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John Wick of Dogs posted:My theory: Renee is not supposed to go on this mission. Picard's assumption that Q changed or is changing it is wrong. She's supposed to skip this one, get treatment, and go on a future mission that's the actual important one. The lesson Picard hasn't learned, that Q is mad at him for, is that going to space is not the solution to all his problems. I'm still not clear if anything is going to come out of the Picard childhood flashbacks. At this point it seems like something that could have been cut.
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Apr 2, 2022 03:12
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Megillah Gorilla posted:Yep, I'm convinced now that the scene with Q snapping his fingers at Renee Picard in the cafe is the very first scene in the series, timewise. What I'm going to say doesn't make actual sense but I think might be true: Q innocent, just like with the All Good Things anomaly. Picard is at fault and causes his own dark timeline by going back in time and forcing his ancestor to go to space with depression. Q shows up in the dark future mad at Picard for doing what he's about to do. Yes that doesn't really make any sense. But I just watched an episode where the only reason Spock didn't die at age seven is because he used the guardian of forever to go back in time and save his life from a lizard tiger. And he was time traveling with Kirk at the same time the guardian of forever showed the events on Vulcan, could not be in two places at once, and thus returned to a future where he did not exist. So he had to reason out that he originally went back in time and posed as his own cousin. It made no sense but at the same time made perfect sense. Why did Picard and crew go from exploding ship confronting the Borg to the Confederation? Well the Borg space vagina was full of chronotons or whatever, please allow the captain of the USS Bozeman to explain. Edit: Ahhhhhhhhhhh shiiiiiiit the sentient microbe Renee finds in Jupiter are Borg nano probes, she gets assimilated and is the queen from episode 1. They weren't calling for Picard, they were saying their own name John Wick of Dogs fucked around with this message at 03:23 on Apr 2, 2022 |
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Apr 2, 2022 03:20
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John Wick of Dogs posted:Edit: Ahhhhhhhhhhh shiiiiiiit the sentient microbe Renee finds in Jupiter are Borg nano probes, she gets assimilated and is the queen from episode 1. They weren't calling for Picard, they were saying their own name They why did they, you know, wait for him?
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Apr 2, 2022 03:32
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It's complete bullshit they didn't wrap the entire plot up in 5 episodes and spend the rest of the season doing spaceship porn with no possible plot being presented
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Apr 2, 2022 03:51
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Charity Porno posted:It's complete bullshit they didn't wrap the entire plot up in 5 episodes and spend the rest of the season doing spaceship porn with no possible plot being presented Yes, the ultimate TVIV post. If only Dr. Jurati could somehow contain this energy in a forcefield, they'd be able to go home.
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Apr 2, 2022 03:54
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Fidel Cuckstro posted:Yes, the ultimate TVIV post. If only Dr. Jurati could somehow contain this energy in a forcefield, they'd be able to go home. I acquit
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Apr 2, 2022 03:54
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Instead the only porn we get is a tentacle choking out a cop and the Soong family's genetically enhanced nipples
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Apr 2, 2022 03:54
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I can't believe Deep Dpace Nine took 7 years to tell a story, they could have done the whole Dominion War in 3 episodes, tops
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Apr 2, 2022 03:56
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Charity Porno posted:I can't believe Deep Dpace Nine took 7 years to tell a story, they could have done the whole Dominion War in 3 episodes, tops My 13 years of experience on this forum has taught me that 70% of goons hate serialized storytelling because it fundamentally breaks their brains.
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Apr 2, 2022 04:01
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Charity Porno posted:I can't believe Deep Dpace Nine took 7 years to tell a story, they could have done the whole Dominion War in 3 episodes, tops Jokes aside Berman legit wanted the war storyline wrapped up in two or three episodes if I remember correctly
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Apr 2, 2022 04:04
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Delsaber posted:Jokes aside Berman legit wanted the war storyline wrapped up in two or three episodes if I remember correctly A visionary! Sisko and Dukat spent a whole episode stranded on a rock! No plot movement!
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Apr 2, 2022 04:05
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Btw, I went back to the scene where they hit the ICE bus with an EMP and no, they didn't horizontally flip the video (and then digitally flip the text on the side of the bus to fix it), they were just driving on the wrong side of the road.
