|
PyRosflam posted:Small firms cant do business with these groups, if your JPMorgan, Deloitte will send its A Team, if your small cap firm X you get the C team. I've found the even when you get the A team (for sales and start of contract) you end up with the C team eventually anyway.
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 00:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 16:50 |
|
|
Glad I could fill out the manager survey. I have some small experience in data obfuscation, so if you need a Senior Director for Global Messaging, let me know. I might be just the disruptor you need!
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 03:53
|
|
|
Motronic posted:I've found the even when you get the A team (for sales and start of contract) you end up with the C team eventually anyway. There is no A team, only A people who move on.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 04:30
|
|
|
Motronic posted:I've found the even when you get the A team (for sales and start of contract) you end up with the C team eventually anyway. During sales, "We cant guarantee people unless you sign now" is used as a trick. Often contracts dont name people only roles so even if you sign, the Sales Engineer will go poof shortly as well.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 05:10
|
|
|
This seems like a good moment to bring up the multi million dollar project I was on where Accenture was hired and their project lead was an alcoholic who routinely came into work at least hung over if not still drunk.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 05:21
|
|
|
BigPaddy posted:This seems like a good moment to bring up the multi million dollar project I was on where Accenture was hired and their project lead was an alcoholic who routinely came into work at least hung over if not still drunk. Wow, This is fairly light for a Big 4 consultant. I recall my managers drinking almost every night and going out for 2nd and 3rd rounds then showing up fresh the next day. This guy is going far in consulting 
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 07:36
|
|
|
Have y'all heard about the people who are currently being blocked from starting their new jobs until their old employer can hire replacements? In a loving AT WILL state? https://eu.postcrescent.com/story/news/2022/01/21/what-we-know-ascension-thedacare-court-battle-over-employees/6607417001/
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 12:28
|
|
|
That is absolutely bonkers
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 14:27
|
|
|
I'm trying to find out more, but it seems to be a very niche case. Most of a hospital's stroke team is leaving to form a new unit at a different hospital, and the injunction seems to be on the basis that there's a public need for stroke treatment and continuity of care.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 15:21
|
|
|
Tibalt posted:I'm trying to find out more, but it seems to be a very niche case. Most of a hospital's stroke team is leaving to form a new unit at a different hospital, and the injunction seems to be on the basis that there's a public need for stroke treatment and continuity of care. That's not the former employees problem. Healthcare in the US isnt a right last I checked. If people are too important to leave your company then you need to pay them enough that they don't. Thedacare had the option to counteroffer to keep their employees and refused.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 16:18
|
|
|
Jordan7hm posted:There is no A team, only A people who move on.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 16:30
|
|
|
Healthcare workers frequently have licensures tied to contracts, so that actually pre-empts a lot of the "At-Will" stuff, but yeah it is generally bonkers and I don't know what ground the court thinks it has to force this though.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 16:41
|
|
|
Tibalt posted:I'm trying to find out more, but it seems to be a very niche case. Most of a hospital's stroke team is leaving to form a new unit at a different hospital, and the injunction seems to be on the basis that there's a public need for stroke treatment and continuity of care. Still not sure how this can stand, unless there was some contract or something the entire team can quit. A ruling like this means the hospital can choose not to staff the unit out of spite. If they sued this hard they may try to do this just to send a message that you can't quit or we go after you even then. Also constitutional issues around freedom of association.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 16:44
|
|
|
At least on my side of (government) consulting, contracts typically are bid with a small number of key personnel. Those people's resumes are included in the bid, and are tied to that contract for the duration. Swapping them out requires the government to approve the replacement. Not filling a key position for various reasons incurs all sorts of payment penalties. However even then you're still dealing with a small fraction of the total workforce - a small contract with 20 FTEs might have two or three key personnel, and a contract with 150 FTEs might have a dozen at most. Then you add the fact that staying in the same job/position for longer than like 18 months will actively hurt your corporate career progression and yeah, you've got lots of turnover. I'm on year 3.5 of a contract for a client and I am the only person out of 12 that has been there for longer than a year. But I'm also never going to get further on corporate side so I don't really give a poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 16:50
|
|
|
at that point it isn't consulting, it's contract labor
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 17:55
|
|
|
KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:at that point it isn't consulting, it's contract labor Sounds like a typical "6 month" SAP deployment.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 18:02
|
|
|
Motronic posted:Sounds like a typical "6 month" SAP deployment. i think the shortest implementation timeframe i've seen for any of my clients to imlement just a single SAP module is like 22 months
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 18:10
|
|
|
KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:at that point it isn't consulting, it's contract labor Kind of yeah. By virtue of my position there's long-term need here; I have an infinite amount of work. I *could* just jump ship whenever I wanted but I'm a creature of habit. Other people on my contract are brought in for specific projects that last however long - they do their job and then gently caress off.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 18:16
|
|
|
Motronic posted:Sounds like a typical "6 month" SAP deployment. Ha! Our 3 year implementation turned into 10. And that was after we sold off half the company. Edit: thank you IBM consulting 
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 18:36
|
|
|
There's no mention of a contract in the article I read, and four of them gave one month of notice. (Well, one month from announcement to start at the new place, no mention of their actual quit date.) Presumably a court could rule them in breach of a contract, if one exists, but other than being questioned by company lawyers (say to document processes or validate company IP), how can a court compel labor? A "stop work" order is possible, but this injunction mostly seems to be saying "well yeah I'm the judge but I'm not working this weekend and I don't know when I'll get to this, so I'm just gonna block any activity and clean up the mess later". (Plus the new employer will have to counter-sue for hours lost, and that means more money for the court system woohoo.)
