|
deep dish peat moss posted:I just got done buying, playing, and refunding Battlesector. It's apparently a pretty faithful recreation of tabletop 40k but I just didn't understand the rules or mechanics enough to follow what was going on, plus only 2 playable factions is a big bummer for me. Fat Shark also has a 40k horde shooter akin to L4D and Vermintide coming out soonish
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2022 00:07
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 08:18 |
|
|
I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc. Games I've played that are like what I'm looking for: UFO Defense UFO Defense + X-Com Files mod UFO Defense + Warhammer 40k mod TFTD + WotS mod Xenonauts Chaos Gate (the 1998 one) Silent Storm Jagged Alliance Abomination Incubation Phoenix Point Battle Brothers I never really got into x-com apocalypse so maybe I'll give that a go? Something about it never clicked with me but I haven't tried in over a decade. I also apparently played a fair bit of 2010 x-com clone UFO: Extraterrestrials and I remember liking it but I don't know if it's worth going back to now. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 08:14 on Jun 7, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 08:06
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:
There are your auto battlers or auto chess games, and your card games like magic the gathering arena.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 08:16
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I never really got into x-com apocalypse so maybe I'll give that a go? Given the other games you played, yes I think you should.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 11:25
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc. That's a pretty solid list. Probably a given, but have you played Jagged Alliance with the 1.13 mod? If not, you should. Also, Fallout Tactics gets an honourable mention.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 11:30
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc. You should check out Shadow Watch, it's absolutely a classic! Nifty art, your guys level up, and just a terrific soundtrack.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 12:00
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 12:16
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc. I guess This is the Police 2 might float your boat? There's not many games these days that give you expendable troops. If you want to forego that, maybe you'd find Valkyria Chronicles or Chroma Squad to be your jam. Maybe Advance Wars making a comeback will change that. Banner Saga might also work for you? Aside from that, I just know of they myriad of games that copied the new XCOMs like Hard West and Shadow Tactics or Mario vs. Rabbids. Personally, I've lost a lot of patience for the turn-based tactics and gotten a lot more interested in the strategic side in the geoscape.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 15:07
|
|
|
Warhammer 40k: Mechanicus is an XCOM clone with expendable troops but it doesn't really have a strategic layer other than upgrading your main guys' gear and skill trees between missions. I like W40k fluff so that gave the game some points with me as well, but people who don't get off on that might not like it as much.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 18:05
|
|
|
I booted up x-com apocalypse this morning and I want to penetrate the surface here but it feels different and overwhelming. I'll keep plugging away at it though. If I remember right, isn't Laser Squad Nemesis multiplayer-only? I never touched it because I thought it was strictly pvp matchmaking stuff  Or maybe it was just purely tactical combat with no geoscape layer or something.I am pretty sure when I played JA2 it was with the most recent community patch (like 4-5 years ago). Shadow Watch is a game I remember wanting to play as a kid but then promptly forgot about. It's on sale for $1.50 on GoG so I just picked it up! SlothfulCobra posted:I guess This is the Police 2 might float your boat? I had no idea This Is The Police had tactical-type battles, that's interesting. I just watched a video and it seems a bit to cutscene-heavy though, which is part of what I want to avoid about more modern XCOM-style games. Also I just don't particularly want to play as the police  . Valkyria Chronicles was sort of the same way with cutscenes and it felt like a solvable "puzzle" strategy game, where you would likely fail a mission due to unforeseen events the first time through, then re-play it perfectly without anyone dying because you knew what was coming. I don't hate the newer XCOM games but I'm just specifically on a kick lately of enjoying the things that they did away with, like huge expendable rosters with large deployment squads, the possibility of unforeseen failure states, and especially the management side of things (buying/managing bases and their facilities, hiring/firing staff, directing multiple research projects, tracking graphs to find out where alien activity was, managing limited storage/living space, etc). So a lot of the newer turn based tactics games like Mario vs. Rabbids do a good job of capturing the fun, balanced, you-can-always-win combat, but that's one of the least important parts to me. And unfortunately lots of cutscenes/dialog that I can't skip with a single button press is a hard no for me I don't want narratives in my sandbox strategy games!I've played all kinds of kind-of-similar games like Battletech that scratch a lot of the same itches, but I'm more specifically looking for things that are very true to original x-com in spirit and mechanics. e: At the end of the day I think what I want is x-com: UFO Defense but with even more focus on the geoscape layer and management elements. But it still needs enough missions that I'm sending rookies into meatgrinders to see who becomes a hero. I really enjoyed the major TFTD expanson mod The World of Terrifying Silence recently for exactly that reason. deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Jun 7, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 19:08
