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Splicer posted:You absolutely know someone tried to kill their implanted chestburster by drowning it in vodka no one has tried it before so maybe it would work...
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Apr 29, 2022 00:10
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David puts the black goo in alcohol and the alcohol doesn't weaken it in the slightest, I doubt spirits would have any effect on a full grown alien.
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Apr 29, 2022 00:12
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ruddiger posted:David puts the black goo in alcohol and the alcohol doesn't weaken it in the slightest, I doubt spirits would have any effect on a full grown alien. Eh, champagne only kinda counts as alcohol.
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Apr 29, 2022 00:14
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ruddiger posted:David puts the black goo in alcohol and the alcohol doesn't weaken it in the slightest, I doubt spirits would have any effect on a full grown alien.
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Apr 29, 2022 00:15
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Sodomy Hussein posted:They were definitely well-equipped to mow down villagers wholesale, commit genocide, and poison everyone with defoliants that cause birth defects, not to win an actual war against an enemy fighting asymmetrically who didn't entertain a plan B. Vietnam was not a winnable war. The issue wasn’t insufficient training or poor tools for committing murder, it was that no amount of killing was going to result in the desired American end state, a compliant and capitalist Vietnam. The VC/PANV suffered an order of magnitude more deaths than the US military but they still won because the US could not kill their way to victory. On the other hand “alien life forms are attacking our colony and we need to stop them” is absolutely a problem you can kill your way out of. Trying to divorce the experience of soldiers in Vietnam from the politics of Vietnam leads to bad analogies.
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Apr 29, 2022 00:16
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YOLOsubmarine posted:Vietnam was not a winnable war. The issue wasn’t insufficient training or poor tools for committing murder, it was that no amount of killing was going to result in the desired American end state, a compliant and capitalist Vietnam. The VC/PANV suffered an order of magnitude more deaths than the US military but they still won because the US could not kill their way to victory. Aliens isn't a winnable war either. They kill a lot more aliens than they lose people, and they still end up nuking the site from orbit at the end of their "rescue mission," in which they were equipped with hardware to realistically do only just that.
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Apr 29, 2022 01:01
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ruddiger posted:David puts the black goo in alcohol and the alcohol doesn't weaken it in the slightest, I doubt spirits would have any effect on a full grown alien. What if you drink, like, a LOT of alcohol
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Apr 29, 2022 01:17
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Sodomy Hussein posted:Aliens isn't a winnable war either. They kill a lot more aliens than they lose people, and they still end up nuking the site from orbit at the end of their "rescue mission," in which they were equipped with hardware to realistically do only just that. The Marines absolutely would have been able to win the war against the aliens if they didn't have to fight with one hand tied behind their back.
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Apr 29, 2022 01:35
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PeterCat posted:The Marines absolutely would have been able to win the war against the aliens if they didn't have to fight with one hand tied behind their back. LeMay was right
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Apr 29, 2022 02:29
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PeterCat posted:The Marines absolutely would have been able to win the war against the aliens if they didn't have to fight with one hand tied behind their back. Would they? Dietrich - ambushed before she can react, has a weapon Frost - taken out by friendly fire Crowe - exploded by munitions bag Wierzbowski - dies off screen Apone - ambushed before he can react, has a weapon Drake - dies from indirect friendly fire/splash , has multiple weapons Ferro - ambushed, has a weapon Spunkmeyer - ambushed, presumably has a weapon The only one who might be alive if they didnt collect ammo is Crowe and maybe Wiezbowski since we never really see what happens to him. None of the other deaths would have changed if they were holding loaded rifles. banned from Starbucks fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Apr 29, 2022 |
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Apr 29, 2022 02:34
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Crowe and Wiezbowski actually survived but no one is ready for that story yet
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Apr 29, 2022 02:38
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PeterCat posted:The Marines absolutely would have been able to win the war against the aliens if they didn't have to fight with one hand tied behind their back. See I’m not so sure. The first engagement was lopsided because the Marines couldn’t use their pulse rifles, but even if they could, there were like 150 Aliens on their home territory. I don’t think things would have changed much. https://youtu.be/IySXgTv3eU4 Like let’s sort of theorycraft this out a little. Let’s say all the Marines can use their pulse rifles, Dietrich still gets grabbed unopposed. She didn’t have a pulse rifle to begin with so things play out like they do in the movie, so that’s Frost down too. He had a flamethrower anyway. Out of the Marines, 3 of them disobey the “no guns” order anyway and blast away (Hicks, Drake, Vasquez). Apone and Crowe got mugged despite having covering fire. Someone else had a flamethrower but I’m not sure if it’s Crowe or Weirzbowsi; you can see them at 3:05 in the above clip. Frost had the ammo bag; if he isn’t holding a bag of live rounds because no one emptied their guns, then there’s no ammo explosion which means no dead Weirzbowski. Crowe also gets knocked down in the ammo explosion, that’s why he gets mugged by an Alien. That