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 18:49
|
|
|
Jordan7hm posted:There is no A team, only A people who move on. Plus you can’t put A people together - A manager gets C staff because they’ll deliver anyway and A staff go with D manager since they’ll step up and then use the experience to argue for early promotion. Seeing A managers and staff put on the same project is a good indicator of an impending shitshow.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 20:32
|
|
|
PhantomOfTheCopier posted:There's no mention of a contract in the article I read, and four of them gave one month of notice. (Well, one month from announcement to start at the new place, no mention of their actual quit date.) Presumably a court could rule them in breach of a contract, if one exists, but other than being questioned by company lawyers (say to document processes or validate company IP), how can a court compel labor? So here is the trick, the judge gave the order on a Friday, and the next hearing is Monday. So even the Judge thinks this is suspect, The main argument is already highly suspect (wont have people to treat a major injury) since by blocking them from working they also cant have the new hospital do the work.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 21:14
|
|
|
Big picture this whole thing is stupid because anyone with half a brain is going to look at it and go "oh, taking a job in medical care means literal enslavement? Guess I'll stay the hell out of that field then"
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 21:30
|
|
|
Democratic Pirate posted:Plus you can’t put A people together - A manager gets C staff because they’ll deliver anyway and A staff go with D manager since they’ll step up and then use the experience to argue for early promotion. This isn’t my experience at all. A people collect other A people. From a client perspective you’ll get more of a mix for sure, because it’s a business and we have to staff in a difficult labour market, so there are going to be misses. But generally the really high performing teams are all anchored around one or two really good people who find and develop other good people. And yeah SAP modules in less than a year is uhhhh. Good luck. S/4 is coming, I feel for everyone about to go through the update (lol) process.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 21:33
|
|
|
yeah, I agree with that. A people will leave if not given the correct opportunities (basically an inevitability in most of my client's organizations), but A people generally prefer to work with competent people rather than not.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 21:47
|
|
|
SpartanIvy posted:That's not the former employees problem. Healthcare in the US isnt a right last I checked. The case isn't against the employees. It's against the new employer for unfair business practices. I think the old employer should get hosed in this case as the compensation appears reasonable, but it's not outlandish that this could be abused.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 22:39
|
|
|
asur posted:The case isn't against the employees. It's against the new employer for unfair business practices. I think the old employer should get hosed in this case as the compensation appears reasonable, but it's not outlandish that this could be abused. The only case I've seen work here is "Tortious Interference of Business". But this mostly only works when your talking a firm taking an active action, like Google hiring all of Apples AI researchers via poaching. However Apple AI researcher is a fairly small targeted group thats really hard to replace, while Nurse, even specialty Nurse, is not difficult as its a standardized job spec. After that your looking at perhaps "breach of non compete", but in this case that wont apply as well. The case facts already show that 1 person got a new job, told coworkers, who all independently applied for jobs as well and then they all got about the same start date. So to me this is only the old employer trying to send a message, because they sued the workers, not the new hospital. Now that message is really kind of scary if it succeeds because it says we're gonna ruin you if you quit. This was stopped in the past with most non competes being made mostly non-valid.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 22:59
|
|
|
It's also important to note that the new place did not poach all the staff from the old place. One person from the old place applied, got accepted, told their colleagues about the much much better deal they were getting, so a couple of them applied and were accepted as well, repeat for the remainder. The staff even gave the old place an opportunity to counteroffer, and the old place didn't because  you are replaceable peons . So the staff left, as is their wont in a free country and all that!The lawsuit is purely out of spite. Some worthless middle manager isn't happy that they're not a literal slavedriver and decided to throw all their toys out of the pram. e:f,b Tibalt posted:I'm trying to find out more, but it seems to be a very niche case. Most of a hospital's stroke team is leaving to form a new unit at a different hospital, and the injunction seems to be on the basis that there's a public need for stroke treatment and continuity of care. Surely that care is provided at the new hospital, is it not? Eric the Mauve posted:Big picture this whole thing is stupid because anyone with half a brain is going to look at it and go "oh, taking a job in medical care means literal enslavement? Guess I'll stay the hell out of that field then"  NO ONE WANTS TO WORK ANYMORE!!!