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc. Urtuk is extremely good. Units don't die that often and the strategy layer is quite simple, but the gameplay is so good that you should still check it out anyway.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 19:51
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc. you'll want to check out age of wonders. look at planetfall specifically, it's the latest game and probably much closer to your ask than 3.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 19:59
|
|
|
There's mods for classic X-COM, so you might check those out.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 20:06
|
|
|
I just picked up 40K battlesector and while the story doesn’t have possible fail states, it does have expendable troops that can leave if you keep them alive. It’s hitting my “close enough to OG XCOM while waiting for xenonaughts” button.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 20:31
|
|
|
TooMuchAbstraction posted:There's mods for classic X-COM, so you might check those out. They listed two of the biggest ones in the list of what they've played
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 20:34
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:Shadow Watch is a game I remember wanting to play as a kid but then promptly forgot about. It's on sale for $1.50 on GoG so I just picked it up! Hell yeah, I'm happy to see this game getting some more love.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 21:01
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I've been on a big classic x-com kick lately and I want something new in the genre but I feel like I've played it all. Are there any obscure gems I've missed? In particular I want turn based tactical combat with (A) Expendable rookies that die often, (B) constantly unlocking new stuff to kit them out with, and (C) some kind of strategic/geoscape layer, not just going from mission to mission. Time Units are good, as is free-aiming (at any tile instead of just at enemy targets), etc. Whoa, I think I played a demo of Incubation in the late 90s on a demo disc that came with some gaming magazine (did Electronic Gaming Monthly exist, or am I making that up?). I've been thinking about the game off and on since then but could never remember the name or anything unique enough about it to search for it. Based on screenshots, I'm like 85% sure it's the same game. I remember the demo had you control a squad of like 4-6 marines that you could outfit either before or during a mission. I very specifically remember that one of the available weapons was a flamethrower and there may have been a minigun in there too. The setting was a spaceship or some other dark environment made entirely out of metal. I think the enemies were four-legged alien things that used claws or blade-hands for melee. Looking at screenshots of Incubation, it looks about right. It was very early 3D isometric style. Does this all sound right or am I thinking of another game? If I am right, would you recommend playing it now? This is probably an itch that will get scratched by booting up, playing half of one level, and never thinking about it again, but it's kind of a white whale.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 21:17
|
|
|
Yea, that's Incubation, it was pretty good.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 23:25
|
|
|
grate deceiver posted:Yea, that's Incubation, it was pretty good. Very cool, thanks for confirming. It looks like GOG has a collection with it and earlier games in the series on sale for $2.50.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2022 23:42
|
|
|
Sandwich Anarchist posted:They listed two of the biggest ones in the list of what they've played Thank you for reading for me, because I clearly have forgotten how to do that 
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 01:11
|
|
|
Sandwich Anarchist posted:They listed two of the biggest ones in the list of what they've played It makes much more sense in a sci-fi setting, but I wish that it was Warhammer instead of W40k. XCOM Vermintide is my 13 year old self dream game.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 09:57
|
|
|
Fat Samurai posted:It makes much more sense in a sci-fi setting, but I wish that it was Warhammer instead of W40k. XCOM Vermintide is my 13 year old self dream game. Have you checked Mordheim: City of the Damned ?
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 11:18
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I booted up x-com apocalypse this morning and I want to penetrate the surface here but it feels different and overwhelming. I'll keep plugging away at it though. It had a MP focus and the campaign came later, they planned to add the strategic layer if it sold well enough but I guess it never did 
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 12:53
|
|
|
SpaceGoatFarts posted:Have you checked Mordheim: City of the Damned ?
