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HackensackBackpack posted:having the enemy go 0-100% from our 99%. it's these. these are the worst
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Apr 21, 2022 19:39
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| # ? May 25, 2024 06:58 |
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Kerrzhe posted:it's these. these are the worst Definitely. Your team was competent enough to almost get a clean win, so it's the frustration of knowing they *can* do it but somehow choked hard enough to lose it all anyway.
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Apr 21, 2022 19:42
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 Red Mage's a good job mate
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Apr 21, 2022 19:45
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Chillgamesh posted:
Tell me more
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Apr 21, 2022 19:51
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Thundarr posted:Definitely. Your team was competent enough to almost get a clean win, so it's the frustration of knowing they *can* do it but somehow choked hard enough to lose it all anyway. Those are infuriating, but I do really hate matches when your team is unable to get a *single* kill. In bronze, I try to mark a target and do callouts. It often can help corral people. If that doesn’t work, I try to follow the team and help burst down whoever they’re focusing. But sometimes you get teams where every single player focuses different people and refuse to coordinate in any way. Then when the whole team wipes, they run solo back into the gently caress pile. My other favorite is when 3 people die, the final two just stay and fight instead of fleeing. Leading to a situation where they die right as the dead rez and the newly resurrected players run, outnumbered, into the gently caress pile.
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Apr 21, 2022 19:56
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the zero kill losses are over in under 2 minutes so they don't bother me at all, any loss where we got an initial push past 75-ish percent and then just straight lose it all the way can be enough to make me take a small break so I don't play the next match tilted
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Apr 21, 2022 20:02
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HackensackBackpack posted:As I flounder in Bronze CC hell, I've come to accept that certain comps are just auto losses and I just accept them and try and better understand my kit and the proper timing of actions for when I get a group that can actually get kills. Like if I get 2 tanks and 2 healers and 1 DPS, we lose. We'll never have the burst to kill anyone. The other team is almost always DRG/MCH/SMN/WAR/WHM and they will eventually focus us down one at a time. And since our deaths are staggered, the remaining team will just zerg into the group of 5 over and over one at a time until the match ends. Out of curiosity, which job are you playing? I'm wondering if playing a DPS is better at low level because your team can't capitalise on utility as much.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:04
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It's like any other competitive game -- if you feel like you are way better than your rank, you should play carries and stomp them instead of playing support. I've had matches where I do double the damage of any other player which I couldn't do as WHM.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:14
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I’ve been playing DRK but I’m thinking of switching to MCH. Maybe I should just do DRG. I don’t think I ever leveled Lancer beyond like level 10 but this could be an excuse to play it.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:17
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S.J. posted:Tell me more Both the shield and the dot on the melee combo stack, so you can give yourself a full shield or put up a brutal DoT on your target, or swap stances to mix giving yourself a 6k shield or doing an 8k total potency dot to the opponent. I like weaving in a White Shift occasionally but mostly sticking with Black Shift for the overall combo because due to its short duration you're typically not going to get the full 18k HP value out of the White Shift Shield unless you're getting focused, in which case you should probably just hit Guard. Verholy can definitely help swing a teamfight though if you notice everyone is stacked up on your target nicely. Beyond that, the big power of your limit break, Southern Cross, is that it's ogcd instant. 24k doesn't sound especially impressive but the fact that you can weave it after Verflare or Resolution in one quick action makes it vicious and not to be underestimated; It's very very easy to snipe people with it. Try to hit as many people as possible with Resolution/Magick Barrier/Frazzle as you can, as often as you can. Those skills are absurdly strong; I usually like Magick Barrier in team fights and Frazzling stragglers so that they can't sustain themselves when they try to escape. Lastly, Corps-a-Corps and Displacement do a shitload of damage, so try not to sit on charges. Note that Resolution is a weaponskill so it won't benefit from the Displacement damage buff.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:22
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I highly recommend Dragoon for climbing. It doesn't require much coordination with your team. You just pepper the enemy with high potency AoEs then when you see someone low you jump on them to secure the kill. The ult is good too and can get you some kills but your AoE nukes and mobility are what win you games. Play it like a ranged where you hang back until they start focussing someone else then jump in. Your only real weakness is being burst down before you can get off your defensives.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:28
