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StashAugustine
Mar 24, 2013

Do not trust in hope- it will betray you! Only faith and hatred sustain.

My impression was that even leveling the city doesn't work (short of like nuclear weapons) because you're not gonna kill everyone and the ruins are even worse to fight in than buildings

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skooma512
Feb 8, 2012

You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.

StashAugustine posted:

My impression was that even leveling the city doesn't work (short of like nuclear weapons) because you're not gonna kill everyone and the ruins are even worse to fight in than buildings

Especially when you rely as heavily on armor as the Russians do. Sure, you might be able to roll over that demolished building, but it still slows you down and leave you a vulnerable target.

Ardennes
May 12, 2002
The best way to take a city is simply the element of the surprise and be able to enter it before the other force can seriously mobilize (this is what the Russians did in southern Ukraine.)

etalian
Mar 20, 2006

Ardennes posted:

The best way to take a city is simply the element of the surprise and be able to enter it before the other force can seriously mobilize (this is what the Russians did in southern Ukraine.)

Or the brilliant strategy the Taliban used to get whole cities to defect and switch sides instead letting them get turned into urban warzones

Maximo Roboto
Feb 4, 2012

Real hurthling! posted:

but they called it the raptor when jurrassic park was cool so im good. dont even miss health care or roads

They made video game real

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDxssLBC_tQ

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

quote:

1. The jet that rusts part is specific only to the F-35C variant, or the aircraft carrier variant. If our Air Force(AF) gets the F-35, it would be the A variant. And there's really nothing you can do about nature. And even though it rusts, as it said in the link, it will do little to affect it's radar cross-section and it will still be the top aircraft carrier fighter until the 6th gen fighter come. And also, it's the F-35Cs very first carrier deployment so there really are bound to be mistakes seen.


2. In the suffocation part, it's a correctable mistake that, in the link that you sent, not just happens to the F-35 but also all other planes.


3. The report said that they are may change the fuel composition. More on this point later

4. Cannons isn't even used anymore. Missiles have become so advanced that there is very little chance of you and your opponent getting within gun range of each other. And NO ONE in their right mind would use a $80m jet to strafe ground targets.

5. About the dogfight thing. Dogfighting won't happen now. Air-to-air combat will happen dozens o miles away from each other. And F-35 pilots would rather run away using its stealth than engage an enemy in a dogfight. Read this:https://warriormaven.com/air/f-35-f-16The pilot also stated that back in 2015 (the time YOUR report was published) the F-35 was still in its infancy stage, therefore, the pilots weren't familiar with it.

To the rest of your statements and no. 3 - The F-35 is still a young plane. It is also very complicated, therefore it will take time before it reaches its maximum potential. Also your links all came from 2014-17 whose problems are probably already solved by now



Also, here's some useful link where you can read about why it's such an awesome plane (these links are pretty new compared to you 2014-17 ones):

https://www.19fortyfive.com/2021/09/f-35-the-best-fighter-jet-in-the-world-drat-right-it-is/

https://www.forbes.com/sites/lorenthompson/2021/02/12/the-five-most-important-facts-about-the-f-35-fighter/?sh=1528075c60b5

https://www.airforcemag.com/article/editorial-the-best-fighter-in-the-world/

important facts in the links I sent:

20-1 kill ratio against simulated enemies
elimination of 100 simulated surface-to-air missile sites w/o the loss of a single plane
Its procurement and operational cost is going down FAST

EDIT: Oh and also, I think that it wasn't shown in the articles I sent, but its networking capability is so advanced that 1 F-35 can fly over hostile airspace undetected and just 'paint' the entire battlefield and send the info to ALL friendly units. It can also guide missiles fired by other friendly aircraft so you can have a non-stealth plane with a bunch of medium to long-range missiles far away from the frontlines and the F-35 will just guide the missiles to their targets.

Wheeee
Mar 11, 2001

When a tree grows, it is soft and pliable. But when it's dry and hard, it dies.

Hardness and strength are death's companions. Flexibility and softness are the embodiment of life.

That which has become hard shall not triumph.