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 14:03
|
|
|
Oh poo poo, duh. XCOM Chimera Squad is great, puts an interesting spin on the tactical layer. Not much going on strategically, mostly just choices on priorities, but the tactical aspect is deeper, has more of a SWAT team feel with really interesting character builds.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 14:14
|
|
|
I would caveat that Chimera Squad has the one annoying detail that you have to have all your dudes survive fights. Doesn’t feel like xcom if it only allows perfect playthroughs.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 16:54
|
|
|
Ritz On Toppa Ritz posted:I would caveat that Chimera Squad has the one annoying detail that you have to have all your dudes survive fights. Don't look at it like an XCOM game and it's fine. It's a more narrative tactical rpg, and you have a lot more tools at your disposal to ensure people survive.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 17:33
|
|
|
Chimera Squad also has a weird racist snake lady.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 18:14
|
|
|
If you like the geoscape, then you might want to check out The Phantom Doctrine. It's Xcom mixed with John le Carre, where you lead an independent spy agency during the Cold War, trying to find and destroy a rogue group that is trying to escalate the conflict. You have your TBS battles, but a mayor part includes trying to discover evidence and link it together to uncover the conspiracy and decide on your next target. This is all done in the geoscape, which makes it quite involved. And there is an iron man mode, so if you want to play with expendable spies and assassins that's no problem.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 18:55
|
|
|
Sobatchja Morda posted:If you like the geoscape, then you might want to check out The Phantom Doctrine. Is Phantom Doctrine actually good? I saw it getting some v mediocre reviews on release. Setting interests me a lot tho.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 20:04
|
|
|
SpaceGoatFarts posted:Have you checked Mordheim: City of the Damned ? Thanks for the suggestion. The lack of research and equipment variety, plus swallow management killed it for me, sadly.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 20:14
|
|
|
Danger - Octopus! posted:Is Phantom Doctrine actually good? I saw it getting some v mediocre reviews on release. Setting interests me a lot tho. It struggles. It focuses too much on stealth in traditionally large XCom maps, which leads to the game feeling meh. It does a lot to get you into the setting and mood, so if that's good enough for you then give it a go. Invisible Inc remains the high water mark of stealth turn based games.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 20:23
|
|
|
Sandwich Anarchist posted:Oh poo poo, duh. XCOM Chimera Squad is great, puts an interesting spin on the tactical layer. Not much going on strategically, mostly just choices on priorities, but the tactical aspect is deeper, has more of a SWAT team feel with really interesting character builds. Can you fail the game from the strategic layer? I know it's a major part of X-Com, but it always makes me anxious and it's a bummer to lose a game (and the soldiers you've invested in) when you're doing fine at the tactical layer but not prioritizing the right things at the right time at the strategic layer.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2022 22:13
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I booted up x-com apocalypse this morning and I want to penetrate the surface here but it feels different and overwhelming. I'll keep plugging away at it though. I gotta believe you are aware of the X-Piratez mod, but on the off chance you have not it might be exactly what you are looking for. Having played X-files, it'll feel very similar. The dev's of both mods are friendly and contribute models/maps/concepts to each other. I think this one does an excellent job of making the strategic layer more interesting - you can pursue different arcs which unlock all kinds of content. One of the more recent patches gives you a different starting bonus based on the country you start in. Some of them can drastically change your approach for a run - one country gives you access to a dozen human clones who make doing underwater and hazardous missions doable way earlier than is typically possible.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2022 02:19
|
|
|
Shine posted:Chimera Squad also has a weird racist snake lady. Yeah but she's hot so....... e: I've never played Chimera Squad, but did they really make one of the cops racist, and have it be the colonizing snake person? A little on the nose isn't it?
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2022 02:46
|
|
|
BrianRx posted:Can you fail the game from the strategic layer? I know it's a major part of X-Com, but it always makes me anxious and it's a bummer to lose a game (and the soldiers you've invested in) when you're doing fine at the tactical layer but not prioritizing the right things at the right time at the strategic layer. Pretty sure you can, but unlike in the other X-Coms it's much more simplified and with that you get more direct control over it. IIRC, the city is split into districts, you can build a thing on each district for bonuses (in lieu of base building), the higher the level of building + the more districts your build on the more "powers" unlock that counter the strategic layer fail state. So for a half-remembered example if you build at least one thing in each district, you unlock a power that wipes out a bit of unrest from the entire city and then goes onto a 3 mission cooldown. Nowhere near as much pressure as juggling satellites or hunting down facilities.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2022 04:05
|
|
|