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Tbh it feels like damage will win out over utility every time, because you need to do enough damage to down your target. Utility just makes that job a little easier or helps alleviate your MP burden while weaving Recuperate in teamfights. Part of why the most popular classes are that way is because they have enough burst that, even in low ranks, you can sometimes do good work around people who may or may not be good enough to coordinate, without communication, on the fly. Even WHM, despite having lower damage in paper, is perfectly capable of dropping 12k AoEs on the crystal with alarming regularity without cast times, and they can pair that with an 18k AoE+stun LB, with a ridiculously good 60 cd. CJ posted:I highly recommend Dragoon for climbing. It doesn't require much coordination with your team. You just pepper the enemy with high potency AoEs then when you see someone low you jump on them to secure the kill. The ult is good too and can get you some kills but your AoE nukes and mobility are what win you games. DRG is probably the DPS of choice and would probably have dominated a lot of the early discourse if it weren't for SAM's ohko meme.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:30
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People are definitely waking up to RDM's power in CC. Someone pulled the top 100 players in Crystal rank on each data center (pulled their most recently played job via lodestone) and RDM was actually the most common job. The top 10 were: RDM - 125 WHM - 113 WAR - 96 DRG - 82 SAM - 78 NIN - 59 SGE - 51 MNK - 33 AST - 32 MCH - 31
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Apr 21, 2022 20:32
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I need to read up on RDM. I see them every other game but i still don't have a clue what they do. I assume they have an offensive and defensive stance based on the aura and i'm pretty sure their LB does extra damage if you're in the middle of it but that's it.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:35
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It cannot be overstated how much damage dragoon's beam does from max distance, you just watch motherfuckers' HP disappear
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Apr 21, 2022 20:39
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Firebert posted:It's like any other competitive game -- if you feel like you are way better than your rank, you should play carries and stomp them instead of playing support. I've had matches where I do double the damage of any other player which I couldn't do as WHM. Oh, I'm fully aware that I'm garbage at this. I was just so close to getting a bit higher than I guess I deserve that I got a bit frustrated. 1 win away from Silver and I get knocked back to Bronze 3 where I belong. CJ posted:Out of curiosity, which job are you playing? I'm wondering if playing a DPS is better at low level because your team can't capitalise on utility as much. I've been alternating between MCH and PLD. I like both. I've turned the tide of a checkpoint fight with the PLD limit break more than once, and I like to think I've got a good handle on how best to use my skills. MCH is fun because I like MCH generally, and I can usually score a few kills regardless of the outcome. I've tried WAR and I always get creamed immediately and any healer I've played gets me instantly swarmed as well. Ultimately, I've accepted that I suck and I'll never  but I'm still going to bitch about it from time to time.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:44
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Countblanc posted:People are definitely waking up to RDM's power in CC. Someone pulled the top 100 players in Crystal rank on each data center (pulled their most recently played job via lodestone) and RDM was actually the most common job. The top 10 were: No Summoners is honestly shocking to me. I guess I need to give RDM a try.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:45
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Countblanc posted:The top 10 were: I want to see WHM numbers after they fix the cure bug.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:47
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Hommando posted:I want to see WHM numbers after they fix the cure bug. It will drop to a staggering 112.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:51
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Hommando posted:I want to see WHM numbers after they fix the cure bug. Cure is not really what makes WHM strong, it’s the overwhelming AoE damage and CC
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Apr 21, 2022 20:54
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The Cure bug is irrelevant to WHM's power, which is that Purgation comboed into Misery + Miracle of Nature + Seraph Strike is basically a guaranteed kill on anyone who doesn't immediately Purify the stun and hit Guard before they can get dogpiled. There's almost no better burst setup out there, and you can do it every 60s like clockwork.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:55
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Kyrosiris posted:No Summoners is honestly shocking to me. I guess I need to give RDM a try. I played SMN for quite a while and it feels as though while they do a good amount of damage, their burst just isn't high enough when people learn to use CC in order to break up sustained damage and spam defensives while they break LoS, pop guard, or get support. You really need to be able to kill someone before your CC runs out and SMN just isn't there, those 99% losses people were talking about earlier, in my experience, happen because the enemy wave assault actually manages to hold on long enough for their team to show up to start counter-killing. You need to be able to instantly delete a player that runs in 1v5, not pound on them for 5 seconds of guard. So in terms of damage they don't have it, and for CC they're largely outclassed by classes like WHM, WAR, and even NIN, which can also deal pretty decent damage. SMN works well in frontlines especially if you have enough of them for critical mass aoe, but in 5v5 I think they aren't as strong. Based on personal experience though. I had a lot of success with SMN at lower ranks but I felt like I was contributing a lot less as I got up into Gold and Platinum.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:56
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Blockhouse posted:It cannot be overstated how much damage dragoon's beam does from max distance, you just watch motherfuckers' HP disappear Geirskogul > Wyrmwind Thrust > Nastrond is 34k damage if you meet the conditions. If you hit 2 or 3 people on the point with it someone is going to die with any follow up.
