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Captain Walker
Apr 7, 2009

Mother knows best
Listen to your mother
It's a scary world out there

Everything Counts posted:

Not to be confused with the Worm of Kings, a regicidal cult looking to depose the monarchy. Or the Wyrm of Kings, a dragon who wishes to share the wisdom of her long-lived people with the rulers of those lands she happens to call home, but must do it secretly to avoid getting in trouble with her more selfish kin.

Don't forget King Worm! Just a guy who lives in the sewers and claims the city's beggars, paupers, and urchins as his subjects, but he hates to feel excluded.

Excluded from what? Why, the Compendium of Cults and Conspiracies, of course; the definitive, self-updating guide to the secrets of commonly known secret societies and societies that are not secret. Sadly all extant copies are lost or hidden except for two complementary fragments held by the Popular Judean Front and People's Front of Judea. The much-feared Judean People's Front keeps launching suicide attacks to liberate them, but somehow they never have any success.

E: hell of a page snipe

Captain Walker fucked around with this message at 17:40 on Feb 17, 2022

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My Lovely Horse
Aug 21, 2010

And neither forget the Worm King who is just Leto Atreides II.

DrSunshine
Mar 23, 2009

Did I just say that out loud~~?!!!
And the Wyrm King, a literal dragon who wears a cute lil' crown. :kimchi:

Shes Not Impressed
Apr 25, 2004


I was browsing battle maps on Amazon and saw someone is selling a big binder that lays flat with battle maps in it. Similar Gloomhaven: Jaws of the Lion, I believe.
I also make a lot of maps for our virtual game using Dungeondraft so I could crank out a bunch pretty easily.

Has anyone ever tried printing and laminating maps that are easy to pull out for encounters or even binding them in a bound book like that?

Kung Food
Dec 11, 2006

PORN WIZARD

Shes Not Impressed posted:

I was browsing battle maps on Amazon and saw someone is selling a big binder that lays flat with battle maps in it. Similar Gloomhaven: Jaws of the Lion, I believe.
I also make a lot of maps for our virtual game using Dungeondraft so I could crank out a bunch pretty easily.

Has anyone ever tried printing and laminating maps that are easy to pull out for encounters or even binding them in a bound book like that?

I don't have flat binder maps, but I do print from my home printer large maps (and by large, I mean I just made a 40"x39" map on a printer I bought at Officedepot) that I can roll up like scrolls and then use a rubber band to hold them. I've thought about doing an effort post about my process but I have been lazy. My maps aren't laminated, but I do put a plastic layer over them that makes them more durable and lets you wet/dry erase mark on them. The downsides is there are some not insignificant upfront costs, and sometimes it doesn't lay as perfectly flat as I would like, and they are scrolls, so a little less portable than a flat binder of maps. If there was enough interest I could put in an effort post about my map production. I am also wondering if this is the best thread for this, or does "DM craft" deserve it's own thread.

Kung Food fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Feb 19, 2022

Sanford
Jun 30, 2007

...and rarely post!


Reveilled posted:

Sun cults.

I’ve pinched all of these ideas for residents on the twelve islands that surround the sun god’s prison in my pirate campaign, thanks. It’s full of cults that don’t trouble outsiders (or ever get round to releasing their god) because they’re too busy fighting amongst themselves.

In my other game, last session they finally killed the River King, big boss of this whole bit and the subject of the paladin’s oath of vengeance from right back when we started playing. They stripped his corpse and as they don’t normally bother looting enemies I was unprepared so just described what he’d got rather than what it did. Now they’re back in Swampsedge and are going to want to look at their stuff. The River King had a crystal crown, a blue orb, and a cloak. One player couldn’t make it, so they cut the face off a hag and turned it into a mask as a gift for him. Appreciate anyone who can check my ideas or suggest anything:

Storm Orb - once per day cast Thunder Wave, Ice Knife or Ice Storm as an action. Destroying the orb allows a single casting of Control Weather.

Cloak of Waterfalls - once per day as a bonus action activate the cloak. Until the end of your next turn all attacks against you are with disadvantage. On a d6 roll of a 6 the effect continues for an extra turn. Otherwise it ends.

