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Pistol_Pete posted:The dnd thread is awful, you honestly get more level headed and informative posting in the Cspam equivalent. Unless your version of level headedness is supporting Russia, I’m not so sure
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Mar 2, 2022 16:37
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Pistol_Pete posted:The dnd thread is awful, you honestly get more level headed and informative posting in the Cspam equivalent. Well lots of Putin apologists in there so makes sense you would think that. (the main dnd thread is also garbage but in a different way)
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Mar 2, 2022 16:39
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I mean I do feel like pretty much all discussion on Ukraine is 'pick a side and reject anything anyone says against that side out of hand as lies'. I think the pro-Putin side is much more guilty of this, but nonetheless we can't ignore the implications of the Azov Battalion etc being full on neo-nazis, which is doubly important given they're an official part of the Ukrainian gendarmerie, not just some independent fash group. I am extremely uncomfortable with them being portrayed in the Western media as totally cool noble freedom fighters!
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Mar 2, 2022 16:45
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I stopped reading the DnD thread when the general consensus was that actually it is very heroic to arm civilians to shoot the russians and if you suggest otherwise it is because you are too soft and have not experienced enough hardship in your life and they should have the opportunity to die heroically.
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Mar 2, 2022 16:46
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Pistol_Pete posted:The dnd thread is awful, you honestly get more level headed and informative posting in the Cspam equivalent. also tactical analysis, rather than omg 2000 russian tanks have just been blowed up, honest
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Mar 2, 2022 16:46
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I do wonder how the "No Fly Zone" crowd would react when confronted by the cost of enforcing said zone even if thermonuclear annihilation wasn't on the table. How many dozens of fighters and pilots would be an appropriate cost I wonder. Russia still haven't managed to stomp all of Ukraine's AA capacity at this point so good luck doing the same to Russia without turning the Russian controlled bits into ash with cruise missiles or just burning through planes doing SEAD.
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Mar 2, 2022 16:48
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OwlFancier posted:I stopped reading the DnD thread when the general consensus was that actually it is very heroic to arm civilians to shoot the russians and if you suggest otherwise it is because you are too soft and have not experienced enough hardship in your life and they should have the opportunity to die heroically. Yeah it's genuinely heartbreaking seeing families being split up because of the dumb gently caress policy that able bodied men have to stay and fight, as if they owe poo poo to their stupid country
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Mar 2, 2022 16:48
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The hazy days of yore when sanctions were Very Effective Actually, see South Africa, etc. It's kind of funny to recall how the left/right discourse on it morphed across the 2010s as targeted financial sanctions coalesced into policies and regulations
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Mar 2, 2022 16:49
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I have been assured that it is a completely independent personal decision they are making to fight and you should not suggest anything other than that the only external factor that may lead someone to die involuntarily is the russians.
OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Mar 2, 2022 |
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Mar 2, 2022 16:50
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OwlFancier posted:I have been assured that it is a completely independent personal decision they are making to fight and you should not suggest the only external factor that may lead someone to die involuntarily is the russians. You can die fighting the Russians or you can die a Russian saboteur.
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Mar 2, 2022 16:52
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I can totally see Raab or Patel pushing to reimplement the draft 'just in case'
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Mar 2, 2022 16:53
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OwlFancier posted:I stopped reading the DnD thread when the general consensus was that actually it is very heroic to arm civilians to shoot the russians and if you suggest otherwise it is because you are too soft and have not experienced enough hardship in your life and they should have the opportunity to die heroically. American Gun Fetishism is incredibly pervasive
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Mar 2, 2022 17:00
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ThomasPaine posted:Speaking of NI my partner pointed out the other day that all these newscasters saying the quiet part out loud about unprecedented conflict in Europe must have been received with some bemusement in Belfast and Derry, not to mention the former Yugoslavia. i was gonna ask someone if i'd gone mad but all the 'first war in europe in 80years' hysteria stuff was like err the entire 90s? there were tank battles and everything? broadcast media is just open nonsense at this point
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Mar 2, 2022 17:06
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The war in kosovo isn't something I remember very well as I was young at the time but I at least do remember that it happened, I assume people old enough to remember better should have less trouble with it.
