of deaths.

Deaths breakdown by age, all time:

pre:

Age	Cases	Deaths	
0-9	159080	2	0.00126%
10-19	242114	1	0.00041%
20-29	227103	12	0.00528%
30-39	191608	10	0.00522%
40-49	183053	31	0.01693%
50-59	140225	112	0.07987%
60-69	71384	315	0.44128%
70-79	37960	926	2.43941%
80-89	14333	1349	9.41185%
90+	3671	765	20.83901%

Ow. The *-marked are wrong because DK lumps cases 40-64 and 65-80 while grouping deaths in 10-year increments.

Daily "Last 7 days cases" split into three age brackets:

pre:

		21 Jan	20 Jan	19 Jan	18 Jan	17 Jan	15 Jan	14 Jan	13 Jan	12 Jan	11 Jan	10 Jan	07 Jan
0-19 years	43.4%	43.6%	43.7%	43.3%	42.2%	40.9%	37.7%	36.5%	35.6%	34.2%	31.8%	30.1%	27%
20-39 years	28.0%	28.3%	28.6%	29.2%	30.0%	31.0%	32.9%	33.8%	34.7%	36.1%	38.2%	39.1%	40%
40+ years	28.6%	28.1%	27.6%	27.5%	27.8%	28.1%	29.4%	29.8%	29.7%	29.6%	30.0%	30.7%	33%

Table 1. Actual and Reported Denmark COVID Cases reported per day

pre:

	Actual	Reported	New	Total
Date	Cases	Cases	Reinf.	Hosp.	Hosp.	ICU		Vent		Dead
==============================================================================================
Jan 22	   ---	36,120	2,285	220	781	45 (+1)		28 (-1)		25
Jan 21	 8,714	46,831	3,160	244	813	44 (-5)		29 (+1)		21
Jan 20	37,109	40,626	2,639	232	825	49 (-1)		28 (-2)		15
Jan 19	37,581	38,759	2,285	248	821	50 (+1)		30 (+1)		16
Jan 18	40,303	33,493	2,002	264	810	49 (-3)		29 (-8)		14
Jan 17	41,486	28,780	1,815	203	802	52 (-7)		37 (-4)		11
Jan 16	28,179	26,169	1,614	159	734	59 (+0)		41 (+1)		16 
Jan 15	25,188	25,034	1,644	202	711	59 (-1)		40 (+4)		16
Jan 14	25,883	23,614	1,519	215	757	60 (-4)		36 (-2)		15
Jan 13	23,776	25,751	1,822	194	755	64 (-9)		38 (-8)		20
Jan 12	22,575	24,343	1,614	215	751	73 (+0)		46 (+0)		25
Jan 11	22,656	22,936	1,459	181	754	73 (-1)		46 (-1)		14
Jan 10	23,244	14,414	  941	156	777	74 (-3)		47 (-3)		 9 
Jan 09	16,330	19,248	1,327	126	723	77 (-1) 	50 (-2) 	14 
Jan 08	13,573	12,588	  984	161	730	78 (+0) 	52 (-1) 	28 
Jan 07	14,434	18,261	1,482	186	755	78 (-4) 	53 (+4) 	10  
Jan 06	15,417	25,995	2,027	161	756	82 (+2) 	47 (-2) 	11  
Jan 05	17,577	28,283	2,083	204	784	80 (+3) 	49 (+2) 	15
Jan 04	23,698	23,372	1,701	229	792	77 (+4) 	47 (+1) 	15
Jan 03*	25,617	 8,801	  532	169	770	73 (-3) 	46 (-4) 	 5
Jan 02  19,906 	 7,550	  404	163	709	76 (+3) 	50 (+1) 	15
Jan 01   8,631	20,885	1,049	139	647	73 (+0) 	49 (+0) 	 5
Dec 31   9,728	17,605	1,090	177	641	73 (-2) 	49 (-1) 	11
Dec 30  19,927	21,403	1,123	178	665	75 (-2) 	50 (-2) 	 9
Dec 29  17,245	23,228	1,205	173	675	77 (+6) 	52 (+2) 	16
Dec 28  21,955	13,000	  670	177	666	71 (+1) 	50 (+4) 	14
Dec 27  22,616	16,164	  639	115	608	70 (-1) 	46 (-2) 	 7
Dec 26  10,965	14,844	  644	123	579	71 (-2) 	43 (+1) 	13
Dec 25   7,853	10,027	  463	 86	522	73 (-1) 	44 (+5) 	10
Dec 24   7,054	11,229	  527	134	509	74 (+2) 	39 (+1) 	14
Dec 23  12,605	12,487	  613	158	541	72 (+6) 	38 (+1)		15
Dec 22  11,591	13,386	  531	126	524	66 (-1) 	37 (+2)		14 
Dec 21  13,011	13,558	  501	121	526	67 (+1) 	35 (+2)		17
Dec 20  13,288	10,082	  ---	 85	581	66 (+3) 	33 (-2)		 8
Dec 19  10,231 	 8,212
Dec 18  10,049 	 8,594
Dec 17  10.614	11,194
Dec 16  10,171 	 9,999
Dec 15  10,775 	 8,773	  ---	 96	508	66 (+0)		43 (-3)		 9
Dec 13  10,294 	 7,799	  ---	 61	480	64 (-1)		42 (+0)		 9
Dec 12   6,986 	 5,989	  ---	 82	468	65 (+5)		42 (+6)	 	 9
Dec 08   6,560 	 6,629	  ---	 72	461	66 (-1)		38 (-1)		 7
Dec 01   4,464 	 5,120	  ---	 88	439	35 (+1)		35 (+1)		14