Crystal Shard Coronet - [NO IDEA]

Hideous Hag Mask - can cast Tasha’s Hideous Laughter 3 times a day. If you kill someone who’s laughing, you heal d4 hp.

Whybird
Aug 2, 2009

Phaiston have long avoided the tightly competetive defence sector, but the IRDA Act 2052 has given us the freedom we need to bring out something really special.

https://team-robostar.itch.io/robostar


Nap Ghost

Sanford posted:


Crystal Shard Coronet - [NO IDEA]

While you wear this, becoming wet switches from being unpleasant and uncomfortable to luxurious and enjoyable. Being immersed in cold, brackish water is like taking a hot, scented bath, and being in clothing that is soaked through with rain is as pleasant as wearing a warm, snug fur coat.

This doesn't offer any waterproofing or protect your gear from water damage -- it just makes it feel nicer.

If you spend an entire extended rest sleeping in water, you wake with five temporary hit points, and your skin doesn't even go all pruney.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Whybird posted:

While you wear this, becoming wet switches from being unpleasant and uncomfortable to luxurious and enjoyable. Being immersed in cold, brackish water is like taking a hot, scented bath, and being in clothing that is soaked through with rain is as pleasant as wearing a warm, snug fur coat.

This doesn't offer any waterproofing or protect your gear from water damage -- it just makes it feel nicer.

If you spend an entire extended rest sleeping in water, you wake with five temporary hit points, and your skin doesn't even go all pruney.

if you wear it for a week you turn into a fish

Pickled Tink
Apr 28, 2012

Have you heard about First Dog? It's a very good comic I just love.

Also, wear your bike helmets kids. I copped several blows to the head but my helmet left me totally unscathed.



Finally you should check out First Dog as it's a good comic I like it very much.
Fun Shoe
Just have the Hag Mask be a simple Hag Face Mask that, unless preserved properly by a craftsman, rots. Because magic items don't work that way. There's almost always something else involved in their creation, and that something else is usually a wizard going "I wonder what would happen if...". If you let them get away with this there is a chance that they'll start lopping off bits of all their enemies hoping they will be magic items inherently. At least make them work for it.

As for the other items, if they were in any way combat useful then the King should have used them in the fight. Thus you should restrict them to abilities the King had, or non-combat gimmicks, such as the cloak allowing the wearer to walk on water and the orb being a generalised scrying device ("Reply soggy, ask again later". Do not underestimate how much you and your players can do with such a magic orb).

I'd honestly suggest using the coronet as a quest item. Something they should return to it's rightful owner/location. I don't know enough about your River King to be able to come up with example lore for it, sadly.

DrSunshine
Mar 23, 2009

Did I just say that out loud~~?!!!

sebmojo posted:

if you wear it for a week you turn into a fish

It manifests slowly, beginning as a sense of comfort and well-being in the water, progressing to a strange look with bulging, unblinking eyes and greyish skin during the middle of the week, a shambling and distorted gait and slimy, iodine stink at the next to last day, culminating in an obsession with returning to the ocean to live forever in shadowed and many-columned Y'Ha-Nthlei among one's brethren.

Jinh
Sep 12, 2008

Fun Shoe
I'm gonna be giving one of my players a book that could give them the secret to lichdom at level 3 for shits and giggles. He's a serious RPer and is a warlock of the raven queen, who is known for her hatred of intelligent undead like liches and vampires. So I suspect he'll choose to try and destroy it, but I need to make the choice clear to him.

I'm ok with him deciding to try and use the thing, but how do I communicate that she hates this item and wants it destroyed asap? He does have a bird familiar. I've never been good at the whole "interacting the the patron" thing in the past and I wanna work on that.

Glans Dillzig
Nov 23, 2011

:justpost::justpost::justpost::justpost::justpost::justpost::justpost::justpost:

knickerbocker expert
when in doubt, dream sequence

Whybird
Aug 2, 2009

Phaiston have long avoided the tightly competetive defence sector, but the IRDA Act 2052 has given us the freedom we need to bring out something really special.

https://team-robostar.itch.io/robostar


Nap Ghost

Jinh posted:

I'm gonna be giving one of my players a book that could give them the secret to lichdom at level 3 for shits and giggles. He's a serious RPer and is a warlock of the raven queen, who is known for her hatred of intelligent undead like liches and vampires. So I suspect he'll choose to try and destroy it, but I need to make the choice clear to him.