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Mar 2, 2022 17:08
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There are accounts of families getting to the border and them letting the mum and kids through while telling that dad 'tough luck, back to Kiev with you to face the Russian tanks. No military training or weapon? Well, good luck!' It's actually a properly sad and inhuman policy and I'm kinda mad it's mostly being ignored or hand-wrung away by the Western media because obviously Ukraine can do no wrong atm. Can you imagine how people would react if it was ordinary Brits being expected to sacrifice themselves in some pointless doomed defence? Thinking out loud, but something something about how the conflict shows the murky semi-whiteness Eastern Europeans occupy today. Rustybear posted:i was gonna ask someone if i'd gone mad but all the 'first war in europe in 80years' hysteria stuff was like err the entire 90s? there were tank battles and everything? tbf I think we all know what they mean, and when you crack the code it's pretty obvious why Bosnia isn't considered 'European' for their purposes.
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Mar 2, 2022 17:09
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literal white european people in literal tanks literally fighting with each other on literal European soil far to the west of the current conflict so even the nudge nudge win wink yeah but people who look like us stuff doesn't apply there is exactly one war in history and it concluded in 1945
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Mar 2, 2022 17:09
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https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1499053533584314380
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Mar 2, 2022 17:13
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OwlFancier posted:The war in kosovo isn't something I remember very well as I was young at the time but I at least do remember that it happened, I assume people old enough to remember better should have less trouble with it. also the war in bosnia and the serbo-croat war which is what i was reaching for also coming away from yugoslav which feels almost like cheating it's so obvious, there's the turkish invasion of cyprus and a ton of internal 'civil' conflicts which as the joke goes weren't very civil at all...and who could forget the cod wars
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Mar 2, 2022 17:14
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The media is basically this at the moment https://twitter.com/Lubchansky/status/1499036555515678723 also namechange pls mods  jiggerypokery posted:American Gun Fetishism is incredibly pervasive Rustybear posted:there is exactly one war in history and it concluded in 1945 
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Mar 2, 2022 17:15
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gently caress me my energy supplier wants to start charging me £127 a month, a guy who lives in his own and spends most of the week at work. This time last year it was £50.
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Mar 2, 2022 17:15
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ThomasPaine posted:There are accounts of families getting to the border and them letting the mum and kids through while telling that dad 'tough luck, back to Kiev with you to face the Russian tanks. No military training or weapon? Well, good luck!' It's actually a properly sad and inhuman policy and I'm kinda mad it's mostly being ignored or hand-wrung away by the Western media because obviously Ukraine can do no wrong atm. Can you imagine how people would react if it was ordinary Brits being expected to sacrifice themselves in some pointless doomed defence? right but serbia and croatia are more white and more christian than the ukraine is; it's genuine actual ignorance rather than coded racism
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Mar 2, 2022 17:15
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The Nuclear annihilation of your entire family, friends and pets: 52% / 48%
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Mar 2, 2022 17:17
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ThomasPaine posted:I mean I do feel like pretty much all discussion on Ukraine is 'pick a side and reject anything anyone says against that side out of hand as lies'. I think the pro-Putin side is much more guilty of this, but nonetheless we can't ignore the implications of the Azov Battalion etc being full on neo-nazis, which is doubly important given they're an official part of the Ukrainian gendarmerie, not just some independent fash group. I am extremely uncomfortable with them being portrayed in the Western media as totally cool noble freedom fighters! Better to have them in the tent pissing out than outside pissing in, don't like them but they are there and until they commit an atrocity they can take a bullet instead of a Ukranian.  
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Mar 2, 2022 17:17
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Aren't the azov guys.. also Ukrainian?
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Mar 2, 2022 17:18
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Kin posted:So, I just took the plunge and grabbed the "loyal customer" fixed price with Octopus. What the christ? I'm on the standard variable rate with British Gas and my Electricity and Gas combined for this past quarter was £140.  e: Very worried as to what next quarter's bill might be. D: Oscar Romeo Romeo fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Mar 2, 2022 |
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Mar 2, 2022 17:20
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Rustybear posted:The Nuclear annihilation of your entire family, friends and pets: 52% / 48% are you implying sanctions would lead to Nuclear war?
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Mar 2, 2022 17:22
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As far as I was aware they are Ukrainian turbo-nationalists, yeah
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Mar 2, 2022 17:22
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All according to keikaku War really is a gift to tories (red, blue or yellow) Pistol_Pete posted:The dnd thread is awful, you honestly get more level headed and informative posting in the Cspam equivalent. troot Jel Shaker posted:also tactical analysis, rather than omg 2000 russian tanks have just been blowed up, honest troot NotJustANumber99 posted:What if this isn't the case? The it being doomed? Civilians with AK47s and molotov cocktails and no training are, in fact, doomed against an actual army, I'm afraid Barry Foster fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Mar 2, 2022 |
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Mar 2, 2022 17:23
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ThomasPaine posted:Being expected to sacrifice themselves in some pointless doomed defence? What if this isn't the case? The it being doomed?