Table 2: ICU Bed Usage, Weekly (reported every 2 weeks)

pre:

Date      		Bed Availability
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
17 January  	328 ICU beds, 54 COVID, 66 available
10 January  	331 ICU beds, 72 COVID, 29 available
03 January  	331 ICU beds, 76 COVID, 32 available
27 December	316 ICU beds, 71 COVID, 62 available 
20 December 	317 ICU beds, 60 COVID, 59 available
13 December 	319 ICU beds, 64 COVID, 39 available
06 December 	310 ICU beds, 67 COVID, 10 available <-- squeaky bum time here
29 November	318 ICU beds, 61 COVID, 25 available

Sourcea:
https://www.rkkp.dk/kvalitetsdatabaser/databaser/dansk-intensiv-database/resultater/
https://covid19.ssi.dk/overvagningsdata/download-fil-med-overvaagningdata
https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/242ec2acc014456295189631586f1d26
https://covid19.ssi.dk/virusvarianter/delta-pcr

Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 15:43 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 15:05

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 25, 2024 07:26

Herstory Begins Now: Aug 5, 2003; SOME REALLY TEDIOUS DUMB SHIT THAT SUCKS ASS TO READ ->>

virtualboyCOLOR posted:

Sounds like you�re not jealous and totally have the best interest of the citizens in the countries that have successfully handled covid for, per your own admission, a year plus.

Meanwhile daily cases in the US of over half a million is presented like this:

https://mobile.twitter.com/SparkNewswire/status/1484599070068928512

presented by a tweet with literally zero likes from what doesn't even appear to be a real news organization?

# ? Jan 22, 2022 15:19

Riptor: Apr 13, 2003; here's to feelin' good all the time

Herstory Begins Now posted:

presented by a tweet with literally zero likes from what doesn't even appear to be a real news organization?

This is what my "what" response was about, for the record

# ? Jan 22, 2022 15:27

Boris Galerkin: Dec 17, 2011; I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!

I�m almost out of proper N95 masks. Where are people ordering these from nowadays?

# ? Jan 22, 2022 15:31

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

So my discussion with my GF who does vaccinations and looking at the stats makes me think:
- over 90% of the over-29s are fully vaccinated
- 60% of over-12s are boosted

The Danish government has been managing what I'll call a "controlled burn" and the arrival of Omicron poured gas on the caseload fire. But *luckily* Omicron causes less serious disease in fully vaccinated people, combined with the rather clear fact it doesn't kill under-20s has led to a huge drop in ICU occupancy, which I believe was their #1 metric - keep the ICUs from running out of beds, while jamming Comirnaty shots into arms as fast as they could.

It doesn't feel like winning, when I look at the daily cases.

At this point I also believe that the government may have decided that the risk of vaccinating children literally is higher than the risk of letting them get Omicron. I haven't dug into it but aren't there suspected side-effects of the mRNA vaccine?

# ? Jan 22, 2022 16:25

Levitate: Sep 30, 2005; randy newman voice

YOU'VE GOT A LAFRENI�RE IN ME

Rust Martialis posted:

At this point I also believe that the government may have decided that the risk of vaccinating children literally is higher than the risk of letting them get Omicron. I haven't dug into it but aren't there suspected side-effects of the mRNA vaccine?

