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Amppelix posted:but see the thing here is that you're wrong and the simple act of catching things in this game is fun. i frankly can't believe you'd prefer the normal system over this. the best thing pokemon has ever done is buff quick balls so they almost always catch a pokemon so you can completely ignore the "real" strategy. there are only so many times i can press zr at the back of a pokemons head until i want to do something else
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Jan 30, 2022 02:33
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| # ? Jun 5, 2024 14:17 |
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I always felt the menu-based combat was itself the curse and why franchises like Final Fantasy work to always be switching things up somewhat progressively towards more real-timeish action. Ni No Kuni is still my favourite alt take on the pokebattle formula but still needed some work. They abandoned it for the sequel though.
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Jan 30, 2022 02:33
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nah turn based combat pwns
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Jan 30, 2022 02:35
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Amppelix posted:but see the thing here is that you're wrong and the simple act of catching things in this game is fun. i frankly can't believe you'd prefer the normal system over this. the best thing pokemon has ever done is buff quick balls so they almost always catch a pokemon so you can completely ignore the "real" strategy. The normal system is boring but I have to do it at most once per pokemon unless I'm really hard up and then focus on the rest of the game. The new system is novel but got boring incredibly fast and is also a much much larger focus wrt the gameplay. I don't think either are all that engaging or fun but I'll take.the former design because the latter being so much of the gameplay means most of the game is a boring slog of catching a few dozen of a specific pokemon with no intention of doing anything but releasing them so in long term it was a pointless exercise made to make a meter to go up because the devs didn't really make things to do in the game other than pressing zr at pokes as you sprint through the areas. Like it was fun until I had to do it for the 30th time because it's still so simple and unengaging. As designed you'll be doing things hundreds of times to fill out the dex. It's just not fun past the initial shock of it being new Also turn based combat rules, stux is correct in that regard. ZenMasterBullshit fucked around with this message at 02:46 on Jan 30, 2022 |
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Jan 30, 2022 02:40
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make hop the professor for the next game. this is my only demand.
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Jan 30, 2022 02:46
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Stux posted:there are only so many times i can press zr at the back of a pokemons head until i want to do something else you can describe anything as "lol i'm just pressing a button over and over again how is this fun" but there's way more involved in catching. without even talking about using any other items, if you want a back strike you have to wait for the opportunity and either aim carefully or sneak up close enough that you can lock on and don't have to aim (and if you're using heavy balls, really close.) and of course it's not guaranteed that you'll catch so you might also want to consider what you'll do next if you fail, etc. it's simple, but engaging, and usually it all happens just a little bit different every time due to outside factors like the terrain and other mons around. and then you've got all the different items you could use on top of that! and i get that this probably isn't going to change your mind, if you don't like it you don't, but there really is more to it than just "ha ha i aim at the back of the head i catch the pokemon"
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Jan 30, 2022 02:47
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Stux posted:make hop the professor for the next game. this is my only demand. This but Guzma.
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Jan 30, 2022 02:47
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Amppelix posted:maybe you should have done something else! ever think about using all the different consumables you get? Yes and largely there's no real point when just doing the basics covers most of everything you'll face well enough. Options are neat but when they're not needed because the game isn't really designed to push you in any way wrt difficulty it's just wasted design space.
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Jan 30, 2022 02:48
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well i see now why it got boring for you
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Jan 30, 2022 02:48
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Amppelix posted:well i see now why it got boring for you I mean I used them like you said to, it still got boring fast. Like im fully engaging with the systems as designed, they're just not that good . It's also just not entertaining enough to be such a large chunk of the gameplay. I'm glad they kept you entertained tho I don't think you need to get this worked up that stux and I found it boring nor do you need to imply we were doing it wrong just because our opinions aren't yours.