I'm ok with him deciding to try and use the thing, but how do I communicate that she hates this item and wants it destroyed asap? He does have a bird familiar. I've never been good at the whole "interacting the the patron" thing in the past and I wanna work on that.

Idk, in this circumstance I would just say "as a warlock of the Raven Queen you know that she hates poo poo like this". If it's something his character would know you should just tell him.

Personally I would make the choice more interesting because as it stands it's a straight "do the right thing vs do the profitable thing" choice. Maybe instead the book is a diary of a still active and notorious lich from when she was alive: you could study it to replicate the ritual she used, but it's also a really good lead on where she's hidden her phylacteries. So it's not just a question of "do you want to be a good Raven Queen follower y/n" but actually asking them to think about what the best way to serve the Raven Queen is.

Jinh
Sep 12, 2008

Fun Shoe

Whybird posted:

Idk, in this circumstance I would just say "as a warlock of the Raven Queen you know that she hates poo poo like this". If it's something his character would know you should just tell him.

Personally I would make the choice more interesting because as it stands it's a straight "do the right thing vs do the profitable thing" choice. Maybe instead the book is a diary of a still active and notorious lich from when she was alive: you could study it to replicate the ritual she used, but it's also a really good lead on where she's hidden her phylacteries. So it's not just a question of "do you want to be a good Raven Queen follower y/n" but actually asking them to think about what the best way to serve the Raven Queen is.

This is a really good call! I should have expanded on his background in my original post some more. He's a warlock whose family once worked for the Red Wizards of Thay, but when Szass Tam the Archlich took over, the lich found that the PC's family worshipped the Raven Queen and had them killed, he was rooting out any threats to his power from within. The PC barely escaped, and now he's entirely focused on vengeance against the Wizards.

The book can easily give insight into possible locations for Szass Tam's phylacteries and methods, by either showing it to some other ex-red wizard allies of his or if he chooses to fully attune to the book and become the thing he despises.

I was gonna reveal to him if he tried to attune to it, if he wants to gain its power and knowledge he's gonna have to collect x innocent souls with it and do an evil ritual involving permanently sacrificing hit dice and losing max health. I think the book will try to tempt him as well. It's a somewhat nerfed version of the Codex Mortis, if anyone here is familiar with Matt Colville' work. Kinda like the books of exalted deeds/vile darkness.

Glans Dillzig posted:

when in doubt, dream sequence

lol that was my first thought as well, i just didn't wanna wait til the night after he gets it to make him have the vision. i guess he could have visions the instant he touches it.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Was the lich a devotee of the raven queen himself...?

Jinh
Sep 12, 2008

Fun Shoe
Sorry I was trying to avoid a wall of text and only mention stuff i think is relevant, but maybe it's unclear.
It's the opposite. The Warlock PC's family worshipped the raven queen openly. When the new lich came into power, he swept through and cleaned house. Any possible traitors and unaligned members of the group were killed. There's a ton of in-fighting among the Red Wizards apparently.

here's the background timeline i worked out with the player. I'm running a heavily modified Lost Mines of Phandelver starting at level 3, leading up to Dead in Thay later.

-when the Warlock PC was super young, his family joined the small Red Wizards mountain base, Bloodgate Keep, because his father is a gifted evil mage.
-Years pass, eventually Archlich Szass Tam took power over all Red Wizards.
-PC's family is killed soon after due to their worship of the Raven Queen, but the PC escapes the facility barely surviving his trip down the mountain.
-He's found by a travelling prospector (Gundren Rockseeker), and brought to Leilon.
-In Leilon, he meets other people who have been kicked out or left the red wizards, a group of assorted mages. An evil cult, but he gets to be good friends with them.
-Joined with them, the PC played a minor role in them attacking and destroying Bloodgate Keep in guerilla warfare, but the wizards who killed their family escaped by teleporting.
-PC goes on the life of an adventurer and takes a small job for his old friend Gundren, traveling to look for more leads about his family's killers.