I’m sure the F-35 will eventually be revised into a decent plane in a couple decades after another trillion dollars have been spent and manned fighters have been made completely obsolete

yellowcar
Feb 14, 2010


grover???

Palladium
May 8, 2012

Very Good
✔️✔️✔️✔️
The more you avoid combat the more invincible you are

Grandpa Palpatine
Dec 13, 2019

by vyelkin
At least the F-22 fuckin worked eventually

A Buttery Pastry
Sep 4, 2011

Delicious and Informative!
:3:
The real advantage the F-22 has over the F-35 is that it's much more aesthetically pleasing, the dobermann to the F-35's pug.

Grandpa Palpatine
Dec 13, 2019

by vyelkin
Seriously tho

the F-35 is the latest iteration of "bloated piece of poo poo that doesn't do what it was intended to do" just like the Bradley fighting vehicle


it will not be the last

Grandpa Palpatine has issued a correction as of 03:41 on Apr 4, 2022

Endman
May 18, 2010

That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even anime may die


Its purpose is to make a whole heap of cash for defence contractors and the people they give kickbacks to, and it's a roaring success. They've even convinced the stupider parts of the anglosphere to buy in as well!

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

Grandpa Palpatine posted:

Seriously tho

the F-35 is the latest iteration of "bloated piece of poo poo that doesn't do what it was intended to do" just like the Bradley fighting vehicle


it will not be the last

the Pentagon Wars Cinematic Universe

Filthy Hans
Jun 27, 2008

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 10 years!)

Grandpa Palpatine posted:

Seriously tho

the F-35 is the latest iteration of "bloated piece of poo poo that doesn't do what it was intended to do" just like the Bradley fighting vehicle


it will not be the last

there was an HBO movie about some of the bullshit procurement corruption behind the development of the Bradley Fighting Vehicle

it starred Cary Elwes and I liked it at the time I saw it but that was a long goddamn time ago


apparently the Bradley wasn't handling rpg hits well, so the brass' big idea was to switch to using older, obsolete Soviet missiles in the testing so the Bradley could pass its tests

SplitSoul
Dec 31, 2000

When Denmark was deciding on its F-16 replacement, the options were the Super Hornet, Eurofighter or F-35, and Lockheed and Boeing would advertise their plane next to diaper sales.



Of course we went with the shittiest and most expensive option. When the Air Force borrowed a simulator, one of only four in existence, it caught fire and was totally destroyed. :lmao:

SplitSoul has issued a correction as of 06:05 on Apr 4, 2022

Fish of hemp
Apr 1, 2011

A friendly little mouse!

SplitSoul posted:


Of course we went with the shittiest and most expensive option.

Are you really saying that you would have preferred Eurofighter?

yellowcar
Feb 14, 2010

denmark selling greenland to trump would be smarter than buying the F35

Filthy Hans
Jun 27, 2008

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 10 years!)

outside of thread context, but re: Denmark Chat, Nicholas Winding Refn's Pusher trilogy is up on Prime now, I'd been waiting ages to see it and now you can too

Mads Mikkelsen plays a very convincing junkie failson, maybe there's a Hunter Biden biopic in his future

Endman
May 18, 2010

That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even anime may die


Fish of hemp posted:

Are you really saying that you would have preferred Eurofighter?

I honestly thought he was talking about the Eurofighter

Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

A while back, but part of Romania’s problem was that they had a political need to accomplish as much as possible, with as little help as possible and so prove themselves a valuable member of the Axis, and that they wanted to ensure that they firmly controlled the areas of the Soviet Union they wished to possess after the war, and not ask Germany to grant it to them.

This wasn’t unique to Romania, all of the “Minor Axis” countries struggled with this one way or another, because the coalition wasn’t nearly as well, - allied - as the Western Allies. I think the military performance of Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria and Italy to an extent has to be viewed through the lens of this bizarre Team of Rivals dynamic.

