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Experienced riders itt - what gets old the fastest: good looks or horsepower? For me, horsepower went first cause straights are boring and corners don't care how much power you have. Then it was looks, because getting good at corners changed why I ride and a bike being not poo poo at them is much, much more important to me than what it looks like. Fwiw my first three bikes were all gorgeous 90's pocket superbikes that I got specifically because they were the fastest learner legal bikes available and very pretty looking. If I could go back in time I'd backhand myself and force a DRZ or 125 down my past self's gob.
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Jun 19, 2022 23:09
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what's the opinion around here on the vitpilen and svartpilen 400 for newbs?
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Jun 19, 2022 23:13
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I'm out glhf guys
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Jun 19, 2022 23:18
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MSPain posted:Is that so? I'm about to buy my first bike and the Internet at large seems to think their newer 650s are pretty solid. I like the vibe of the continental gt and there is a triumph/re dealer just down the street. If something like that fits what you want, then go for it. The 650 in either the Continental or Interceptor isn't putting down a lot of power and if you're that close to a dealer for if there are warranty needs then that covers that well enough. If you're looking at a heavy bias toward in-city riding, then starting out on one of their 350s will be a bit easier to manage with being lighter in weight, though really the riding position of the 650s (especially the Interceptor with proper bars instead of the elevated clip-ons on the Continental) doesn't mean it's going to be particularly challenging to control. You'll be pretty excited no matter what you're on though, but I wouldn't count on carrying around a passenger for a while. MSPain posted:what's the opinion around here on the vitpilen and svartpilen 400 for newbs? If I remember right they have a rather high seat height and I think you'd actually get better reliability from Enfield, lols metallicaeg fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Jun 19, 2022 |
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Jun 19, 2022 23:18
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Being able to merge onto a highway is a terrible consideration for a first bike unless you have no choice but to ride that every day. Even then any modern 250-300 can do it.
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Jun 19, 2022 23:19
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MSPain posted:what's the opinion around here on the vitpilen and svartpilen 400 for newbs? don't
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Jun 19, 2022 23:29
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Also there is no information about bikes that is worth getting from yammienoob and anything he says should be considered sus. Do what you want but the OP of this thread is still the most relevant post here and most responses to “what bike” are just reiterations of it. There really is no better alternative to small displacement Japanese standards or dual sports for learners. Reddit might be a better place to get told what you want to hear.
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Jun 19, 2022 23:37
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I've put 5k miles on my Monkey in a year commuting, including highway travel. I limit myself to 55mph highways though. 125cc bikes are an option, even in the US
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Jun 19, 2022 23:45
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There was/is some AI superstar who claimed cars under 150hp shouldn’t be allowed on highways and I always remember that and chuckle when someone claims that anything under 500 cc isn’t powerful enough to merge, pass, “get out of its own way,” or some other silly bullshit that nobody needs to even be worried about until they have a drat good idea of their own ability to brake, swerve, or see what’s going on 4 seconds ahead on the road.
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Jun 19, 2022 23:56
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Slavvy posted:2. The 650 hasn't been around anywhere near long enough to make that determination; at best you could conclude they ride well and look nice I've only briefly seen the new 650s and they look like a fairly big improvement from the old singles, but still some red flags. I noticed that the muffler manufacturing sequence was the same as the old ones. That is, the end cap of the muffler is welded onto the body of the muffler AFTER the chroming process was done. So there's an unchromed weld bead around it in a very visible place. So their solution is to paint it with chrome paint. It'll rust and look like total poo poo in a couple years of normal use I'd predict. That's just shameful build quality, even the backwards European brands who get by on name recognition like Guzzi don't do poo poo like that. That's a very small example though, they may be doing the rest of their poo poo right.
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Jun 19, 2022 23:57
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I seem to remember Yammie Noob gave away a Street Triple 765 as a newbie bike not too long ago, and he regularly recommends 700s as brand new beginner bikes.
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Jun 20, 2022 00:02
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HenryJLittlefinger posted:There was/is some AI superstar who claimed cars under 150hp shouldn’t be allowed on highways and I always remember that and chuckle when someone claims that anything under 500 cc isn’t powerful enough to merge, pass, “get out of its own way,” or some other silly bullshit that nobody needs to even be worried about until they have a drat good idea of their own ability to brake, swerve, or see what’s going on 4 seconds ahead on the road. I'm reminded of my mate who definitely needed to upgrade from a ninja 650 cause it was absolutely too slow, so I went for a ride in the hills with him. I rode my 13hp 1980 cb125 TWINNN with a top speed of 125km/h indicated and I lost sight of him within a minute. This at least made him switch gears and get a bike with equal performance but much better suspension.