Classic DND backstory.

--- cut to what's happening now ---

My player group reached the hub town of the adventure, Phandalin, and heard a rumor about a wizard in red robes at a well nearby. So they immediately want to go kill this dude. They had a couple quest option rumors, and chose this one.

I'm using the Old Owl Well adventure, where a random red wizard named Hamon Kost is camped out at a ruined well with a bunch of zombies digging for *something*. I'm gonna say that Hamon is seeking a powerful artifact in a ruin underneath the well, the Codex Mortis, because he seeks to become a lich himself and depose Szass Tam (lots of in-fighting!)

By the time the players arrive, Hamon will have uncovered the entrance to the underground portion. But he's cautious and hasn't gone in yet, expecting traps. Hamon's zombies will automatically attack anyone who approaches the well, but Hamon will call them off after a round or two and attempt parley. He's fairly chill and calculating, he doesn't want trouble if he can help it and he didn't mean to draw attention to his operation. If the players stop fighting, Hamon will send them on a sidequest to confirm the name of the mage who built the ruin (to help him work out what to expect down there), and he'll give the party a reward for their help. More likely, they'll kill Hamon and go into the ruin themselves, where they may find the Codex.

The PCs can do whatever they want with it, take it or leave it. But the book will have knowledge of how liches are made and how to store phylacteries etc, so whoever gets it, it'll be hella useful for finding and killing Szass Tam one day. But the Warlock's Raven Queen patron wants it destroyed, for obvious reasons.

Phrosphor
Feb 25, 2007

Urbanisation

Hello GM's,

I was hoping I could ask you for some ideas. My (5) level 6 characters have found themselves in a drowned cathedral underneath a floating city. Said cathedral is devoted to a god that was somehow excised from the pantheon and the world a long time ago. Such was the extent of the removal that it broke the world quite a bit. For example nobody remembers the name of this god, any writing of their name are replaced with chaos and all icons, and examples of them are also just replaced with mess that hurts brains to look at.

In the center of this cathedral, which was their primary site of worship, the party have discovered a gigantic distorted lens of unreal space. I want *something* to crawl through and get them. I have really hyped this encounter up and I want it to be intense and as epic as possible. The idea is that whatever slops through from the other side has been feeding on the leftover divinity of this god and has shlorped into the space left behind by it's excision. It's also been communicating with worshippers in the city above.

Can anyone recommend any cool otherworldly/eldritch things they could encounter here, or templates to use on my own reskin? I don't have a lot of experience with midtier DND and sometimes the party can really surprise me with the combos they can pull off. I want this to be quite a challenge.

Caveat, the whole party bar 1 have very low wisdom saving throws.

Azathoth
Apr 3, 2001

I'd take the aboleth and skin it as you see fit. It'll be their first experience with lair actions and you can either use those to go hard if they're an optimized party or hold off on them to pull punches.

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy
Hi GMs thread! I made a big book of random tables formatted for printing. Its a DM tool for me so I'm sharing :)

https://www.mediafire.com/file/3zypyaoezv5mrxe/Rutibex_Solo_RPG_Tables.pdf/file

Whybird
Aug 2, 2009

Phaiston have long avoided the tightly competetive defence sector, but the IRDA Act 2052 has given us the freedom we need to bring out something really special.

https://team-robostar.itch.io/robostar


Nap Ghost

Phrosphor posted:

In the center of this cathedral, which was their primary site of worship, the party have discovered a gigantic distorted lens of unreal space. I want *something* to crawl through and get them. I have really hyped this encounter up and I want it to be intense and as epic as possible. The idea is that whatever slops through from the other side has been feeding on the leftover divinity of this god and has shlorped into the space left behind by it's excision. It's also been communicating with worshippers in the city above.

I don't GM 5e, but as a general running-a-combat piece of advice, the main thing I've found that makes combat encounters feel epic and memorable is how many things are going on in them *other than* an enemy which the players are trying to kill. There's a lot of stuff that a party working in unison can do to cheese a single enemy, but if you have multiple other objectives to split their attention then they're often in a lot less of a position to do any of that cheesing.