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Apr 2, 2022 04:06
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Charity Porno posted:A visionary! Sisko and Dukat spent a whole episode stranded on a rock! No plot movement! Yes, what episode of Picard would you say has been their 'Waltz'?
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Apr 2, 2022 04:07
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And that episode was a REUSE of the exact same idea where Odo and Quark were stranded on a planet, DS9 was really slow and lazy overall
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Apr 2, 2022 04:08
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Big Mean Jerk posted:My 13 years of experience on this forum has taught me that 70% of goons hate serialized storytelling because it fundamentally breaks their brains. But like, each episode of DS9 also contained its own story. So far we've yet to actually have one. Unless, I dunno, Rios' side adventure is all wrapped up?
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Apr 2, 2022 04:11
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At least it's all wrapping up in another 5 episodes, so we're halfway home either way. If this was a 26 episode season and we were still where we are, it would be absolutely inexcusable.
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Apr 2, 2022 04:29
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Another one of these, that's everyone but Pike himself I think https://twitter.com/StarTrek/status/1510029346785832963?s=20&t=WPHcqPQ3882nQD9voQ_Vnw There's a space station in there that looks the same as or similar to the one from Lower Decks last season All these new sets are solid improvements to the Disco versions. The new lounge also does a good enough job of feeling 60s without being a 1:1 recreation of the TOS lounge set.
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Apr 2, 2022 04:30
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Delsaber posted:Another one of these, that's everyone but Pike himself I think I hope all these quips have actual characters behind them for when the show isn't 20 seconds long. Fingers crossed.
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Apr 2, 2022 04:34
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Big Mean Jerk posted:My 13 years of experience on this forum has taught me that 70% of goons hate serialized storytelling because it fundamentally breaks their brains. Brah there's plenty of shows that do serialized storytelling without spinning their wheels like this and goons love them, get out with this weak-rear end strawman
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Apr 2, 2022 05:00
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McSpanky posted:Brah there's plenty of shows that do serialized storytelling without spinning their wheels like this and goons love them, get out with this weak-rear end strawman I think the real issue is that the problem isn't that the show is too slow, the problem is that a lot of it is just boring and lovely. If they took an episode off to do some incredible, emmy-worthy 2-person show between Agnes and the Queen that was an exploration of their characters and humanity and the strange alien borg perspective and what that reveals about our own internal lives and whatever, no one would give a poo poo that the main story beats got delayed, because we got to watch an awesome story. But instead we're getting really terrible car chases and Rios sitting in a cage silently waiting to be rescued and poo poo. It doesn't matter whether it advances the main narrative but it's at least gotta be compelling and Rios, Seven, and Raffi's story has failed at that. That's like half the show. XboxPants fucked around with this message at 05:47 on Apr 2, 2022 |
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Apr 2, 2022 05:41
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Fidel Cuckstro posted:I hope all these quips have actual characters behind them for when the show isn't 20 seconds long. Fingers crossed. The quips seem short enough to hold people's interest here, fingers crossed
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Apr 2, 2022 05:52
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Charity Porno posted:It's complete bullshit they didn't wrap the entire plot up in 5 episodes and spend the rest of the season doing spaceship porn with no possible plot being presented Every moment that doesn’t feature the exterior of a starship is a moment where nothing is happening in the plot. Very disappointed that this most recent episode had about fifteen seconds worth of plot in it and a cloak was on the entire time. Jurati needs to just give up and let herself get assimilated so that we can get another shot of the La Sirena skipping along the Sun’s coronasphere on its way back to the future so that it can join the fleet in front of the spatial rift.
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Apr 2, 2022 05:54
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It's super obvious that this season almost entirely taking place in the 21st century is just an excuse to be as cheap as possible. Maybe season 3 will actually take place in space since they blew the entire s2 budget on the very shiny Stargazer bridge.
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Apr 2, 2022 05:59
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8one6 posted:It's super obvious that this season almost entirely taking place in the 21st century is just an excuse to be as cheap as possible. Maybe season 3 will actually take place in space since they blew the entire s2 budget on the very shiny Stargazer bridge. TVIV > STAR TREK: CIVIL WAR (OVER BRIDGE SET FINANCING)
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Apr 2, 2022 06:10
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Remember how TNG Season 1 and sometimes 2 had these cool, alien planet looking sets, and then in 3 onward, every away team went to Southern California World?