Thanks for the recommendations everyone! I still haven't played Chimera Squad because the shift toward named unique characters with a story presence is very offputting to me in this type of game  That's also why I haven't tried the new Chaos GateA big part of these games to me is the sense of throwing rookies into a meatgrinder to see what cream rises to the top. Like that Starship Troopers RTS where you carried consistent permadeath units through the campaign (that game was great), preferably with as much management on the geoscape as possible. I played a bit of Phantom Doctrine at some point but couldn't really get into it because the focus on avoiding combat and stealth meant there was no rookie meatgrinder. Not really sure how to describe it but it's refreshing to play games that aren't focused on 100% perfect play where you avoid taking any damage and never lose your resources, like most more modern games are - like in Fraxis XCOM (a good game to be sure) everything is so much more gameified that you can effectively just stack the odds in your favor and rarely run the risk of losing a soldier or even taking damage. Whereas a game like X-Com UFO Defense allows you to turn off that drive for perfection and just throw (50+ bravery) rookie after rookie at a problem until it's solved, and turn the ones who manage to keep surviving into heroes. Especially with mods adding things like training centers to provide a pool of sturdy replacements, they're games where failure is baked into the core gameplay loop (and in a very different way than e.g. modern roguelites does it) re: Mordheim: Yes, I am in fact one of the 10 people who actually really likes it and I have played at least up to warband rank 5+ multiple times The story missions are absolutely brutal considering they heavily stack the odds against you in a game where the whole point is you can never have a real advantage over your opponents, I would probably play it a lot more if not for those. I have even been very tempted to buy Necromunda: Underhive Wars a few times because of how much I like Mordheim but it sounds like it's legit bad, not just "brutal and unfair" bad.Shadow Watch has been... interesting. I like what's going on but the pacing is slow with one-step-at-a-time tank controls for each unit  I'm still not 100% sure how I feel about it but it has been a fun experience so far.X-Piratez is like the one x-com mod I didn't try because I heard it gets extremely weird with overly sexualized stuff but I guess I should check it out because x-com ufo/tftd with a ton of variety jammed in has been exactly my jam for a while now. e: And come to think of it, Blood Bowl is a pretty good example of this type of game too, but I'm just not too into the whole fantasy sport thing. I'm probably going to check out BB3 when it releases though! e: I have a combined total of over 400 hours in Age of Wonders 3/Planetfall Urtuk is one I've played too, I got about 16 hours out of it but something about it just didn't scratch the itch, the battles felt very gamey and solvable and even though the healer classes in it healed in some non-traditional ways, they took a lot of tension out of the combat. It was a fun game but not quite an x-com substitutee 1 million: lmao, x-piratez literally opens with a "NO CENSORSHIP" logo next to an anime girl's tits, then a several-slide long illustrated softcore porn fanfic 
deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 04:48 on Jun 9, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2022 04:30
|
|
|
deep dish peat moss posted:I have even been very tempted to buy Necromunda: Underhive Wars a few times because of how much I like Mordheim but it sounds like it's legit bad, not just "brutal and unfair" bad. - Only three warbands, +1 DLC - AI will get stuck in place or run around like a headless chicken. - The turn times. Oh, god, the turn times. - A plethora of bugs, freezes and infinite loops. - You play short "campaigns" against the same 2 warbands. They don't evolve, so if you take their weapons from them in a battle they will wander into the next one without any weapons. Bann posted:Having played X-files, it'll feel very similar. Speaking of this, I just downloaded the mod after seeing it on a youtube LP, and I don't know whether I'm missing some options or the LPer is using some extra QoL mods. Of the top of my head, needing to double click to move and agent, with the first click showing path and remaining TUs, showing whether your shots have actually damaged an enemy, and whether you can safely sell something because you have already researched it. I'm almost sure that's not in the manual. Does anyone have a list of QoL mods for X-files?
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2022 09:19
|
|
|
Fat Samurai posted:Speaking of this, I just downloaded the mod after seeing it on a youtube LP, and I don't know whether I'm missing some options or the LPer is using some extra QoL mods. Of the top of my head, needing to double click to move and agent, with the first click showing path and remaining TUs, showing whether your shots have actually damaged an enemy, and whether you can safely sell something because you have already researched it. I'm almost sure that's not in the manual. Those are all hotkeys under the options, extended I think. iirc ctrl+H for the shot hits/misses/zero damage, shift+click for the green lines with TUs that's colour coded for which actions you can take, and you can middle click an item to see what research it's part of and whether it has been done. While you're there set a key for permanent 'night vision' - no gamplay effect, just makes it easier to see for you, the player. On the world map there's a button labeled something like 'extended' that has a bunch of the QoL options like the research tree, funding, etc (which are also hotkeys) There's no real QoL mods afaik but Arsenal Additions is very good for filling out the early-to-mid game equipment. Other random stuff: Don't forget to set your agents to train under Agents-Training - it'll turn them all into decent soldiers over time. 'Medals' for doing various things with an agent are very powerful and the primary way of increasing stats after training. The monthly income is not meant to be your primary money source until mid-late game - cash drops from the cults are so make sure to always be farming them if you can and minimizing explosives. The animals are incredibly deadly, just as a warning. Rynoto fucked around with this message at 09:38 on Jun 9, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2022 09:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 08:18 |
|
|
Boba Pearl posted:Yeah but she's hot so....... It's been a while since I played it, but I don't recall Torque being 'racist' so much as having a teenager-punk sort of aggression against most humans. The team has clashing attitudes for flavor. Also, I haven't played it since the growing public awareness of 'copaganda' so I don't recall if it makes a statement on it.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2022 10:11
|
|