So I would think of things like:
- whatever is reaching through starts collapsing the room they're in, so pillars come crashing down to create new obstacles and collapse onto players
- it sends out a distress call to leftover worshippers in the city above, and they start rushing in as backup
- one of its priests makes a break for it with a book of holy scripts that must surely contain additional clues on how to defeat it properly
- there are eldritch devices made of glass and metal dotted around the room which seem to be maintaining -- or even widening -- the rift, and which can be smashed.

DrSunshine
Mar 23, 2009

Did I just say that out loud~~?!!!

Phrosphor posted:

Hello GM's,

I was hoping I could ask you for some ideas. My (5) level 6 characters have found themselves in a drowned cathedral underneath a floating city. Said cathedral is devoted to a god that was somehow excised from the pantheon and the world a long time ago. Such was the extent of the removal that it broke the world quite a bit. For example nobody remembers the name of this god, any writing of their name are replaced with chaos and all icons, and examples of them are also just replaced with mess that hurts brains to look at.

In the center of this cathedral, which was their primary site of worship, the party have discovered a gigantic distorted lens of unreal space. I want *something* to crawl through and get them. I have really hyped this encounter up and I want it to be intense and as epic as possible. The idea is that whatever slops through from the other side has been feeding on the leftover divinity of this god and has shlorped into the space left behind by it's excision. It's also been communicating with worshippers in the city above.

Can anyone recommend any cool otherworldly/eldritch things they could encounter here, or templates to use on my own reskin? I don't have a lot of experience with midtier DND and sometimes the party can really surprise me with the combos they can pull off. I want this to be quite a challenge.

Caveat, the whole party bar 1 have very low wisdom saving throws.

Shlorpy? You're looking for a Shoggoth, repurposed for D&D

DrSunshine fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Mar 2, 2022

Jinh
Sep 12, 2008

Fun Shoe

Phrosphor posted:

Hello GM's,

Can anyone recommend any cool otherworldly/eldritch things they could encounter here, or templates to use on my own reskin? I don't have a lot of experience with midtier DND and sometimes the party can really surprise me with the combos they can pull off. I want this to be quite a challenge.

Caveat, the whole party bar 1 have very low wisdom saving throws.

i forget where i got this from, but my first thought was "biblical angel, but eldritch" and i remembered i had this saved to a folder.

Jinh fucked around with this message at 03:20 on Mar 3, 2022

Dareon
Apr 6, 2009

by vyelkin

Phrosphor posted:

Hello GM's,

I was hoping I could ask you for some ideas. My (5) level 6 characters have found themselves in a drowned cathedral underneath a floating city. Said cathedral is devoted to a god that was somehow excised from the pantheon and the world a long time ago. Such was the extent of the removal that it broke the world quite a bit. For example nobody remembers the name of this god, any writing of their name are replaced with chaos and all icons, and examples of them are also just replaced with mess that hurts brains to look at.

In the center of this cathedral, which was their primary site of worship, the party have discovered a gigantic distorted lens of unreal space. I want *something* to crawl through and get them. I have really hyped this encounter up and I want it to be intense and as epic as possible. The idea is that whatever slops through from the other side has been feeding on the leftover divinity of this god and has shlorped into the space left behind by it's excision. It's also been communicating with worshippers in the city above.

Can anyone recommend any cool otherworldly/eldritch things they could encounter here, or templates to use on my own reskin? I don't have a lot of experience with midtier DND and sometimes the party can really surprise me with the combos they can pull off. I want this to be quite a challenge.

Caveat, the whole party bar 1 have very low wisdom saving throws.

My immediate thought was Missingno, just due to the excised god's remnants being glitchy.

If you have access to a 3d printer, there's even multiple models available.

I'm picturing the fight being similarly glitchy, let's say you roll damage with a negative modifier and the roll winds up negative. This could heal the target or glitch their HP into a buffer underrun so they wind up with 500 temp HP. If a die lands cocked, you play it as it lies and both hit and miss. Deal 4.5 damage. Switch the background music to glitch hop.

Phrosphor
Feb 25, 2007

Urbanisation

These are excellent, I am thinking of a glitch aboleth reskin that reaches through the tear and interacts with the party but it's all wrong. Thanks for the ideas!