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Apr 21, 2022 20:57
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Magil Zeal posted:Based on personal experience though. I had a lot of success with SMN at lower ranks but I felt like I was contributing a lot less as I got up into Gold and Platinum. Hilariously that is where I am starting to stall out in my own progress so I guess it's rapier time. 
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Apr 21, 2022 20:59
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Kyrosiris posted:No Summoners is honestly shocking to me. I guess I need to give RDM a try. I switch to summoner to do better at CC and it isn't even on the list 
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Apr 21, 2022 21:04
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The only thing I'd recommend if you're trying really hard to rank up is to avoid playing WAR or WHM because they're pretty easy to pilot and very popular. If you don't pick them, you're very likely to have them on your team, and they're fairly likely to be decent teammates Also avoid playing GNB because holy poo poo it's not good lol
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Apr 21, 2022 21:05
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I'm MNKing purely so I can piledrive people
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Apr 21, 2022 21:14
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Chillgamesh posted:Also avoid playing GNB because holy poo poo it's not good lol It's definitely not impossible to climb with it - former League pro Dyrus hit Crystal playing GNB almost exclusively - but you're in for a much harder time compared to the relatively carefree power of something like WAR.
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Apr 21, 2022 21:16
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Playing into the meta is lame. I'll play gnb all day because it is a blast to play.
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Apr 21, 2022 21:34
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i switched from monk to warrior and got up to gold last night
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Apr 21, 2022 21:34
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Countblanc posted:People are definitely waking up to RDM's power in CC. Someone pulled the top 100 players in Crystal rank on each data center (pulled their most recently played job via lodestone) and RDM was actually the most common job. The top 10 were: Outside of AST (which apparently is much better than I initially thought) that list surprises me zero percent
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Apr 21, 2022 21:36
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I gave up and Switched fomr Sage to WHM, which got me to Diamond Rank now. It's just unfair how much better WHM is.Vermain posted:The Cure bug is irrelevant to WHM's power, which is that Purgation comboed into Misery + Miracle of Nature + Seraph Strike is basically a guaranteed kill on anyone who doesn't immediately Purify the stun and hit Guard before they can get dogpiled. There's almost no better burst setup out there, and you can do it every 60s like clockwork. Yeah, Cure is absolutely not why WHM is powerful. Being able to to do 36k AoE damage every minute is.
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Apr 21, 2022 21:39
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SettingSun posted:Playing into the meta is lame. I'll play gnb all day because it is a blast to play. You can take Bard from my cold dead hands. It's funny how many games I just get ignored while pick off weakened targets or soften up others for my team to pounce. And I buff their damage just for existing.
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Apr 21, 2022 21:40
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Dragongem posted:Outside of AST (which apparently is much better than I initially thought) that list surprises me zero percent Bear in mind there's not that many jobs and there's a big clump around 30 people, AST is pretty middle of the pack on this list: 
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Apr 21, 2022 22:00
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YoshiOfYellow posted:You can take Bard from my cold dead hands. Yeah, it's interesting that Bard isn't on that list because when people talk about who they hate to see (going by this thread) it's usually up there with Warrior and WHM. Maybe because the top players are trying to carry themselves and Bard relies on other people to take advantage of their being a nuisance? I wonder what responses you'd get if you asked those top players who they wanted to see on their team?
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Apr 21, 2022 22:04
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yes, please do not interpret that data as a tier list or whatever. like every diamond/crystal player i've spoken to agrees reaper and gunbreaker are the worst jobs currently but neither is in the bottom 5 of representation. if there's much of value to draw from those numbers I think it's pretty exclusively looking at the top 5-6 spots and everything below that with a few exceptions is people playing what they want and are comfortable with. like i don't think there's anything meaningful to take from bard having 21 and machinist having 31.
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Apr 21, 2022 22:14
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I am so confused that even in Gold there are people in CC who just run away from the point during overtime. Like they're the only person on your team on the point, they take some damage and decide "ooh! I'd better run away and heal...bwuwh? we lost??"
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Apr 21, 2022 22:29
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Also keep in mind it's based on what people logged out on so if they switched to Reaper for PvE it will be overrepresented.
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Apr 21, 2022 22:29
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Yeah this is just what data they managed to gather using an admittedly low-rigor method. The specifics matter much, much less than broad trends.
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Apr 21, 2022 22:32
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Wonder how long until we start seeing some real pvp changes. Other than the whm bug which I suspect will get fixed next Tuesday, wonder if they think the way things have panned out now is good enough to act on or if they want to wait and see if the meta shifts.
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Apr 21, 2022 22:45
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