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Jun 20, 2022 00:11
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The first week I was riding I stalled out at a red light at rush hour in a busy as hell intersection. The light turned green and my newbie brain panicked, turned on the engine,revved super high, dumped the clutch, and popped a wheelie through the intersection. If I was on something more powerful than the MT-03 I probably would done a backflip. Long story short buy a 650 and a GoPro.
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Jun 20, 2022 00:25
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Slavvy posted:I'm reminded of my mate who definitely needed to upgrade from a ninja 650 cause it was absolutely too slow,
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Jun 20, 2022 00:33
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My partner is currently considering a Trail 125 for her first bike because she mostly wants to tool around on dirt roads and around town. I think it might be a perfect solution for her. I think she’d benefit from more time with a clutch, but it’s not like that can’t happen down the line if she really takes to it and wants a long-distance minded bike, too.
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Jun 20, 2022 00:44
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Good luck finding one. There's one guy near me trying to sell one for $7k I hope your local situation is much better than what I've been seeing. I actually wanted to buy a Trail 125 but couldn't get one anywhere near me. Stumbled across a Monkey with less than 300 miles and bought that instead. TotalLossBrain fucked around with this message at 01:05 on Jun 20, 2022 |
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Jun 20, 2022 01:01
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Around here most of the dealers only have used, anything else is ordered and your lucky if it comes in in the next few months.
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Jun 20, 2022 01:19
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Geekboy posted:My partner is currently considering a Trail 125 for her first bike because she mostly wants to tool around on dirt roads and around town. You’ll be better off with a cheap dual sport, including they’ll be easier to find (still not easy). KLX300 or CRF300L; if you’re looking used look for the 250 versions of either of these. Only because the cost difference will be minimal but having that little more displacement and off road ability gives you more riding options. MSPain posted:what's the opinion around here on the vitpilen and svartpilen 400 for newbs? Don’t do this. They are duke 390s in a better looking package. Google duke 390 common problems. MSPain posted:there's a place nearby that sells kawasakis and hondas. I'll take a trip up there soon and look around. thanks for your help goons Yes do this. I know we sound snarky a little here, but the most important thing from your first bike is that it’s a good learning companion for the start of your moto journey. Small, light bikes are forgiving to the mistakes you’re going to make. But importantly the consequences will usually be minor so that you can keep riding. Russian Bear fucked around with this message at 02:17 on Jun 20, 2022 |
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Jun 20, 2022 01:53
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The Trail became an option because we actually found some. They’ll probably disappear before we pull any triggers, but hopefully the fact that we saw a couple today means the scarcity is getting a little less extreme.
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Jun 20, 2022 03:26
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My country being almost exclusively dominated by liter bikes, I regularly get laughed at for having a 500cc engine, but I am glad I don't care and was really helped by the opinions on this forum when I first decided on my bike. While A1 probably has it's place (especially if new to traffic as well), I think A2 is a good starting point for people new to riding. Yes, legally I could ride anything, I also did my license stuff all on a 650 I think. But all the things mentioned regularly on this forum and in this thread are very true. The "limited" power is more forgiving to mistakes, a whiskey throttle probably wouldnt throw me off the bike. Jerkiness is less extreme, loving up throttle inputs around corners doesn't result in as extreme instabilities as it might with a bigger engine. The bike is far nimbler than many bigger bikes, generally just a nice thing to have. I have ridden a few big bikes by now and I wouldn't say I am scared by them or couldn't handle them, but I have made some riding mistakes that I could totally see having gone to utter poo poo if my engine was twice the size. And the most important point to me is the fact that you really only benefit on the straights. My bike is even decent at Autobahn speeds and it's OK to drive on it, but the gas mileage suffers a lot. For touring I'd want a bigger engine simply for the more appropriate gearing and fuel economy. But in the twisties (and that is where we want to be) none of this matters at all. Sure, the liter bike folk probably never switch gears, but honestly that's their loss and not really a benefit. You can ride your bike 24/7 in third? Great, have fun. Never ever have I felt limited by my engine when riding around motorcycle appropriate streets.