Azathoth
Apr 3, 2001

If you haven't watched Archive 81 on Netflix, you should. Just sayin'

Squidster
Oct 7, 2008

✋😢Life's just better with Ominous Gloves🤗🧤
The battle takes place in the psychic memory from the player's backstories. Collage a map from discordant memories into a great big tragic smush. Maybe a burning ship tosses in the ocean trapped in a wooden chapel, while just upstairs fresh flowers roar like a waterfall onto frozen tundra. As characters confront or resolve some aspect of their past, that fragment falls into 'reality' and they can start directly attacking the godling's altars there.

Sally Forth
Oct 16, 2012
Does anyone have any advice for managing conversations with NPCs over chat? In a party of three enthusiastic roleplayers, whenever we meet an NPC everyone wants to interact with them simultaneously, which is putting an unfair burden on the GM. PC1 and PC2 will simultaneously ask a question, and by the time the NPC has answered PC1, PC3 has something they want to say, PC1 wants to ask a follow-up, and PC2 is still expecting their answer. No individual player is causing the issue and we have two GMs who alternate, both of whom are having the same problem (and are part of the same problem as players).

This would almost certainly be less of an issue if we weren't playing over Slack, but no one is interested in switching to voice chat. The solution we're about to try is nominating a PC to take the lead in a conversation while everyone else agrees to back off a bit, but I was wondering if anyone has other suggestions or has tried a system that has specific rules for managing the flow of conversation?

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy

Sally Forth posted:

Does anyone have any advice for managing conversations with NPCs over chat? In a party of three enthusiastic roleplayers, whenever we meet an NPC everyone wants to interact with them simultaneously, which is putting an unfair burden on the GM. PC1 and PC2 will simultaneously ask a question, and by the time the NPC has answered PC1, PC3 has something they want to say, PC1 wants to ask a follow-up, and PC2 is still expecting their answer. No individual player is causing the issue and we have two GMs who alternate, both of whom are having the same problem (and are part of the same problem as players).

This would almost certainly be less of an issue if we weren't playing over Slack, but no one is interested in switching to voice chat. The solution we're about to try is nominating a PC to take the lead in a conversation while everyone else agrees to back off a bit, but I was wondering if anyone has other suggestions or has tried a system that has specific rules for managing the flow of conversation?

Having run a game over Discord for the last two years, I don't think voice chat would solve your problem
:negative:

Maybe have a marching order for roleplay segments? So everyone has a turn, just like combat. People can do their questions on their turn.

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters
Doing it over text is a little complicated, to be sure, but if I were the GM I'd simply roleplay what would happen if three people immediately came up to me and starting bombarding me with questions - the NPC could just be like "Woah one at a time, please, this is a lot"

Harold Fjord
Jan 3, 2004
I'd get all the questions and answers written down and retcon the actual timeline

My Lovely Horse
Aug 21, 2010

I would probably try letting everyone get one question or line in, then review everything - text based RP offers an advantage there - and compose a reply. Then start another round like that until the talk is done. Remember that the NPC gets to ask questions too, and that they may become angry or impatient or other things may cut a conversation short. You could, for example, determine that the party only get a limited amount of conversation rounds like that. Doing this I wouldn't try to write a naturally flowing dialogue, I'd expect it to end up more like a summary of a conversation.

I could see an example convo (with, e.g., a city guard) like this:

P1: "Do you know anything about the missing merchants?"
P2: Hang on, before we flat out ask him, I want to try and gauge if he knows there are merchants missing in the first place. Remember, we weren't supposed to go blabbing.
P3: And before we do that I give him a friendly and respectful greeting. "Good morning, guardsman, a minute of your time?" or something like that.
DM: The guard gives you a curt, but not unfriendly nod; you involve him in a brief conversation about what's going on in the market and quickly determine he does indeed know. And when you finally pop the key question, he says "Only rumors, revolving about a particular warehouse - but who are you, anyway, that you want to know so badly...?"

(and sprinkle calling for social skill rolls or what have you in there as liberally as you'd like)

Pickled Tink
Apr 28, 2012

Have you heard about First Dog? It's a very good comic I just love.