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Jan 30, 2022 02:49
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i don't think i implied that or got too worked up but ok
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Jan 30, 2022 02:56
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Amppelix posted:maybe you should have done something else! ever think about using all the different consumables you get? i did. i sat around throwing out food, using the stunning items etc early on. but i would run out and then throwing balls raw it became very quickly apparent that theres no real reward for it, getting a back hit either way is extremely reliable, and regular balls and especially feather balls are very easy to hit at range. theres so little incentive on regular pokemon to take your time given the high catch rate, and the numbers required for the dex, that you can just chain throw balls at every spawned pokemon and get on wryder and ride off. and there really just isnt anything to it more than that unfortunately. none of it feels special, or earned. you amass so many pokemon and given that theres, no abilities, no statistical differences that cant easily be made up, you just end up with boxes full of literally identical pokemon. you are directly rewarded for discarding pokemon and the game gives you a mass release button. it sucks, and i hate it. its not fun, and it turns the pokemon from little friends that i catch and train to cattle. i hope it never comes back.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:00
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Amppelix posted:i don't think i implied that or got too worked up but ok I mean you directly said you thought I was wrong for thinking it got boring (And misread me saying the replaced combat with something worse as saying the old capture system was better, which is weird because that part of that first post is directly followed by "then focused on something that's novel but novelty has an incredibly short shelf-life." which I felt was a clear enough statement that the former wasn't talking about the latter but apparently it was not) then implied I was playing it wrong by asking if I even used the consumables and the like.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:02
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just caught a nickit in sword, its the only one ill catch and its my friend. when the ball wiggled and then finally clicked it felt cool. this is all that matters to me.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:03
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It's stayed fun for me through post-game because coward-strikes are only worth doing when that specific monsters gets a bonus for being caught without notice. Otherwise you can throw it at it's face, stun it out with mudballs or rotten fruit, kick it's rear end with a specific element, or just pick the fight and catch in combat. You got hundreds of pokemon to dex, throwing pokeballs/knocking is good for a couple of the first research levels for catching, but u really gonna go around slower than necessary catching poo poo endlessly when you could instantly warp to camp, grab that fucker, and knock out their dex in a battle or two if you put half second of thought into knocking out 2-4 birds with one agile stone attack against a mon that needs to get it's rear end whupped with rock. That poo poo ain't enough for a good gameplay loop alone, the game obviously would need another year or two of content and mechanic development if this were a game by another company that has a pretty guaranteed audience regardless of individual game quality or time investment. Reckon the next one of these will have progressively more poo poo to do with monsters since they can copypaste the checklist they have now.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:06
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Stux posted:just caught a nickit in sword, its the only one ill catch and its my friend. when the ball wiggled and then finally clicked it felt cool. this is all that matters to me. 
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Jan 30, 2022 03:09
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Also they should make a pokemon game where the battles are cool and fun as their artwork like  and not incredibly flaccid feeling like the Dynamax gym battles. Let me do fun battles on a moving train, or a haunted merry-go-round or a rollercoaster again but with an actual budget and sense of place.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:15
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Stux posted:nah turn based combat pwns This right here. The problem is pokemon's brand of turn based combat which is slow, boring and too easy. SMT and Etrian odyssey have very engaging menu combat.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:26
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how so, real question edit: how are those good menu-based combats, not how is pokemon's bad
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Jan 30, 2022 03:30
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i like pokemons combat
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Jan 30, 2022 03:38
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I mean fundamentally this is just people going 'I enjoy this thing, but not this thing' 'well I enjoy the second thing but not the first!'
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Jan 30, 2022 03:42
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Why does this game have such poo poo graphics? Other "open world" games on Switch don't look this awful, so how does a first party title manage it?
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Jan 30, 2022 03:43
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Grand Theft Autobot posted:Why does this game have such poo poo graphics? Other "open world" games on Switch don't look this awful, so how does a first party title manage it? It's not first party is it? Not that that's an excuse for these textures.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:44
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HopperUK posted:It's not first party is it? Not that that's an excuse for these textures. Oh, I guess I always assumed GameFreak was a Nintendo owned studio. edit: GameFreak is a second party studio. Maybe Nintendo should hire someone good to make these. Grand Theft Autobot fucked around with this message at 03:50 on Jan 30, 2022 |
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Jan 30, 2022 03:46
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Gamefreak should have insane budget considering how much revenue they generate and how big of a franchise they handle for Nintendo. Or they need to hire more sophisticated programmers and 3D artists. I feel like Gamefreak never made proper jump from 2D to 3D. The 3DS games also have terrible anti aliasing, their artstyle is good but technically all their games look like crap. Or they should just get another Japanese studio to help them with the stuff they can't handle. Like Intelligent Systems never made a game like Fire Emblem 3 Houses so they got KoeiTecmo to co develop it with them. Same for Breath of The Wild, they got help from Monolith who had made open world rpgs forever.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:57
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I definitely think the most important thing to take into the main games is it's approach to getting in and out of battles, even if apparently that means they can't show all the grass on screen all at once. Shields prettier so far but so muc hof the game is already me mashing a while waiting for the game to even let me give commands, and that's after applying a 60 fps mod to effectively get 2x speed. coming off of Arceus this is hard to keep focus on because there's less input for me to give and less action when I press anything.HopperUK posted:I mean fundamentally this is just people going 'I enjoy this thing, but not this thing' 'well I enjoy the second thing but not the first!' I mean I was asking a real question about what are those two systems doing that makes them more compelling than pokemons or not, I don't know those games systems.
