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Yooper posted:Industrial HVAC question. What's the go to brand for a bulletproof industrial chiller? Are you looking for air-cooled or water-cooled, and what kind of chilled water temp are you trying to reach? I've had good experiences with York, and Daikin chillers recently, but both are water-cooled chillers, and much much larger than what you're looking for. You may struggle to find something with very little electronics these days. Lots of manufacturers put their own controllers on there, and most are doing VFDs because it's more efficient. This is going to be especially difficult if you're looking for a packaged system that has the chiller, pumps, and condensing unit all in one. I haven't dealt with Thermalcare before, but you could look at Multistack. They make a similar product to Thermalcare where it's a packaged chiller system. If you can be more specific with what you're doing, I could probably find some other products.
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Mar 9, 2022 14:15
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Bird in a Blender posted:Are you looking for air-cooled or water-cooled, and what kind of chilled water temp are you trying to reach? I've had good experiences with York, and Daikin chillers recently, but both are water-cooled chillers, and much much larger than what you're looking for. You may struggle to find something with very little electronics these days. Lots of manufacturers put their own controllers on there, and most are doing VFDs because it's more efficient. This is going to be especially difficult if you're looking for a packaged system that has the chiller, pumps, and condensing unit all in one. Air cooled, target temp is ~ ambient. We've got some big DC rectifiers that just need to stay below 120f. Right now we're running 14 gpm of flow with ~ 25f delta-t.
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Mar 9, 2022 14:24
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devicenull posted:Easily DIY because the consequences for failure are pretty low. If it were me, I'd cover the wall side the board in caulk before putting it in, to try and seal off any leaks that may occur. Just gonna note, if danhenge is near central mass I have a bucket of duct butter I'll just give them, unopened, I ended up using heavy duty foil tape instead because of project OCD and I'm sure I can't return it at this point.
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Mar 9, 2022 20:44
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hi thread, we are looking at estimates to get our house upgraded with central air - most topics are pretty well covered across the 5ish vendors we are talking to but one topic came up regarding running ductwork. we don't have ducts so we will need to run some through closets/crawlspaces/etc with various vendors having different ideas of how many and where. one vendor though was very adamant that we want hardpipe ducts instead of flex ducts and that it was his specialty to do this. he made the argument that they are more durable and won't get crushed during insulation projects etc... everyone else thinks he is smoking crack - what does this thread think? also, who "boxes" ducts if we want to hide them once they are in the closets - none of the HVAC vendors seem to do this around here e: we have a 2 story 2,222sqft colonial e: also a surprising amount of shittalking between the pure hvac companies, companies that do plumbing that also do hvac, and oil companies that do hvac - they all bitterly hate each other its kind of amazing, also cost estimates have run from $17K all the way up to $33K Mad Wack fucked around with this message at 21:36 on Mar 9, 2022 |
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Mar 9, 2022 21:32
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Mad Wack posted:one vendor though was very adamant that we want hardpipe ducts instead of flex ducts and that it was his specialty to do this. he made the argument that they are more durable and won't get crushed during insulation projects etc... everyone else thinks he is smoking crack - what does this thread think? Flex duct is fast, easy and cheap for contractors. It reduces airflow, is difficult to clean (should that become a necessity) and is in every way worse than properly installed, sealed and insulated sheetmetal ductwork. Any contractor who does reno work should be able to handle boxing out and drywalling ductwork/building soffits.
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Mar 9, 2022 21:52
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kastein posted:Just gonna note, if danhenge is near central mass I have a bucket of duct butter I'll just give them, unopened, I ended up using heavy duty foil tape instead because of project OCD and I'm sure I can't return it at this point. Thanks, but I'm at least a full day's drive away!
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Mar 9, 2022 22:30
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Mad Wack posted:want hardpipe ducts instead of flex ducts and that it was his specialty to do this. he made the argument that they are more durable and won't get crushed during insulation projects etc... everyone else thinks he is smoking crack - what does this thread think? He is absolutely right. rigid sheet metal ducting will last you basically forever, is difficult to damage, and easy to repair. It is however, much more costly to install in time and material. Cost has won in the industry, and people go with flex which is basically a really big wire spring with plastic tubing around it, so you stretch it from A to B. eventually* the plastic degrades and it will need to be replaced. *15-20 years, the same lifespan as the rest of the system 
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Mar 9, 2022 22:46
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Danhenge posted:Thanks, but I'm at least a full day's drive away! Darn. Oh well. Anyone else who's in the area is welcome to it as well, just figured I'd offer it to you first since you're why I even remembered I owned it.
