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Non Sliver commander for a Sliver deck?
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Jun 10, 2022 01:35
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The page is done. I return once more to my slumber.
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Jun 10, 2022 02:17
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MonsieurChoc posted:Non Sliver commander for a Sliver deck? Morophon?
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Jun 10, 2022 02:46
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Jiro posted:Morophon? That's a sliver.
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Jun 10, 2022 02:47
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Workin on a Jan Jansen deck since he hits my 2 passions, mardu and being a staxy piece of poo poo. Cool being able to do a sword of the meek combo outside of blue.
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Jun 10, 2022 03:04
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MonsieurChoc posted:Non Sliver commander for a Sliver deck? Alesha, Who Smiles At Death
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Jun 10, 2022 03:39
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Heath posted:sexiest card art The Fallen
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Jun 10, 2022 03:55
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Batterypowered7 posted:That's a sliver. Who's also a jellyfish
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Jun 10, 2022 04:17
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H.P. Hovercraft posted:Alesha, Who Smiles At Death This actually sounds like a really fun deck if there's enough slivers to support it. E: There are 48 slivers in mardu with power 2 or less, some are kinda poo poo but that's still enough to fill out an aggro ish deck. Fajita Queen fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Jun 10, 2022 |
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Jun 10, 2022 05:38
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Really excited to see how CMB prices do now that we've made it to release weekend. Box prices have been trending down hard on TCGPlayer, ebay, etc. Amazon collector box pre-orders started at ~$274 and now at $255. Rudy sold to his patrons as cheap as $240/box in bulk. But TCGPlayer has plentiful listings at $223.90 with free shipping... So far, looks like demand isn't where WotC was hopping it would be.
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Jun 10, 2022 12:44
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Because the set is A) devoid of the flavor appeal that the original Commander Legends had, giving cards to a ton of MTG characters that didn't already have them, instead using an IP that isn't immediately familiar to everyone, and B) doesn't really have any home run reprints (some welcome ones, yes, but like, Vamp Tutor? Mana Drain? Staff of Domination? Rings of Brighthearth? Scroll Rack? 2016 Partners? Najeela? Nah.), or really any stupid good chase rares like Jeweled Lotus. The set has some cool cards and I'll buy them as singles, and I think backgrounds are cool, but the set as a whole is a pretty big letdown and doesn't have much appeal if you're not familiar with D&D. Framboise fucked around with this message at 14:02 on Jun 10, 2022 |
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Jun 10, 2022 14:00
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I cannot imagine why product for a legacy-tier power level format with sub-standard-tier cards isn't selling well.
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Jun 10, 2022 14:00
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I'm gonna argue that even if you are familiar with D&D the cards are still a let down. There's a handful of good stuff but nothing even remotely like Strixhaven, of all things, where I want the rush of maybe cracking a sweet looking Demonic Tutor and Strixhaven cards are like fine as opposed to whatever this set is trying to be.
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Jun 10, 2022 14:28
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I bought the 4 precons but I'll probably just purchase some singles and be done with the rest of the set. Supporting the goon running the LGS def was a substantial reason, but I'm also still new to playing commander so I wanted a bunch of the basic cards. I also thought there were some good cards mixed in and figured eh, why not? Learned my lesson with the collector's box from New Capenna, cause while it was a fun and novel experience... def not really worth it for what I got. I do have a commander draft on sunday with the cards which I'm excited for, mainly cause I've only ever done a sealed draft (think that's what it was called, the Innistrad vampire one) and I've heard they're super fun. Plus it's with a great group. Fake edit: And here's another probably dumb question, but could someone explain why Reliquary Tower/Temple of the False God are considered to be just trash lands? RT's no-limit hand size is neat, but I guess it could just be blown up to ruin your day? And the 5-land limit on TotFG means that by the time you can get it out you're probably decent on mana? Are those the reasons? 