means the only thing really changing in the fight is that Hudson, Weirzbowski, and Crowe are able to contribute to the fight, again, against 150 Aliens. Drake goes down when his gun jams and he switches to his flamethrower, and Vasquez tries to save him and instead gets him splashed with acid, so he’s likely still toast. The Dropship still goes down and takes out the APC. If they’re firing their guns in the hive with reckless abandon they still damage the atmosphere processor (and the dropship crashing into it doesn’t help). That means they’re still stuck on the planet with a nuclear time bomb. The Marines still have the 4 sentry turrets, which the Aliens run dry before infiltrating Ops. If Crowe and Weirzbowski are still alive from the hive ambush then they’re present at the Ops battle but I don’t think that changes much. Yeah I don’t think very much changes if the Marines could have used their pulse rifles in the ambush. I think Gorman taking their guns away (an order 3 of them disobey anyway) is meant more to demonstrate his ineptitude and how he’s not contributing to the Marines usefully, not that the Marines were truly handicapped. Edit— beaten
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Apr 29, 2022 02:46
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I was more making a joke about the common misconception that the reason America was unsuccessful in Vietnam is that it was unable to comprehend the Asian mind and its non-linear form of warfare, rather than the war became politically untenable and the US left. In Aliens, James Cameron uses the movie as a metaphor to express his opposition to communism. The ruggedly individualistic colonists, who are pioneers trying to make their fortune on the frontier, are attacked by a hive mind that replaces them on a one for one basis with an interchangeable drone, their individuality removed, their efforts now directed at the survival of the commune rather than the individual. By the end of the movie, prior to the plant blowing up, the Marines have been successful in attritting the aliens, there are only a handful left when Ripley enters the plant to save Newt. If an entire platoon had been sent, rather than one squad, it's obvious that the Marines would have defeated the xenos. Here Cameron was foreshadowing what would happen during OIF 1 in 2003, where the powers that be sent in a smaller than adequate force in the hopes of not drawing as much attention to their actions and hoping to spend less than the larger force required would have cost. Also hoping for exclusive development rights and profits that would come after a successful invasion though it all blew up in their face.
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Apr 29, 2022 03:52
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While I agree with everything else you wrote, there's this one thing:PeterCat posted:By the end of the movie, prior to the plant blowing up, the Marines have been successful in attritting the aliens, there are only a handful left when Ripley enters the plant to save Newt.
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Apr 29, 2022 04:10
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Xenomrph posted:While I agree with everything else you wrote, there's this one thing: Given how many aliens we see get killed on screen by the Marines, plus how many were killed by the auto-cannon if we're counting that scene, the Marines came out a head as far as number of aliens killer per Marine lost. The dropship would have made it if the Marines had practiced basic security instead of assuming that 2 pilots guarding their own aircraft was sufficient, and it's still very strange to me that they wouldn't have brought along enough crew to leave someone on board the Sulaco while the rest of them went down to the plane to investigate.
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Apr 29, 2022 04:17
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PeterCat posted:
it was to save money because the company is greedy OP
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Apr 29, 2022 04:26
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PeterCat posted:Given how many aliens we see get killed on screen by the Marines, plus how many were killed by the auto-cannon if we're counting that scene, the Marines came out a head as far as number of aliens killer per Marine lost. I'm not saying that really proves anything, it just reminded me of a nerdy sperglord anecdote. PeterCat posted:The dropship would have made it if the Marines had practiced basic security instead of assuming that 2 pilots guarding their own aircraft was sufficient, and it's still very strange to me that they wouldn't have brought along enough crew to leave someone on board the Sulaco while the rest of them went down to the plane to investigate. 16-bit Butt-Head posted:it was to save money because the company is greedy OP Xenomrph fucked around with this message at 04:40 on Apr 29, 2022 |
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Apr 29, 2022 04:37
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the company also sent heavily armed dog catchers with nets to capture the xenomorph in alien 3 lmao because they do not understand what kind of creature they are dealing with and it shows in every single movie thats the point
16-bit Butt-Head fucked around with this message at 04:57 on Apr 29, 2022 |
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Apr 29, 2022 04:55
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16-bit Butt-Head posted:the company also sent heavily armed dog catchers with nets to capture the xenomorph in alien 3 lmao About that, the last chapter of the Colonial Marines Technical Manual is pretty fun, it’s written from the perspective of a group of Company execs reviewing Ripley’s testimony and intel, the flight recorder data from the Nostromo and Narcissus, and all of the camera feed stuff from Aliens, and their big takeaway ends up being “there’s no way Ripley’s testimony is right despite what we’re seeing with our own eyes, we can totally catch an Alien no problem”
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Apr 29, 2022 04:59
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:Are they wearing bulletproof armor (against animals that don't use guns) ironically?  "Hey Top! This whole mission sounds bullshit, alien monsters my rear end. Like the poindexter from the Company said, it's probably just a downed transmitter. So why are we even taking our guns? That poo poo weighs a ton." "Good point, Hudson. Let's just take a couple of sharp sticks."