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Mar 9, 2022 23:44
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Flex ducting does have one performance advantage over rigid ducting and that is that it will reduce blower noise coming out of your vents more than rigid ducting will.
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Mar 9, 2022 23:59
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Thanks for all the feedback - this is super helpful. We are still checking out a few more guys but I am more inclined towards the rigid pure HVAC guy - only downside with him is he seems to be a little weak on the electrical and he doesn't sub. We might just have our regular electrician come and sort it out afterwards...
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Mar 10, 2022 00:19
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Our home office gets to bake in the sun every day with two exposed walls, and it's the furthest run on our central AC system and so it typically doesn't get cool enough, while the rest of the house is fine. Our unit is a few years old and the rest of the house is comfortable, and we've tried doing adjustments to the dampers, etc., without much luck. I'm thinking of having a ductless mini split installed just for this room. It'd just then be supplemental to our existing central AC system, and meant to help cool the room down further through most of the year. The room is about 140 sq ft, has windows on both sides that see sunlight, and gets used as office/mancave. I'm in the process of getting quotes, but right now it seems like it'd be about a 9K BTU unit, and I'm usually seeing Daikin and Mitsubishi so far. I've kinda always thought of Mitsubishi as the gold standard for mini split systems, but how is Daikin? So far, the Daikin systems are running about $1K lower for roughly equivalent specs, but since this is supplemental and not the primary, it seems like the $1K savings could be worth it?
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Mar 15, 2022 03:54
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Update: I'm going to probably go with one of the quotes that had a Trane-rebadged Mitsubishi as an option, since it was only $400 more. Does anyone know though typically how lineset lengths work for these? Looking online at the model # listed in the quote, it seems like the 1-ton unit I'm looking at has a maximum length of 65 ft, with maximum rise of 40 ft. The rise isn't an issue, but for where I'd like to put it, it'd be about a 80-85 ft lineset run. Unit is a (Mitsubishi model #) MSZ-HM12NA (indoor) and MUZ-HM12NA (outdoor).
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Mar 17, 2022 22:11
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The max length is the max length on these units, any contractor that exceeds that is going to get told to eat poo poo if they try for tech support when it doesn't work. you need to go up to an hm24a (twice the capacity) if you want 100ft of line. Find another place to put it, or some creative way to cut 20ft off the run. the flow resistance of the pipe is critical on these units, which is the reason they specify limits and sizes.
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Mar 17, 2022 22:35
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Thanks; yeah, I wasn't sure whether the 65 ft listed in the manual was just its pre-charged max lineset length limit, or the actual maximum length regardless.
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Mar 17, 2022 22:45
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You actually need to add ref to the unit on startup if you want 65ft. the default is for like 25.
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Mar 17, 2022 22:48
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Im debating replacing an 80% has furnace with a central ASHP because my state has a 10k rebate for a system like that, but I was wondering: how loud is the heat exchanger? Is there a lot of electric whine with that?
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Mar 18, 2022 14:23
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Its exactly as loud as an equivalent cooling unit. EDIT: Its more of a hum, not a whine. lower pitch.
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Mar 19, 2022 01:50
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SourKraut posted:Our home office gets to bake in the sun every day with two exposed walls, and it's the furthest run on our central AC system and so it typically doesn't get cool enough, while the rest of the house is fine. Our unit is a few years old and the rest of the house is comfortable, and we've tried doing adjustments to the dampers, etc., without much luck. Have you considered just getting a window unit? I went through the same process w/ my office, and the quotes I was getting to add a mini split were crazy. Also consider window film if you're getting a bunch of heat coming through the windows.