Johnny Truant fucked around with this message at 14:39 on Jun 10, 2022 |
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Jun 10, 2022 14:35
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Johnny Truant posted:Fake edit: And here's another probably dumb question, but could someone explain why Reliquary Tower/Temple of the False God are considered to be just trash lands? RT's no-limit hand size is neat, but I guess it could just be blown up to ruin your day? And the 5-land limit on TotFG means that by the time you can get it out you're probably decent on mana? Are those the reasons? RT is... fine in a mono color deck that also draws a bunch of cards. But commander decks are often multiple colors, and if you have more than 7 cards in hand, you're already in a really good position. There are a LOT of utility lands out there, and most are better than RT. TotFG doesn't tap for mana before turn 5. If you get it in your opener with 2 other lands, you have a 2 land hand. By the time it comes online, a bunch of ramping has already been done, and if you want a late game big mana pump, you probably want Nykthos or something like that. It looks better than it is
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Jun 10, 2022 14:54
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Johnny Truant posted:Fake edit: And here's another probably dumb question, but could someone explain why Reliquary Tower/Temple of the False God are considered to be just trash lands? RT's no-limit hand size is neat, but I guess it could just be blown up to ruin your day? And the 5-land limit on TotFG means that by the time you can get it out you're probably decent on mana? Are those the reasons? Colorless, non-basic lands have a real deckbuilding cost, especially as you put more color requirements into your deck. And for what gain? Reliquary Tower is the definition of do-nothing. If the 7 best cards in your hand can't win you the game, what makes you think the 8th or later will? How many times could you have played out more of those cards by having a good land in play instead of a colorless one? Temple of the False God has had a bunch of professional math on it and it's a mana gain in exactly 1 scenario: A land-ramp heavy deck that has a bunch of 6+ drops and 42+ lands. Nobody should be playing that deck. 42 lands is already too many, land ramp is good for landfall decks, but generally less efficient than other options, and if your deck is full of 6+ drops that you are hardcasting, it's probably too slow for even a lot of casual metas now. And the downside is even worse than Reliquary Tower. These 2 cards were jammed into precons relentlessly and were the pet cards of Sheldon Menery and Gavin Verhey respectively. They've never been good, and putting them in everything has actively made the format worse by gaslighting new players into thinking that the format should be defined by sitting around doing nothing for several turns instead of playing magic.
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Jun 10, 2022 14:55
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Reliquary Tower: If you're losing with 7 cards, you're losing with 30. A good deck should have few to no dead cards that have no impact on a board at any given time. You're not going to realistically be able to use all of them anyway short of having infinite mana, and if you do, there are way better ways to use that. Temple of the False God: Lands that do nothing are garbage. Lands that do something kinda okay but are completely dependent of your board state are also garbage. Temple of the False God is completely and entirely dead if you don't have five lands, and can be shut off if someone happens to make you go under 5 lands. Not common, but still. There are so many lands that are just better in general. Hell, run a basic over it imo. Or another mana rock or something. Ideally you'd like your lands to: 1) come into play untapped 2) not be something you don't want to see in your opening hand (like Temple of the False God) 3) have some kind of impact if they're meant more for utility. e;fb dammit
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Jun 10, 2022 14:57
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coelomate posted:Really excited to see how CMB prices do now that we've made it to release weekend. Box prices have been trending down hard on TCGPlayer, ebay, etc. Makes me wonder if the Double Masters 2 box toppers being in random collector's packs was a printing error or someone just got nervous about a potential lack of chase cards.
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Jun 10, 2022 15:00
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Also discarding to hand size is actually good in some decks that operate out of the graveyard, so RT actively harms you in those cases.
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Jun 10, 2022 15:01
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I have a Reliquary Tower in exactly one commander deck: mono-blue Kami of the Crescent Moon whose entire point is to draw a bunch of cards and do dumb stuff with a big hand. IMO if you find yourself needing RT because you don't want to discard, you're better off figuring out the reason why you don't want to discard and adjusting your deck so you don't have to, like adding more mana sources or rebalancing the mana curve so you can cast things when you need to.