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Jan 30, 2022 03:57
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Ulio posted:Gamefreak should have insane budget considering how much revenue they generate and how big of a franchise they handle for Nintendo. Or they need to hire more sophisticated programmers and 3D artists. I feel like Gamefreak never made proper jump from 2D to 3D. The 3DS games also have terrible anti aliasing, their artstyle is good but technically all their games look like crap. They should have a big budget but I’m pretty sure they don’t or if they do it’s all wasted due to their short dev times. I mean even back in the 2D days they were hardly cutting edge. Apparently they did get outside support for the game too but again the game probably had less than 2 years of work put into it, which is pretty rushed these days. Seems pretty clear the higher ups think a new game a year is necessary for the ip but it’s not doing the studio any favours.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:06
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status update: cooking curry with my funny little green monkey. i would die for him.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:10
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Khanstant posted:how so, real question Kinda hard to explain. Let's say that a "good turn" in a turn based game is one where you evaluate the current situation, consider your options, and come up with a solution that will resolve your current problems while putting you on the path to execute your long-term strategy. And a "bad turn" is one where you pick the most obvious choice without thinking and mash through all the text. Storyline pokemon has a much higher percentage of bad turns than both of those other series, where you can make a some bad choices and in the course of single turn the battle can snowball into a loss. I don't think pokemon's battle system is like, inherently bad. Multiplayer pokemon has a really high concentration of good turns. Storyline is just a boring sleepwalk for actual children, with no real options to improve it without intentionally handicapping yourself to an absurd degree. Also pokemon turns are SLOW AS poo poo. Like seriously you can cut the amount of time a turn takes by like a half or more and lose absolutely nothing, it's ridiculous.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:10
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I kind of wish the game didn't get rid of the border lines for areas once you set foot in them, it'd be nice to know what exactly counts as "Deerland Heights" for example. I finished every single research task for Bidoof and the Pokeball icon next to it in the dex is now sparkly. I think someone said that raises the shiny chances? I still haven't seen or caught a shiny yet although I got the request to get that specific one.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:11
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Mainline pokemon is sort of bogged down with sequential battle messages, and could use an option to simplify and speed up how turns playout. While some other turn-based RPGs are snappier with their preseentation. "Charmander got a critical hit, wishing to be praised!" "Charmander is in a pinch, and looks like it might cry!" are cute and all, but after seeing them and pressing A to confirm a hundred times it would be nice if they could just do something like a critical indicator graphic pop up on the battle screen at the same time the attack animation and healthbar resolve.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:14
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Gruckles posted:Mainline pokemon is sort of bogged down with sequential battle messages, and could use an option to simplify and speed up how turns playout. While some other turn-based RPGs are snappier with their preseentation. And they could make Charmander look at you for praise or make him look like he's crying You know Show rather than tell
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Jan 30, 2022 04:21
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Gruckles posted:Mainline pokemon is sort of bogged down with sequential battle messages, and could use an option to simplify and speed up how turns playout. While some other turn-based RPGs are snappier with their preseentation. What's weird is that the solution exists, they already have the popup messages for when abilities trigger without devoting an entire text box to it for you to sit through, they just need to actually use those for more things.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:23
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Grand Theft Autobot posted:Why does this game have such poo poo graphics? Other "open world" games on Switch don't look this awful, so how does a first party title manage it? but mostly because the game was made in two (2) years and for half of that they didn't even have a full team because they were also making DLC for the previous game
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Jan 30, 2022 04:25
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Am I missing it or is there no way to see which tasks are left for a Pokemon while I'm looking in the boxes?
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Jan 30, 2022 04:28
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Alright, so if they let these games bake a little longer we might end up with something that looks and runs a lot better. But Nintendo and/or the Pokemon Company don't want that to happen because they think everyone will just forget Pokemon exists if they don't squeeze one of these out every year?
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Jan 30, 2022 04:36
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Grand Theft Autobot posted:Alright, so if they let these games bake a little longer we might end up with something that looks and runs a lot better. But Nintendo and/or the Pokemon Company don't want that to happen because they think everyone will just forget Pokemon exists if they don't squeeze one of these out every year? That's unbridled greed, baby.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:39
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pokemon has been almost yearly for a decade now (only missed 2015) and it's clearly been working out for them so far so i don't think anything is going to happen until it somehow massively bites them in the rear end but yeah these games deserve it. probably best we can hope for is that they take full advantage of the studio they hired for BDSP for continued pokemon games and maybe even hire a third one so they can get somewhat of a buffer between game freak releases.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:41
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Grand Theft Autobot posted:Alright, so if they let these games bake a little longer we might end up with something that looks and runs a lot better. But Nintendo and/or the Pokemon Company don't want that to happen because they think everyone will just forget Pokemon exists if they don't squeeze one of these out every year? Yeah probably.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:45
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Ulio posted:Gamefreak should have insane budget considering how much revenue they generate and how big of a franchise they handle for Nintendo. Or they need to hire more sophisticated programmers and 3D artists. I feel like Gamefreak never made proper jump from 2D to 3D. The 3DS games also have terrible anti aliasing, their artstyle is good but technically all their games look like crap. Three Houses was a pretty ugly game a lot of the time too.
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Jan 30, 2022 04:46
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