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Surely it's somehow corbyns fault
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Jun 5, 2022 09:40
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jiggerypokery posted:Surely it's somehow corbyns fault spectator posted:5. Jeremy Corbyn
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Jun 5, 2022 09:49
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Jedit posted:imperialist murderers are the ones we have a problem with. best of luck with that messaging outside of western europe and north america
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Jun 5, 2022 11:09
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Guavanaut posted:It worked out much better after WW2 when we humiliated the ideology instead, removed it's symbols, destroyed it's altars. Problem is that Russia has one of the largest nuclear arsenals in the world. There is an extremely hard upper limit on what anyone can do to the country and its government. This is doubly unfortunate because the whole incident creates a cast-iron case for global nuclear proliferation as the only truly trustworthy defence against imperialism.
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Jun 5, 2022 11:54
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That's why any ideas about regime change or taking Putin out are delusional nonsense, unless his own chef decides to rat poison him like Stalin. But there are softer outs available, and it was Russia's own brand of nonsense in the form of the Holy Rus idea that they just deserve a sphere of influence because the universe says so running head first against the material reality of the people actually living there that started the whole thing, and people like Kyrill are unpopular enough globally that a whole bunch of Russian Orthodox dioceses just became Ukrainian or Greek to distance themselves from his ravings, so it's far more within the bounds of reality that those sorts of people get removed (euphemistically or otherwise) and then the sanctions go away and everyone just sorta pretends that it was all the fault of the bad ideologues. And so, social progress was made.
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Jun 5, 2022 12:08
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Given that they are the source of their own humiliation I’m not exactly sure how anyone else is supposed to stop them feeling humiliated.
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Jun 5, 2022 12:26
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we should of let them be in eurovision
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Jun 5, 2022 12:28
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Schrodinger's nuclear arsenal: putin is going to personally nuke your house tomorrow but also regime change is both necessary and realistic and we'll have them balkanised into wessex and mercia style regional identities within 3 months of the last big mac being airlifted out
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Jun 5, 2022 12:28
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If only Ukraine would simply stop resisting and just give Russia more of its territory, then maybe the aggressor would stop being so aggressive. It's all Ukraine's fault, and NATO countries for offering Ukraine the tools to fight back. We should listen to Frenchie....
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Jun 5, 2022 14:02
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There is an assumption here that France or Germany have a meaningful say in how this conflict ends. They have a role, but the only people who can decide when this conflict are over are Putin and the Ukrainian people. And one of those choices has shown that his word isn't worth squat, which makes negotiation impossible.
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Jun 5, 2022 14:46
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fuctifino posted:If only Ukraine would simply stop resisting and just give Russia more of its territory, then maybe the aggressor would stop being so aggressive. It's all Ukraine's fault, and NATO countries for offering Ukraine the tools to fight back. We should listen to Frenchie.... That's not what he's saying at all... Please stop making us defend Macron, it makes me feel gross. He's a poo poo, but what he is saying here is absolutely correct and giving Russia an 'out' is the best way to maintain peace in Europe not only now but for the decades that follow.
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Jun 5, 2022 14:54
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If it were me I would just walk into the Kremlin and make Putin stop.
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Jun 5, 2022 14:56
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NotJustANumber99 posted:should of Guillotine
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Jun 5, 2022 15:04
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I think isolation historically correlates fairly well with idiotic revanchist nationalism, either national isolation or alienation due to capitalism. And the idea of inflicting national humiliation on people is usually dependent on crushing military victory over them which again, nobody has the ability or will to do with Russia. So while it might be very romantic to imagine that everyone can come together and teach the perfidious ruskies a lesson what ho, realistically that is 1. impossible and 2. probably not likely to make russia good and submissive, rather make people even more xenophobic and supremacist.
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Jun 5, 2022 15:06
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I mean, if you crush and humiliate a nation the only way of doing that under neoliberalism is economically, and also under neoliberalism you can't punish the rich people, so it would just lead to the poorest civilians getting absolutely hosed.
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Jun 5, 2022 15:14
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The Question IRL posted:There is an assumption here that France or Germany have a meaningful say in how this conflict ends. They have a role, but the only people who can decide when this conflict are over are Putin and the Ukrainian people. i mean that's not really historically true, nor ought to be the case morally. if a third-party can broker a peace that is acceptable to both russia and ukraine then they should.
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Jun 5, 2022 15:15
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JeremoudCorbynejad posted:Guillotine Yeah, it should clearly be "should off"
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Jun 5, 2022 15:18
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Mega Comrade posted:That's not what he's saying at all...
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Jun 5, 2022 15:42
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https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1533444953849974785?t=OhMXdkrRyOkDoEp8eRNAwg&s=19 All hail our queen, Elizabeth the Deathless. May she rule for a thousand years!
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Jun 5, 2022 15:43
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sebzilla posted:https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/1533444953849974785?t=OhMXdkrRyOkDoEp8eRNAwg&s=19
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Jun 5, 2022 15:49
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https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/1533456612240855042?s=21&t=yyRmUsjnv9Oj5fCT6L1tSw The Americans are never going to let us live this one down. Rightfully so, tbh
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Jun 5, 2022 15:56
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TACD posted:If we have to protect Putin's feelings to avoid getting nuked, then surely it follows that Putin can get whatever he wants if his feelings are fragile enough? What?