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Mar 2, 2022 17:23
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OwlFancier posted:Aren't the azov guys.. also Ukrainian? seems they have collected a few ultra fash psychos across europe over the past few years, there’s a video of some croatian volunteers for example
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Mar 2, 2022 17:24
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Mega Comrade posted:are you implying sanctions would lead to Nuclear war? Barry Foster posted:All according to keikaku
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Mar 2, 2022 17:25
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kecske posted:I can totally see Raab or Patel pushing to reimplement the draft 'just in case' National Service was ended at the absolute insistence of the armed forces themselves and they've only ever got more opposed to it. It's not like we've even got enough kit to keep our current lot supplied (or warehouses full of Lee-Enfields left over from WW1 to hand out like we did in 1939), and modern warfare just doesn't need warm bodies holding guns any more. At least one, extremely powerful, argument used against going to a Swiss-style citizen's militia model (one proposal for the continuation of National Service but on a smaller scale) where after 2 years you're discharged but can be called back immediately in the event of war is that by the 60s any possible scenario for invasion of the British Isles would come *after* the country had been turned into a faintly-glowing dust cloud drifting over the North Sea, and that definitely still applies now to a more general conscription - any war we're going to get involved in that would require millions of troops will be WW3 and we'd all be dead before they'd even had a chance to polish their boots. goddamnedtwisto fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Mar 2, 2022 |
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Mar 2, 2022 17:27
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Mega Comrade posted:are you implying sanctions would lead to Nuclear war? it was just a joke on the most cursed polling ratio
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Mar 2, 2022 17:28
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NotJustANumber99 posted:What if this isn't the case? The it being doomed? Then it would still be a dumb gently caress idea. I'm not super keen on the idea of conscription either, but at least with that you get a basic level of training and support and equipment. Just handing Alexei the barista a rifle he has no idea how to use and telling him he has to stand his ground against a whole rear end mechanised invasion force and probably die alone in a ditch for the sake of country he doesn't care about is as pointless as it is immoral. It's near enough a cannon-fodder strategy to play for time, imho.
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Mar 2, 2022 17:30
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OwlFancier posted:Aren't the azov guys.. also Ukrainian? It's mixed, 2,500 members from latest info, but if you're a neo nazi from another country that's where you want to go.  Most Ukranian men spend a year in the army/defence force so when the call up for all able bodied men to join in the defence occurred we're not talking about noobs being handed a gun and told to charge the enemy. Their choices in life are much harder than ours and i do not envy them for a second. 
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Mar 2, 2022 17:32
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Anyone seen those antivaxx stickers with anime girls on them What happened to those guys now everyone's stopped giving a poo poo about COVID (wrongly of course, but that's what's happened)?
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Mar 2, 2022 17:33
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ThomasPaine posted:Then it would still be a dumb gently caress idea. I'm not super keen on the idea of conscription either, but at least with that you get a basic level of training and support and equipment. Just handing Alexei the barista a rifle he has no idea how to use and telling him he has to stand his ground against a whole rear end mechanised invasion force and probably die alone in a ditch for the sake of country he doesn't care about is as pointless as it is immoral. It's near enough a cannon-fodder strategy to play for time, imho. Well yes that is exactly what it is but it might actually work. If they slow the invasion down enough that public opinion/money/russian army morale turns against it in Russia then the country might survive.
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Mar 2, 2022 17:34
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Barry Foster posted:Civilians with AK47s and molotov cocktails and no training are, in fact, doomed against an actual army, I'm afraid I think they know this, the plan seems to be to make it as painful enough that Russia back off and it worked for the Fins (until Russia regrouped and tried a second time...)
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Mar 2, 2022 17:35
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What is a 'no fly zone' if not a massive 'cool zone'.
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Mar 2, 2022 17:36
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Oscar Romeo Romeo posted:What the christ? I'm on the standard variable rate with British Gas and my Electricity and Gas combined for this past quarter was £140. If only there was a circles-based diagram type that could help us! Ah well.
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Mar 2, 2022 17:36
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