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Mar 19, 2022 17:06
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SourKraut posted:Our home office gets to bake in the sun every day with two exposed walls, and it's the furthest run on our central AC system and so it typically doesn't get cool enough, while the rest of the house is fine. Our unit is a few years old and the rest of the house is comfortable, and we've tried doing adjustments to the dampers, etc., without much luck. Another solution I haven't seen mentioned is to have the ducting redone for your central HVAC so that your front office gets more conditioned air. My home office is in the front of my house and had a similar issue. The room is like 12x12 and has 3 windows on 2 exterior walls and is the furthest run of the ducts. It was actually a branch off of the bathroom vent run. Very poorly done originally. I had all my ducting replaced because of other reasons, but had the installers adjust it so that the office got its own beefier and dedicated ducting. It's dramatically improved the temperature in the room. Another thing to think about is the actual venting from the register. My home office had a two way vent cover screwed on it so that it was ducting the little air it got into two walls, and not the center of the room. I replaced it with a vent cover that blows the air into the center of the room and that also helped.
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Mar 19, 2022 17:27
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devicenull posted:Have you considered just getting a window unit? I went through the same process w/ my office, and the quotes I was getting to add a mini split were crazy. Yeah, if all you need is AC, and you don't mind the look and noise of a window shaker, a minisplit will never pay back over a window AC unit, especially if you're paying contractor install costs.
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Mar 21, 2022 13:15
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Our office is basically uninsulated, so we split the difference and got a freestanding refurb heat pump off woot. 14000 BTU The window vent is annoying, it looks awful, and takes up a bunch of floor space but it was only $350 and it works very well. We regularly saw 82-83F in the room and it can easily bring it to 75 and below. In addition it's a heater, although we rarely need that function, since radient heaters are way more efficient at adding a little heat to the space.
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Mar 21, 2022 17:30
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devicenull posted:Have you considered just getting a window unit? I went through the same process w/ my office, and the quotes I was getting to add a mini split were crazy. The quotes I have been getting too have been crazy. Unfortunately the design of our windows isn't conducive to a window unit, and even if it were, the HOA told me that they wouldn't approve it. SpartanIvy posted:Another solution I haven't seen mentioned is to have the ducting redone for your central HVAC so that your front office gets more conditioned air. My home office is in the front of my house and had a similar issue. The room is like 12x12 and has 3 windows on 2 exterior walls and is the furthest run of the ducts. It was actually a branch off of the bathroom vent run. Very poorly done originally. I had all my ducting replaced because of other reasons, but had the installers adjust it so that the office got its own beefier and dedicated ducting. It's dramatically improved the temperature in the room. Thanks! Yeah, two of the HVAC companies I got quotes from, actually discussed this. The duct that supplies the room does actually supply a bathroom and another room too, and the room I need to cool is at the end. I'm a little peeved that the Contractor that did my AC replacement a few years back didn't bring this (and some other stuff up), because I would have asked them to provide dedicated branches. Since they didn't, and since the plenum box downstream of the air handler would need to be completely replaced for this, the quotes I got from a couple of companies to do something along this line, weren't much cheaper than just going the mini split route.
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Mar 23, 2022 06:53
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I might be overreacting here but I have a wife and mother-in-law with heat intolerance, along with rabbits - and two previous guinea pig deaths from overheating due to a past failed AC. I just had a power hiccup an hour or so ago, enough for my computer and the router to shut off, not enough for my grill to shut off or there to be any noticeable interruption in the air. I live in Florida, it's 89°F out right now, not terribly humid. Unit is a Lennox, less than 2 years old, both outside and inside units are blowing fine. Outside is blowing hot air, inside is blowing cool air. Coils are not frozen up, filter was just installed a couple of days ago, drain pan is not overflowing, condensation pipe is not jammed. The copper line going into the unit does not feel cold. However, the temperature has steadily climbed since the hiccup. Did it just happen to hit at a really bad time during the day or...is something wrong? EDIT: I turned it off and let it sit for about 5 minutes, then turned it back on. Temp is coming back down but I'm still loving paranoid. D34THROW fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Apr 5, 2022 |
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Apr 5, 2022 19:38
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It is possible that during the power hicup, the compressor either did not restart, or restarted in reverse direction. See what happens.  EDIT: oh yeah if this is a heat pump the reversing valve could have been stuck mid cycle too. seen that happen. MRC48B fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Apr 5, 2022 |
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Apr 5, 2022 22:26
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IDK if this is the thread for it, but, I have a 'rheem classic 90' in my basement, and in the attic. I want to be able to filter the air for when my kids (too young to be vaccinated) get covid. I have air purifiers running throughout my house, but, I just changed the filters using the filters the previous owners left behind, and noticed they're rated like: 'filtrete 600' and 'filtrete 700'. It said they're no good for viruses, according to the filter itself, and google. I want to put in merv-13 (filtrete 1900?) filters. Will my blower explode / will this gently caress up the heating or AC?