Also, wear your bike helmets kids. I copped several blows to the head but my helmet left me totally unscathed.



Finally you should check out First Dog as it's a good comic I like it very much.
Fun Shoe

Rutibex posted:

Having run a game over Discord for the last two years, I don't think voice chat would solve your problem
:negative:

Maybe have a marching order for roleplay segments? So everyone has a turn, just like combat. People can do their questions on their turn.
This, but make people roll their charisma/charisma analogue for question initiative.

As a joke: For every time they try to talk over each other anyway, deal one point of conversation damage which makes the NPC more and more annoyed with them until they send them off on a wild goose chase, give them bad info, or tell them to gently caress off.

Kenning
Jan 11, 2009

I really want to post goatse. Instead I only have these🍄.



I ran a game over live chat once, and very early we had to establish some serious ground rules for who got to type when. Essentially, if I (DM) was ever typing, everyone else had to stop until I was done. I would always end a block of text with the phrase "What do you do?" to indicate that the floor was open for responses. Everybody got to put in a single response, which we would play out in order of narrative precedence. If it involved a conversation we might need to adjudicate who got their words out first, and play out that back-and-forth until it was natural for the next person's contribution to come into play. If the conversation moved such that the original contribution no longer made sense, they were given the floor to make a new gambit.

The fact that live chat games can have literally everyone composing at the same time means that you have to really establish order. You could even just have a fixed rotating order for people to do stuff in, arrange alphabetically by character name or something. So something happens, and then people can respond in order 1 2 3 4. Then when the next thing happens, they can respond in order 2 3 4 1, etc. Or maybe the order just determines who gets narrative precedence when two responses would negate each other. In any case, just make sure it's clear that whatever your intended action/response was, it didn't actually happen until the DM engaged with it, and it might change depending on the engagement with other players.

Baller Ina
Oct 21, 2010

:whattheeucharist:
I think this might be a breaking point for our group and I am going to have a real conversation with them, so I'm aware of the old "talk to your group" adage, I just need to share the session's contents with fellow players.

So my group, which is down to three people at this point, has been making their way through The Dragon of Icespire Peak module, and they're at Icespire Hold, the final dungeon where you take out the white dragon Cryovain for good. I added a subplot to the campaign about a group of goblins doing some nasty magic stuff with an unspecified artifact, and at the party's final encounter with them Cryovain swooped down and snatched the artifact post-battle, cackling about how he'll use its powers to get tough and kill the party(who whooped his rear end once before) and destroy the town, evil villain stuff.

Anyway, the wizard's hawk tails the dragon to find the way to his lair and the next morning they set off. They get to the hold and they're moving through breach and clear style, stopping only to make sure a room is empty of monsters before moving on, not even stopping to search for loot or anything, to my mild surprise. They get to the roof, the staircase to which leads to a large room that then exits onto the open-air rooftop. They stage an ambush(which took like ten minutes despite being really basic) and the wizard and the ranger launch attacks from a pair of arrow slits while the artificer is on the roof around a corner. Their plan was to hunker down in the building and the dragon would come to the doorway where the artificer could easily tank it and the other two could safely attack from range.

Dragon pretty much loses initiative and the wizard gets to lob another Lightning Bolt and the ranger another round of arrows. With his health already dipping, I have Cryovain fly forward, blast his breath weapon into the room through the arrow slit, and then fly up and onto the roof of the building to break line of sight with the players and gain the high ground. I figured if they stayed in the building he'd try to collapse the roof; otherwise he would fly back down and get into melee.

The wizard and artificer immediately considered the fight basically lost. Wizard was apparently unaware you could move both before and after your action, and says the dragon will simply retreat to the roof after every attack, and if they went outside Cryovain would have his pick of targets, which uh, yeah. Artificer, despite having 19 AC and resistance to all damage(he drank a potion that the wizard would NOT accept for some reason), sullenly mumbles "well, I can't fly, so" and walks back inside the room and, to my shock, down the stairs back to the first floor. The wizard follows on his turn, saying some jumbled stuff about trying to lure the dragon downstairs; in retrospect he was just rattled by the cold breath hitting him and wasn't willing to risk even hitting 0, much less dying(his spell choices make it clear ever taking damage isn't something he plans for). Verbatim: "I came here to kill a dragon, not die heroically." Ranger is stunned by his companions' actions but, being alone, has no choice to follow them. They stand around with no plan other than to shout insults at Cryovain, which he ignores, returns to the artifact, and has a breakthrough, animating a pack of snow golems and taking off from the roof in flight, laughing as he flies away.