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Jun 5, 2022 15:57
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Ziggy Tzardust posted:https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/1533456612240855042?s=21&t=yyRmUsjnv9Oj5fCT6L1tSw  Jimmy Savile impersonators and terrible vehicles on point tho
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Jun 5, 2022 16:02
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JeremoudCorbynejad posted:Guillotine Sorry We should have of let them be in Eurovision
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Jun 5, 2022 16:05
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Mega Comrade posted:What? If we're forced to give an "out" because of the threat of nuclear war then Putin is incentivised to demand whatever insane poo poo he feels like, using the threat of nuclear war. The whole idea of being forced to provide an embarrassment–free exit from the war they started is a pointless tactical weakness.
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Jun 5, 2022 16:10
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Ziggy Tzardust posted:https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/1533456612240855042?s=21&t=yyRmUsjnv9Oj5fCT6L1tSw A dodgy flea market scammer, a failed vehicle that the world laughed at, a japanese computer game icon, a hungarian game, and multiple Vicky Pollards Best of British.
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Jun 5, 2022 16:13
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NotJustANumber99 posted:we should of let them be in eurovision I would support Russia's return to Eurovision, but only if they send Little Big. Otherwise, no.
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Jun 5, 2022 16:14
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Mega Comrade posted:What? it's mad that 'the corbyn thread' has taken this turn, personally i think it's good tho we don't all have to all think the same all the time will people be voting for a pro-nato withdrawl pro-unilateral nuclear disarmament left candidate again when keith steps down or have the scales truly fallen from the eyes?
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Jun 5, 2022 16:15
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TACD posted:You're arguing that to avoid further war, Putin has to be given an "out" so he can avoid embarrassment. But the problem with that is it isn't up to us to say what's a good enough out to avoid embarrassment, and the minimum viable "out" for Putin might well be far beyond the pale of what's acceptable for anybody else. You aren't "forced" to give an out, the assertion is that that they are more likely to agree to an end to the war if the terms are not "give us everything we want and suck poo poo" because if that's the case they are likely to keep fighting. And again, unless you have the means and will to invade russia, there is comparatively little you can do to stop them from continuing to fight. It is entirely possible that the fighting will continue until either civil unrest in Russia reaches a critical mass, which I think is unlikely given we already know that you can keep fighting forever wars indefinitely as long as they are far enough away, or until Ukraine can't endure the war that is actually happening in its cities and killing its civilians any longer and agrees to some sort of ceasefire that concedes territory to russia because the alternative is either eventual military or civil collapse, regardless of how many weapons are being supplied by the west. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 16:26 on Jun 5, 2022 |
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Jun 5, 2022 16:21
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I urgently need to know how Pac Man ended up in the parade. What is it? A nod to the British video games industry? In which case it should have been Jet Set Willy or Sabreman
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Jun 5, 2022 16:26
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Or Spiky Harold.Rustybear posted:will people be voting for a pro-nato withdrawl pro-unilateral nuclear disarmament left candidate again when keith steps down or have the scales truly fallen from the eyes? The funniest thing about NATO was the fubpees saying "lexiters are mad at the EU for things that are actually NATO, they confuse them all the time on purpose" right up until brexit and then pivoting to "why are people anti-NATO?" It's definitely guilty of a double standard on imperialist powers though.
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Jun 5, 2022 16:33
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Nazi Disco https://twitter.com/GW0017/status/1533454250260541440
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Jun 5, 2022 16:35
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That's the 70s bus. Northern Soul, Black Power, Yorkshire, and the National Front checks out as a theme.
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Jun 5, 2022 16:36
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Look. Corbyn couldn't survive one scandal. are boy Boris has survived 6,587.59 scandals so we know who's has a real mandate.
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Jun 5, 2022 16:39
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smellmycheese posted:I urgently need to know how Pac Man ended up in the parade. What is it? A nod to the British video games industry? In which case it should have been Jet Set Willy or Sabreman It's the 80's segment of the parade, hence the Sinclair C5's, rubicks cubes, and Timmy Mallet. If they wanted a more accurate depiction of Britain in the 80's it would be a group of striking miners being beaten by police.
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Jun 5, 2022 16:49
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Guavanaut posted:That's the 70s bus. Northern Soul, Black Power, Yorkshire, and the National Front checks out as a theme. Did it have "The Bins (TM)" and "Labour's The Three Day Week Though Actually It Was The Tories (TM) " on it? And The Sex Pistols.
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Jun 5, 2022 17:00
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Mega Comrade posted:That's not what he's saying at all...
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Jun 5, 2022 17:11
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https://twitter.com/allymc29/status/1533205190404460556 I think it's safe to say that this is going to be norm for him wherever he goes now.
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Jun 5, 2022 17:15
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Payndz posted:Russia has had an 'out' from day 1: Get The gently caress Out Of Ukraine. They're the unprovoked aggressor - if they feel humiliated by not being allowed to win, tough poo poo. If that is to happen, however, it is likely to have to come with minimal punitive measures afterwards. Which I do not think is what Ukraine would prefer to happen and also I think, not what a lot of other countries would like to happen either. Because otherwise I doubt they would agree to it. A "white peace" kind of deal where nothing substantially changes, I think is the most likely outcome that doesn't involve Ukraine losing more territory, simply because nobody has the means to enforce anything else on Russia.
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Jun 5, 2022 17:15
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Payndz posted:Russia has had an 'out' from day 1: Get The gently caress Out Of Ukraine. They're the unprovoked aggressor - if they feel humiliated by not being allowed to win, tough poo poo.
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Jun 5, 2022 17:17
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