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Apr 7, 2022 19:16
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Unless you have 4" or thicker filters you're best steering away from the high-filtration filters as they will just strain your system. If you're dead set on having better HVAC filtration like I was, you can get a larger filter box installed in your system to accept 4"+ filters. I did it and have no regrets. Honestly though I don't think any amount of filtering will help with Covid. SpartanIvy fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Apr 7, 2022 |
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Apr 7, 2022 19:29
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Need some advice HVAC thread. Here's my air handler- Here's how the condensation drain and overflow are set up coming out of it  I've got water leaking from the air handler into the tray that's below it. The condensation drain line headed outside is clear and not clogged, backed up, etc. It's not coming out of the elbow that's to the left of the drain line either, so it seems to be leaking or overflowing internally somewhere and making its way out and into the pan. Made a quick call to the AC guy who does our units at work who said it's probably crud of some variety clogging up the pan that's inside the air handler making it overflow. He suggested that I cap that open T you see sticking up from the drain line and suck it out again from the outside so I'm getting pull on whatever is inside the unit and can hopefully clear it out. If I was describing my setup and situation properly to him, he also said that the T that's currently open should remain capped for proper pressure and draining (or something to that effect). I had questioned this before when I bought the house and saw conflicting answers online so I left it as it was since everything was working properly. So my questions are- Is capping that opening and sucking from the outside again my logical next troubleshooting step? Anything else to try? Should that T be capped or left open going forward? When the AC is running cool air is blowing out of it. Thanks for any help and advice!
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Apr 7, 2022 19:48
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redreader posted:IDK if this is the thread for it, but, I have a 'rheem classic 90' in my basement, and in the attic. I want to be able to filter the air for when my kids (too young to be vaccinated) get covid. I have air purifiers running throughout my house, but, I just changed the filters using the filters the previous owners left behind, and noticed they're rated like: You cannot make your home hvac system into a hospital air control ward. Even merv13 are not useful against airborne virus like covid, even IF your return and supply ducting was set up correctly, which they are not, and the unit could take the filter air resistance.
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Apr 7, 2022 19:56
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I appreciate the replies everyone. Changed all my filters today and just used the same stuff the previous owner and I had before, that the HVAC guy said was fine.
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Apr 8, 2022 07:46
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A quote for a furnace replacement included a two stage furnace. The house is only like 850 sqft. two stage seems unnecessary? will there be any benefit to a house so small?
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Apr 8, 2022 17:27
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Hey there ho there, I just bought a house and am figuring out all the stupid poo poo the PO left for me to deal with. I have a Goodman 90% furnace with condensation issues on the flue, looking up things online has gotten me to the point where possibly the issue is that the gas is too cool hitting the pipe? I have seen repeated statements that I can adjust the blower and/or temperature to fix this and that calling a professional is the right move, but those are statements on HVAC company websites and I'm willing to shut the furnace down to fix it because we're not moving in properly for another couple weeks. There's rust on the screws around the flue vent already since the PO's solution was to wrap a towel around it. So, is this realistically something I could try and fix myself? Also this is the first time I've had central air and I've been looking up maintenance tips, one of them is to re-level the AC evaporator outside which is already noticeably off-level. I'm planning on doing that myself, is that a bad idea and is there anything else I should be looking out for while out there.
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Apr 8, 2022 18:17
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Teabag Dome Scandal posted:A quote for a furnace replacement included a two stage furnace. The house is only like 850 sqft. two stage seems unnecessary? will there be any benefit to a house so small? I am in an ~850 sqft house too!  Two stage is actually pretty good for smaller houses. I don't have one currently but I hope to when I next upgrade. Basically it lowers your temperature fluctuations and more evenly heats your house. A traditional single stage furnace only has 1 speed which is full-bore. If your house is freezing because it's 0 degrees outside or if it's only in the 50's, when the furnace wants to heat house up it just blows 100% of the hot air it can to bring up the temp to your set point as fast as possible. With a two stage furnace, the furnace can run at a lower temperature longer so it can cut on earlier but not short cycle.