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Jun 20, 2022 06:04
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Sports bikes (actual ones not ninja 650s) absolutely are better than parallel twin shitters on twisty roads, just not in a way that helps new riders. Riding the bigger mountain roads around here on a super sharp handling bike is phenomenal. The super twisty roads a supermoto will be more fun but that doesn't mean a sports bike is bad. Excess power is more of a hindrance to fun, it teaches bad habits and if you're never able to open it up then what's the point. I'm not saying they're good for beginners, they're not, but pretending there's no reason to enjoy a cbr600rr over a cb500 is pretty silly imo.
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Jun 20, 2022 06:46
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knox_harrington posted:Excess power is more of a hindrance to fun, it teaches bad habits and if you're never able to open it up then what's the point.
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Jun 20, 2022 14:29
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Slavvy posted:Experienced riders itt - what gets old the fastest: good looks or horsepower? Both. But torque never gets old  But yeah, I tuned my Bandit 1200 up to 120HP and it would clutchless power wheelie in 3rd, and it would pull your arms out of the sockets, but it would also make you lose your license in an instant and it wasn't really a great track bike, so it just wound up feeling like wasted potential for the most part The complete opposite end of that spectrum was the DRZ-400SM, where every single corner, street, bump, or alleyway felt like an adventure waiting to happen. Yeah, the Bandit could go faster in 2nd gear than the DRZ could in 5th, but the DRZ was never, ever boring, no matter what you were doing. There is a reason I've owned two of them and still want a third. I've only had one really "good looking" bike in the sense that most people think of, a 2004 GSXR-600, and I was mostly so worried about protecting the wildly expensive body work, and then not even seeing how good it looked from the cockpit that the looks were mostly worthless. All it did was impress sideways hat bros, who I had no interest in talking to anyway.
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Jun 20, 2022 15:11
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HenryJLittlefinger posted:There was/is some AI superstar who claimed cars under 150hp shouldn’t be allowed on highways and I always remember that and chuckle when someone claims that anything under 500 cc isn’t powerful enough to merge, pass, “get out of its own way,” or some other silly bullshit that nobody needs to even be worried about until they have a drat good idea of their own ability to brake, swerve, or see what’s going on 4 seconds ahead on the road. I remember seeing that post and I'm fairly sure it was in reply to me shouting the praises of tiny cars. I've had several cars under 60hp that I've never had an issue driving anywhere but maybe that's because I'm not a poo poo driver and know what's around me 
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Jun 20, 2022 17:31
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Same. Power is nice to have, but not necessary. My Twingo was slow as hell (0 to 100km/h in 16ish seconds). But in practice people don't even accelerate to 100 in 15 seconds in their more powerful cars, and uphill many just forget that even in their powerful car they have to give it a bit more gas. That's pretty annoying, because when speed in a tunnel uphill dropped below 90km/h, i couldn't leave the little Twingo in top gear, having to shift down. It just wouldn't keep its speed. Now annoyed with the incompetence of drivers, i usually floored it in 4th, engine screaming along, ending up at god knows how many revs and exiting the tunnel at 115km/h or so. The whole tunnel could enjoy the little twingo's roar, because it was pretty loud. Even in a slow car, you can be the fastest on the road!
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Jun 20, 2022 17:49
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Olympic Mathlete posted:I remember seeing that post and I'm fairly sure it was in reply to me shouting the praises of tiny cars. I've had several cars under 60hp that I've never had an issue driving anywhere but maybe that's because I'm not a poo poo driver and know what's around me Yeah and there was a follow up “Well here in Colorado there’s mountain passes on the interstate and traffic around Denver moves fast” but I dunno my wife’s 1.8L Matrix does all those things just fine even loaded with camping gear and coolers. Small bikes and cars can help you learn great habits of actually being engaged with your driving and observing what is going on and how to drive considerately since you don’t have the power or bulk to be aggressive. Also you can learn where not to operate your vehicle. I’ve got all the power I need to merge onto any interstate at high speed and pass at 80 mph, but i don’t like feeling the need to do those things so I don’t ride in those places and it’s incredibly rare that I have the “need” to.