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Jun 10, 2022 15:18
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Reliquary Tower is great in my Kruphix Maro tribal deck. But yeah, I wouldn't play it anywhere else.
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Jun 10, 2022 15:26
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Usually if you want to play a deck that draws a lot of cards and you don't want to discard your main choices tend to be Thought Vessel or RT. I enjoy having options and will fit either or depending on the need and what my color pie/mana rock situation looks like. RT is less likely to get blown up since most pods tend to play without land destruction. because they are weak willed FOOLS
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Jun 10, 2022 15:38
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I run RT in my Minn deck where the entire point is to draw cards every turn and keep a big hand so I can dump stuff for free. For any other strategy it is never worth it.
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Jun 10, 2022 16:17
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Heath posted:I run RT in my Minn deck where the entire point is to draw cards every turn and keep a big hand so I can dump stuff for free. For any other strategy it is never worth it. I don't understand. Why are you waiting to dump your hand instead of just playing it out and winning?
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Jun 10, 2022 16:20
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Tight, thanks for the replies! Glad I was on the right path with Temple, means that I'm learning  Guess I should be a little more mindful of my Queza deck, like it's Esper so I am wide open to plumbing my graveyard for poo poo instead of it just sitting in my hand with RT. Hmmmm...
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Jun 10, 2022 16:20
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Just because you have the option of no max hand limit, doesn't mean you are cut off from dumping your hand into the yard with wheels and other stuff. It is possible to do both.
Jiro fucked around with this message at 16:30 on Jun 10, 2022 |
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Jun 10, 2022 16:23
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Toshimo posted:I don't understand. Why are you waiting to dump your hand instead of just playing it out and winning? Well I mean that is the idea to dig for my wincons and cheat them into play quickly. Generally I try to get Mordenkainen out and start making dog illusions because they're often 20+ power in that deck Edit: or Meloku, so I can just make an absolute shitload of 1/1 fliers to buff up the ones Minn makes and then just put the lands back down untapped when they die. It works surprisingly well Heath fucked around with this message at 16:28 on Jun 10, 2022 |
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Jun 10, 2022 16:25
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Heath posted:Well I mean that is the idea to dig for my wincons and cheat them into play quickly. Generally I try to get Mordenkainen out and start making dog illusions because they're often 20+ power in that deck Yes. But why don't you just ... Do that? You are telling me "I am making a bunch of tokens so I can dump my hand. But then I just ... Don't? And then instead I hold a big grip full of stuff unplayed." And I don't understand why.
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Jun 10, 2022 16:38
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I've got RT in my Kozilek, the Great Distortion deck, because it's a circumstantial upgrade to just playing another Wastes, but making a colorless EDH deck is admittedly pretty gimmicky to begin with.
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Jun 10, 2022 16:48
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Toshimo posted:Yes. But why don't you just ... Do that? I don't understand why you don't understand. The deck functions on having a big hand. Things like Mordenkainen's dogs scale directly with the number of cards I have in my hand. The purpose of the deck is to derive value from the illusions who die in combat, which means I need to have stuff in my hand, because if the cards are discarded down to hand size and are in my graveyard, I can't cheat them into play, so it always pays to have a bigger hand than a smaller one in that particular deck. I don't know why you have this built in assumption that I simply must be durdling instead of "just... winning?" I'm not dumping my hand just to have a huge board, this particular commander has a value engine based on scale. I mean you haven't even seen the decklist aside from the three cards I've mentioned, why are you doing this glib "I just don't get it! It makes no sense!" thing when you just heard about it two seconds ago except that you seem to have some kind of trauma surrounding Reliquary Tower?
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Jun 10, 2022 16:56
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Heath posted:The purpose of the deck is to derive value from the illusions who die in combat This is the part that doesn't make sense. Why not just put some sac outlets in and not let your opponents decide if and when you get value?