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 23:26
|
|
|
Jordan7hm posted:This isn’t my experience at all. A people collect other A people. That’s fair. The coordinated deployment of A teams I saw in public accounting were for important new clients, and first year audits tend to be terrible even for established public companies.
|
|
#
?
Jan 23, 2022 23:26
|
|
|
asur posted:The case isn't against the employees. It's against the new employer for unfair business practices. I think the old employer should get hosed in this case as the compensation appears reasonable, but it's not outlandish that this could be abused. It's only not against the employees in the strictest sense. The injunction is to stop them from starting their new job, and specifically mentions it's because the company can't afford to lose them, while ignoring the fact that the company had every chance to compensate them more to retain them but decided not to. Their old employer is trying to force them to work at their old job by denying them the ability to work at the new job and thus collect any payment. It is reasonably shown that the new employer did not poach the employees from their competitor. Their previous employer is just incredibly uncompetitive with pay and benefits, and once one person figured it out and communicated it to the others, many more followed in leaving. I've seen it happen at every office I've worked at to some extent.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 00:15
|
|
|
Sounds like there is a massive shortage of qualified healthcare workers. We need H1B nurses stat. Hire four of them at a time, each on a different shift so they can share one set of scrubs.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 00:23
|
|
|
I like how old hospital will never be given notice ever again. They can't sue if they don't know you're leaving!
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 00:26
|
|
|
Tomfoolery posted:I like how old hospital will never be given notice ever again. They can't sue if they don't know you're leaving! This would be the long-term outcome if this somehow went sideways. If anyone even decided to go into healthcare at that point lol. There's no way this doesn't get appealed if their old employer somehow wins, right? Right???
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 00:29
|
|
|
Salami Surgeon posted:Sounds like there is a massive shortage of qualified healthcare workers. We need H1B nurses stat. Hire four of them at a time, each on a different shift so they can share one set of scrubs. Hello and welcome to twenty years ago. Philippines is one of the largest sources, but there’s big backlog on applications.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 00:32
|
|
|
Weatherman posted:
Apparently Old Hospital has a designation that requires them to maintain specific staffing levels in order to provide advanced care 24/7. New Hospital does not have this designation, so while they may do the same things, they aren't required to have the same 24/7 capability and are supposed to be able to transfer patients to Old Hospital if they get overwhelmed. With the massive healthcare worker shortage, Old Hospital has to force the nurses to work insane hours to meet the requirements, while New Hospital can offer more reasonable hours since they are held to a different standard.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 00:33
|
|
|
Sounds like old hospital needs to staff and pay to manage their obligations and the court system should gently caress right on off on helping them to do that on a budget. The old hospital should be the ones accountable for this. Perhaps even personal liability for people in positions of power?
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 00:58
|
|
|
Motronic posted:Perhaps even personal liability for people in positions of power? you're cute
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 01:17
|
|
|
Decent video on this poo poo show https://youtu.be/QE5mV5V-pHs
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 01:19
|
|
|
Salami Surgeon posted:Sounds like there is a massive shortage of qualified healthcare workers. We need H1B nurses stat. Hire four of them at a time, each on a different shift so they can share one set of scrubs. There is, because the pay/benefits/conditions are so lovely. You see plenty of travel nurses glad to work and reaping the benefits. The solution should be to pay/provide for your current hospital staff what they’re worth and mandate nurse to patient ratios, not bring in a bunch of H1B nurses just because they will take less money to do the same lovely job. But,  US healthcare system. It’s laughable that the least paid nurses are the ones that work as a W2 staff nurse at the bedside trying to keep people alive.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 02:04
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 3, 2024 16:50 |
|
|
Immigrant nurses do come in on something similar to an H1B called an EB3 Schedule A visa. They are mostly from the Philippines and are employed by staffing agencies that underpay them while charging massive amounts to hospitals.
|
|
#
?
Jan 24, 2022 02:33
|
|