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Apr 29, 2022 07:30
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The main thing is, if they went in loaded for bear like the normally word, they wouldn't be caught flat footed trying to adapt to the situation. The smart gun operators would be laying down suppressing fire while the rest of the Marines maneuvered with their rifles. Apone would be able to concentrate on fighting rather than getting taken from behind while he was busy trying to hear what Gorman was saying on the radio. Basically the squad could have acted as a cohesive whole instead of a bunch of panicked individuals and they would have been able to concentrate their power and maintained good order in the fight. As it was, they were cocky and they were caught off guard by the xenos.
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Apr 29, 2022 07:45
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16-bit Butt-Head posted:Crowe and Wiezbowski actually survived but no one is ready for that story yet If we are getting a Vazquez prequel then we deserve to hear their sequel as well
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Apr 29, 2022 11:23
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I think drinking a bunch of stuff and puking out a chestburster happens in one of the old comics? Couldn't tell you which one since it was in the old Aliens euro magazine.
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Apr 29, 2022 14:43
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PeterCat posted:The main thing is, if they went in loaded for bear like the normally word, they wouldn't be caught flat footed trying to adapt to the situation. I still think things would have played out largely the way they did in the movie: the Aliens ambush them, the Marines largely can’t see the Aliens because they don’t show up on infrared, and the Aliens are literally coming out of the walls to grab them.
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Apr 29, 2022 15:16
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No matter their equipment, they were always going to be skeptical of the threat and unprepared for what they encountered. Back to the Nam metaphor; the place they found was nothing like they presumed it would be, and the environment was just as important to their failure as the tactics they used. The attempts to force their desired combat outcomes just leads to them being surprised again and again with their pants down.
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Apr 29, 2022 16:39
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If the reactor hadn't blown up a 2nd squad would have been able to mop up easily
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Apr 29, 2022 17:16
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Blood Boils posted:If the reactor hadn't blown up a 2nd squad would have been able to mop up easily What second squad? Like, a whole additional second deployment from a second ship?
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Apr 29, 2022 17:18
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Xenomrph posted:What second squad? Like, a whole additional second deployment from a second ship? I suppose a second mission, and it wouldn't matter how long it takes them to get there if everyone from the Sulaco is already dead, wouldn't have much trouble because most of the xenos are gone. Regardless of if the queen is still alive, all she can do is lay eggs. Without any colonists or marines left to face hug then there wouldn't be enough xenos to give the mop up team any problems.
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Apr 29, 2022 17:21
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The marines are the second group. The colonists were the first. Just because corporate calls their employees a family doesn’t mean they didn’t send everyone there to do exactly what ended up happening (besides the nuke) Anything else is just a power fantasy
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Apr 29, 2022 17:26
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Xenomrph posted:What second squad? Like, a whole additional second deployment from a second ship? Yeah. Obviously that would be dumb given what the story is about, but in-universe it's seems like that would've worked.
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Apr 29, 2022 17:27
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the second squad is in the DS game aliens infestation which everyone should play
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Apr 29, 2022 17:29
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ruddiger posted:The marines are the second group. The colonists were the first. Just because corporate calls their employees a family doesn’t mean they didn’t send everyone there to do exactly what ended up happening (besides the nuke) Right but when the marines went in the entire colony had just been converted into fresh new xenos. The marines then killed at least a good chunk of them, if not the majority of them, and there's no more humans to use to replenish the xeno ranks. So another team would have a much easier time of it.
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Apr 29, 2022 17:31
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There’s still a poo poo load of face huggers
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Apr 29, 2022 17:41
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Elizabeth Shaw's Mummified Head is going to come back as a character.
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Apr 29, 2022 18:03
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16-bit Butt-Head posted:the second squad is in the DS game aliens infestation which everyone should play Technically there’s a second squad in seminal gaming masterpiece ‘Aliens: Colonial Marines’, too. It doesn’t go great for them either.
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Apr 29, 2022 18:29
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16-bit Butt-Head posted:the second squad is in the DS game aliens infestation which everyone should play It’s good even tho it’s mostly remembered for the hilarious butt rock song
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Apr 29, 2022 21:10
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FastestGunAlive posted:It’s good even tho it’s mostly remembered for the hilarious butt rock song That song rules, and the band did an AvP version too https://youtu.be/OgXd6Npj4ZY
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Apr 29, 2022 21:28
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Xenomrph posted:Technically there’s a second squad in seminal gaming masterpiece ‘Aliens: Colonial Marines’, too. Yeah cause somehow there are like quadruple the number of xenos there now. Maybe they just found some really bad indigenous hosts given how dumb they are.
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Apr 30, 2022 00:11
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Darko posted:Yeah cause somehow there are like quadruple the number of xenos there now. Maybe they just found some really bad indigenous hosts given how dumb they are. Also do you know about the single typo in colonial marines that broke the entire AI?
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Apr 30, 2022 00:25
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a single xenomorph is very deadly but many xenomorphs are stupid so the marines would have killed all the xenomorphs but one and that single super deadly xenomorph would have killed them all
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Apr 30, 2022 00:31
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