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Apr 2, 2022 06:18
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Joking aside I think a challenge all the new Trek shows are (usually poorly) dealing with is trying to give a team of characters arcs and development in a serial format half the episode length of the old show. Sure we don’t know much about half of Discovery but see Kim, Mayweather, etc and that was with a kind of show that both had 26 eps a year and could easily skip between character focus and plots due to not being serialised. Picard has to move things foreward at an often agonising rate simply because of how many characters it’s trying to juggle over a small amount of episodes without reducing them to Discovery bridge crew level no names. That takes a really deft hand if you don’t have much time. They can’t (or don’t want to) spare a whole episode for the Seven or the Rios episode. They have to weave it all in. This problem extends beyond Trek, and obviously there are shows that manage it well. But even TNG struggled with this and they had tons more wiggle room. If you cut the heavy single character episodes for half the crew I wonder if the show would be as well remembered even if you left all the award winning ones. I think this is one of the key reasons Voyager and then Enterprise are less well remembered. Edit: late Voyager is egregious with this as it becomes the Janeway/Seven/doctor show, but then I guess I didn’t want to see much of the rest at that point anyway. In Picard I genuinely would enjoy seeing more of probably the whole crew but there is just no time, but it needs to do something with them anyway. This also drove me nuts with the Witcher where I probably would have preferred EITHER a Geralt or a Yen episode rather than they continually cutting back and forth. I kept getting basically two 15 minute episodes cut together which was a huge pain. This is exactly what Picard had been doing too and I think is part of what makes it feel slow. Season 1 would cut away to Romulan bad guys which did the same thing. TNG rarely cut away from the crew - DS9 did but for far shorter slices of Cardassian/Dominion scheming. And again they had 26 eps and no need to pick up each episode exactly where the last ended. Blamestorm fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Apr 2, 2022 |
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Apr 2, 2022 06:32
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Charity Porno posted:Remember how TNG Season 1 and sometimes 2 had these cool, alien planet looking sets, and then in 3 onward, every away team went to Southern California World? Kinda like how The X-Files started off moody and rain-drenched and atmospheric and ended up looking like every episode was shot at Golden Hour in some LA suburb. If I were President, my first executive order would be to outlaw the filming of any movie or tv show within the greater LA or Vancouver areas. Please for the love of god, start shooting somewhere else. I feel like I’ve seen every square inch of LA in particular and I’ve only been there once in my life.
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Apr 2, 2022 06:33
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Kinda like how The X-Files started off moody and rain-drenched and atmospheric and ended up looking like every episode was shot at Golden Hour in some LA suburb. The bridge also was lit in really interesting ways in the first two seasons. Sometimes it was almost moody. Then in season 3 onwards, washed out florescents
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Apr 2, 2022 06:50
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The thing about Discovery no names bridge crew is over the four seasons I've learned their names, and most of them have had development, and the ones that haven't, their job is clear. But most of Discovery's core cast is people who don't work on the bridge. Stametz, Reno, Adira, Zora, Gray, Culber, Tilly, Book, none of them are bridge officers! But of the bridge officers Saru and Michael are really the only ones, plus whoever the captain is that year if not one of them. Of the others we've really gotten to know Detmer well, Owo not quite as well, Bryce less so still but has had a few moments, and Rhys the least. There are also two other ones that are basically glorified extras. And your comedy character Linus who basically only exists for a recurring gag. Overall though Discovery has a very large cast and a most of them have developed a lot. The ones that haven't are like fun recurring characters. None of them except the core core cast really started getting any development until late season 2 though. But when they added new ones in season 3 and 4 they were way better at it.
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Apr 2, 2022 06:57
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Charity Porno posted:The bridge also was lit in really interesting ways in the first two seasons. Sometimes it was almost moody. They also fired their primary composer because Rick Berman thought the music was too memorable and emotion-stirring for his bland space shopping mall TV show starring the colour beige and some light brown accents, and brought in Jerry Goldsmith to crank out some industrial scale elevator music for the remaining five years of the show. E: Also the lighting doesn't get REALLY bad until Time's Arrow, Part II at the start of Season 6, where they start throwing the vaseline blur filter on all the blown out flourescents that basically became the standard lighting setup for DS9 eventually too. nine-gear crow fucked around with this message at 07:06 on Apr 2, 2022 |
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Apr 2, 2022 07:02
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John Wick of Dogs posted:
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Apr 2, 2022 07:41
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Baron von der Loon posted:My bet: the microbe is Q. And it will somehow provide new background information on why he was always interested in Picard. So then why's Q trying so hard to derail the Europa mission then? If Renee Picard rescues him from Io like say, Voyager did to Quinn when the Continuum locked him up inside that comet to keep him from trying to kill himself over and over again, wouldn't making it so that he was never discovered and set free basically undo his entire reason for wanting to punish Picard in the first place?