Danann
Aug 4, 2013

Posting Russian BTG OOB visualization in here for easy reference in the future ( and also because globalsecurity gets annoying with the paywall):


Danann
Aug 4, 2013

apparently there are carrier killers on surface botes now
https://twitter.com/CovertShores/status/1516520842334720006

Real hurthling!
Sep 11, 2001




why did america allow a hypersonic missile gap

Endman
May 18, 2010

That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even anime may die


Real hurthling! posted:

why did america allow a hypersonic missile gap

No nazis left to make good rockets for them

Centrist Committee
Aug 6, 2019

Real hurthling! posted:

why did america allow a hypersonic missile gap

it starts with an F and ends with a 35

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy
pictured a typical infantry soldier in the PLA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxnC6jkJyEM

Lastgirl
Sep 7, 1997


Good Morning!
Sunday Morning!

Oglethorpe posted:

it's the intergalactic weapon of choice



stargateguy uses p90s and doesn’t afraid of anything

strange feelings re Daisy
Aug 2, 2000

I would buy a P90 for fun but the bullets are like $1 each lol

Danann
Aug 4, 2013



huh that's a lot of stuff i didn't realize was important for industrial applications

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy

Danann posted:



huh that's a lot of stuff i didn't realize was important for industrial applications

im getting EVE online flashbacks from this list

Ardennes
May 12, 2002

Lastgirl posted:

stargateguy uses p90s and doesn’t afraid of anything

Having an assault rifle or any weapon effective beyond 100m would cause feedback effects in the gate and make it explode

Filthy Hans
Jun 27, 2008

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 10 years!)

Rutibex posted:

im getting EVE online flashbacks from this list

same except System Shock II

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
same except Protostar

Regarde Aduck
Oct 19, 2012

c l o u d k i t t e n
Grimey Drawer

Fish of hemp posted:

Are you really saying that you would have preferred Eurofighter?

what's wrong with the Eurofighter?

Pryor on Fire
May 14, 2013

they don't know all alien abduction experiences can be explained by people thinking saving private ryan was a documentary

Any fighter is better than the one that is always in the hangar because it needs 1,000 unplanned maintenance hours and you have neverending parts shortages and personnel shortages. This is how the US Air Force describes the F22 and F35 in their own scathing reports year after year.

Fish of hemp
Apr 1, 2011

A friendly little mouse!

Pryor on Fire posted:

Any fighter is better than the one that is always in the hangar because it needs 1,000 unplanned maintenance hours

Yes, that's Eurofighter.

Making modern fighter jet is hard.

Centrist Committee
Aug 6, 2019

Fish of hemp posted:

Yes, that's Eurofighter.

Making modern fighter jet is hard.

it’s really unfair of the oppressed nations of the world to invest in drones and hypersonic missiles, I’d go so far to say it’s cheating

KomradeX
Oct 29, 2011

Fish of hemp posted:

Yes, that's Eurofighter.

Making modern fighter jet is hard.

Sure is when the main goal is grifting as much government money as possible and not building an effective plane

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Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

I thought this was pretty interesting and wasn’t sure where else to post it.

I have access to the PE of Command Modern Operations but never use it because I’m not an air or naval guy, and other than research for a paper on “Field Artillery in the Coastal Role” have not read too much on boat stuff. Anyways I was going through their databases, checking out the modern Chinese navy, whatever whatever it seemed neat. You know, impressive how quickly they built those two new carriers, taking a look at their new ASMs. PE has hypersonic weapons in the database but I barely understand CMO let alone the actual systems.

It turns out there is a huge Chinese community for CMO/CMANO. Like, massive forum, just on CMO, that has posters painstakingly translating not just the game - including decrypting the exe and database files to add localization - but translating the names of all of these western weapons systems, their descriptions, and then translating western reference books and papers too. Their reference book thread is pretty amazing, and that they found and translated all of this stuff on their own, wow.

I don’t know if Grogs are a thing in China, or if these are university students or whatever, but the work that went into understanding naval affairs, just to play this English language game with no localization, it’s incredible.

All of that to say, I would guess the Chinese people are really proud of and engaged with their Navy. It kind of reminds me of the 1910’s when there were books like Jane’s for regular people since the British public wanted to know every ship in the Royal Navy and the latest developments in ship design.

Forum is called something like The Operational Art of War, which is confusing since TOAW is already the name of a completely different wargame in English.

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