Myocarditis I think. The chance of getting it is probably far outweighed by the chance of a bad outcome from COVID though so I don�t really know why they choose to make a stand about that

# ? Jan 22, 2022 17:13

Pingui: Jun 4, 2006; WTF?

Rust Martialis posted:

(..)
At this point I also believe that the government may have decided that the risk of vaccinating children literally is higher than the risk of letting them get Omicron. I haven't dug into it but aren't there suspected side-effects of the mRNA vaccine?

There are some noted potential side effects (like myocarditis), but the chances of getting them from the vaccine are vastly lower than the chance from getting COVID.

I disagree that they believe the risk higher in a health sense (and I would disagree with that assessment), but it certainly is more risky in a political sense.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 17:13

StratGoatCom: Aug 6, 2019; Our security is guaranteed by being able to melt the eyeballs of any other forum's denizens at 15 minutes notice

Frankly, the risk of possible long term sequelae in people with their whole lives ahead of them is unconscionable and plain stupid from the point of resource uses.

edit:

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/...genumber%3D4606

here we go again

# ? Jan 22, 2022 17:16

spankmeister: Jun 15, 2008

Blech, BA2 is dominant in Denmark and there's no marked difference between the other subvariants.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 17:35

virtualboyCOLOR: Dec 22, 2004

spankmeister posted:

Blech, BA2 is dominant in Denmark and there's no marked difference between the other subvariants.

There appears to be one difference:

https://twitter.com/itosettiMD_MBA/status/1484677936334749698?s=20

BA.2 appears to evade any immunity the body builds to protect against the original omicron (although would need someone to translate the article to be sure).

Anecdotal data: work colleagues are going down more often now with omicron and they are all vaxxed. Definition of �mild� for every case has been fevers at least as high as 102, difficulty breathing for 7 days minimum, brain fog for 14 days minimum. Worst case has been death. Again, all have been vaxxed. It sounds like we are back to square one.

virtualboyCOLOR fucked around with this message at 17:46 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 17:42

StratGoatCom: Aug 6, 2019; Our security is guaranteed by being able to melt the eyeballs of any other forum's denizens at 15 minutes notice

Not quite that strong, but any sign of increase in evasion is a very bad sign, as it suggests we're not near the ceiling in what the virus can do in that domain.

StratGoatCom fucked around with this message at 17:55 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 17:44

Kalit: Nov 6, 2006; The great thing about the thousands of slaughtered Palestinian children is that they can't pull away when you fondle them or sniff their hair.

That's a Biden success story.

virtualboyCOLOR posted:

There appears to be one difference:

https://twitter.com/itosettiMD_MBA/status/1484677936334749698?s=20

BA.2 appears to evade any immunity the body builds to protect against the original omicron (although would need someone to translate the article to be sure).

Anecdotal data: work colleagues are going down more often now with omicron and they are all vaxxed. Definition of �mild� for every case has been fevers at least as high as 102, difficulty breathing for 7 days minimum, brain fog for 14 days minimum. Worst case has been death. Again, all have been vaxxed. It sounds like we are back to square one.

You probably shouldn't be taking that random twitter's account at their word, IMO. I used Google Translate, so if anyone here knows Danish and this is wrong, please correct me:

quote:

It is possible that you can be infected with BA.1 Omikron first, and then shortly after with BA.2, he says in 'Go morgen Danmark'.

What does "shortly after" mean? Up to 1 day later? Up to 2 weeks later? I have no idea and it doesn't specify.

On top of that, the possibility stated is "mostly" theoretical, whatever that means. But that's a long ways away from "can get infected", like that linked tweet states. Also, Fomsgaard stated it isn't really worth worrying about at the moment:

quote:

But, says Anders Fomsgaard in a tender interview with TV 2 , the possibility of extensive re-infection after a short time is for now mostly a theoretical possibility.

- It is something we keep an eye on, he says.

At the same time, he warns against excessive concern.

- We can not see any difference in hospitalization numbers, death rates and so on on Omikron and BA.2, so it is not something that worries us as such. But we are also aware that we have a very short observation time, he says, referring to the fact that BA.2 is still a new piece in the game that SSI is still investigating.