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Jun 10, 2022 17:00
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Heath posted:I don't understand why you don't understand. The deck functions on having a big hand. Things like Mordenkainen's dogs scale directly with the number of cards I have in my hand. The purpose of the deck is to derive value from the illusions who die in combat, which means I need to have stuff in my hand, because if the cards are discarded down to hand size and are in my graveyard, I can't cheat them into play, so it always pays to have a bigger hand than a smaller one in that particular deck. I don't know why you have this built in assumption that I simply must be durdling instead of "just... winning?" I'm not dumping my hand just to have a huge board, this particular commander has a value engine based on scale. It's because you're playing EDH wrong.
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Jun 10, 2022 17:03
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Toshimo posted:This is the part that doesn't make sense. Why not just put some sac outlets in and not let your opponents decide if and when you get value? Where, anywhere in anything I said, was there any indication that I don't have sac outlets, having not seen the deck, having not bothered to ask this question (because your post was in response to me saying nothing more than "I include a Reliquary Tower in my deck," not about sac outlets), jumping straight into this "I don't get why you don't just ... Win?" as though your Magic the Gathering brain is so insanely elevated and evolved that you've worked out that I simply must be playing wrong? Have you ascended to some upper plane where the notion that a mono blue card draw deck might include a Reliquary Tower is beyond you?
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Jun 10, 2022 17:18
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I run vensers spellbook and thought vessel and reliquary tower and howling mine and font of mythos in my psychosis crawler hidden commander deck and I win 100% of my games by using blue suns zenith to draw 40 anyway. (psychosis crawler is actually pretty fun, but it’s 3 mana too expensive to be playable for a “nice to have” efffect, unfortunately. Plus, every card takes up a slot!)
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Jun 10, 2022 17:18
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Sometimes I play an expensive draw spell on a turn where I don't have surplus mana to win instantly, and it's nice to not have to discard down to 7 either because I have board effects that scale off the number of cards in hand or because discarding to 7 would take too long and paralyze the table long enough to be annoying.
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Jun 10, 2022 17:29
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Framboise posted:Because the set is A) devoid of the flavor appeal that the original Commander Legends had, giving cards to a ton of MTG characters that didn't already have them, instead using an IP that isn't immediately familiar to everyone, and B) doesn't really have any home run reprints (some welcome ones, yes, but like, Vamp Tutor? Mana Drain? Staff of Domination? Rings of Brighthearth? Scroll Rack? 2016 Partners? Najeela? Nah.), or really any stupid good chase rares like Jeweled Lotus. This set is like a Homelands or Fallen Empires bad.
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Jun 10, 2022 18:18
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Low power for a supplemental set is such a weird choice. With standard, there's some measure of "forcing" the product into the rotating tournament format regardless of power level. And that has a strong tradition over decades. But for a supplemental product? If they don't print valuable reprints and/or strong new cards... it's gonna be pretty easy to just not buy it.
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Jun 10, 2022 18:23
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https://twitter.com/NitpickingNerds/status/1535096140261203976 Man I forgot that Dbl Masters Stoneforge Mystic was freaking gorgeous.
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Jun 10, 2022 18:37
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Jiro posted:https://twitter.com/NitpickingNerds/status/1535096140261203976 I had never seen it before but now I want one.
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Jun 10, 2022 18:49
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coelomate posted:Low power for a supplemental set is such a weird choice. I feel like it has to do with the fact that it's a DnD set -- they're expecting/hoping for new players who are Forgotten Realms fans who might be more interested in a format like Commander (which included me when I started playing, I like the roleplaying aspect of the singleton format with a central "hero" character) to cross-pollenate, so the set will overall trend lower power. A lot of their marketing logic for newer players is acclimating them to the idea of having somewhere "to go" from their introduction. Whether or not that is in fact the case I'm not sure, that's just my sense of it.
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Jun 10, 2022 19:26
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