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Jun 20, 2022 17:50
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That's the most annoying discussion that comes up in some AI threads. Everyone think that they need to be able to pass instantly at 80mph "for safety" instead of paying attention and putting themselves in an appropriate place on the road. Don't tell anyone but sometimes I even go a few miles under the speed limit on a 75mph highway!!! Turns out people just pass you if you're going slower?
Russian Bear fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Jun 20, 2022 |
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Jun 20, 2022 21:23
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In some cases, having some acceleration at highway speeds does make things safer. Such as when you're overtaking someone and you notice they start drifting or deliberately moving into your lane. I've not really have had that issue in the car very much, but on bike people sometimes just don't register you, and start to move. There is no way to avoid accidents caused by people not looking. You can do everything in your own power to be visible in a car driver's mirrors, but that does not mean they actually look and register. Braking can be the right way out, but can also be unexpected by the people behind you. After all, you end up being overtaken on the wrong side (comment only valid for countries that use the left lane as a dedicated passing lane or when you're already faster than people on the right) and thats unusual, sometimes even illegal. So while a proper acceleration while already at highway speed is not necessary, it does add an extra way out, improving safety.
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Jun 20, 2022 21:43
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IMO passing/merging safely is about minimizing time exposed to danger (so on the other side of the road, next to the cars etc), so you want to avoid crawling past slowly, it's better to just zip by in a flash. You can do this by planning your moves and building up speed beforehand so you slingshot past with a decent speed advantage, or by having a bike powerful enough to create that speed differential instantly. One of these requires using your brain meats, planning ahead, having some skill. The other requires opening your wallet and then opening the throttle.
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Jun 20, 2022 22:00
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My 300cc Versys was kind of bothering me when I first started when it came to merging because of that. These days I find it completely appropriate to use 5th or even 4th gear on the highway. Theres loads of RPM headroom and a whole throttle to use. 6th is worthless for anything but merging that is planned far ahead, and cruising. Downshifting to accelerate felt super weird at first, feels normal now...and bikes shift faster than car synchromesh trannies. I feel lately more at an advantage on the bike than not when it comes to merging. Unless I am just cruising though I am shifting a lot. Not necessarily a problem though. 😂 Merging while cornering I still need to work on. The need doesn't crop up often but I don't have as much confidence. A lot going on at once. SSH IT ZOMBIE fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Jun 21, 2022 |
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Jun 21, 2022 00:27
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If you don’t have the power to pass someone quickly, you don’t need to be passing them. If you feel like you absolutely have to be passing someone who is moving too fast to be safely overtaken by a modern 300cc motorcycle, then you are putting yourself in a stupid situation that you as a learner should not be in. Any getting merged into because your bike doesn’t have the power to overtake quickly and smoothly is your own fault because you’re doing dumb poo poo. Same as laying it down, if you think through a hundred increasingly unlikely scenarios you could probably come up with a way that you really do need 50+ hp to pass someone at 70 mph, but the odds against that are enough that you’ll be a millionaire off deeznutscoin before that happens.
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Jun 21, 2022 02:58
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what is the best beginner-friendly motorcycle that doesn't look like it came from Cybertron and transforms into a can of monster energy drink
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Jun 21, 2022 03:13
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Suzuki DRZ 400 SM
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Jun 21, 2022 03:14
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Gn250 Sr400
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Jun 21, 2022 03:21
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I actually like those, slavvy
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Jun 21, 2022 03:22
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Suzuki DRZ 400; SM not necessary but owns
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Jun 21, 2022 03:36
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I was hoping for something with EFI and ABS. That said I used to fix up old mopeds from the 70s so carbs aren't entirely foreign to me.
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Jun 21, 2022 03:42
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Officially licensed today and just bought my first bike, 2022 Z400. supposed to get delivered to me later this week, all i've been doing is watching youtube videos and internally panicking everytime counter steering is brought up because we didn't really get fast enough in the MSF course for me to "get it" first few days are just gonna be cone courses in the abandoned subway/mcdonalds i guess
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Jun 21, 2022 03:56
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You understand counter steering. You might not think you do, but if you've been on a bicycle your body already knows how the bike is going to move.
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Jun 21, 2022 04:15
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My bike came with some aftermarket levers on it and have felt good in the monthish I've had it. The other day I went and googled the company and found out they're Amazon bargain specials. How difficult of a job is it to swap them out with a better set if I'm a novice at motorcycle repairs?
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Jun 21, 2022 04:30
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