Kalit fucked around with this message at 18:01 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 17:58

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

If we only had some Danes in this thread :denmark:

Google seems to be okay for translating.

quote:

But a subvariant of Omikron called BA.2 can now potentially threaten group immunity, explains Anders Fomsgaard, who is chief physician and virus researcher at SSI.

"It is possible that you can be infected with BA.1 Omikron first, and then shortly after with BA.2", he says in 'Go morgen Danmark'.

In Norway, where BA.2 is also spreading, a few cases have been seen where this has happened.

If the same thing happens in Denmark, it may be that we have to accept that the epidemic will peak again, it sounds like.

But, says Anders Fomsgaard in a tender interview with TV 2 , the possibility of extensive re-infection after a short time is for now mostly a theoretical possibility.

"It is something we keep an eye on", he says.

At the same time, he warns against excessive concern.

- We can not see any difference in hospitalization numbers, death rates and so on on Omikron and BA.2, so it is not something that worries us as such. But we are also aware that we have a very short observation time, he says, referring to the fact that BA.2 is still a new piece in the game that SSI is still investigating.

So someone go look at Norwegian data, right now the article is clearly saying it's a few cases in Norway.

e: f, b.

Also, if BA.2 is now over half the cases in DK, with BA.1 coming in December, most recovered cases were pre-Omicron, so the only free, bonus risk is that anyone recovering from BA.1 might be up for a do-over with BA.2. Until shown otherwise, I think it's reasonable to assume that anyone just recovered from BA.1 is *fresh* with immune reaction that presumably would have an effect on BA.2.

I mean this is just the obvious stuff based on a Google Translate and checking the original Danish to compare.

Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:08

spankmeister: Jun 15, 2008

We need to make the thread more hygge then they'll show up

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:11

VitalSigns: Sep 3, 2011

StratGoatCom posted:

Frankly, the risk of possible long term sequelae in people with their whole lives ahead of them is unconscionable and plain stupid from the point of resource uses.

Only if you assume the people in charge have any incentive to care about the long term.

They are all in their 60s and 70s, so the rational thing to do is get all the money they can now and ignore the future when they will be dead anyway

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:14

StratGoatCom: Aug 6, 2019; Our security is guaranteed by being able to melt the eyeballs of any other forum's denizens at 15 minutes notice

Rust Martialis posted:

If we only had some Danes in this thread

Google seems to be okay for translating.

So someone go look at Norwegian data, right now the article is clearly saying it's a few cases in Norway.

e: f, b.

Could be nothing, or it could be a very bad sign if there is a statistical increase in reinfections.

Like I said, we are likely nowhere near an evolutionary optima or fitness trap for evasion.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:16

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

spankmeister posted:

We need to make the thread more hygge then they'll show up

Jeg vi lave noget br�ndende k�rlighed og tager en behagelig sweater p�.

N��h: https://en.ssi.dk/news/news/2022/omicron-variant-ba2-accounts-for-almost-half-of-all-danish-omicron-cases

S�dan: https://www.fhi.no/en/publ/2020/weekly-reports-for-coronavirus-og-covid-19/

quote:

A variant of SARS-CoV-2, so far defined as an omicron sub-variant, BA.2, is increasing rapidly in Norway. From seven detections on 4th January to a total of 611 detections on 19th January (mainly in Oslo), this variant of the omicron virus is growing strongly compared to the original omicron virus, BA.1. The properties of the virus are not known other than that it is more contagious than BA.1 and is also increasing in Denmark and Sweden, and may appear to be taking over BA.1 already.

So there were 7 detections as of the 4th of January, and that rose to 611 detections by the time the report was written.

So anyone with BA.2 who was re-infected caught Omicron in December, got over it, and was then re-infected in January. There's no mention of re-infections.