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Apr 2, 2022 07:53
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I mean in All Good Things Picard is responsible for the anomaly but only because Q makes him bounce through time. If we are just rehashing All Good Things Though... Another thing this Season repeated from season 1: Jurati prevents the plot from advancing by senselessly murdering a critical character. In fact not only are all the characters apart from Picard still complete fuckups who have achieved nothing but make things worse at every stage, this episode even makes a self aware joke that it knows this is what they are doing.
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Apr 2, 2022 08:03
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Alchenar posted:I mean in All Good Things Picard is responsible for the anomaly but only because Q makes him bounce through time. If we are just rehashing All Good Things Though... The "plot" that Jurati prevented from advancing in this instance though is "the Borg Queen creates an assimilation apocalypse in 2024 because she's a loving scorpion, it's in her nature", which I think is a net benefit compared to "Jurati murdered the one guy who had all the answers and could have told Picard what the gently caress was going on so he didn't have to meander around the galaxy for another six episodes and then stumble across another character they created out of thin air to give them all the answers Maddox would have given them anyway."
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Apr 2, 2022 08:08
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nine-gear crow posted:So then why's Q trying so hard to derail the Europa mission then? If Renee Picard rescues him from Io like say, Voyager did to Quinn when the Continuum locked him up inside that comet to keep him from trying to kill himself over and over again, wouldn't making it so that he was never discovered and set free basically undo his entire reason for wanting to punish Picard in the first place?
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Apr 2, 2022 08:11
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nine-gear crow posted:The "plot" that Jurati prevented from advancing in this instance though is "the Borg Queen creates an assimilation apocalypse in 2024 because she's a loving scorpion, it's in her nature", which I think is a net benefit compared to "Jurati murdered the one guy who had all the answers and could have told Picard what the gently caress was going on so he didn't have to meander around the galaxy for another six episodes and then stumble across another character they created out of thin air to give them all the answers Maddox would have given them anyway." Now they need an alternative way back to the future because for some reason Jurati left the Borg Queen unattended on a spaceship while she took a nap in a creepy Manor (not waking up when the Policeman walked through yelling) and then decided that for personal protection she needed an ancient shotgun she found and not, oh, a phaser which could have been set to stun. The only reason that entire sequence happens is because everyone, but particularly her, is forced by the script to be inept. E: not to mention, you know, getting herself assimilated
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Apr 2, 2022 08:13
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"It-it's so cold here in central France in April!" [Le Flic enters in a t-shirt]
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Apr 2, 2022 09:50
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Alchenar posted:Now they need an alternative way back to the future because for some reason Jurati left the Borg Queen unattended on a spaceship while she took a nap in a creepy Manor (not waking up when the Policeman walked through yelling) and then decided that for personal protection she needed an ancient shotgun she found and not, oh, a phaser which could have been set to stun. I liked how the policeman walked half a mile into the dark out from the chateau for no reason to find the ship. You can see where the ship parked here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuF6pNjat2Q at the 20 sec mark. And wouldn't it have been better to make the cop into a borg drone to help take others?
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Apr 2, 2022 09:57
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The thing is this episode seems to have had at core a really solid concept (two characters being offered faustian pacts) but the parallels fall completely flat because Picard still refuses to hint at what any of this is actually about so we aren't really able to come to any conclusions about how how we are supposed to think about Jurati and Spiner's situations, moreover the parallels in the episode are broken up by the C and D plots of Rios on a bus and Picard in a living room. The show keeps pickup up interesting ideas, playing about with them a little for about 30-40 minutes of screentime, then dropping them without actually saying anything. Like, will we ever meet hispanic doctor or Rios's undocumented friend again or are they gone forever? Who knows!
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Apr 2, 2022 10:31
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Alchenar posted:I mean in All Good Things Picard is responsible for the anomaly but only because Q makes him bounce through time. If we are just rehashing All Good Things Though...
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