This module has been a lot of bland fights with not much more than "walk up, attack" style monsters, so I was relishing the opportunity to control a somewhat intelligent creature, but with my first use of rudimentary tactics provoking such a complete surrender from two of my players, it bodes ill for our future, as we were going to head back to playing a homebrew after this where I was planning to spice up the combat quite a bit.

My main dilemma is how to resolve this, since it was supposed to be the end of the whole thing. I've come up with two options:

1. Cryovain heads back to the north, which he had been chased out of by bigger, stronger creatures, using the artifact to try and reclaim his territory. The dragon is gone, so the town is safe, but he could easily return in the future, so not exactly a victory.
2. Cryovain flies to Phandalin(the town in question) to get petty revenge against the party and shred it to bits. He'll have at least a day on the party travel-wise, so a lot of lives will be lost, but they get a second chance to end him. I'm less a fan of this one, mostly because I don't want to roleplay the townspeople asking how Cryovain got past the party in the first place. Also, it's not like they lost a tough fight, they ran away; why do they get a second chance?

So that's a lot. Just needed to get this off my chest as I'm still amazed that a loving roof defeated the "heroes". Anybody else have such a reaction from either your players or other party members that felt like such a flop?

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


Yeah I just don't play anything tactical with my RPG group. Their default response to any combat friction is to instantly give up. I end up playing tactical games with different friends.

Harold Fjord
Jan 3, 2004
The townsfolk mock them and the so called heroes are forced to retire in disgrace. Now roll actual heroes.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Talk 2 Ur Players

Azathoth
Apr 3, 2001

sebmojo posted:

Talk 2 Ur Players

Counterpoint: TPK and start over repeatedly until they start behaving.

Baller Ina
Oct 21, 2010

:whattheeucharist:
A chat is unavoidable before even starting the next session for sure, I'm just dreading because on top of everything the wizard has anger issues which have come up a couple times. Can't wait to have to tell my own father to take a chill pill when discussing proper nerdgame tactics.

Also wizard and artificer are not roleplayers at all so if the fights are dull as well I don't know where I'm supposed to get MY fun.

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Discount Dracula
Aug 15, 2003


Nap Ghost

Baller Ina posted:

Scared party stuff…

I am a 1st time GM also running the Icespire campaign. Two of my players were so worried about getting their fictional characters hurt that the warrior fled when two orcs advanced at the end of the dwarven mine quest. My solution was to have them roll perception or history or nature or whatever checks to help them assess their relative strength against hostile creatures. For example, they were freaked out seeing twig blights for the first time. With a decent nature roll, the Druid remembered that twig blights were no more than a nuisance to farmers. Having the knowledge that they were likely to survive bolstered their confidence.

Another possibility for your campaign: The party flees the mountain fortress and a passing band of displaced orcs charges to reclaim their home. Cryovain slaughters them, but is weakened from the encounter (but it ends up having the same hit points as when the party disengaged).

Another scenario: the party comes across a traveling mercenary as they head back to wherever and the merc is extra damage or becomes bait.

Baller Ina posted:

Also wizard and artificer are not roleplayers at all so if the fights are dull as well I don't know where I'm supposed to get MY fun.

The most fun I had was during the quest to escort Don Jon Raskin to his mine. I played “DJ” as an incompetent fighter with a massive case of braggadocio (think Harry Potter’s Gilderoy Lockhart). He had a belt filled with throwing daggers. The group loved it every time he botched a roll and threw a dagger into the floor. The wererats bit him and infected him with lycanthropy and the party nearly killed him to put him out of his misery. They agreed to let him live once they got a promise from the remaining dwarf miners that they would put DJ a cage during a full moon.

Discount Dracula fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Mar 12, 2022

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