This Norwegian report is COOL.

quote:

There is increasing diversity in the omirkron variant, also in Norway (Figure 45). We have larger chains of infection with the same virus, at the same time as we have had a number of imports of viruses from abroad, and new clusters are beginning to emerge. In Rogaland, omikron with the nail mutation R346K has given rise to an infection cluster. The R346K substitution is in an antibody binding site and changes here have occurred in different variants through the pandemic and can potentially contribute to further antigenic operation of the omicron. Omikron BA.2 has developed in parallel with BA.1 and shows a higher mutation frequency than BA.1 (Figure 45)
Sequence analyzes of BA.2 indicate that there have been at least two introductions with BA.2 to Norway recently as we have both BA.2 viruses that have key mutations otherwise found in the majority of the Danish BA.2 viruses and we have viruses without these mutations (not shown).

quote:

Reinfections
Through the pandemic, cases of infection have also been detected among people who have previously been infected with SARS-CoV-2. By definition, new infection detection after 6 months is a reinfection, but by studying the virus that has given new infection detection, it is possible to also detect reinfection after a shorter time. In the case of new detection after 3 months, an attempt is therefore made in many cases to investigate reinfection by sequence analysis. A total of 7984 possible reinfections have been registered so far, of which 6031 are confirmed reinfections. The number of reinfections has increased in recent weeks, in connection with increased infection rates.

17 possible cases of triple infections have also been registered.

The number of reinfections with omicron is 5% of all detected omicron cases in the last 4 weeks, in the same period reinfections with delta account for 0.4% of the detected delta cases. There have also been signals that omicron may present a higher risk of reinfection than delta (https://www.imperial.ac.uk/mrc-global-infectious-disease-analysis/covid-19/report-49-Omicron/) . We do not have a data basis for estimating whether the risk of reinfection is higher for any of the variants yet in Norway, but will continuously monitor this in the future.

oooh, triples.

Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:19

virtualboyCOLOR: Dec 22, 2004

Kalit posted:

What does "shortly after" mean? Up to 1 day later? Up to 2 weeks later? I have no idea and it doesn't specify.

On top of that, the possibility stated is "mostly" theoretical, whatever that means. But that's a long ways away from "can get infected", like that linked tweet states. Also, Fomsgaard stated it isn't really worth worrying about at the moment:

Reinfections seems to be a concern enough for the UK: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jan/21/covid-reinfection-how-likely-are-you-to-catch-virus-multiple-times

quote:

Is it easier to be reinfected with some variants?

In short, yes. According to scientists at Imperial College London, after taking into account a host of factors Omicron was associated with somewhere between a 4.38 and 6.63-fold higher risk of reinfection, compared with Delta.

The team add that this means protection against catching Covid arising from a previous infection within the past six months has fallen from about 85% before Omicron turned up to somewhere between 0% and 27%. The drop is not surprising given that Omicron has been found to have the ability to dodge the body�s immune responses to a significant degree.

And https://www.theweek.co.uk/news/science-health/955464/can-you-get-omicron-twice

quote:

General reinfection risk �five times higher�
Scientists did see a lot more people being reinfected with Omicron after previously having another variant such as Beta or Delta.

An early study of 36,000 suspected reinfections in South Africa estimated that Omicron could be �twice as likely to cause a re-infection than earlier variants�, said the BBC. One of the researchers, Professor Juliet Pulliam from Stellenbosch University, said the findings suggested that Omicron could have an �increased ability to infect previously infected individuals�.

A study a few weeks later by Imperial College London put the risk of reinfection with the Omicron variant at more than five times higher than with Delta.

Sure there isn�t a guarantee, but more often then not being extra cautious has panned out better than being optimistic.

Remember when optimists supported and pushed:

* reinfections in general are not possible
* CDC saying one can�t get covid if one has been vaccine
* CDC saying one can�t spread covid if one has been vaccinated
* denouncing booster shots
* the CDC declaring masks are no longer needed if one is vaccinated
* the omicron is mild narrative (while ignoring the extreme stress to healthcare workers)

I think the optimists need learn that they have been consistently wrong and their optimism is generally dangerous.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:24

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

VitalSigns posted:

Only if you assume the people in charge have any incentive to care about the long term.

They are all in their 60s and 70s, so the rational thing to do is get all the money they can now and ignore the future when they will be dead anyway

Nu taler vi om *Danmark*.

The Prime Minister of Denmark is 44.

The Health Minister is 46.

They're both Social Democrats, not my preference but Enhedslisten isn't big enough.

Maybe do some legwork before making trivially disprovable claims next time?

Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 18:31 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:28

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

virtualboyCOLOR posted:

Reinfections seems to be a concern enough for the UK: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jan/21/covid-reinfection-how-likely-are-you-to-catch-virus-multiple-times

[...]

I think the optimists need learn that they have been consistently wrong and their optimism is generally dangerous.

I've been posting Danish reinfection data for over a month. I mean this isn't exactly news that you can get Omicron after Delta.