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Apr 8, 2022 18:23
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SpartanIvy posted:I am in an ~850 sqft house too! Ok, that makes sense. The old furnace does sometimes feel oppressively hot so maybe a low setting is a good thing. Thanks!
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Apr 8, 2022 18:42
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Benagain posted:I have a Goodman 90% furnace with condensation issues on the flue, Check out my posts in this thread about a similar issue. I was able to diagnose and fix the issue thanks to the thread and pdfs of the manuals. The exhaust is cool enough that condensation flows freely during burn. It needs a path to drain. My rusty screws were because the flue had never been glued and was missing a gasket, allowing condensate and probably combustion gasses to leak out.
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Apr 8, 2022 23:45
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Anyone have experience with Bryant Central Ducted Heat Pumps? I'm looking at replacing an 80% NG furnace/AC and my state has a $10,000 instant rebate on installations of central heat pumps that remove NG as a fuel source so it knocks the price down to similar to an 80% replacement furnace. Indoor unit: FE4ANB005L00 Outdoor Unit: 284ANV036000
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Apr 12, 2022 00:01
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If I'm insulating ductwork to prevent sweating, is just fiberglass insulation enough or does there also need to be plastic barrier around it? I'm used to dealing with AC in incredibly hot and humid areas but just moved to socal. The metal duct coming from the air handler and some runs are just covered with the fiberglass sheet loosely (which is better than too tight, I guess); as an example: The other houses here are the same (or not insulated). Logically, I can't work out why this would work because the dew point is the same, this doesn't change the surface temp of the metal, and nothing is keeping moisture and ambient air away from that surface. Two HVAC contractors here said the plastic was just to hold the fiberglass in place. I haven't prodded under the insulation, but on an exposed section there is a slight amount of moisture when I run my finger over it (nothing like drops forming or anything pooling, though). I don't know if I've got blinders on how this should be done technically because of those other regions I've worked in, and this is fine and just works and in not understanding the science here (or the climate here just doesn't necessitate it). PageMaster fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Apr 15, 2022 |
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Apr 15, 2022 05:49
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I have a crappy apartment with horizontally sliding windows that I've tried to put a large window AC into, but after a couple summers of use I've noticed some separation of the window frame which I'd like to avoid making worse so I don't have to pay for it to be fixed later on. It's also probably very inefficient due to the gap that I have to try to seal off above the AC since the window closes to the side rather than on top of it. I don't have access to any way to build or install a frame or box for this and can't make structural modifications to the window. Does anyone have a recommendation on air conditioners that fit in horizontally sliding windows without damaging the window frame? It only needs to cool a ~150-200 sq ft space, so nothing too heavy duty.
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Apr 15, 2022 22:09
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Joementum posted:I have a crappy apartment with horizontally sliding windows that I've tried to put a large window AC into, but after a couple summers of use I've noticed some separation of the window frame which I'd like to avoid making worse so I don't have to pay for it to be fixed later on. It's also probably very inefficient due to the gap that I have to try to seal off above the AC since the window closes to the side rather than on top of it. get a floor standing portable with dual hoses. PageMaster posted:If I'm insulating ductwork to prevent sweating, is just fiberglass insulation enough or does there also need to be plastic barrier around it? water makes insulation useless, so if it starts to drip and soaks the insulation it makes the problem worse. plastic wrap is cheap, water damage cleanup isn't.
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Apr 15, 2022 22:15
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If I’m getting a loud buzzing noise from my furnace blower motor, and the motor doesn’t spin, is that likely a capacitor issue or the motor itself? I have a service guy coming in the morning. Just seeing how bad it might be.
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Apr 15, 2022 22:31
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Bird in a Blender posted:If I’m getting a loud buzzing noise from my furnace blower motor, and the motor doesn’t spin, is that likely a capacitor issue or the motor itself? Yes. (less sarcastic: you test the cap first. If it's bad it's probably just the cap. If it's good it's probably the motor. There is no way to guess without an LCR meter/cap tester or just shotgunning a new cap in)
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Apr 15, 2022 22:43
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