The concern on this page is "can you get BA.2 after BA.1" and so I'm checking the report in the Norwegian health site.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:35

Kalit: Nov 6, 2006; The great thing about the thousands of slaughtered Palestinian children is that they can't pull away when you fondle them or sniff their hair.

That's a Biden success story.

virtualboyCOLOR posted:

Reinfections seems to be a concern enough for the UK: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jan/21/covid-reinfection-how-likely-are-you-to-catch-virus-multiple-times

And https://www.theweek.co.uk/news/science-health/955464/can-you-get-omicron-twice

Sure there isn�t a guarantee, but more often then not being extra cautious has panned out better than being optimistic.

Remember when optimists supported and pushed:

* reinfections in general are not possible
* CDC saying one can�t get covid if one has been vaccine
* CDC saying one can�t spread covid if one has been vaccinated
* denouncing booster shots
* the CDC declaring masks are no longer needed if one is vaccinated
* the omicron is mild narrative (while ignoring the extreme stress to healthcare workers)

I think the optimists need learn that they have been consistently wrong and their optimism is generally dangerous.

Of course, re-infections in general can happen, what's your point? That tweet was specifically about BA.2 reinfections after BA.1, which neither of these stories address, and was misrepresenting what Fomsgaard was stating.

E: f, b me this time. But yea, what Rust Martialis posted

Kalit fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:39

spankmeister: Jun 15, 2008

Rust Martialis posted:

Jeg vi lave noget br�ndende k�rlighed og tager en behagelig sweater p�.

N��h: https://en.ssi.dk/news/news/2022/omicron-variant-ba2-accounts-for-almost-half-of-all-danish-omicron-cases

S�dan: https://www.fhi.no/en/publ/2020/weekly-reports-for-coronavirus-og-covid-19/

Hygge is a state of mind, maaan.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:48

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

spankmeister posted:

Hygge is a state of mind, maaan.

Burning Love is some meget hyggeligt food. Og senere, Olsen Banden ser R�dt.

That Norwegian report is REALLY interesting.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 18:55

StratGoatCom: Aug 6, 2019; Our security is guaranteed by being able to melt the eyeballs of any other forum's denizens at 15 minutes notice

Meanwhile, In salt-lake city:

https://www.sltrib.com/news/2022/01/21/utahs-covid/

spoilering this poo poo for posted:

�I sorry, Mommy. Mommy hugs, I scared. I don�t like it. Mommy!�

Those were the last words 3-year-old Justin Lee Francis spoke to his mother, Yvonne, before he was sedated and put on a ventilator at Primary Children�s Hospital last week, when he was diagnosed with COVID-19, asthma, pneumonia and other illnesses.

�Those words are burned in my memory,� Yvonne Francis said Thursday from the hospital, where Justin Lee still is on a ventilator, still sedated, and slowly recovering after nearly a week in the intensive care unit. �He was really scared.�

Justin Lee is one of nearly 140 Utah children under age 15 who have been hospitalized with COVID-19 in the past two weeks as the number of serious infections explodes, especially among infants and kids younger than 5.

For very young children, one pediatric specialist said, the omicron variant may not be so much �milder� than previous strains of the virus.

StratGoatCom fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 19:05

ExcessBLarg!: Sep 1, 2001

StratGoatCom posted:

Meanwhile, In salt-lake city:

Having a child in the ICU sucks. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 19:58

VitalSigns: Sep 3, 2011

Rust Martialis posted:

Nu taler vi om *Danmark*.

The Prime Minister of Denmark is 44.

The Health Minister is 46.

They're both Social Democrats, not my preference but Enhedslisten isn't big enough.

Maybe do some legwork before making trivially disprovable claims next time?

I was talking about the USA not Denmark

But I also wasn't talking about the ages of politicians, but the age of the plutocrats really calling the shots. Even if America elected millenial cabinet secretary Pete Buttigieg the people in charge would stay the same.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 20:03

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

VitalSigns posted:

I was talking about the USA not Denmark

Yeah, the discussion you blindly jumped into was about Denmark (you may not have heard of it, I know how crap the US education system is and all that), not the USA.

I don't particularly like Statsminister Mette Frederiksen (age 44) but she's a Social Democrat, and I'm pretty loving sure she's been infinitely better being in charge here than Lars Løkke Rasmussen or Martin Messerschmitt or Inge Støjberg would have been from an actual right-wing party.

So maybe if there's a discussion going about a government from a different country, don't randomly drop a random irrelevant outburst in the middle of it, no matter how hosed up your own country is.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 21:32

VitalSigns: Sep 3, 2011

The criticism about exposing children to covid is a general one, Denmark isn't the only country doing that, but keep reaching for owns to deflect from the policy

Maybe it's just a coincidence that gambling with children's health is being done in socialist paradise Denmark and its politics aren't controlled by wealthy old plutocrats, but pointing out that the ruling class sometimes lets 40 year old secretaries and ministers be the face of the policy doesn't really prove that

VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 21:53 on Jan 22, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 21:51

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

VitalSigns posted:

The criticism about exposing children to covid is a general one, Denmark isn't the only country doing that, but keep reaching for owns to deflect from the policy

I brought *up* the policy, genius.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 22:06

UCS Hellmaker: Mar 29, 2008; Toilet Rascal

ExcessBLarg! posted:

Having a child in the ICU sucks. I wouldn't wish it on anyone.

Literally picu pediatric burn and pediatric oncology are a level of hell that I never wish upon anyone, and the staff that do those jobs and do them everyday are angels that deserve so much more then what they get.

Like, I shadowed on a pediatric burn Ward and assisted with a 5 year old dressing change from pan falling on her arm full of oil. I can handle a ton, and the sheer disconnect I needed to be able to not be broken by her crying was insane. Trying to comfort her was so difficult. I can't imagine oncology or picu let alone with how absolutely devastating a pediatric code is as ems or in the ed.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 22:11

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

UCS Hellmaker posted:

Literally picu pediatric burn and pediatric oncology are a level of hell that I never wish upon anyone,

I worked in IT at the Hospital for Sick Children in Toronto and pædiatric hæmoncology had the absolute craziest churn rate of any department. I never was in PICU but I was in NICU a couple times and bassinets brimming with tubes are all I recall.

It was the best place I will ever work for doing good.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 22:21

UCS Hellmaker: Mar 29, 2008; Toilet Rascal

Rust Martialis posted:

I worked in IT at the Hospital for Sick Children in Toronto and pædiatric hæmoncology had the absolute craziest churn rate of any department. I never was in PICU but I was in NICU a couple times and bassinets brimming with tubes are all I recall.

It was the best place I will ever work for doing good.

The average turnover in the burn Ward at my current hospital (before covid mind you) was 18 months. No one stayed more then 5 years.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 22:27

Illuminti: Dec 3, 2005; Praise be to China's Covid-Zero Policy

virtualboyCOLOR posted:

There appears to be one difference:

https://twitter.com/itosettiMD_MBA/status/1484677936334749698?s=20

BA.2 appears to evade any immunity the body builds to protect against the original omicron (although would need someone to translate the article to be sure).

Anecdotal data: work colleagues are going down more often now with omicron and they are all vaxxed. Definition of �mild� for every case has been fevers at least as high as 102, difficulty breathing for 7 days minimum, brain fog for 14 days minimum. Worst case has been death. Again, all have been vaxxed. It sounds like we are back to square one.

Anecdotally Omicron is starting to work its ways into my company, having not had a case since the start. No one had to take more than 3 days off, most common symptoms were a cough that lingered a bit and runny nose.

I don't really get the point of your anecdote. There are large data sets and virtually everyone knows someone with Omicron and therefore knows that, no, everyone who catches Omicron does not have a fever of 102, difficulty breathing,and brain fog. Why are you trying to tell everyone what they can see with their own eyes is not true?

# ? Jan 22, 2022 23:03

VitalSigns: Sep 3, 2011

Rust Martialis posted:

I brought *up* the policy, genius.

And you're engaging in deflection of criticism of it now with a bunch of desperate ad homs. It's pretty clear that the welfare of children is a low priority to the people in charge and the policies of most of the world follow what old rich dudes want, which is incidentally the same policy being followed in other areas like say climate change.

I don't think it should be really controversial that the welfare of the next generation isn't a priority to most governments, it's pretty obvious from what they do

# ? Jan 22, 2022 23:03

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

VitalSigns posted:

And you're engaging in deflection of criticism of it now with a bunch of desperate ad homs.

If you could maybe not consistently try to turn every single discussion into how poo poo the USA is and support your argument that Mette Frederiksen is following the directions of some group of old plutocrats - who incidentally are orders of magnitude more likely to die from the policies of her government?

Go ahead, support your claim Mette Frederiksen is being ordered to put Danish kids at risk by plutocrats.

quote:

I don't think it should be really controversial that the welfare of the next generation isn't a priority to most governments, it's pretty obvious from what they do

We were talking about *Denmark*, Don Quixote. Not whatever other windmill you're angry at today.

I think you need to support your argument. I've posted *tons* of statistics with links to sources.

Here's today's cumulative case and mortality stats for Denmark:

pre:

Age	Cases	Deaths	 
0-9	159080	2	0.00126% 
10-19	242114	1	0.00041% 
20-29	227103	12	0.00528% 
30-39	191608	10	0.00522% 
40-49	183053	31	0.01693% 
50-59	140225	112	0.07987% 
60-69	71384	315	0.44128% 
70-79	37960	926	2.43941% 
80-89	14333	1349	9.41185% 
90+	3671	765	20.83901%

It isn't *children* dying of COVID in Denmark.

Edit: ok, you were happy to declare the 44-year old Mette Frederiksen an aged plutocrat, then merely a tool of aged plutocrats (as a Social Democrat), while admitting you have no actual knowledge of Danish healthcare (or evidently politics), and ignoring the actual statistics that show that the impact of COVID has been overwhelmingly on the elderly and infirm.

If that's not bad faith posting, what is?

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 00:07 on Jan 23, 2022

# ? Jan 22, 2022 23:35

VitalSigns: Sep 3, 2011

Old plutocrats aren't more likely to die from covid, there's plenty of evidence that outcomes are linked to socioeconomic status although I don't know if any studies have been done on that in UHC countries, a more equal medical system probably attenuates that somewhat, although there's still plenty of non-medical reasons the 1% are more protected from covid than say service workers

I think the disregard for the welfare of young people is obvious from the policy that disregards the welfare of young people, I guess it could all be a coincidence, but I doubt it personally. Demanding citations for what's in specific politicians' hearts is silly when we can just look at what they do.

# ? Jan 22, 2022 23:48

Professor Beetus: Apr 12, 2007; They can fight us
But they'll never Beetus

VitalSigns posted:

Old plutocrats aren't more likely to die from covid, there's plenty of evidence that outcomes are linked to socioeconomic status although I don't know if any studies have been done on that in UHC countries, a more equal medical system probably attenuates that somewhat, although there's still plenty of non-medical reasons the 1% are more protected from covid than say service workers

I think the disregard for the welfare of young people is obvious from the policy that disregards the welfare of young people, I guess it could all be a coincidence, but I doubt it personally. Demanding citations for what's in specific politicians' hearts is silly when we can just look at what they do.

If you're going to respond to someone talking specifics and citing data with nothing but broad generalities, you could consider just not responding.

# ? Jan 23, 2022 00:04

Rust Martialis: May 8, 2007; At night, Bavovnyatko quietly comes to the occupiers’ bases, depots, airfields, oil refineries and other places full of flammable items and starts playing with fire there

Professor Beetus posted:

If you're going to respond to someone talking specifics and citing data with nothing but broad generalities, you could consider just not responding.

It's ridiculous.

Observation: 3 deaths in 0-19 year olds in 400000 cases

Observation: 3300 deaths in over 60s in 127000 cases

Conclusion: This is genocide of the young by the Danish government! Hundehoveder og hængerøve, lusede amatører, elendige klamphuggere, latterlige skidesprællere. Talentløse skiderikker, impotente grødbønder, og Socialdemokrater!

Rust Martialis fucked around with this message at 00:19 on Jan 23, 2022

# ? Jan 23, 2022 00:14

Charles 2 of Spain: Nov 7, 2017

Can't find the link, but COVID mortality is skewed younger in the USA compared to European countries. Maybe it's an artefact of the differences in healthcare systems.

# ? Jan 23, 2022 01:20

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# ? May 25, 2024 07:26

Fritz the Horse: Dec 26, 2019; ... of course!

Charles 2 of Spain posted:

Can't find the link, but COVID mortality is skewed younger in the USA compared to European countries. Maybe it's an artefact of the differences in healthcare systems.

Also I'd guess higher rates of obesity and diabetes are a factor in the US.

# ? Jan 23, 2022 02:04

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > COVID-19: People on the internet are judging me for going outside. It used to be the reverse.

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